DeSantis For President in 2024?

[Joe Ferguson forever]

a biz "genius".  wonder if this comes up in the debate:

https://news.yahoo.com/floridas-broward-county-says-losses-212500160.html

[Doc]

13 minutes ago, Joe Ferguson forever said:

a biz "genius".  wonder if this comes up in the debate:

https://news.yahoo.com/floridas-broward-county-says-losses-212500160.html

 

Move them to Chicago.  Much safer for blacks there...

[Orlando Tim]

On 8/18/2023 at 4:35 PM, The Frankish Reich said:

It was deliberately leaked by his far and away dominant PAC. A PAC led by the same guy who has now been pulled into the immediate DeSantis campaign. 

It was leaked because it's illegal for these PACs to coordinate with campaigns. In other words, the PAC people can't call the DeSantis campaign people and say "you're doing it wrong; here's what our research shows would work better." So they posted - briefly, but long enough for everyone including the campaign to take notice - a strategy memo for everyone to see. Technically no "coordination" that way. There's nothing happenstance or "outsider" here.

So what advice did he take from this open list? 

[The Frankish Reich]

2 hours ago, Orlando Tim said:

So what advice did he take from this open list? 

I don't know. I wasn't about to read hundreds of pages of oppo research.

It looks like he refrained from giving Vivek a nickname, which is the only thing I remember about what was in that long memo. Good for him.

[Doc]

2 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

I don't know. I wasn't about to read hundreds of pages of oppo research.

It looks like he refrained from giving Vivek a nickname, which is the only thing I remember about what was in that long memo. Good for him.

 

More like the memo was BS.

[The Frankish Reich]

Just now, Doc said:

 

More like the memo was BS.

It was clearly NOT bs. It was from his own PAC, the one that's raised the most money for him. And the head of that PAC left to join the DeSantis campaign itself.

I suspect you'll be seeing a lot of what's in that memo start to seep into the day-to-day DeSantis campaign now. He couldn't very well follow the script at the debate since Vivek would've been ready for a comeback on that.

[JaCrispy]

On 8/22/2023 at 12:24 PM, B-Man said:

 

These people’s God is their feelings…It’s all they thing anyone should care about…😉

[Doc]

1 minute ago, The Frankish Reich said:

It was clearly NOT bs. It was from his own PAC, the one that's raised the most money for him. And the head of that PAC left to join the DeSantis campaign itself.

I suspect you'll be seeing a lot of what's in that memo start to seep into the day-to-day DeSantis campaign now. He couldn't very well follow the script at the debate since Vivek would've been ready for a comeback on that.

 

The memo was verified to be from the PAC?

[Orlando Tim]

49 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

It was clearly NOT bs. It was from his own PAC, the one that's raised the most money for him. And the head of that PAC left to join the DeSantis campaign itself.

I suspect you'll be seeing a lot of what's in that memo start to seep into the day-to-day DeSantis campaign now. He couldn't very well follow the script at the debate since Vivek would've been ready for a comeback on that.

Why are you doubling down on it? Things can change but that was a memo on debate prep which he did not follow so it is already wrong. If he follows any of it now it does not verify the memo since so much is fairly generic items. 

[Joe Ferguson forever]

2 hours ago, The Frankish Reich said:

t looks like he refrained from giving Vivek a nickname,

probably figures he couldn't do better thew desanctimonious....That's pretty good.

[Magox]

 

This is the first post debate poll commissioned by 538/IPSOS/WP, it polled 775 Likely voters and caucus goers and it polled people before and after the debate.

It only measured people who watched the debate.

 

DeSantis first with 29% and Vivek second with 26% of "Who won the debate".   I'd venture to guess that the majority of Vivek's 26% are identify as MAGA Trump Republicans who won't vote for him anyway.

 

This was interesting, you can see inside the internals that DeSantis despite being by far the most attacked candidate with over $20M against him in paid attack ads, Trump constantly bashing him and the Corporate legacy media who loathes DeSantis is viewed most favorably by GOP voters.   Btw, DeSantis is consistently at or near the top in favorability poll after poll. 

 

Interesting Nugget, people who didn't have an opinion of Vivek going into this debate, his net favorability fell by - 9 which is more than anyone else.  I'm guessing its because he comes across as annoying and slick to most people.

 

 

According to this poll and the people who watched the debate, more people are considering voting for DeSantis than anyone else, including Trump.  Trump actually lost 5 points from people they polled right before the debate to the people after the debate.    Haley had the biggest gain of +17 of who are considering voting for her.  I knew she'd do well in the debates even though I don't align with some of her positions.

