Beck Water Posted January 23, 2023 Author Share Posted January 23, 2023 28 minutes ago, TheBeaneBandit said: Probably so he doesn't kill someone lol. The guy is just sick of the same s**t happening just like us except he sees what's happening behind the scenes which makes you wonder how smooth sailing things really are within the organization. If that's where he's at, in all honesty, he needs to Seek Professional Help. It's great to love what you do, take your profession seriously, and strive to be the best, but perspective and self-awareness are necessary for mental health. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HomeTeam Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 11 minutes ago, Beck Water said: If that's where he's at, in all honesty, he needs to Seek Professional Help. It's great to love what you do, take your profession seriously, and strive to be the best, but perspective and self-awareness are necessary for mental health. It's definitely something to keep an eye on. You obviously want to keep your play makers but no player is above the team (and josh allen). I've played around the idea of trading him and drafting a cheaper replacement like the way the Chiefs did with Hill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beck Water Posted January 23, 2023 Author Share Posted January 23, 2023 (edited) 45 minutes ago, LabattBlue said: I am talking about the entire season. On TV it seems like he goes to the aidelines, but maybe it is just me. You're correct that during the regular season, more like 75% - 80% of the snaps but what the ratio is between plays where he's not part of the personnel or plays where he takes himself out, can't tell you. 4 minutes ago, HomeTeam said: I've played around the idea of trading him and drafting a cheaper replacement like the way the Chiefs did with Hill. Spotrac and Overthecap are fantastic resources for fans. I wish I could persuade people to consult them before they "play around" with ideas like this. Please? https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/stefon-diggs-16872/ Edited January 23, 2023 by Beck Water Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HomeTeam Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 5 minutes ago, Beck Water said: You're correct that during the regular season, more like 75% - 80% of the snaps but what the ratio is between plays where he's not part of the personnel or plays where he takes himself out, can't tell you. Spotrac and Overthecap are fantastic resources for fans. I wish I could persuade people to consult them before they "play around" with ideas like this. Please? https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/stefon-diggs-16872/ Does a trade not negate the deadcap? I was under the impression that a team would pick up that contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beck Water Posted January 23, 2023 Author Share Posted January 23, 2023 2 hours ago, FrenchConnection said: You have to think this is still festering from the 13 seconds wound. I don't know what you do. It feels like Diggs is about ready to explode into full diva mode, where he demands a trade. We're stuck with the losing franchise. These guys can go play somewhere else. Once again: He's not going to get traded with the dead cap hit we'd take. Doesn't matter who we get, no way we can lose our best offensive skill player next to Allen AND absorb a $33M+ cap hit. His choices are maximize his value on this team and when he becomes tradeable OR Sulk, and damage his value both for commercial endorsements and as an NFL WR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 14 minutes ago, Beck Water said: You're correct that during the regular season, more like 75% - 80% of the snaps but what the ratio is between plays where he's not part of the personnel or plays where he takes himself out, can't tell you. Spotrac and Overthecap are fantastic resources for fans. I wish I could persuade people to consult them before they "play around" with ideas like this. Please? https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/stefon-diggs-16872/ A post 6/1 trade frees up $8M this year but costs $25M next year in dead cap. Which is about the same as it would cost to have him here. I am not in the "cut/trade Diggs" camp. But I am certainly not happy with him. If this were a better draft for WR I would start to consider it for 2x firsts. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thenorthremembers Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Beck Water said: Once again: He's not going to get traded with the dead cap hit we'd take. Doesn't matter who we get, no way we can lose our best offensive skill player next to Allen AND absorb a $33M+ cap hit. His choices are maximize his value on this team and when he becomes tradeable OR Sulk, and damage his value both for commercial endorsements and as an NFL WR Checked it out this morning as well. Cant trade or cut his contract. Hope he gets its together because he is clearly an emotionally immature and self centered guy. Edited January 23, 2023 by thenorthremembers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iccrewman112 Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 1 minute ago, thenorthremembers said: Checked it out this morning as well. Cant trade or cut his contract. Hope he gets its together because he is clearly and emotionally immature and self centered guy. we have no idea what he was yelling about. He may have been complaining to Josh “this is the route concept that’s working, stop running the garbage coming down from the booth” motivation and leadership take many forms, I agree he needs to be in the locker room postgame. Maybe he is fed up with the coaches, most on this board are. Does that make us immature and self-centered. