PearlHowardman Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 I appreciate your excitement, but can you make your point without the insane hyperbole? " one of the greatest defensive minds to have ever been in the NFL"? Really? How did Rex change the way football is played on the defenseive side of the ball? Look up his rankings? He would " never allow a team he coaches to have anything but a outstanding defense"? With superstars on his Baltimore D, he had top 5 D's in yards allowed and points allowed for 4 years--but so did Mike Nolan before him. It's nice to walk into a situation loaded with talent--just ask Jim Schwartz. And Rex would never "allow" a team to have anything but and oustanding D? Look at the points scored on the Jets D over the past 4 years: 20, 20, 19, 24th ranked. He's been running the "break, don't bend" D over there for years. Excellent post! The Jets defense in the past four years have not been good! He was fired! Who has had 2 winning seasons in 6 and none in 4 years. This^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xsoldier54 Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 The Big Picture is we now need an NFL calibre QB. Without that piece all the coaching garbage is pretty meaningless. Plus you don't win with defense in the NFL anymore. You win with offense. Defense is for show. Offense/QB play is for dough. Look at the final 4 QBs . probably the best 4 in the league. that is not a coincidence. Go get Cutler and get him now. Couldn't disagree more. We had 9 wins this year and almost all were due to a stellar defense. The offense was putrid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Bills Fan Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Who has had 2 winning seasons in 6 and none in 4 years. I dont understand why people keep saying this. We did not trade for the Jets team. We got their HC. The Jets had pretty much zero playmakers on offense and Rex went 7-5 against the Bills while coaching the Jets with 2 losses coming this year CBF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) I appreciate your excitement, but can you make your point without the insane hyperbole? " one of the greatest defensive minds to have ever been in the NFL"? Really? How did Rex change the way football is played on the defenseive side of the ball? Look up his rankings? He would " never allow a team he coaches to have anything but a outstanding defense"? With superstars on his Baltimore D, he had top 5 D's in yards allowed and points allowed for 4 years--but so did Mike Nolan before him. It's nice to walk into a situation loaded with talent--just ask Jim Schwartz. And Rex would never "allow" a team to have anything but and oustanding D? Look at the points scored on the Jets D over the past 4 years: 20, 20, 19, 24th ranked. He's been running the "break, don't bend" D over there for years. Well said. If a head coach could simply decide "not to allow" a facet of the team he coaches to be "anything but outstanding", the NFL would be overrun with outstanding franchises. And our defense wasn't great last year, it generated a lot of turn overs but it gave up a lot of big plays, especially on the ground. Schwartz did a lot less gambling and generated pressure with out having to send numbers so often. In the end, I think that Schwartz is as good or better a coach of this defense than Ryan so I have to ask, where did we gain? We had a really good defense this year and we didn't make the play offs. Ryan's success will be determined by what he does with the offense and on that score, I don't see much evidence that Ryan will make a difference. Under Ryan, the longer he was there, the worse they got. Yes, their offensive personnel was weak but I don't buy that the head coach had zero input on player acquisitions for 6 years so part of the blame for the weak personnel is his. Ryan is colorful and a good motivator. He is also a good defensive coach with as good a record of making life difficult for Tom Brady as any coach in the league. He also doesn't shy away from making difficult decisions. But he often appeared to be the top clown in a franchise that was more of a circus than a model of competence. The current hyperbolic worship of Ryan will eventually wear off and then we'll see if he is as good at winning games as he is at trash talking and making us laugh. As is, this team is only a game or two from getting to the post season. It's not like Ryan has to pull off a miracle. He just needs to make an already good team a little bit better. If he can't do that, then all the amusing press conferences in the world shouldn't save him. Edited January 13, 2015 by Mickey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 People keep saying it because it is true. And hell if having a winning record against the Bills is all it takes to make a top Head Coach then there would be dozens of them hanging around to pick from. Ask yourself this..... if we had a Head Coach who had just gone 8-8, 6-10, 8-8. 4-12 would we be clamouring for him to get a 5 year extention or for him to be fired? