[Incomplete Title] Sabres (21-12-5) & NHL 2018-19 - Game 39 (MSG-B) vs. BOS (20-14-4) at 7 PM ET on 12/29

[Seanbillsfan2206]

2 hours ago, Jauronimo said:

I'll take that bet but you seem very sure so I want odds.  3/1 they don't win the Cup next year.

One million dollars

[JohnC]

32 minutes ago, GG said:

 

Against better judgment I went through the thread.  It struck me odd that they complained most that Botts didn't get a D-man in return.  The proper response would have been - yeah, sure would have been nice to get Myers, Pysyk & McNabb in return

This was a fair-value deal for the Sabres and for the Blues. If Tag can develop and contribute then it would be a very good deal for us. As I said in prior posts no one is going to be hustled for or against. We made a deal that suited our interests and they did the same. 

 

I really hope that Bogo can stay healthy and play to his talents. He fits in with the Housley system because he is such a good skater. I just wish he would be less of a banger and be more of a skating and puck moving defenseman. That might help to keep him healthier. 

[Fadingpain]

6 minutes ago, JohnC said:

This was a fair-value deal for the Sabres and for the Blues. If Tag can develop and contribute then it would be a very good deal for us. As I said in prior posts no one is going to be hustled for or against. We made a deal that suited our interests and they did the same. 

 

I really hope that Bogo can stay healthy and play to his talents. He fits in with the Housley system because he is such a good skater. I just wish he would be less of a banger and be more of a skating and puck moving defenseman. That might help to keep him healthier. 

Bogo is a bust and he is on the way out the door.  Just a question of when he goes. 

 

I was all in favor of moving ROR but I'm not sure we got enough in return.  We got a lot of parts, but not sure any of them add up to what we should have gotten.  ROR is the best face-off man in the league and a really strong defensive center man.  He is worth his weight in gold to the right team.

 

Unfortunately, the Sabres are not the right team at this point in his career.  His age is too out of whack with our developing core of players anyway.  He didn't fit plus he was actively engaged in a "Trade me" campaign all last year...

 

He needed to move on, just hope one of the pieces coming back matures into something special.

 

 

[Dante]

On 7/1/2018 at 10:16 AM, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

They will score plenty of goals, but their defense corps and goaltending are question marks. 

After watching the Leafs in the playoffs this spring I didn't think they would go in this direction. I mean, it's never a bad thing getting Taveras. But the playoffs showed a definite lack of grit and defensive competency. I thought the smarter move for them would be to sign James Neal (6 million) who is a playoff stud. 

Then make a deal with the Kings for Dana Muzzin on D. Capable, playoff proven gritty and solid as it gets. Kings need team speed and Leafs have lots of that they could deal.

Anyway, reportedly the Sharks were offering JT upwards of 13 million per year. I don't know,  I would have been a little uncomfortable with that. I would rather have someone like Neal and another real good player for the same price.

[JohnC]

32 minutes ago, Fadingpain said:

Bogo is a bust and he is on the way out the door.  Just a question of when he goes. 

 

I was all in favor of moving ROR but I'm not sure we got enough in return.  We got a lot of parts, but not sure any of them add up to what we should have gotten.  ROR is the best face-off man in the league and a really strong defensive center man.  He is worth his weight in gold to the right team.

 

Unfortunately, the Sabres are not the right team at this point in his career.  His age is too out of whack with our developing core of players anyway.  He didn't fit plus he was actively engaged in a "Trade me" campaign all last year...

 

He needed to move on, just hope one of the pieces coming back matures into something special.

 

 

We got what we could get for him. There were other teams interested in him so it is obvious that our GM felt that the Blues offer was the best in the market. Not only did the GM move out a player who didn't want to be here and a player the GM believed that he needed to move but he moved a player with a long term expensive contract. That certainly will help in the not too distant future when he has to re-sign his players and acquire players. 

 

As you indicated a more accurate evaluation of this deal will come in the future when the younger player and picks in the deal can be more accurately assessed. Overall, I have no problem with this deal. 

[26CornerBlitz]

44 minutes ago, Dante said:

After watching the Leafs in the playoffs this spring I didn't think they would go in this direction. I mean, it's never a bad thing getting Taveras. But the playoffs showed a definite lack of grit and defensive competency. I thought the smarter move for them would be to sign James Neal (6 million) who is a playoff stud. 

Then make a deal with the Kings for Dana Muzzin on D. Capable, playoff proven gritty and solid as it gets. Kings need team speed and Leafs have lots of that they could deal.