 

 

 

Edited August 25, 2023 by Magox

[The Frankish Reich]

9 minutes ago, Magox said:

 I'd venture to guess that the majority of Vivek's 26% are identify as MAGA Trump Republicans who won't vote for him anyway.

Vivek is running to be Trump's VP and the Republican presidential candidate in 2028. He provided no reason other than "I'm young" to vote for him instead of Trump.

 

10 minutes ago, Magox said:

Haley had the biggest gain of +17 of who are considering voting for her. 

She strikes me as the Republican who would fare best in November 2024. She could swing a lot of independent voters.

But I don't see any path for her to get nominated given the mindset of Republican caucus/primary voters today.

[Magox]

30 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

Vivek is running to be Trump's VP and the Republican presidential candidate in 2028. He provided no reason other than "I'm young" to vote for him instead of Trump.

 

She strikes me as the Republican who would fare best in November 2024. She could swing a lot of independent voters.

But I don't see any path for her to get nominated given the mindset of Republican caucus/primary voters today.

 

Of course he is, he's Trump's top cheerleader that is running in this race.   It was always the plan.

 

 

 

Things like this is what make Vivek unlikable aside from the fact that he doesn't believe half the things he says

 

[The Frankish Reich]

1 minute ago, Magox said:

 

Of course he is, he's Trump's top cheerleader that is running in this race.   It was always the plan.

 

 

 

Things like this is what make Vivek unlikable aside from the fact that he doesn't believe half the things he says

 

WTF was that Vivek hand doing? That's just weird.

 

This makes sense: Vivek as Trump's stalking horse, aimed squarely at Ron.

Vivek is going to be the subject of a whole lot of oppo research now, and he deserves it. There's a lot of pretty unsavory things in his pharma bro past.

[Tommy Callahan]

1 minute ago, The Frankish Reich said:

WTF was that Vivek hand doing? That's just weird.

 

This makes sense: Vivek as Trump's stalking horse, aimed squarely at Ron.

Vivek is going to be the subject of a whole lot of oppo research now, and he deserves it. There's a lot of pretty unsavory things in his pharma bro past.

lol, like clockwork you guys' attack who polled the best.

 

yesterday it daftly was his religion.  And that position had all kinds of xenophobic undertones.

 

Now it's down to his hand movement and threatening PAC opposition research.  we saw with Clintons how accurate those are.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Magox]

6 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

WTF was that Vivek hand doing? That's just weird.

 

This makes sense: Vivek as Trump's stalking horse, aimed squarely at Ron.

Vivek is going to be the subject of a whole lot of oppo research now, and he deserves it. There's a lot of pretty unsavory things in his pharma bro past.

 

He's as big of a fraud as they come.

 

 

 

There are over 30 of these examples that he changed his positions in just the year alone 

5 minutes ago, Chris farley said:

lol, like clockwork you guys' attack who polled the best.

 

yesterday it daftly was his religion.  And that position had all kinds of xenophobic undertones.

 

Now it's down to his hand movement and threatening PAC opposition research.  we saw with Clintons how accurate those are.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

He didn't poll the best and his net favorability dropped by more than anyone after the debate.

 

 

Vivek PharmaSwampy lol

[Tommy Callahan]

5 minutes ago, Magox said:

 

He's as big of a fraud as they come.

 

 

 

There are over 30 of these examples that he changed his positions in just the year alone 

 

He didn't poll the best and his net favorability dropped by more than anyone after the debate.

 

 

Vivek PharmaSwampy lol

And another attacking him.

 

Pelosi has a good quote about edited videos being nothing more than propaganda.

 

its the agenda to stop the climate change that is the scam. same with the "We are in the 6th mass extinction event" so many of them reference.

 

 

 

 

[Magox]

1 minute ago, Chris farley said:

And another attacking him.

 

Pelosi has a good quote about edited videos being nothing more than propaganda.

 

its the agenda to stop the climate change that is the scam. same with the "We are in the 6th mass extinction event" so many of them reference.

 

 

 

 

 

It's not editing a video, he said that Climate change is real and that humans are partially responsible.

 

Now, 5 months later he says it's a hoax.

 

Did he do new research on his own and come to a different conclusion?

Quote

 

In another conversation that same month, he called climate change “one of the most fundamental societal discussions we ought to be having.”

 

“I think that the point here is if you’re an alternative energy company you’re going to have an important role to play in America’s energy future. Be the best version of yourself. But I also think that oil and gas is going to play an important role in getting there too. And at the end of the day it will be malpractice to enter the decarbonization revolution without an alternative to fill the void, that’s exactly what’s happened,” said Ramaswamy.

 

As recently as this March, Ramaswamy was far less dismissive of climate change action.