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thenorthremembers Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 1 minute ago, iccrewman112 said: we have no idea what he was yelling about. He may have been complaining to Josh “this is the route concept that’s working, stop running the garbage coming down from the booth” motivation and leadership take many forms, I agree he needs to be in the locker room postgame. Maybe he is fed up with the coaches, most on this board are. Does that make us immature and self-centered. Anyone having an emotional outburst and being outwardly fed up with coaches is immature and self-centered, yes. You're putting your need to be emotional over the betterment of the entire team, which is self centered. Motivation and leadership may take many forms, but effective motivation and leadership is self sacrificing. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndyMark Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 3 hours ago, Beck Water said: If we even remotely consider bringing Saffold back, it suggests the Bills front office is sleeping at the wheel. The audacity of him saying "as long as it is fair"? Fair? Saffold should start by paying back about 5 games worth of paychecks, that seems fair to me. For sure, he should pay back all of yesterdays game check. That is fair. Literally, we would be better off lining up with 4 OLinemen and add some random player with a dice role each play then have him on our line. I am way more troubled by his perception of self than Diggs storming out. At least Diggs is aware. Saffold comes across sort of out of touch with reality. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 (edited) 6 minutes ago, iccrewman112 said: we have no idea what he was yelling about. He may have been complaining to Josh “this is the route concept that’s working, stop running the garbage coming down from the booth” motivation and leadership take many forms, I agree he needs to be in the locker room postgame. Maybe he is fed up with the coaches, most on this board are. Does that make us immature and self-centered. Per McKenzie who said he talked to him after the game he was mad about "Why the same crap keeps happening every year and he wants to find out answers". Both to the team losing in those moments and why teams are able to erase him from the offense so easily where other teams players are not. Last year 3 catches for 7 yards against KC, this year 4 for 35 against Cincy. He is right...why can't we get him the ball? Why is Allen looking at Davis in a "gotta have it" moment on 4th and 6 with the season on the line and not Diggs? Edited January 23, 2023 by Big Turk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thenorthremembers Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 1 minute ago, Big Turk said: Per McKenzie who said he talked to him after the game he was mad about "Why the same crap keeps happening every year and he wants to find out answers". Both to the team losing in those moments and why teams are able to erase him from the offense so easily where other players are not. Last year 3 catches for 7 yards against KC, this year 4 for 35 against Cincy. He is right...why can't we get him the ball? Why is Allen looking at Davis in a "gotta have it" moment on 4th and 6 and not Diggs? Because Josh is a human and not a robot. If Diggs wants answers he needs to start by looking in the mirror and figuring out what he can do better. Thats how you lead. Not throwing tantrums and assuming everyone else is the issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beck Water Posted January 23, 2023 Author Share Posted January 23, 2023 5 minutes ago, HomeTeam said: Does a trade not negate the deadcap? I was under the impression that a team would pick up that contract. No, a trade normally increases dead cap by accelerating unamortized signing bonus into the trade season. Quick primer: a player's yearly cap hit consists of salary and bonuses (workout bonus, per game roster bonus, achievement bonuses), and signing bonus/option bonuses which are paid up front, but for cap purposes, amortized (divided into equal chunks assigned to each year of a contract). When a player is traded, his SALARY and BONUSES (money yet to be paid) go with the trade, but the un-amortized portion of the signing and option bonuses get amortized together and charged to the trade year's cap. Take a look at Stefon's contract