The good and bad of Chris Hogan

[Storm Front]

I suspect the Hogan hate comes from him being white. Unless you are the Pats, the best wideout on your team can't be, right? Goodwin was one of the worst 3rd rd. draft picks the Bills have ever taken, but TBDers never cease to defend that guy. Robert Woods has turned out to be a poor 2nd rd. pick, but folks always defend the guy even though he rarely gets open, is not quick and has no elusiveness. Sammy hasn't proven to be any better than Hogan, yet the excuses for him and his two #1 picks are endless. Did he even try to play against the Pats?

[GunnerBill]

I don't understand how people can defend him and think he will get better. He's been a yard short his entire career.

 

Because he has gotten better each year? He is a very good player and if you compare him to 3rd and 4th guys around the league he stacks up pretty well.

[Formerly Allan in MD]

Hogan is reliable and can play on my team any time. Players, all of them, make mistakes. If you want to nit pick every player in the league you'll find that to be the case. Yes, he's no Julian Edelman but he produces. We have plenty of players who are not near as consistent as Hogan. Where do we begin?

[klos63]

With the attitude of many WRs coming out of college, his is a nice breath of fresh air. Keep him around - at least he puts in the work.

 

He's a depth guy forced to learn all the roles on the offense (Z,Y, Slot), and play special teams.

 

He's also pretty big - which is good for a running team.

What attitude? What players? A lot of great WR have come out the last couple seasons, last year especially. Let's not make Hogan out to be something special. He is a decent #4/#5 WR, that's ok.

[3rdand12]

Hogan has room fro improvement, situational awareness. But he also has not been playing football all his life like some guys.

Let Sanjay get the tape out and remind him where the marker is, and when to stay in bounds.

and yes he did have good game. Thank goodness because Bellicheat was bound to take away Watkins.

[starrymessenger]

 

He's not a bad player and deserves a roster spot. Plus he doesn't break the bank. But lots of other teams ie Pittsburgh, Zona, Cinci etc... seem to find much better WRs to work in his spot later in the draft or even UDFAs. And the Bills always seems to wind up with the lesser lights instead, track guys who are not football players, lacrosse players... Bills are not really very good at scouting and drafting WRs. A bit like QBs, but without the excuse that they are really hard to find.

[Formerly Allan in MD]

He's not a bad player and deserves a roster spot. Plus he doesn't break the bank. But lots of other teams ie Pittsburgh, Zona, Cinci etc... seem to find much better WRs to work in his spot later in the draft or even UDFAs. And the Bills always seems to wind up with the lesser lights instead, track guys who are not football players, lacrosse players... Bills are not really very good at scouting and drafting WRs. A bit like QBs, but without the excuse that they are really hard to find.

As far as recent picks go, Watkins, Woods were bad picks? They're both underutilized but far from bad picks. And I don't believe they ever played lacrosse.

[starrymessenger]

As far as recent picks go, Watkins, Woods were bad picks? They're both underutilized but far from bad picks. And I don't believe they ever played lacrosse.

 

Let's be sensible, shall we? SW was the consensus # 1 WR in his draft class, so the risk of his being a bad wideout is greatly reduced. That doesn't mean that his selection by the Bills shows that they know how to evaluate WRs. To the contrary, the argument is that they essentially lazed out, even before you get into the price they paid, which further substantiates that they really aren't very good at it. How about finding a Marvin Jones in the fifth, a Rueben Randle in the third, Victor Cruz, John Brown, Antonio Brown in the sixth, Martavius Bryant etc... all later in the draft - even before you get into taking Graham just ahead of TY Hilton for example.

 

When Woods fell in the draft they did well to land him in the second. He is a good (not great) wideout. But that's hardly enuf to say they are good at evaluating WRs. They are not.

[Talley56]

First of all congrats on a pretty good game.

 

But his problems as a WR still rear their ugly head. He has GOT to pick up the first down when he has the first down. He blew it, which led to the bad call on third and inches. You just can't do it.

 

Another time he didn't fight for an extra yard and went out of bounds easily after a 9 yard catch.

 

One play that bothered me, however, and something he always does that is not good, is on the 31 yard catch he made. He is wide open. The ball is there. But instead of catching it on the run, he slows down, turns sideways and jumps to catch it above his head, and then comes down and is immediately tackled. Most WR and all good ones pick up the trajectory, keep running, catch it without jumping and then try to avoid the tackle. It's possible that he could have even cut to the middle of the field and broke the tackle of the hard closing DB if he had just caught it on the run.