 

“Climate change is also real, by the way. We’re talking about the climatism piece of this. When I talk about climatism and COVIDism, I’m not denying the underlying reality of COVID. I’m not denying the underlying reality that global surface temperatures are going up, and in part due to human activity,” he told CBS’s Major Garrett.

 

 

https://www.mediaite.com/politics/vivek-ramaswamy-called-the-climate-change-agenda-a-hoax-on-wednesday-a-year-ago-he-said-it-was-an-important-question/

 

You can find the videos of those comments in the link.   They are not selectively edited.   If you want to dismiss all the flip flops he has made in just the past 6 months that is your prerogative.     

[The Frankish Reich]

2 minutes ago, Chris farley said:

its the agenda to stop the climate change that is the scam

I will grant you this - the media ask questions like the "raise your hand if" one that don't really allow for a sensible answer.

 

If I were up there, I would have tried to answer three different questions, something no one has time for:

 

1.  Is the climate changing? Answer: yes. Clearly. The world as a whole is warming.

2. Is this explained in whole or in part by greenhouse gas emissions? Answer: Yes, at least in part. But we do not know whether 80% of the warming is attributable to human action or whether its as low as 50% or 20%.

3. Is it prudent to take steps as a country and as a world to try to reduce greenhouse gas emissions? Answer: yes. On a U.S. level, it is prudent to take such steps. But (as Vivek noted) it is critical to also work with other huge contributors (China, India, others) if such steps are to have an appreciable impact. Of course, country (USA) level interventions will have to be balanced against economic and other costs (mining of rare earth metals, etc) in developing sound policies.

 

I would guess that 90% of informed voters would agree with me on these 3 propositions. 

Good luck giving any candidate time to explain. And good luck getting any candidate to answer in anything other than political talking points ("mass extinction!" "hoax!")

[Tommy Callahan]

Just now, Magox said:

 

It's not editing a video, he said that Climate change is real and that humans are partially responsible.

 

Now, 5 months later he says it's a hoax.

 

Did he do new research on his own and come to a different conclusion?

 

https://www.mediaite.com/politics/vivek-ramaswamy-called-the-climate-change-agenda-a-hoax-on-wednesday-a-year-ago-he-said-it-was-an-important-question/

 

You can find the videos of those comments in the link.   They are not selectively edited.   If you want to dismiss all the flip flops he has made in just the past 6 months that is your prerogative.     

Then provide them. cause the one you provided was a very small clip out of a larger conversation.  

 

But I now grasp your just puking the mediate article. that doesnt provide the link to the unedited video in question or the text of the discussion.

 

Old hillary/biden would just swipe it off as saying she "evolved" on the topic. 

 

he is young.  got things to learn.

 

 

[Tommy Callahan]

1 minute ago, The Frankish Reich said:

I will grant you this - the media ask questions like the "raise your hand if" one that don't really allow for a sensible answer.

 

If I were up there, I would have tried to answer three different questions, something no one has time for:

 

1.  Is the climate changing? Answer: yes. Clearly. The world as a whole is warming.

2. Is this explained in whole or in part by greenhouse gas emissions? Answer: Yes, at least in part. But we do not know whether 80% of the warming is attributable to human action or whether its as low as 50% or 20%.

3. Is it prudent to take steps as a country and as a world to try to reduce greenhouse gas emissions? Answer: yes. On a U.S. level, it is prudent to take such steps. But (as Vivek noted) it is critical to also work with other huge contributors (China, India, others) if such steps are to have an appreciable impact. Of course, country (USA) level interventions will have to be balanced against economic and other costs (mining of rare earth metals, etc) in developing sound policies.

 

I would guess that 90% of informed voters would agree with me on these 3 propositions. 

Good luck giving any candidate time to explain. And good luck getting any candidate to answer in anything other than political talking points ("mass extinction!" "hoax!")

Add the fourth question, should we transform our economy and spend insane amounts of money on things like the Paris accord and carbon credits.

Why we are cutting our emissions while another member of the pac won't even have a baseline till 2030. and dont even figure war/military into the formulas or cuts.

 

Up here in NY we are dealing with insane rising cost of sewer and water due to the federal program to clean the Chesapeake basin.  I guess that involves our town having to change all our sewer system at a cost of 200 million dollars, on a budget of 20 million.   Watershed Implementation Plans (WIP) are what they are called.

 

https://www.dec.ny.gov/lands/33279.html

 

just for a small example.

 

[The Frankish Reich]

1 minute ago, Chris farley said:

Why we are cutting our emissions while another member of the pac won't even have a baseline till 2030. and dont even figure war/military into the formulas or cuts.

I would like to see more money spent on geoengineering research.