https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/stefon-diggs-16872/ https://overthecap.com/player/stefon-diggs/3994 (both sites have pluses and minuses) Diggs is due a "moderate" $7.9M salary this year, and counts against the cap for $20.25M due to this year's share of his various amortized bonuses. But, if he's cut, that cap hit becomes $45M due to all the amortized chunks of bonus accelerating into this year. If he's traded, the trade partner picks up his $8M salary, but we keep all the bonuses that are already payed, so cap hit of $37M. 21 minutes ago, Big Turk said: Per McKenzie who said he talked to him after the game he was mad about "Why the same crap keeps happening every year and he wants to find out answers". Both to the team losing in those moments and why teams are able to erase him from the offense so easily where other teams players are not. Last year 3 catches for 7 yards against KC, this year 4 for 35 against Cincy. He is right...why can't we get him the ball? Why is Allen looking at Davis in a "gotta have it" moment on 4th and 6 with the season on the line and not Diggs? Because at the point where Allen had to decide (quickly) Diggs was not open and had a safety over him. Sure he got open - but if Allen had held the ball that long, he would have been sacked. Where did you get the details about what he was mad about? Is there an interview with McKenzie up somewhere? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 3 minutes ago, Beck Water said: No, a trade normally increases dead cap by accelerating unamortized signing bonus into the trade season. Quick primer: a player's yearly cap hit consists of salary and bonuses (workout bonus, per game roster bonus, achievement bonuses), and signing bonus/option bonuses which are paid up front, but for cap purposes, amortized (divided into equal chunks assigned to each year of a contract). When a player is traded, his SALARY and BONUSES (money yet to be paid) go with the trade, but the un-amortized portion of the signing and option bonuses get amortized together and charged to the trade year's cap. Take a look at Stefon's contract https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/stefon-diggs-16872/ https://overthecap.com/player/stefon-diggs/3994 (both sites have pluses and minuses) Diggs is due a "moderate" $7.9M salary this year, and counts against the cap for $20.25M due to this year's share of his various amortized bonuses. But, if he's cut, that cap hit becomes $45M due to all the amortized chunks of bonus accelerating into this year. If he's traded, the trade partner picks up his $8M salary, but we keep all the bonuses that are already payed, so cap hit of $37M. Because at the point where Allen had to decide (quickly) Diggs was not open and had a safety over him. Sure he got open - but if Allen had held the ball that long, he would have been sacked. Where did you get the details about what he was mad about? Is there an interview with McKenzie up somewhere? It as in the 1/23 Locker Cleanout Media Coverage thread...McKenzie said he texted with Diggs last night and that's what he was upset over Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
78thealltimegreat Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 1 hour ago, thenorthremembers said: Had that same exact thought today. Problem is they will still need more help at wideout. Id be more than happy to move Diggs for Hopkins. Oh I agree they definitely need more imagine Deandre Hopkins with Josh Allen 🙄 1 hour ago, WEATHER DOT COM said: Whether or not you get Hopkins, you would still need a #2 receiver. Keep Diggs. Get him help. Oh I agree he definitely needs help but if he has a problem with one the best QBs in football not throwing him the ball enough let him goto Arizona with Kyler he might be on blood pressure medication by the 3rd game 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beck Water Posted January 23, 2023 Author Share Posted January 23, 2023 36 minutes ago, iccrewman112 said: motivation and leadership take many forms, I agree he needs to be in the locker room postgame. Maybe he is fed up with the coaches, most on this board are. Does that make us immature and self-centered. Poor analogy. No fan is charged with influence and leadership in the locker room or on the Bills team. So if we do an immature thing like break our TV, it affects only us and our family/roommates. If we yell and sulk and storm out of the house, thus upsetting said family and maybe not being there for family members or things we ought to be there for, yeah I would say that's immature and self-centered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 3 hours ago, Beck Water said: "A deal that is fair"? ....... A partially eaten donut good? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southern_Bills Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 4 hours ago, Beck Water said: I respectfully disagree with McDermott "that's what matters most" for a team captain and a guy who presents himself as a leader on the team. I don't blame Diggs, every year ends with a coaching nightmare. This year was worse than others, the players had to see that they were completely unprepared gameplan wise. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beck Water Posted January 23, 2023 Author Share Posted January 23, 2023 11 minutes ago, Big Turk said: It as in the 1/23 Locker Cleanout Media Coverage thread...McKenzie said he texted with Diggs last night and that's what he was upset over I'm sorry, I can not find such a thread. There's this thread - and there's a quote from McKenzie in it - but it doesn't cover all that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beck Water Posted January 23, 2023 Author Share Posted January 23, 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott7975 Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 They arent trading Diggs. He will be fine and will still be a star here next year. Some of you guys just like to create further drama. 1 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkeerie Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 4 hours ago, Beck Water said: Thank you for coming. Have a nice day...elsewhere. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Firebaugh Kid Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 11 minutes ago, Beck Water said: Maybe make ONE IMPACTFUL PLAY all season, and it would've been different. Undersized and overwhelmed, the plight of poor AJ Epenesa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SectionC3 Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 Just now, The Firebaugh Kid said: Maybe make ONE IMPACTFUL PLAY all season, and it would've been different. Undersized and overwhelmed, the plight of poor AJ Epenesa. Invisible. It’s hard to say a 6.5 sack season or whatever was is invisible. But this year it was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 1 minute ago, The Firebaugh Kid said: Maybe make ONE IMPACTFUL PLAY all season, and it would've been different. Undersized and overwhelmed, the plight of poor AJ Epenesa. Who was the genius at OBD to have AJE drop all that weight as a pro, so he looks like a big safety playing DE. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toledo Bill Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 4 hours ago, Beck Water said: I respectfully disagree with McDermott "that's what matters most" for a team captain and a guy who presents himself as a leader on the team. McD is just trying to hold things together right now. I disagree with him, also, but he is trying to keep this train wreck partially on the tracks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Vader Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 11 minutes ago, Scott7975 said: They arent trading Diggs. He will be fine and will still be a star here next year. Some of you guys just like to create further drama. Definitely. Diggs wants to win, and he's sick of being in this situation the last few years. It's that simple. I think a lot of us can identify with that. I don't care about the outbursts on the sidelines, it doesn't affect his play. Remember when Hamlin was taken away in the ambulance, and the players were given 5 minutes to warm up in order to resume the game? We saw Diggs doing what he could to get the team motivated to continue playing. Diggs is a leader who just happens to hate losing a playoff game in an embarrassing way. He will have plenty of time to get over this and come back fighting to win it all. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 I have zero problem with Diggs' reaction. He's elite and our coaching staff couldn't figure out a way to get him more involved. I'd be frustrated too. And he had a lot of inaccurate throws directed at him. Simply put, he wants to win. Probably more importantly, I want more guys who aren't "emotionally exhausted" in a divisional round playoff game and who are all about amping up the intensity in the postseason. 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extrahammer Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 (edited) Too many of you are holding Diggs to a higher standard than the coaches. If that grows I look forward to us reverting back to our mid-2000's position of being a hot destination where every FA wants to come here. (sarcasm) Jeez, get it together. I want more Diggs-like players! He catches the highest percentage of his targets and shows passion. Can't say the same for anyone else on the team. Especially our defensive coach! Unless not catching passes gets a Super Bowl? (more sarcasm but the way some of you are griping about him I'm starting to wonder if that's what you believe) Some of you are holding him to a higher standard than the coaches and making it seem like this is some prestigious character league or something. It's the NFL. Please leave your morality at the door, because you're naive if you really think that somehow is a huge factor in winning Super Bowls, it's not. I couldn't care any less about what he does outside of practices and games. Especially at this moment. How many players is this fanbase or media gonna run off for naive, emotional, meaningless character questions? It's the NFL! The Patriots had a guy hired specifically just