Anyway, reportedly the Sharks were offering JT upwards of 13 million per year. I don't know,  I would have been a little uncomfortable with that. I would rather have someone like Neal and another real good player for the same price.

 

Hard to pass up on a great player like JT at a discount.  We'll see what other moves they have in store, but they have to take care of Matthews, Marner, and Nylander. 

[26CornerBlitz]

That would be interesting to say the least.

[26CornerBlitz]

7-2: Lou Korac of NHL.com with Sal Capaccio on the Ryan O'Reilly trade (17:36)

[26CornerBlitz]

From The Athletic:

Oh, really! Just when a trade for Ryan O'Reilly looked dead,...

 

Armstrong was somehow able to make the deal without giving up the Blues’ top prospects: Thomas, Jordan Kyrou and Klim Kostin.

 

“I know Buffalo is really excited about Tage Thompson,” Armstrong said. “We didn’t want to give Tage up, either, but we do value Robert Thomas as a centerman. I think I’ve been pretty consistent for a while that we weren’t trading him until we know exactly what he can do because center icemen are hard to find. And Kyrou is a player that really excites us just with his speed. You have to give to get, and giving up Tage was difficult, but we’re excited about our return.”

 

Thompson, 20, was the Blues’ first-round pick in 2016. He played 41 NHL games as a rookie last season out of necessity and had his moments, registering three goals and nine points. But the 6-foot-5, 205-pound right winger also showed some flaws that might have worried the Blues.

 

“Tage, listen, I think he’s got potential,” said Corey Pronman, The Athletic‘s prospect guru. “I think he might be a second-line forward one day. He’s 6-foot-5, he’s got high-end puck skills, a high-end shot, makes plays. But he doesn’t play with pace, he takes shifts off here and there, and he’s got some room to develop. I think with Buffalo, he’ll be a potential second-line, third-line guy, play some power play. That’s what I see him topping out as. You didn’t want to lose Thomas, and you didn’t want to lose Kyrou. Those are the two big pieces, and you couldn’t lose either two of those guys, particularly Thomas. I did not see any way they could have included him.”

[KD in CA]

32 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

But he doesn’t play with pace, he takes shifts off here and there

 

He doesn’t sound like a ‘process’ guy.

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, KD in CA said:

He doesn’t sound like a ‘process’ guy.

 

Depends on the situation or scenario. 

[BillsFan4]

https://apnews.com/f4b8d724ec614d8fa2c61bc0daeaf785

 

This article leaves little doubt in my mind that he wanted/needed a trade.

 

Quote

"I couldn't be happier going to St. Louis. I'm absolutely thrilled," he said. "I feel like I have a spark in me now. It's something different."

 

 

 

Quote

“There’s something different. It’s interesting how it happened, but I’m happy, I’m excited and I don’t regret anything that’s happened."

 

 

 

I take that as he doesn't regret saying what he did even though it led to a trade, which makes me think maybe that was part of his end goal?

 

 

Quote

“My first year in Buffalo, I was really trying to feel things out, and being kind of young at that time, getting that contract, I don’t think I kind of got a hold of the situation as best I could have,” O’Reilly said. “I don’t think I was ready for that situation as best as possible. But I think going to St. Louis with all the kinds of things in play, the veterans that they have there, that it’s something that’s easier to kind of jump into.”

 

 

I take that as him Saying he basically wasn't equipped to handle the situation in Buffalo, and will be a much better fit on a veteran team, where he doesn't have the burden of being looked at as a leader.

 

 

Quote

“He’s got great passion for the sport,” Armstrong said. “He’s got great passion to compete and to win and hopefully this gives him the boost that he feels is necessary that he can come in here and quite honestly we need that boost.”

 

 

 

Sounds like he may have possibly mentioned something to Doug Armstrong about feeling that he needed a change of scenery to get that "boost" or passion back in his game.

 

 

 

I don't know, maybe it's just me looking for reasons he had to be traded, but I am becoming more and more convinced that it had to happen.

Edited July 3, 2018 by BillsFan4

[eball]

The more I look at this trade the more I believe it was a good trade for both teams.  ROR doesn't have to be looked at as the "leader" and can fit in with the vets on that team and do what he does.  He clearly doesn't have the mental makeup to be "the man" -- that was evident in his admission after the season, and even in the comments he made about his first year there.  St. Louis is a good landing spot and I bet he'll do well.

 

The Sabres accomplished a significant goal of removing a potentially negative presence when they've got a group of young guys they want to build around.  Even if you don't believe ROR's presence was "negative" it certainly wasn't the leadership role they wanted/needed from him.  In return they got two very solid vets (who are also pretty good faceoff men) and a prospect with a potential top 6 ceiling.  Not to mention the draft picks.  Most importantly, they acquired veterans (including Hutton in this also) who bring the type of character they're trying to build in the room.