It is a critical issue. But if people believe it truly is a threat to the continued existence of human life on the planet, we ought to be thinking outside the box here instead of just taking prudent incremental steps to reduce emissions over decades.

[Magox]

21 minutes ago, Chris farley said:

Then provide them. cause the one you provided was a very small clip out of a larger conversation.  

 

But I now grasp your just puking the mediate article. that doesnt provide the link to the unedited video in question or the text of the discussion.

 

Old hillary/biden would just swipe it off as saying she "evolved" on the topic. 

 

he is young.  got things to learn.

 

 

 

Ok, you asked for it lol

 

He was invited to speak to congress on "Climate change and Social Responsibility"    His part starts at around the 39:15 mark

 

 

 

 

You can hear what he says in its totality, his entire interview.

 

 

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/video/entrepreneur-vivek-ramaswamy-on-the-takeout-352023/

 

This is where he says  

 

Quote

“Climate change is also real, by the way. We’re talking about the climatism piece of this. When I talk about climatism and COVIDism, I’m not denying the underlying reality of COVID. I’m not denying the underlying reality that global surface temperatures are going up, and in part due to human activity,” he told CBS’s Major Garrett.

 

 

Now that you got to see the videos where he has done a completely 180 in a matter of 5 months from "Climate change is real and is partially due to humans" To "Climate change is a hoax"

 

Do you think he did some new research in the past 5 months that led to his newfound view?  What do you think caused his 180 view on Climate change?  Serious question

 

 

Edited August 25, 2023 by Magox

[Tommy Callahan]

51 minutes ago, Magox said:

 

Ok, you asked for it lol

 

He was invited to speak to congress on "Climate change and Social Responsibility"    His part starts at around the 39:15 mark

 

 

 

 

You can hear what he says in its totality, his entire interview.

 

 

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/video/entrepreneur-vivek-ramaswamy-on-the-takeout-352023/

 

This is where he says  

 

 

 

Now that you got to see the videos where he has done a completely 180 in a matter of 5 months from "Climate change is real and is partially due to humans" To "Climate change is a hoax"

 

Do you think he did some new research in the past 5 months that led to his newfound view?  What do you think caused his 180 view on Climate change?  Serious question

 

 

Thank you.  I listened to his opening monologue at the time stamp you mentioned. I need to watch more to find the clip referenced above. 

 

But it sure sounded like he was calling out and laying exactly why the Green Machine is a money making and political game in the first part.  

 

 

[Magox]

9 minutes ago, Chris farley said:

Thank you.  I listened to his opening monologue at the time stamp you mentioned. I need to watch more to find the clip referenced above. 

 

But it sure sounded like he was calling out and laying exactly why the Green Machine is a money making and political game in the first part.  

 

 

 

To a degree, but he acknowledged that there is climate change and that humans contributed to it.

 

That's a far cry from "Climate change is a hoax".

 

I've been posting on this board for years, I just have been M.I.A for a couple years on PPP side, the posters on here that know me know that I don't just spout nonsense.

 

From his positions on masks, vaccines, Juneteenth holiday, Mike Pence, J6, Trump, Soros and a whole bunch of other topics, which I'll share, you'll see that he's not a genuine person.   He has no track record for delivering for conservatives/righties, his only record he has is his very questionable and shady practices with his pharmaceutical/biotech companies (which I'll share one day as well) and his record of tons of flip flopping inconsistent views which coincidentally happened right before he entered the race.

 

He says he's not a politician, technically that is true.  But, he certainly behaves like a career politician.

[SCBills]

Not sure the debate moves the needle in a monumentally notable way, but now that the polling has settled from it..

 

DeSantis has the highest favorables in the race now.  He may not have had a “breakthrough moment” but he clearly helped himself in the eyes of primary voters. 
 

Trump’s favorables dropped due to not debating, but who knows how the Atlanta stuff factors in now. 
 

Haley helped herself the most.  Went from a candidate on the periphery to someone justifying their spot moving forward, as of now, with Trump, DeSantis and Vivek. 
 

Vivek had the most interesting reaction to the debate.   Trump supporters love him, but he’s never going to win them, nor is he trying to (or trying to be President for that matter).   He did do what he set out to do … Splinter the vote from those who like Trump but want to go in another direction.  That needs to be DeSantis wheelhouse, but Vivek is in the race to take some of that group .. and he’s doing so currently by being received well by that group, especially after the debate.   That being said.. his favorability dropped noticeably amongst R voters in general.  
 

Edited August 25, 2023 by SCBills

[B-Man]

 

 

The post-GOP debate fallout is always interesting to watch. Numbers shift, analyses are shared, insults are traded, and predictions are a dime a dozen. 