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. K Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 All this jazz about Rex's great defensive mind is completely beside the point. The Bills ALREADY HAD a top five defense without Rex's great defensive mind. Do you really expect, with another freakin' change of system for next season, that the defense is going to be better than it was in 2014? So what is Rex bringing to the defense that the defense NEEDED? Even if you don't care about the prospect of players having to change roles to responsibilities they are not suited for. I will be flabbergasted if they play better defense in 2015 than they played in 2014. So what is Rex Ryan bringing to this team that IMPROVES their situation for 2015? Well, apparently he's bringing Roman as the new OC, a guy who has shepherded the decline of Colin Kaepernick over the last three seasons and whom they can't wait to be rid of in San Francisco. Even if you like Roman, the Bills could have had him ANYWAY--or any number of other OCs who I think would do a better job with the Bills personnel and as mentors for Manuel, while keeping Schwartz as HC. They have thrown away any chance for continuity on either side of the ball by throwing away Schwartz, and any improvement they have at OC they could have had anyway without hiring Rex. All this optimism that Rex's presence immediately makes this team more competitive is moonshine. The guy is 26-38 over the last four seasons as a head coach. I expect Whaley will give him a good roster to manage, with upgrades on the o-line, for instance. But Whaley would have done the same for anyone--Schwartz with Bevell, for instance, as OC. I do not see any convincing way that hiring Rex is going to improve this team for 2015 over what we saw in 2014. Except all of you who are so excited that the national press is paying more attention to the Bills. Enjoy Rex's press conferences, brothers and sisters. Wrong coach for this team at this time. A step backwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BmarvB Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Yes....our D was awesome this year Yes.....Schwartz did a great job with them after we were worried were going to lose our great D that was under Pettine the previous year........ bear with me....... We are not getting a OC retread or 1st year OC that is bringing his his favorite guy as a defensive coordinator We are getting Rex Ryan.....who is one of the greatest defensive minds to have ever been in the NFL......it is the one thing he can hang his hat on (and if you dont belive me go back and look at his defensive rankings) My worry this year was never about defense no matter what happens......2 reasons Rex Ryan would never allow a team he coaches to have anything but a outstanding defense and The defensive talent on this team is nothing short of incredible.....from DL.....to linebackers (with Kiko Alonzo also returning) to a very solid secondary My concern is what it has been from the beginning.....who would the OC be because that is not Rex Ryan's strength...he took care of that by bring in a OC with deep NFC playoffs and one super bowl We are ok....we really are ok. And it is ok to still love Schwartz and wish him well. I certainly do. You're right. We're still good. No worries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Rex won't hurt the awesome Bills D. So the continued unknown ..... Can the offense improve in the run game and QB stability? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Of the 54 sacks we had this year all but 6 were by the D line. I like Schwartz but he benefited from having the best D line in football. They work hand in hand, IMO. Having the DL to play that scheme left the other seven guys free to make plays in the secondary, giving them a big numbers advantage in pass coverage--causing the QB to in many cases hold the ball longer, setting up the sack. IMO, the 4-3 (if you have the horses to play it) is a better scheme than the 3-4 which is a guessing game, in many respects. The 3-4 puts a lot more pressure on the secondary if you have blitzing LB or DB. And while I'm not that worried about our CBs, I think our young safeties are going to have more problems in coverage than under Schwartz's scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lofton80 Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) All will be fine. Assume we add some talent via free agency and draft. Rex's team fell apart when Revis got hurt and was not resigned. We have a good secondary and Rex running our violent defense should be a match made in heaven. Edited January 13, 2015 by Lofton80 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jletha Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) These are valid points, but there is still the issue of personnel. Granted going to a 3-4 would allow Spikes to stay when Kiko returns. But who on the line will play where? Mario Williams is a great DE, and Dareus and Kyle Williams are great DTs. We have no NTs, and might not keep Jerry Hughes. Do we have Kyle play DE? He's not built for that. My biggest fear is a new guy comes in a blows up a great ensemble, and the Bills great D this year collapses in a couple of years. Rex is not going to blow anything up, he knows we have talent and I feel