 

I just watched it a dozen times. It's arguable that the pass was one yard short. But even if it was he still could have and would have caught it on the run with his hands without jumping and had a split second to put a move on the DB. He almost always stops and jumps to try to make a catch like that rather than just running and catching it and getting as many yards as he can. It's bothersome.

 

Again, he did have a good game. But his awareness is still a glaring problem.

It looked more like this was due to a poor throw by Tyrod not a bad jump by Hogan. But I do agree that not fighting for the extra yard when he came up short of the 1st down was pretty terrible on his part.

[Kelly the Dog]

Hogan has room fro improvement, situational awareness. But he also has not been playing football all his life like some guys..

Yes he has. He played as a kid. He was a star in high school. He was planning on playing college football. The only reason he didn't play college football more than one year is because he got better lacrosse scholarships.

[3rdand12]

Yes he has. He played as a kid. He was a star in high school. He was planning on playing college football. The only reason he didn't play college football more than one year is because he got better lacrosse scholarships.

thats what i said. He has not been playing all his life. /S

 

You are too serious today Kelly.

I think Tyler Dunne did an article on why he made the decisions he made.

[Punching Bag]

when woods does it consistently I'll complain. Hogan does it on almost every play were he catches the ball near the marker(a majority of his catches). He is a very below average receiver that only gets catches because he's so bad the defense doesn't bother to cover him. I don't understand how people can defend him and think he will get better. He's been a yard short his entire career.

Do you know how stupid that sound "that only gets catches because he's so bad the defense doesn't bother to cover him"? There would be twenty threads on this board saying coach needed to be fired if they did not cover a player because he was "so bad". 26 catches for 330 yards and 2 TDs and a critical toss plus the blocking as WR and special teams.

 

I wish you were DC of teams we faced.

Edited November 27, 2015 by Koolaid

[GunnerBill]

Do you know how stupid that sound "hat only gets catches because he's so bad the defense doesn't bother to cover him"? There would be twenty threads on this board saying coach needed to be fired if they did not cover a player because he was "so bad". 26 catches for 330 yards and 2 TDs and a critical toss plus the blocking as WR and special teams.

 

You are wasting your breath Koolaid.... 'cos D'Rick Rodgers has the size..... and something.....

[metzelaars_lives]

What you guys said. Unfortunately with Percy & Goodwin out, Hogan's role is elevated.

Yeah he's doing his best to match the production that Goodwin was giving us lo these many years.

Especially when he started the season as the #5WR,,,

At no point was he behind Goodwin on any depth chart. He was absolutely going to get reps this year one way or another. He's good. The play where he got and then gave up the first down was terrible. My guess is he learns from it and you'll never see anything like that again.

Edited November 28, 2015 by metzelaars_lives

[GunnerBill]

Yeah he's doing his best to match the production that Goodwin was giving us lo these many years.

 

 

But what about that one catch last year? It was epic. And did you know he was in the Olympics? Cool fact.

[Not at the table Karlos]

 

You are wasting your breath Koolaid.... 'cos D'Rick Rodgers has the size..... and something.....

who said anything about darick?

Do you know how stupid that sound "that only gets catches because he's so bad the defense doesn't bother to cover him"? There would be twenty threads on this board saying coach needed to be fired if they did not cover a player because he was "so bad". 26 catches for 330 yards and 2 TDs and a critical toss plus the blocking as WR and special teams.

 

I wish you were DC of teams we faced.

did you not see his catch when the defense didn't cover him? It has been talked about in this thread already, tyrod threw it short and hogan jumped. The defensive coordinator that called the play was the patriots Patricia/belichick. I don't see how them calling a play has anything to do with my capabilities to be a DC. Edited November 28, 2015 by Not at the table Karlos

[John from Riverside]

I think he is a decent number 3

 

but

 

It is maddening the way he will catch a ball 1 yard short of the 1st...then proceed to bounce his route trying to gain extra yards

 

He is not explosive......he needs to be a "dependable" guy

[NoSaint]

I think he is a decent number 3

 

but

 

It is maddening the way he will catch a ball 1 yard short of the 1st...then proceed to bounce his route trying to gain extra yards

 

He is not explosive......he needs to be a "dependable" guy

Which is weird, given his impressive measurables. But my eye test says the same. I'm not sure if he's just not good at football angles or what, but it always surprises me when I see what he did at workouts

[Punching Bag]

who said anything about darick?

did you not see his catch when the defense didn't cover him? It has been talked about in this thread already, tyrod threw it short and hogan jumped. The defensive coordinator that called the play was the patriots Patricia/belichick. I don't see how them calling a play has anything to do with my capabilities to be a DC.