[GG]

And once again, Crayonz nailed it.

[26CornerBlitz]

7-3: Newest Sabres' Goalie Carter Hutton with Jeremy White on WGR (8:49)

 

Newest #Sabres goalie Carter Hutton (@CarterHutton) joins Jeremy White right now on WGR! Tune in:

 

Hutton - Buffalo was the right fit all around, it made sense. Me knowing Jerry Forton, Andrew Allen, and Phil Housley, it was a comfort factor for me. Just to be part of the turn around is something I take pride in. Looking forward to it. #Sabres

 

Hutton - we haven't talked a ton of numbers, but I think the main goal is for me to come in and win hockey games while not rushing Linus Ullmark. You don't want things to get rushed for him. I'm committed to the team and here to help everyone get better. #Sabres

 

Hutton - I try not to get caught up in the numbers and what's going on stats wise. As I've gotten more mature and come into the NHL, you just go out and focus on winning hockey games. If we're winning and playing well, the rest will take care of itself. #Sabres

 

Hutton - The #Sabres thought that with the younger group that's on the team, I'd bring some good veteran leadership. Guys know who I am and what I am about, and the younger guys will be able to lean on me. #Sabres

 

Hutton - I think the guys coming to Buffalo in the O'Reilly trade will be excited knowing that I am coming along with them as well. #Sabres

[plenzmd1]

1 hour ago, GG said:

And once again, Crayonz nailed it.

Plenty of us here who believe in advanced stats could see ROR was not getting it done as early as January of his 2nd year. Going back to that year one could also see that Risto was really struggling as well..team had much better possession numbers and entries when Risto was not on the ice. I was getting killed on here for saying they were better with him off the ice. Now folks are starting to come around on that a bit. 

 

I know I was early, but I was off the GMTM bandwagon with the Lehner and Pysck trades, as was Craoynz. He was a little more vocal about his hate for Lehner...but lots of folks hated that trade.

 

I will grant we were two of the early ones saying Murray talked a great game and gave great interview...but those two trades just convinced me dude was an idiot and had to go.

 

Also funny when I think back to the arguments we had that year whether to trade Kane or not. I was convinced that core was never going to work, and wanted a Kane trade that year, not last year. Think you could have received a much better return if he was not a pure rental, but no way GMTM was getting rid of one of "his" guys. 

Edited July 3, 2018 by plenzmd1

[Dr. Who]

12 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

Plenty of us here who believe in advanced stats could see ROR was not getting it done as early as January of his 2nd year. Going back to that year one could also see that Risto was really struggling as well..team had much better possession numbers and entries when Risto was not on the ice. I was getting killed on here for saying they were better with him off the ice. Now folks are starting to come around on that a bit. 

What is your current opinion of Risto? I still think with reduced minutes, he can be valuable to the team going forward. Some seem to think he is a good chip to help acquire a top six winger. I dunno. Certainly, Botterill has now packed the pipeline for D.

[Dante]

18 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Hard to pass up on a great player like JT at a discount.  We'll see what other moves they have in store, but they have to take care of Matthews, Marner, and Nylander. 

 

It would be great karma if the Sharks submitted an offer sheet for Matthews next year. Since we will have lots of cap space.  Him being a hometown boy (San Ramon, Ca)he can come home just like Tavares!

[shrader]

59 minutes ago, Dante said:

It would be great karma if the Sharks submitted an offer sheet for Matthews next year. Since we will have lots of cap space.  Him being a hometown boy (San Ramon, Ca)he can come home just like Tavares!

 

I'm not sure what the purpose of an offer sheet would be.  Toronto is going to back the brinks truck up to his house anyway.  You can't stick them with a cap hit they weren't already expecting and they certainly don't have any issues with spending money.

[Dante]

44 minutes ago, shrader said:

 

I'm not sure what the purpose of an offer sheet would be.  Toronto is going to back the brinks truck up to his house anyway.  You can't stick them with a cap hit they weren't already expecting and they certainly don't have any issues with spending money.

I know they can. Funny thing is this move doesn't address any of their weaknesses. They still don't win the cup. At least with their current lineup. 

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[BillsFan4]

3 hours ago, Dante said:

It would be great karma if the Sharks submitted an offer sheet for Matthews next year. Since we will have lots of cap space.  Him being a hometown boy (San Ramon, Ca)he can come home just like Tavares!

 

He was born in CA, but he moved to Arizona when he was just an infant. That is where he was raised and considers home. 