 

As RedState's been covering, polls are showing that the first winner of the debate seems to be Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, who remains second in terms of the GOP's likely primary winner. While many made little of his performance, his increasing approval rating as well as his decreasing unfavorability rating may reveal that the traction of the debate stage is where his campaign will start gaining real speed. 

 

DeSantis was going over what went down in a post-debate interview, and something he said caught my attention that I think is worth pondering. 

 

“The thing about the debate is, you know, nobody hit me so I wasn’t gonna get involved in that scrum," said DeSantis. " I know those guys were going back and forth."

"What I did with 100% of my time was to speak directly to the American people about our vision to reverse the country’s decline, what specifically we need to do, and most importantly what I’ve already done to show that I can do this nationally," he continued. "Of anyone on the stage, I’m the only guy that’s actually delivered on all the things that our voters care about.”

 

But no one wanted to take a shot at DeSantis? 

 

I'm sure a lot of conspiracy theories can be cooked up here, but DeSantis might very well have touched on why. Florida is proof of his leadership, which is stellar whether you want to vote for him or not. Before the election, he was America's favorite governor because of his ability to take on the left without blinking, as well as turning his state into a conservative powerhouse. 

 

https://redstate.com/brandon_morse/2023/08/25/are-the-other-candidates-afraid-of-ron-desantis-n2163039

 

 

.

[Magox]

1 hour ago, SCBills said:

Not sure the debate moves the needle in a monumentally notable way, but now that the polling has settled from it..

 

DeSantis has the highest favorables in the race now.  He may not have had a “breakthrough moment” but he clearly helped himself in the eyes of primary voters. 
 

Trump’s favorables dropped due to not debating, but who knows how the Atlanta stuff factors in now. 
 

Haley helped herself the most.  Went from a candidate on the periphery to someone justifying their spot moving forward, as of now, with Trump, DeSantis and Vivek. 
 

Vivek had the most interesting reaction to the debate.   Trump supporters love him, but he’s never going to win them, nor is he trying to (or trying to be President for that matter).   He did do what he set out to do … Splinter the vote from those who like Trump but want to go in another direction.  That needs to be DeSantis wheelhouse, but Vivek is in the race to take some of that group .. and he’s doing so currently by being received well by that group, especially after the debate.   That being said.. his favorability dropped noticeably amongst R voters in general.  
 

 

I agree pretty much with everything you said.

 

Let's not kid ourselves, Trump is the heavy favorite and most likely going to be the nominee.  There is a lot of goodwill for him among Republicans, with that said he's not invincible.  He has by far the highest floor out of all the candidates which I'd say is probably around 30% in Iowa/NH/SC, and then there is another 30% considering him of which at this moment he has around 1/3 of them on his aside according to more credible pollsters.

 

But, DeSantis does have almost as many people considering him as Trump and GOP voters do like him aside from the 10-12% that consider themselves MAGA/TRUMP Republicans and the eunuch/moderate/Neocon/NeverTrumpers.  The problem for DeSantis is that he hasn't been able to coalesce some of the more moderates and normies.  Christie pretty much owns the eunuch/Neocons, Scott/Haley/Burgum have a chunk of the moderate/normies.

 

DeSantis is a pretty hard right dude, and the only way he will be able to defeat Trump is if those voters that prefer Scott/Haley/Burgum make a calculated choice to maybe not go with their top guy but go with who can defeat Trump.

 

Vivek has a very low ceiling.  He appeals to Trump, Ron Paulish and some low propensity voters.  He's not going to eat into Trump's base, but maybe some of those that are considering Trump/DeSantis/Vivek.   Aside from that, he will never get any meaningful amount of moderate and normie types which make up a decent bit of the party.  There aren't enough votes for him to be had, the only way he can do that is by taking away the voters that are already in Trump's and to a much smaller degree DeSantis side.

 

Which btw, why is Vivek even running. if he considers Trump the greatest president of the 21st century?  https://www.politico.com/video/2023/08/24/vivek-ramaswamy-praises-trump-best-president-of-the-21st-century-1037286

Edited August 25, 2023 by Magox

[Pokebball]

3 hours ago, Magox said:

 

He's as big of a fraud as they come.

 

 

 

There are over 30 of these examples that he changed his positions in just the year alone 

 

He didn't poll the best and his net favorability dropped by more than anyone after the debate.

 

 

Vivek PharmaSwampy lol

He appears to be misquoted an awful lot

[Magox]

3 minutes ago, Pokebball said:

He appears to be misquoted an awful lot

 

It's not that he's misquoted, it's that he doesn't have a true core.   He says what people want to hear.

[SCBills]

51 minutes ago, Magox said:

 

I agree pretty much with everything you said.