There is a difference between ONE play and what you said. Players make mistakes but not like you claimed "the defense doesn't bother to cover him".

[Coach Tuesday]

I am saving an expensive bottle of champagne for the first tackle that Chris Hogan breaks in his career.

[GG]

Yeah he's doing his best to match the production that Goodwin was giving us lo these many years.

At no point was he behind Goodwin on any depth chart. He was absolutely going to get reps this year one way or another. He's good. The play where he got and then gave up the first down was terrible. My guess is he learns from it and you'll never see anything like that again.

 

That is clearly debatable because it would depend on the roles. Sammy & Percy were clear 1 & 2, with Woods in the slot as the possession WR. Hogan's role on the outside would come in to spell Sammy or Percy. Goodwin had a different role for offensive formations that utilized his speed. There were no plays designed specifically for Hogan. So yeah, Hogan was the 5th guy in the offensive game plan.

[Not at the table Karlos]

There is a difference between ONE play and what you said. Players make mistakes but not like you claimed "the defense doesn't bother to cover him".

there are more. Just don't feel like digging into it and I don't think anyone would waste their time making a video of all hogan catches as a bill. I think he's well below average you dont. Cool.

[Punching Bag]

there are more. Just don't feel like digging into it and I don't think anyone would waste their time making a video of all hogan catches as a bill. I think he's well below average you dont. Cool.

And you exaggerate to try to support your position but that is obvious.

[metzelaars_lives]

 

That is clearly debatable because it would depend on the roles. Sammy & Percy were clear 1 & 2, with Woods in the slot as the possession WR. Hogan's role on the outside would come in to spell Sammy or Percy. Goodwin had a different role for offensive formations that utilized his speed. There were no plays designed specifically for Hogan. So yeah, Hogan was the 5th guy in the offensive game plan.

Well at this point it doesn't really matter because once again, just like last year, Hogan is making big catches in games that count in the meat of the season and once again, just like last season, Goodwin will not be wearing a Bills uniform in a big game that actually counts on Sunday. The 2015 Goodwin charade was over before it started. And it's too bad because he made some great plays as a rookie in 2013.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

I was gonna make this topic. He's the anti-Edelman. Always finds a way to not get the first down.

Is that why hogan's celebration is always showing the second down hand signal?

[GG]

Well at this point it doesn't really matter because once again, just like last year, Hogan is making big catches in games that count in the meat of the season and once again, just like last season, Goodwin will not be wearing a Bills uniform in a big game that actually counts on Sunday. The 2015 Goodwin charade was over before it started. And it's too bad because he made some great plays as a rookie in 2013.

Isn't that the point of this thread? He's made some big catches, but for most part his game is pedestrian that's exemplified by constant head scratching moves. He's a below average 3rd string WR.

[Webster Guy]

5 catches for 90 yard pace puts you at over 1400 for the season.

 

Good for 5th overall in the NFL last year.

 

If TT hits him on that long one he has a 140 yard game.

 

But apparently the "worst" instincts of all time.

[NoSaint]

5 catches for 90 yard pace puts you at over 1400 for the season.

 

Good for 5th overall in the NFL last year.

 

If TT hits him on that long one he has a 140 yard game.

 

But apparently the "worst" instincts of all time.

Dramatic, eh?

 

He had a productive game but left some on the table.

[John from Riverside]

5 catches for 90 yard pace puts you at over 1400 for the season.

 

Good for 5th overall in the NFL last year.

 

If TT hits him on that long one he has a 140 yard game.

 

But apparently the "worst" instincts of all time.

I get what your saying....but that wont happen every game. Frankly if he does then that means Sammy is continuing to be frozen out of the game plan which is going to end up bad in the long run.

there are more. Just don't feel like digging into it and I don't think anyone would waste their time making a video of all hogan catches as a bill. I think he's well below average you dont. Cool.

I think well below average is a little unfair

 

Like I said....decent number 3

[Kelly the Dog]

Dramatic, eh?

 

He had a productive game but left some on the table.

A few times he was not covered at all and were a direct unarguable result of Sammy Watkins and not Chris Hogan.