 

But i I still hope SJ offer-sheets him! That would be amazing. lol 

[Dante]

11 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said:

 

He was born in CA, but he moved to Arizona when he was just an infant. That is where he was raised and considers home. 

 

But i I still hope SJ offer-sheets him! That would be amazing. lol 

I know it's a stretch claiming him as Bay Area. What the hell why not?

[plenzmd1]

 

6 hours ago, Dr. Who said:

What is your current opinion of Risto? I still think with reduced minutes, he can be valuable to the team going forward. Some seem to think he is a good chip to help acquire a top six winger. I dunno. Certainly, Botterill has now packed the pipeline for D.

I think he has a long way to go. As many mention, maybe reduced minutes and responsibility playing on a 2nd pair open's his game up, but there is no doubt he has regressed the past two seasons.

2 hours ago, shrader said:

 

I'm not sure what the purpose of an offer sheet would be.  Toronto is going to back the brinks truck up to his house anyway.  You can't stick them with a cap hit they weren't already expecting and they certainly don't have any issues with spending money.

If you are going to offer sheet anyone next year, its Marner. That's the one that will put a hurting on their cap. Like you said, Matthews aint getting out of there......although there is some rumblings up that way maybe Babcock wins a war between the two..have to see where THAT goes this season.

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[BillsFan4]

16 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

 

I think he has a long way to go. As many mention, maybe reduced minutes and responsibility playing on a 2nd pair open's his game up, but there is no doubt he has regressed the past two seasons.

If you are going to offer sheet anyone next year, its Marner. That's the one that will put a hurting on their cap. Like you said, Matthews aint getting out of there......although there is some rumblings up that way maybe Babcock wins a war between the two..have to see where THAT goes this season.

 

Personally,I think/hope Ristolainen just needs a better defensive partner and reduced minutes (as well as a better overall team surrounding him, obviously).

 

You already seen his underlying analytics get better this season, when he finally got to play with a competent D partner (Scandella). 

 

Risto has just been in over his head in his time in Buffalo. Such a young kid shouldn't be playing close to 30mins a night (which was like top 3, or close to it, in the entire NHL iirc). Especially with no help. And his QoC is damn tough too. He plays some of the toughest minutes/match ups in the NHL. 

 

I am very anxious to see what a reduced role and a bit of sheltering (like every other young defenseman gets the benefit of) will do for Risto's game. As well as a better team around him. It's hard to put up good underlying numbers on such a bad, low scoring team (especially when you're on the ice for 1/2 the game). 

 

I am hopeful you will see a much better version of Rasmus Ristolainen once Dahlin gets himself established. 

 

 

 

 

As far as Matthews/Marner, I doubt you'll be able to pry either out of Toronto. But if the goal of an offer sheet is to screw the Leafs salary cap and maybe shake loose other good players, or as revenge in the case of Lou Lamoriello, I actually think Matthews might be more susceptible to an offer sheet than Marner. 

 

Mitch Marner is a hometown Toronto boy. Grew up a leafs fan and is living his dream, just like Tavares.   Who knows, He may not even be willing to sign an offer sheet (unless TO is really low-balling him or something). 

 

Matthews though, he's an Arizona boy and he could be a malcontent by then. There's already rumors of a rift already. I can see why...

 

Matthews plays about 15mins ES per game. And about 2mins of PP time. 

Most young stars, and top line players, play about 20+ ES per game, and about 4mins on the PP (or at least 3+). 

 

If Bozak was taking away ES and PP time from Matthews, I don't see it getting any better with John Tavares there. You know Babcock is playing him as #1C. 

 

 Most likely they get both locked up before July 1st next year.

 

It will be interesting to follow, though. A free agent like JT basically never hit the market, so we've never seen a team who has such a good, young #1C already, go out into free agency and sign a #1C to one of the biggest contracts in the NHL. 

 

 

 

3 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

 Looks like it's for $1.5M 

 

https://www.capfriendly.com/players/robin-lehner

[plenzmd1]

Good points Billsfan, and I am hopeful as well he comes back to his form of two years ago. 

 

The Matthews thing could get interesting, I agree. But absent coach/player drama , I think Mathews will absolutely be getting what JT did, if not more , but maybe not so Marner. So I think the Leafs would plan on getting Mitch for a bit cheaper.. and that’s where ya hit! 

 

 

[BillsFan4]

1 hour ago, plenzmd1 said:

Good points Billsfan, and I am hopeful as well he comes back to his form of two years ago. 

 

The Matthews thing could get interesting, I agree. But absent coach/player drama , I think Mathews will absolutely be getting what JT did, if not more , but maybe not so Marner. So I think the Leafs would plan on getting Mitch for a bit cheaper.. and that’s where ya hit! 

