We Should Pick Up the Option on Tyrod No Matter What

[Fadingpain]

November 30, 2014.

 

Orchard Park, NY. Browns vs. Bills.

 

Kyle Orton vs. Brian Hoyer.

 

Hoyer had to be pulled in favor of Johnny Football after putting up a **** show of absolutely epic proportions.

 

Hoyer was absolutely undaunted in that game, showing laser guided focus, unwavering tenacity, steadfast drive, and utter determination to prove he completely sucked beyond all comprehension.

 

Doesn't anyone remember this game?

 

Hoyer's performance was so putrid, so inept, so vile, it put him on my personal black list forever.

 

That's why I don't like the Hoyer backup plan.

[MAJBobby]

November 30, 2014.

 

Orchard Park, NY. Browns vs. Bills.

 

Kyle Orton vs. Brian Hoyer.

 

Hoyer had to be pulled in favor of Johnny Football after putting up a **** show of absolutely epic proportions.

 

Hoyer was absolutely undaunted in that game, showing laser guided focus, unwavering tenacity, steadfast drive, and utter determination to prove he completely sucked beyond all comprehension.

 

Doesn't anyone remember this game?

 

Hoyer's performance was so putrid, so inept, so vile, it put him on my personal black list forever.

 

That's why I don't like the Hoyer backup plan.

One game. But yet when TT puts stinker after stinker it is someone else's fault

[Thurman#1]

Tyrod should and will come back I feel. With a deep threat like Sammy (when healthy) and the running element to his game, hes the perfect dual-threat fit for the style of offense this regime wants to run.

 

20th (ish) highest paid QB.

 

Leader of an offense ranked 8th in the NFL in Pts this yr and top 10 since 2015.

 

3rd best TD/TURNOVER ratio in the entire NFL since named Bills' starter.

 

Better winning % than Rodgers, Brees, Stafford, Cousins, Dalton, Eli, Rivers, Mariota, Tannehill, Matt Ryan, Winston, Bortles, Luck, Fitz, Bradford, Flacco, Etc since TT was named Bills' starter.

 

Continue to develop Cardale. EJ will probably go somewhere else - and I wish him well.

 

Draft another QB this year too.

 

 

 

Winning percentages are team stats.

 

The name for the stat itself is not QB Win Percentage. It's "Team Record in Games Started by this Quarterback." And for good reason. Tyrod isn't worse if Carpenter missed an extra point to lose the game and he's not better if a CB has a walk-off pick six to win the game. You judge QBs by how well the QB plays QB, it's that simple.

 

But yeah, draft another QB this year too, if you believe he's got a real shot. They should run guys through here consistently till they find a top ten or twelve guy, and even after. That's how the Pats and Packers and most good teams do it.

Edited December 2, 2016 by Thurman#1

[Fadingpain]

One game. But yet when TT puts stinker after stinker it is someone else's fault

Oh I certainly don't lay Tyrod's many faults at the feet of others.

 

People like to confuse and camouflage the discussion by talking about tangental matters like which WR is injured, how the OL performed, or whatever else.

 

The reality is that Tyrod has a lot of deficiencies that are not likely to be overcome.

 

His vision of the field is not good; his ability to see a receiver as being open before he is open doesn't exist; he very rarely throws a ball to anyone unless they are more or less standing still and open; his mechanics are inconsistent and poor for the most part; he refuses to use the middle of the field; he often throws passes way late, and when he does go for it, his accuracy is highly irregular; he leaves tons of points off the scoreboard with bad throws or throws that never happen; when he does read, see, anticipate, and throw accurately, he can't repeat it consistently.

 

There is huge room for improvement at the QB position with Tyrod.

 

I just don't think we are going to find it for the 2017 season.

[fridge]

Don't you get it? There are like five posters who lump Taylor in with those QB's since Bledsoe and, not coincidentally, all of them believe "Manuel got screwed" and is still a better QB than Taylor as we sit here in December of 2016. They'll never get over it. They harp on the poor performances and disappear after the good ones. They cite the YPG put never acknowledge the rushing prowess or the lack of turnovers or the WINNING or when they do, they mock the starting QB he won against. They are a rare breed who spend countless hours every day bashing the starting QB of a team they supposedly root for on a message board for said team. I don't get it.