confident that he will use this talent properly in his own scheme, whatever it may be. But your last point, the D is going to collapse anyway in a couple years, thats just the NFL. Maybe not drop off a cliff entirely but the players we have now will not all be able to stay beyond the next 1-3 years so its inevitable things will change and we will likely regress. Thats why the hire was made, looking into the future when things like Kyle retires, Marios contract is up, Gilmore leaves next year, etc (not saying all of this is going to happen, just examples). The guys we have were built to play Jim's scheme perfectly but that only will last a few years and we want to hire a coach for the long term. Guys like Kiko, Brown, Dareus and Gilmore are primed to flourish in Ryans system and they are also the youngest guys on the team, lock them up and were a solid defense for the next decade. Mario, Kyle dont seem to have a good fit right now (but I know they will be fine) but they will not be here for the next 10 years. Edited January 13, 2015 by jletha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realist Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 So many people are complaining about Rex Ryan and losing Schwartz, well there is only one person to blame for this…Doug Marrone. Doug Marrone quitting is the reason we’re losing Schwartz. Doug Marrone thought it would be best to sit on his ass at home and collect his 4 million. That’s how you treat your team/fans after preaching “Finish the Job” to them all year? I don’t think there were any better options or sure things out there than Rex Ryan. He wasn’t my first choice, but he’s no worse than any of the other dozen they brought in and he’s possibly the best of the lot. Ryan has had good defenses his entire career when he’s had the personnel, give him a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seq004 Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) Yes, but Sully said we won't make the playoffs so can we just forfeit the season? Ok really I agree with what you said. Edited January 13, 2015 by seq004 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heitz Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Ask yourself this..... if we had a Head Coach who had just gone 8-8, 6-10, 8-8. 4-12 would we be clamoring for him to get a 5 year extension or for him to be fired? But you leave off the part where he went 9 - 7 and 11 - 5 and made the AFC Championship game twice in a row! What if you said in the past 6 years the XXX coach was above .500 twice (AFC Title Game), was at .500 twice (a threshold we've crossed twice since 2004) and was under .500 twice? Not as terrible, especially when you consider the Jets front office the past several years... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDH Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Who has had 2 winning seasons in 6 and none in 4 years. How do yo think Belichick would do with the "talent" on those Jets teams? I'm guessing he'd have a record like Rex's...or like he had in Cleveland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted January 13, 2015 Author Share Posted January 13, 2015 I have no problem with the doubts..... But if you have the time go back and look at this board when Pettine was hired There was a strong sentiment on this board that we were not getting the great defense because a lot of people thought Rex Ryan was still in charge of the play calling and Pettine would not be good because of it then Fast forward to the end of that season and everyone was crying because we were losing Pettine Now a lot of people are upset because we are losing Schwartz Anyone notice the pattern here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heitz Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Anyone notice the pattern here? A lot of tears over nothing? It's the TBD way... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 I dont understand why people keep saying this. We did not trade for the Jets team. We got their HC. The Jets had pretty much zero playmakers on offense and Rex went 7-5 against the Bills while coaching the Jets with 2 losses coming this year CBF This. I like how people point to a guy's record as the determinative factor. Jim Caldwell must be a better coach than Rex because he has a better record, right? Child, please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realist Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 I have no problem with the doubts..... But if you have the time go back and look at this board when Pettine was hired There was a strong sentiment on this board that we were not getting the great defense because a lot of people thought Rex Ryan was still in charge of the play calling and Pettine would not be good because of it then Fast forward to the end of that season and everyone was crying because we were losing Pettine Now a lot of people are upset because we are losing Schwartz Anyone notice the pattern here? Hmmm...maybe we have a great defense because of the players? No, can't be, its the coach, everyone says so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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