 

 

Very true about Marner. 

 

I heard he was going to be asking for Eichel money... 

 

 I found it interesting that both Matthews and Marner wanted to wait until next offseason to sign extensions, instead of signing now (since they are eligible for a new deal as of July 1st). 

 

That tells me that they are both looking to get Paid. 

 

I don't know if signing JT changes anything... Maybe his contract will serve as a "cap" for the team, where no one will want to ask for more than $11M now? Hope not, though. I want to see Matthews/Marner sign for as much as possible! lol (or get offer-sheeted...)

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[snafu]

4 hours ago, plenzmd1 said:

Good points Billsfan, and I am hopeful as well he comes back to his form of two years ago. 

 

The Matthews thing could get interesting, I agree. But absent coach/player drama , I think Mathews will absolutely be getting what JT did, if not more , but maybe not so Marner. So I think the Leafs would plan on getting Mitch for a bit cheaper.. and that’s where ya hit! 

 

 

 

Though I tend to agree with your assessment of him, I would hate it if they traded Ristolainen. Especially now that the focus is properly on upgrading the D corps. I think we will see him settle in as an indispensable vet this coming year.  Overall, I like the blueline moves so far, and I'm actually looking forward to seeing how this team progresses this season. It is a work in progress, but the direction seems right. I can see the "process" with the Sabres more than I see it with the Bills. 

 

[BillsFan4]

Wow. 

 

I still cant believe that, for the Senators, it has actually come to trading Erik Karlsson.

I don't really see how you can win that trade... 

 

Heard they may have actually offered him $10M per year, which is kind of surprising if true (you know, Melnyk and all...). I guess EK wants $11M (Doughty deal). They said neither party is at all interested in budging from their number.

 

if EK would truly stay for $1M more per year, why wouldn't you do it?!! 

 

By this point there's probably a lot more to it though. 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

On 7/3/2018 at 10:56 PM, BillsFan4 said:

Wow. 

 

I still cant believe that, for the Senators, it has actually come to trading Erik Karlsson.

I don't really see how you can win that trade... 

 

...By this point there's probably a lot more to it though. 

Intentional tank?  I'm just speculating.

Edited July 6, 2018 by Ridgewaycynic2013
You know you're OCD when 2 days later, you edit punctuation.

[BillsFan4]

On 7/4/2018 at 6:46 AM, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

Intentional tank?  I'm just speculating,   

 

Yeah, It kind of seems like they're going into full rebuild mode. 

 

But, they don't have their 1st round pick next year! 

 

They sent it to Colorado in that Matt Duchene trade. And there's no top 0 protection.

Colorado could damn well end up with the #1 overall pick... 

 

Poor Senators fans. lol 

On 7/3/2018 at 6:08 PM, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

 

Lou Lamoriello says "Because I'm Lou Lamoriello, I will get the NYI their 2015 1st round pick back that they traded 3yrs ago in the Vanek deal!"

 

 

Buffalo traded the NYI #21 overall pick for Robin Lehner, and now the NYI have Lehner... lol. 

Edited July 5, 2018 by BillsFan4

[JohnC]

On 6/19/2018 at 8:42 AM, eball said:

Fantastic article by Kris Baker on The Athletic about how the Sabres may approach the draft after selecting Dahlin.  Incredibly comprehensive; I'll definitely go back to read up on the prospects after the draft.

Kris Baker is a gem. His knowledge of prospects from all over the world is at an encyclopedia level. When he is on WGR talking hockey he has a  talent for giving a concise summary on any prospect that is brought up. What stands out when listening to him is that he has a genuine passion for hockey and evaluating talent. He is someone worth listening to. 

[26CornerBlitz]

 

Will be interesting to see how this plays out.

[BillsFan4]

2 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Will be interesting to see how this plays out.

 

It'll likely all depend on what type of AAV all 3 are willing to sign for. 

 

All 3 are eligible to sign extensions now, but Nylander is the only one who needs an extension before next season.

 

If Matthews and Marner truly aren't interested in signing an extension this year, as rumored, then I would guess that's because they are hoping to get as much $$ as they possibly can. 

 

 

Toronto has that Brandon Pridham though. He was the NHL's salary cap expert before he was hired by Shanahan. There's not many people more knowledgeable when it comes to the salary cap system.  

 

Like you said, Itll be interesting to see how this plays out. 

[26CornerBlitz]

The Sens and Canadiens are both in for rough seasons.

 

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[26CornerBlitz]

 

Edited July 6, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[26CornerBlitz]