 

Seriously? You literally did the same thing, not even two years ago.

[MAJBobby]

I would actually not be too upset if the Bills picked up the option if they still drafted a QB in round 1 or 2. And get some real competition at the QB spot. But they won't. And that is the problem with this team.

[metzelaars_lives]

November 30, 2014.

 

Orchard Park, NY. Browns vs. Bills.

 

Kyle Orton vs. Brian Hoyer.

 

Hoyer had to be pulled in favor of Johnny Football after putting up a **** show of absolutely epic proportions.

 

Hoyer was absolutely undaunted in that game, showing laser guided focus, unwavering tenacity, steadfast drive, and utter determination to prove he completely sucked beyond all comprehension.

 

Doesn't anyone remember this game?

 

Hoyer's performance was so putrid, so inept, so vile, it put him on my personal black list forever.

 

That's why I don't like the Hoyer backup plan.

Bills fans have a tendency to do this too much. We see Tannehill play a couple bad games against us and it's a blanket "Tannehill sucks." You know, guys play other games. The fact of the matter is that Hoyer was very good last season (save for his miserable performance in that playoff game) and was even better this season. He's a no doubt top 32 QB in the world and will start somewhere next season. And no, I don't want him either.

Edited December 2, 2016 by metzelaars_lives

[bobobonators]

 

 

 

Winning percentages are team stats.

 

The name for the stat itself is not QB Win Percentage. It's "Team Record in Games Started by this Quarterback." And for good reason. Tyrod isn't worse if Carpenter missed an extra point to lose the game and he's not better if a CB has a walk-off pick six to win the game. You judge QBs by how well the QB plays QB, it's that simple.

 

But yeah, draft another QB this year too, if you believe he's got a real shot. They should run guys through here consistently till they find a top ten or twelve guy, and even after. That's how the Pats and Packers and most good teams do it.

I understand how wins work. I also understand how rhetoric works on these boards. Because when QBs put up stats and dont win, people focus on wins saying ultimately its the QB's responsibiity. When the QBs win but dont put up style points then the team wins in spite of the QB. Its a circular argument generally no matter what angle you take, so i include wins on there to just answer that question before its even presented.

[metzelaars_lives]

 

Seriously? You literally did the same thing, not even two years ago.

Well first of all, that's a false equivalency because Taylor is light years better than Manuel. And I don't even think Taylor is that good. And I'm always arguing with the same five guys. My take prior to the 2015 season was, hey guys, I don't think the EJ Manuel thing is happening. I was right. 99% of the people on here agreed with me. The Bills entire organization agreed with me. 100% of non-Bills fans agreed with me. And of course, the same five guys who mock Taylor now were insisting prior to the 2015 season (when I spent admittedly way too much time on here saying that it was over for EJ Manuel- which again, it was, I was right) that the Bills hadn't given Manuel a fair shot, he was still gonna be good, etc., etc. Ya know it's OK to say Ryan Leaf sucks. Or they should've taken Gronkowski over Troup. I was never saying anything radical- then or now.

Edited December 2, 2016 by metzelaars_lives

[MAJBobby]

I understand how wins work. I also understand how rhetoric works on these boards. Because when QBs put up stats and dont win, people focus on wins saying ultimately its the QB's responsibiity. When the QBs win but dont put up style points then the team wins in spite of the QB. Its a circular argument generally no matter what angle you take, so i include wins on there to just answer that question before its even presented.

The smart ones don't. Example TT best game of the season and the game I wish he could reproduce on a weekly basis is in a Loss and I put none of that loss on him.

 

I actually put it in the Refs a bit (Woods was interfered with the last play of the game).

[John from Riverside]

I would actually not be too upset if the Bills picked up the option if they still drafted a QB in round 1 or 2. And get some real competition at the QB spot. But they won't. And that is the problem with this team.

Regardless of the QB crop?