 

Let's not kid ourselves, Trump is the heavy favorite and most likely going to be the nominee.  There is a lot of goodwill for him among Republicans, with that said he's not invincible.  He has by far the highest floor out of all the candidates which I'd say is probably around 30% in Iowa/NH/SC, and then there is another 30% considering him of which at this moment he has around 1/3 of them on his aside according to more credible pollsters.

 

But, DeSantis does have almost as many people considering him as Trump and GOP voters do like him aside from the 10-12% that consider themselves MAGA/TRUMP Republicans and the eunuch/moderate/Neocon/NeverTrumpers.  The problem for DeSantis is that he hasn't been able to coalesce some of the more moderates and normies.  Christie pretty much owns the eunuch/Neocons, Scott/Haley/Burgum have a chunk of the moderate/normies.

 

DeSantis is a pretty hard right dude, and the only way he will be able to defeat Trump is if those voters that prefer Scott/Haley/Burgum make a calculated choice to maybe not go with their top guy but go with who can defeat Trump.

 

Vivek has a very low ceiling.  He appeals to Trump, Ron Paulish and some low propensity voters.  He's not going to eat into Trump's base, but maybe some of those that are considering Trump/DeSantis/Vivek.   Aside from that, he will never get any meaningful amount of moderate and normie types which make up a decent bit of the party.  There aren't enough votes for him to be had, the only way he can do that is by taking away the voters that are already in Trump's and to a much smaller degree DeSantis side.

 

Which btw, why is Vivek even running. if he considers Trump the greatest president of the 21st century?  https://www.politico.com/video/2023/08/24/vivek-ramaswamy-praises-trump-best-president-of-the-21st-century-1037286

It’s pretty well known that Vivek is a Trump plant. 
 

He’s running to slice into DeSantis ability to dominate the the group of former Trump voters who now want an alternative.   Which is a pretty large group primary-wise, that includes myself. 
 

In a head to head, DeSantis, according to the newest Iowa poll today, is 3% behind Trump.  
 

In NH, Sununu is likely going to endorse DeSantis at some point. 
 

Problem is..  of course, as of now and the foreseeable future, this is not a head to head. 
 

Edited August 25, 2023 by SCBills

[Pokebball]

38 minutes ago, Magox said:

 

It's not that he's misquoted, it's that he doesn't have a true core.   He says what people want to hear.

Oh, he's misquoted an awful lot

[Magox]

36 minutes ago, Pokebball said:

Oh, he's misquoted an awful lot

 

I can't speak to others but I won't misquote him and I can assure you that there are tons of positions that he has taken that he did not hold just 6 months ago.

59 minutes ago, SCBills said:

It’s pretty well known that Vivek is a Trump plant. 
 

He’s running to slice into DeSantis ability to dominate the the group of former Trump voters who now want an alternative.   Which is a pretty large group primary-wise, that includes myself. 
 

In a head to head, DeSantis, according to the newest Iowa poll today, is 3% behind Trump.  
 

In NH, Sununu is likely going to endorse DeSantis at some point. 
 

Problem is..  of course, as of now and the foreseeable future, this is not a head to head. 
 

1 hour ago, Magox said:

 

I agree pretty much with everything you said.

 

Let's not kid ourselves, Trump is the heavy favorite and most likely going to be the nominee.  There is a lot of goodwill for him among Republicans, with that said he's not invincible.  He has by far the highest floor out of all the candidates which I'd say is probably around 30% in Iowa/NH/SC, and then there is another 30% considering him of which at this moment he has around 1/3 of them on his aside according to more credible pollsters.

 

But, DeSantis does have almost as many people considering him as Trump and GOP voters do like him aside from the 10-12% that consider themselves MAGA/TRUMP Republicans and the eunuch/moderate/Neocon/NeverTrumpers.  The problem for DeSantis is that he hasn't been able to coalesce some of the more moderates and normies.  Christie pretty much owns the eunuch/Neocons, Scott/Haley/Burgum have a chunk of the moderate/normies.

 

DeSantis is a pretty hard right dude, and the only way he will be able to defeat Trump is if those voters that prefer Scott/Haley/Burgum make a calculated choice to maybe not go with their top guy but go with who can defeat Trump.

 

Vivek has a very low ceiling.  He appeals to Trump, Ron Paulish and some low propensity voters.  He's not going to eat into Trump's base, but maybe some of those that are considering Trump/DeSantis/Vivek.   Aside from that, he will never get any meaningful amount of moderate and normie types which make up a decent bit of the party.  There aren't enough votes for him to be had, the only way he can do that is by taking away the voters that are already in Trump's and to a much smaller degree DeSantis side.