to make sure balls were deflated properly. They had a guy hired to video tape opponents play-calling. The Saints and others have had a bounty system. Jets and Steeler coaches trip opponents. The Broncos ran a PED covert ops team and even helped Von Miller cheat a drug test. The Falcons used to pump in artificial noise. But Diggs doesn't have character and that is the focal point for some of you and the media right now? Come on... this isn't high school football. It's the NFL. If you're harping on Diggs, you're part of the problem of feeding a wave of media circus and holding this franchise back thinking this fantasy of character somehow exists and matters in terms of winning Super Bowls. We ran off Marshawn and what happened, he won a Super Bowl. Plenty of other examples. Spare me any character or morality pedestals. I'm rational enough to realize we have a talented roster and repeatedly aren't coaching them when it comes playoff time. Why some of you are keying in on Diggs and not that is one of the dumbest things I've seen from this fanbase and should be called out more. Good day! Edited January 23, 2023 by extrahammer 2 1 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Firebaugh Kid Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 37 minutes ago, SectionC3 said: Invisible. It’s hard to say a 6.5 sack season or whatever was is invisible. But this year it was. Shocked it was 6.5. For where he was drafted, definitely not good enough. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MILFHUNTER#518 Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 3 hours ago, LabattBlue said: I am talking about the entire season. On TV it seems like he goes to the aidelines, but maybe it is just me. He doesn't write the plays, he is just running the assigned routes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SectionC3 Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 40 minutes ago, dave mcbride said: I have zero problem with Diggs' reaction. He's elite and our coaching staff couldn't figure out a way to get him more involved. I'd be frustrated too. And he had a lot of inaccurate throws directed at him. Simply put, he wants to win. Probably more importantly, I want more guys who aren't "emotionally exhausted" in a divisional round playoff game and who are all about amping up the intensity in the postseason. I don’t disagree with wanting teammates who can dig a little deeper. But we’re all human, including them, Here’s the other layer, at least in my view. Everything we did offensively during the second half of the season was a downright struggle. Our offense hinges on Josh Allen doing something ranging from extraordinary to miraculous. Without that extra little bit of pop or energy or whatever you want to call it, the miracle didn’t come. And here we are today. So I guess I’m hinting at a coaching issue as well. I’m done with Dorsey. And, if they move on from Frazier, I could live with it. Time to double down on the offensive side of the ball and take our chances elsewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunsgoodtime Posted January 23, 2023 Share Posted January 23, 2023 59 minutes ago, The Firebaugh Kid said: Maybe make ONE IMPACTFUL PLAY all season, and it would've been different. Undersized and overwhelmed, the plight of poor AJ Epenesa. Aj is a bust based off draft position. Same can be said about the rest of the massive draft capital on the DL. Rousseau has a chance, that it. Ed is likely gone after this season as he should be, not worth a contract. A complete failure that has not only hurt the Defense, but the offense as well. That draft capital could have, should have been used on OL and WRs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauleeeWalnuts Posted January 24, 2023 Share Posted January 24, 2023 3 hours ago, dave mcbride said: I have zero problem with Diggs' reaction. He's elite and our coaching staff couldn't figure out a way to get him more involved. I'd be frustrated too. And he had a lot of inaccurate throws directed at him. Simply put, he wants to win. Probably more importantly, I want more guys who aren't "emotionally exhausted" in a divisional round playoff game and who are all about amping up the intensity in the postseason. Amen to this. If you can’t get up for a game like this, you need to be doing something else. Everyone should have been fired up like Diggs, seems like he and Milano were the only ones interested in being there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
y2zipper Posted January 24, 2023 Share Posted January 24, 2023 7 minutes ago, PaulieYayo said: Amen to this. If you can’t get up for a game like this, you need to be doing something else. Everyone should have been fired up like Diggs, seems like he and Milano were the only ones interested in being there Yeah Diggs and Milano are clearly the vocal leadership guys here. At LB and WR you can have that and it's ok. Josh Allen can fall on the sword and Diggs can say what needs to be said. Creates less controversy that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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