 

I dont want to reach for a QB

[MAJBobby]

Well first of all, that's a false equivalency because Taylor is light years better than Manuel. And I don't even think Taylor is that good. And I'm always arguing with the same five guys. My take prior to the 2015 season was, hey guys, I don't think the EJ Manuel thing is happening. I was right. 99% of the people on here agreed with me. The Bills entire organization agreed with me. 100% of non-Bills fans agreed with me. And of course, the same five guys who mock Taylor now were insisting prior to the 2015 season (when I spent admittedly way too much time on here saying that it was over for EJ Manuel- which again, it was, I was right) that the Bills hadn't given Manuel a fair shot, he was still gonna be good, etc., etc. Ya know it's OK to say Ryan Leaf sucks. Or they should've taken Gronkowski over Troup. I was never saying anything radical- then or now.

I do think EJ's development was handled as poorly as it could have been. But I will never say he was not given a shot. I just don't think Bills can develop QBs.

 

Why should I think that they can what QB has David Lee ever developed though

Edited December 2, 2016 by MAJBobby

[Kirby Jackson]

 

 

 

From what I see, he's tied for 17th highest, in terms of average salary anyway. And I didn't say it was a bad deal, period. I said it was a bad deal if he doesn't become a franchise QB.

 

So, yes, emphatically, undoubtedly, if he doesn't become a top ten or twelve guy it will be a waste of $27 mill. Fitz's contract was around 21st highest, if I remember quickly. I understood totally why they signed him to it. And it hurt the team.

 

Sure context is important. The main items of the context are money - $27 million which can't be used on other players - and how good he is and becomes, and whether we end up having to look for another QB a year or two down the road.

 

 

 

 

If he does end up improving a lot, it will look like a terrific deal. That's what it comes down to, does he or does he not improve a lot. If he doesn't it's an awful deal. If he does, it's a great deal. And we really don't know. It's a tough choice. My guesses are that they renew him and he doesn't improve much. And I really hope that he does improve an awful lot, simply because it would be the best thing for the Bills.

That's the point and you don't have the benefit of hindsight to make the decision. You could say the bolded about absolutely every contract. "If the guy's play exceeds the contract it was great. If it doesn't it was bad." The decision has to be made on what we know now. The Bills are getting decent QB play at a price that is slightly below what most pay for similar play (see Flacco, Joe). That factors in that Tyrod is younger than RW and roughly the same age as Andrew Luck. He may have room to grow that some older guys, that have played more, don't have. Lastly, the viable alternatives just aren't there. When you factor all of that in the decision isn't all that complicated for the Bills. They know that.

 

Whether it works out or not is a totally different story and one that we can't know for sometime.

[bobobonators]

The smart ones don't. Example TT best game of the season and the game I wish he could reproduce on a weekly basis is in a Loss and I put none of that loss on him.

 

I actually put it in the Refs a bit (Woods was interfered with the last play of the game).

there are plenty of objective posters. There are also plenty that arent objective.

 

TT has room to improve. Injuries arent an excuse. The offense has played very well overall. His salary isnt going to be ridiculous. The team has won more often than not when hes the starter. Let him continue to develop rapport with WR like sammy and woods. Bring in another QB in the draft. Continue improving the defense.

[MAJBobby]

Regardless of the QB crop?

 

I dont want to reach for a QB

Round 1 or 2. I don't need to reach for a QB in round 1(there are a couple I like in round 1 though).

 

But there is very good value for a QB in round 2 so far in my analysis of the college QBs

there are plenty of objective posters. There are also plenty that arent objective.

 

TT has room to improve. Injuries arent an excuse. The offense has played very well overall. His salary isnt going to be ridiculous. The team has won more often than not when hes the starter. Let him continue to develop rapport with WR like sammy and woods. Bring in another QB in the draft. Continue improving the defense.

I don't agree picking up his option, but can live with it if we actually take a QB in round 1 or 2 and provide legit competition at the position.

 

However I just think we are treading water until Rex is gone.

 

Because even if the Rookie we draft plays like Wilson did in offseason do you really think Rex and this staff sits Taylor down before the season? Like Seattle did with Flynn.

[John from Riverside]

Round 1 or 2. I don't need to reach for a QB in round 1(there are a couple I like in round 1 though).