 

Which btw, why is Vivek even running. if he considers Trump the greatest president of the 21st century?  https://www.politico.com/video/2023/08/24/vivek-ramaswamy-praises-trump-best-president-of-the-21st-century-1037286

 

 

This right here speaks exactly to what I was just saying.  It looks like this polling data matches that.

 

 

[Magox]

2 hours ago, B-Man said:

 

 

The post-GOP debate fallout is always interesting to watch. Numbers shift, analyses are shared, insults are traded, and predictions are a dime a dozen. 

 

As RedState's been covering, polls are showing that the first winner of the debate seems to be Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, who remains second in terms of the GOP's likely primary winner. While many made little of his performance, his increasing approval rating as well as his decreasing unfavorability rating may reveal that the traction of the debate stage is where his campaign will start gaining real speed. 

 

DeSantis was going over what went down in a post-debate interview, and something he said caught my attention that I think is worth pondering. 

 

“The thing about the debate is, you know, nobody hit me so I wasn’t gonna get involved in that scrum," said DeSantis. " I know those guys were going back and forth."

"What I did with 100% of my time was to speak directly to the American people about our vision to reverse the country’s decline, what specifically we need to do, and most importantly what I’ve already done to show that I can do this nationally," he continued. "Of anyone on the stage, I’m the only guy that’s actually delivered on all the things that our voters care about.”

 

But no one wanted to take a shot at DeSantis? 

 

I'm sure a lot of conspiracy theories can be cooked up here, but DeSantis might very well have touched on why. Florida is proof of his leadership, which is stellar whether you want to vote for him or not. Before the election, he was America's favorite governor because of his ability to take on the left without blinking, as well as turning his state into a conservative powerhouse. 

 

https://redstate.com/brandon_morse/2023/08/25/are-the-other-candidates-afraid-of-ron-desantis-n2163039

 

 

.

 

 

Yes, it's difficult to after DeSantis on substance and policy.  You aren't going to outflank him from the right, you aren't going to go after him on his ability to win a purple state and you most definitely aren't going to go after him for getting ***** done that us righties care about.   He's bar none the most accomplished person running along with Trump.  I'd argue more impressive wins than Trump but we can leave that argument for another day.

 

Check out what Mark Levin today just had to say about about DeSantis.  It's a 6 minute clip.

 

He also happens to share a similar view of some of what I said on Vivek, that he's an empty slate that talks of doing revolutions when in fact he hasn't done squat for righties and the only one on that debate stage that has done things is DeSantis.

 

 

[Joe Ferguson forever]

6 hours ago, Magox said:

 

This is the first post debate poll commissioned by 538/IPSOS/WP, it polled 775 Likely voters and caucus goers and it polled people before and after the debate.

It only measured people who watched the debate.

 

DeSantis first with 29% and Vivek second with 26% of "Who won the debate".   I'd venture to guess that the majority of Vivek's 26% are identify as MAGA Trump Republicans who won't vote for him anyway.

 

This was interesting, you can see inside the internals that DeSantis despite being by far the most attacked candidate with over $20M against him in paid attack ads, Trump constantly bashing him and the Corporate legacy media who loathes DeSantis is viewed most favorably by GOP voters.   Btw, DeSantis is consistently at or near the top in favorability poll after poll. 

 

Interesting Nugget, people who didn't have an opinion of Vivek going into this debate, his net favorability fell by - 9 which is more than anyone else.  I'm guessing its because he comes across as annoying and slick to most people.

 

 

According to this poll and the people who watched the debate, more people are considering voting for DeSantis than anyone else, including Trump.  Trump actually lost 5 points from people they polled right before the debate to the people after the debate.    Haley had the biggest gain of +17 of who are considering voting for her.  I knew she'd do well in the debates even though I don't align with some of her positions.

 

 

 

Interesting stats.  My takeaways

people already see thru Vivek.  He'll drop more one his biz details emerge

Haley did very well up 6 points.  Maybe there still is a moderate wing to the R party

Desantis apparently did well.  Seemed a cold, calculated fish to me.  lots of red meat for the base

Speaking of which, lots of them were watching tucker...

Lastly, virtue and honor don't pay in the R party.  I thought Pence was great even tho I disagree with him on policy.

Edited August 25, 2023 by Joe Ferguson forever

[Joe Ferguson forever]

11 minutes ago, Magox said:

you aren't going to go after him on his ability to win a purple state

Wisconsin, Michigan, New Mexico, Nevada, Georgia and even NC are very different from Fla which i think is now firmly red.  We'll see.  Suburban moms are a big deal.

