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YoloinOhio

Bills DB coach John Butler reportedly in consideration for position with Browns

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1 minute ago, YoloinOhio said:

There is still a possibility that the Browns keep Wilks. There is some buzz that he could stay.They are trying not to change too much. They are keeping the ST coordinator who Stefanski worked with in Minnesota. 

That is smart. But if Wade Phillips is the hire at DC that was talked about last night (not sure if official) they really should get whoever wade wants as long as they can and not blocked by other teams 

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19 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d815667b9/article/changing-coaching-staffs-isnt-as-easy-for-teams-as-it-once-was%3fnetworkId=4595&site=.news&zone=story&zoneUrl=url%3Dstory&zoneKeys=s1%3Dstory&env&pageKeyValues=team%3Dcin%3bteam%3Dbal%3bteam%3Dwas%3bteam%3Dmin%3bconf%3Dafc%3bconf%3Dnfc%3bdvsn%3Dacn%3bdvsn%3Dnce%3bdvsn%3Dncn%3bplyr%3Dray_lewis%3bplyr%3Djake_delhomme%3bplyr%3Dleon_hall&sr=amp
 

all coaches are assistants and considered lateral moves EXCEPT the HC position. So everyone on Staff can be blocked from interviews for other staff. 
 

they cannot be blocked for HC. 
 

same in FO only position that cannot be blocked is GM. 
 

that is the issue when trying to put your staff together late. Time to look at those that are unemployed Browns. Every team should block your requests at this point. 

Wilks (Browns old DC) was also The DB coach in Carolina when McD was there 

 

I wish you’d use the actual link and not that google abomination.  Any chance you could edit?

 

The point is “assistant HC” title is NOT the HC position.

 

So even if they offer him the title “assistant HC” he can be blocked if he’s under contract.

 

I would not let John Butler to the Browns.  Now if they’re making him DC, then I could see McDermott “doing the right thing” to let his guy get a jump.

But a lateral move with “assistant HC” tacked on, that’s a “No” for me.

 

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4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I wish you’d use the actual link and not that google abomination.  Any chance you could edit?

 

The point is “assistant HC” title is NOT the HC position.

 

So even if they offer him the title “assistant HC” he can be blocked if he’s under contract.

 

I would not let John Butler to the Browns.  Now if they’re making him DC, then I could see McDermott “doing the right thing” to let his guy get a jump.

But a lateral move with “assistant HC” tacked on, that’s a “No” for me.

 

 

Fixed

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Man, F the Browns.

 

Keep Butler here.

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Man, Wade just can't step away from the game.    I guess he'll die with his boots on...

 

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Most teams will let their assistant coaches explore other coaching positions in the NFL (as well as college), for one very good reason.  If, as an employer, they are real stinkwads about letting coaches out of contracts, the best candidates to fill their vacancies may hesitant to take a job, knowing they could be denied a chance to land a dream job later.

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10 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

Is his contract up? Not sure what he would do that would be considered a promotion if Phillips is the DC

 

Who is this Dustin Fox guy anyway?  Or maybe because our DL coach did a lateral move to college they figure it’s open season on any of the Bills assistants, despite what McDermott said about wanting to keep as much of the team (specifically mentioned coaches) intact as possible?

 

I think the DL coach was a special case.  We had problems on DL at times, and maybe Frazier or McD felt they had to mix it in to the DL room more than they wished.  Maybe McD just wanted his buddy from Carolina on his team, and told the guy “hey, if you’ve got an opportunity elsewhere, take it, nudge nudge catch my drift?”

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2 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

I wonder what Gil Byrd is up to these days 

What about Donnie Henderson?

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9 hours ago, ganesh said:

They can't stop him from interviewing if the positions title includes  Assistant HC or  Assistant DC in addition to being the DB coach.  

 

Yes they can.

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If the guy wants to go, does it make sense to force him to stay?  Does it create bad feelings?

Awkward work environment?

I know..   it’s a job, it pays a ton of money, just shut up and get to work.  Human nature sometimes is stronger than logic, or money. 

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29 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Who is this Dustin Fox guy anyway?  Or maybe because our DL coach did a lateral move to college they figure it’s open season on any of the Bills assistants, despite what McDermott said about wanting to keep as much of the team (specifically mentioned coaches) intact as possible?

 

I think the DL coach was a special case.  We had problems on DL at times, and maybe Frazier or McD felt they had to mix it in to the DL room more than they wished.  Maybe McD just wanted his buddy from Carolina on his team, and told the guy “hey, if you’ve got an opportunity elsewhere, take it, nudge nudge catch my drift?”

Dustin Fox actually used to play for the Bills. One of the last white NFL CBs.

 

he does a radio show in Cleveland and is a sideline reporter for the Browns.

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29 minutes ago, TigerJ said:

Most teams will let their assistant coaches explore other coaching positions in the NFL (as well as college), for one very good reason.  If, as an employer, they are real stinkwads about letting coaches out of contracts, the best candidates to fill their vacancies may hesitant to take a job, knowing they could be denied a chance to land a dream job later.