 

But there is very good value for a QB in round 2 so far in my analysis of the college QBs

I would not be against it

 

I think it makes sense if for no other reason I think EJ is gone after this year and I dont know what C. Jones would give us as a back up (who at any point and time can become your starter with a running QB)

 

Two things

 

I want Mike Williams from Clemson if he is available when we pick...that is my guy in the 1st.

 

We somehow have to fix our horrid safety situation

[MAJBobby]

I would not be against it

 

I think it makes sense if for no other reason I think EJ is gone after this year and I dont know what C. Jones would give us as a back up (who at any point and time can become your starter with a running QB)

 

Two things

 

I want Mike Williams from Clemson if he is available when we pick...that is my guy in the 1st.

 

We somehow have to fix our horrid safety situation

I am fine with Safety for now. Have to see what Aaron is actually going to do in the offseason first

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

Yes but overall, many more misses than hits. That's why there aren't 32 top level franchise QB's in the league. The misses far out weigh the hits

 

 

And drafting a QB in first or second round is also fine with me if they love one of those guys, but there have been plentyyyyyy of misses in first and second rounds so no point in even posting that list

 

 

And there have been plenty of hits so no point in posting the list.

[Maury Ballstein]

Seriously? You literally did the same thing, not even two years ago.

Pow, Biff, Boom, Shazam !! Goodnight my sweet prince Metz

 

Oh I certainly don't lay Tyrod's many faults at the feet of others.

 

People like to confuse and camouflage the discussion by talking about tangental matters like which WR is injured, how the OL performed, or whatever else.

 

The reality is that Tyrod has a lot of deficiencies that are not likely to be overcome.

 

His vision of the field is not good; his ability to see a receiver as being open before he is open doesn't exist; he very rarely throws a ball to anyone unless they are more or less standing still and open; his mechanics are inconsistent and poor for the most part; he refuses to use the middle of the field; he often throws passes way late, and when he does go for it, his accuracy is highly irregular; he leaves tons of points off the scoreboard with bad throws or throws that never happen; when he does read, see, anticipate, and throw accurately, he can't repeat it consistently.

 

There is huge room for improvement at the QB position with Tyrod.

 

I just don't think we are going to find it for the 2017 season.

Amen.

[PromoTheRobot]

To me it would make absolutely no sense to not pick up the option on Tyrod. Okay, if Brees or Rivers were available and willing to come here, then yes buh bye Tyrod, nice knowing ya. But let's be serious. I seriously think their is about a 1% chance that happens. Please do not bring up Romo, who was never quite on that tier and has had continuous serious injuries over the last few years. Let Tyrod walk to watch Romo get injured in game 1 and retire? I don't think so.

 

If we are going to replace Tyrod, where is that replacement going to come from? The draft is where you are going to find your guy. I think we should definitely be drafting more QB's but that doesn't mean they have to start right away. Yes if we are going QB in the top ten, I am a believer you should be going with that guy from day one, but we have learned with players like Kirk Cousins, Russell Wilson and Dak Prescott, that you don't have to get your QB in round one. That said two of those guys started as rookies and have be great thus far. I think you re-up Tyrod and put more a an emphasis on drafting QB's and if one can beat Tyrod out that is great. If Tyrod can elevate his play and solidify his position as a starter, that is great.

 

Tyrod's contract is very low for a QB and if we were to draft somebody who panned out, Tyrod's contract would run out before we had to pay the new guy. Tyrod's extension will have no bearing on our ability to keep another QB should we find one that we think can be great. Even if Tyrod regresses and we want to cut him, his dead cap space is extremely low and would have little affect on the roster. http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/tyrod-taylor-7899/

 

I know we have statistically, the worst passing game in the NFL. I wish we could have what we had with the K-Gun in the 90's but that isn't happening unless we draft someone who is really good. So we aren't going to have that great passing game just yet but we do have the best running game in the NFL both by yards and yards per carry. I do like that we are going against the grain and doing the exact opposite of what everyone else is doing. I also don't think we have peaked yet as an offense and we won't this season. I think if we improve the RT position, be savvy in free agency and add some useful veteran receivers, and give Anthonly Lynn an off-season to fine tune the offense. We could be very good next season.

RED ALERT! RED ALERT!