[Magox]

1 minute ago, Joe Ferguson forever said:

Interesting stats.  My takeaways

people already see thru Vivek.  He'll drop more one his biz details emerge

Haley did very well up 6 points.  Maybe there still is a moderate wing to the R party

Desantis apparently did well.  Seemed a cold, calculated fish to me.  lots of red meat for the base

Speaking of which, lots of them were watching tucker...

 

Believe it or not, they weren't.  That number that you see that they keep throwing out is a completely fabricated number.  All that means is how many times it showed up in someone's feed.   So the same person could just scroll through it a number of times and that person could have hundreds of views in a short time period.  Specially when you take into account that Elon pinned it on his X account.

 

There were only about 14 million who watched at least 2 seconds of it and about 7% of those 14 million which is about a million watched the entire video.

 

So 1 million for Tucker and 13 million for the Debate.

 

 

Quote

To break down what this means for Tucker Carlson's Trump interview: The video itself was actually played only 14.8 million times, for at least two seconds of the more than 46-minute interview — or just over six percent of the total 236 million times someone saw the post on X.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In terms of DeSantis, yes he's kind of a quirky dude.  And he does use some canned lines, no doubt about it.   If I were on his team, I would just suggest to him to not have any rehearsed lines and speak naturally.

 

There is no one on that stage that can speak to the substance as well as DeSantis.  I've been watching him for years and when he does interviews, the dude is just straight up knowledgeable about these topics.    He needs to embrace his inner nerdiness and speak substantively which is he more than capable of doing.

 

However, they set out what they wanted to do which is talk about the things they care about and let that huge audience of 13 million hear it.

 

 

 

3 minutes ago, Joe Ferguson forever said:

Wisconsin, Michigan, New Mexico, Nevada, Georgia and even NC are very different from Fla which i think is now firmly red.  We'll see.  Suburban moms are a big deal.

 

Have a listen to that Mark Levin 6 minute segment I put up above.   

 

DeSantis won his initial race by less than 1 point against at that time a rising African American star in Gillum.   lol

 

He transformed that state into a plus 1 state into a plus 19, so they aren't a swing state any longer.

 

Wisconsin is a state I believe tailor made out of those 3 for DeSantis.  A lot of suburbs which Trump struggles with where DeSantis would do much better and his credentials should do well in the rest of the state aside from the cities of course.

[Joe Ferguson forever]

8 minutes ago, Magox said:

 

Believe it or not, they weren't.  That number that you see that they keep throwing out is a completely fabricated number.  All that means is how many times it showed up in someone's feed.   So the same person could just scroll through it a number of times and that person could have hundreds of views in a short time period.  Specially when you take into account that Elon pinned it on his X account.

 

There were only about 14 million who watched at least 2 seconds of it and about 7% of those 14 million which is about a million watched the entire video.

 

So 1 million for Tucker and 13 million for the Debate.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In terms of DeSantis, yes he's kind of a quirky dude.  And he does use some canned lines, no doubt about it.   If I were on his team, I would just suggest to him to not have any rehearsed lines and speak naturally.

 

There is no one on that stage that can speak to the substance as well as DeSantis.  I've been watching him for years and when he does interviews, the dude is just straight up knowledgeable about these topics.    He needs to embrace his inner nerdiness and speak substantively which is he more than capable of doing.

 

However, they set out what they wanted to do which is talk about the things they care about and let that huge audience of 13 million hear it.

 

 

 

 

Have a listen to that Mark Levin 6 minute segment I put up above.   

 

DeSantis won his initial race by less than 1 point against at that time a rising African American star in Gillum.   lol

 

He transformed that state into a plus 1 state into a plus 19, so they aren't a swing state any longer.

 

Wisconsin is a state I believe tailor made out of those 3 for DeSantis.  A lot of suburbs which Trump struggles with where DeSantis would do much better and his credentials should do well in the rest of the state aside from the cities of course.

i think his abortion stance will hurt him.  I think Haley can talk policy, especially foreign policy with more gravitas.  But I'm not good at reading R sentiments anymore...

[Magox]

5 minutes ago, Joe Ferguson forever said:

i think his abortion stance will hurt him.  I think Haley can talk policy, especially foreign policy with more gravitas.  But I'm not good at reading R sentiments anymore...

 

In Iowa it won't hurt him or for that matter SC.  But, there are some states that believe it will hurt his electability in a general.   Some of his donors don't like that he did the 6 week abortion bill.

 

However, he isn't forcefully saying it, he's trying to kind of have it both ways but if you hear what he says, he would leave it up to the states to decide which is the right approach.  When they press him on it, he basically just says "I will be a pro life president".

 

 

[Magox]

Two more polls showing DeSantis with a pretty big bump after the debate.

 

Vivek, pretty flat.  That's just because most of his supporters are supporters of Trump.