 Do you consider a pure lateral move to be a DB coach a dream job??  I think you're making more out of a potential block than there is. 

Daboll interviewed for HC and most coaches would understand if the Bills deny this purely lateral interview.

If Bills denied a position coach the chance to be a coordinator then you might have a good point. 

Quite frankly, I would think less of the FO if they allowed an excellent position coach the opportunity to interview for a pure lateral move.

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The real question I wish someone would answer is if the Browns are allowed to hire an assistant coach from a team that is owned by someone who also owns an NHL franchise?  I seem to recall an obscure ruling on this topic.

 

I think it was U.S. vs. Fishbein.

 

 

Edited by eball

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21 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Dustin Fox actually used to play for the Bills. One of the last white NFL CBs.

 

he does a radio show in Cleveland and is a sideline reporter for the Browns.


So a Chris Brown type but who knows more football?

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4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:


So a Chris Brown type but who knows more football?

More of a Sal  Capaccio 

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11 hours ago, TwistofFate said:

Whats with Cleveland trying to poach everything from front office to coordinator and now positional coaches from us. 

 

Im really starting to hate them. 

 

Now we know how the Carolina Panthers must feel.

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Just now, Happy Gilmore said:

 

Now we know how the Carolina Panthers must feel.

At least there is a connection there though 

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1 minute ago, YoloinOhio said:

At least there is a connection there though 

 

I'm sure that is of no consolation to Panther fans.  It just shows that someone rarely looks at the 30 other NFL teams for resources, because of the connection.

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6 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said:

 

I'm sure that is of no consolation to Panther fans.  It just shows that someone rarely looks at the 30 other NFL teams for resources, because of the connection.

Consolation to their fans - who are you referring to that they would need that? The Bills haven’t taken any coaches from them that weren’t fired. Eric Washington was not retained by Matt Rhule. Outside of Heath Farwell who was promoted here,  the Bills have hired no coaches or FO personnel from the panthers since Beane and McDermott got here.  The panthers did however hire Rob Hanrahan from the Bills. 

Edited by YoloinOhio

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If Butler wants to stay he will go to Bills and say deny the interview. 
 

they will talk to him before denying anything. But ultimately it is up to Bills. 
 

at no point in the NFL have teams not been able to hire and attract coaching talent because they deny lateral moves. 

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11 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Consolation to their fans - who are you referring to that they would need that? The Bills haven’t taken any coaches from them that weren’t fired. Eric Washington was not retained by Matt Rhule. Outside of Heath Farwell who was promoted here,  the Bills have hired no coaches or FO personnel from the panthers since Beane and McDermott got here.  The panthers did however hire Rob Hanrahan from the Bills. 

 

There were pretty pissed about Beane leaving, who was supposed to take over from Dave Gettleman.

Other than that, a number of players, who in hindsight we actually did them a favor such as Benjamin.  Don't think they miss Star, either.

McD likes his Carolina connection, and I'm not the only one who has pointed this out.  It has been mentioned in articles over the past year or so.

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1 hour ago, The Jokeman said:

What about Donnie Henderson?

Hasn’t coached in the nfl since the Bills in 2016. Coached in cfl this year. 

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2 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said:

 

There were pretty pissed about Beane leaving, who was supposed to take over from Dave Gettleman.

Other than that, a number of players, who in hindsight we actually did them a favor such as Benjamin.  Don't think they miss Star, either.

McD likes his Carolina connection, and I'm not the only one who has pointed this out.  It has been mentioned in articles over the past year or so.


Well they could have easily kept Beane buy making him the GM. They didn’t do it and lost him. That is on Panthers to only fire Gettleman what a couple months after Beane left? 

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When you're team gets better, people want your guys. It's that simple... no one is combing the bottom of the league for coaching talent, they always look up.  Right now we're top half of the league overall, an our Defensive staff is STACKED, so people are noticing.

 

People are getting upset that we may lose a guy... we lost a D-Line coach and got a better one to replace him.  While it stinks not having continuity, I'm not really worried about losing positional coaches on the defensive side.  We have too many talented coaches over there for it to really matter losing just 1.  It's good if you can become a coaching factory, means you're luring in the best and brightest and you're developing them.  Also means you're good for an extended period of time.  

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Various organizations handle the lateral moves to another organization in different ways.   The corporation I was in for 35 years, allowed management to deny a lateral move if they wanted to.......but, could not deny a promotion interview unless you have concrete plans for that individual to be promoted in the near term.  Maybe the Bills coach wants to go...who knows.  Maybe he doesn't.  And, nobody here at this website seems to know the actual rules of engagement on these matters in the NFL. (although many here say its a two level game.....HC and others.  I doubt that myself as DC is a bigger title than DB  coach and would lead to more HC opportunities)

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