Heitz Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Whaley did work for the Seahawks for three years. As a scout on the east coast from 1996-1998. What an idiot Clayton is sometimes. Well, boom, there you go - gracias BTW, Whaley has the worst Wiki page ever: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doug_Whaley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reed83HOF Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Polian's decision was based on, by his own admission, he didn't want to make a long term commitment or work very hard. His decision is the HOF and honestly why shouldn't it be right now? I saw on twitter a few days back after Polain saying I'm staying at ESPN, that the Bills will still bring in a czar, but have decided to wait a while... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOUSE Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 (edited) If you think back the problems started when Whaley was looking to sign Kyle Orton You remember, Whaley threw his arms up in disgust because Marrone obviously wanted to stick with EJ and didn't like Kyle Orton This was an obvious power struggle. I side with Whaley on this one. EJ just was not ready and still isn't. Edited January 3, 2015 by HOUSE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Well, boom, there you go - gracias BTW, Whaley has the worst Wiki page ever: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doug_Whaley The funnier thing is that it make Clayton sound like a bigger buffoon that he did work there, but it was 16 years ago, so he obviously would have no connection whatsoever to those guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reed83HOF Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Also, last year the reports were that Whaley and Marrone were both frustrated with Littman and Overdorf's level of control. Littman was CFO (now gone) and Overdorf was "Senior VP of Football Administration" - wasn't he the one who was negotiating all the contracts? And isn't Overdorf being cut out of the coaching search? Polian's comments and Marrone's bad-mouthing are assumed to be directed at Whaley, but it seems to me there's a distinct possibility that they're directed elsewhere, at Littman, Overdorf, and even Berchtold. If I'm correct, all 3 of them date from the late '80s when Polian was there, and may well have had personal stories that were not to Polian's credit - remember Levy being asked "which of Polian's temper tantrums was most memorable?" and responding "there were too many of them to choose". Obviously Levy liked and respected Polian and had to some extent an equal or superior position to protect him from ill effects, but temper tantrums from a boss towards a full subordinate are a different matter. They can be perceived as abusive or bullying. Rico brought up an interesting point in another thread that Russ could be a "power jockey". You have to wonder how Polian would get along with him as well... Besides out of everyone in the Bills FO who has the most to lose with bringing in a czar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark80 Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Marrone can't have 5 pro bowl linemen and a pro bowl QB. That is not how the NFL works. That said, what else did he need? They spent significant resources on the o-line (FA signing, three draft picks), drafted a 1st round QB, signed the highest paid backup QB, spent four high picks on receivers, traded for another no. 1 receiver, traded for an emerging star RB, signed all of those core ST players, and got depth all across the defense. Exactly, apparently he believes that franchise QBs grow on trees. I need a franchise QB, go get one now. Can't find one immediately? I'm gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reed83HOF Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 If you think back the problems started when Whaley was looking to sign Kyle Orton You remember, Whaley threw his arms up in disgust because Marrone obviously wanted to stick with EJ and didn't like Kyle Orton This was an obvious power struggle. I side with Whaley on this one. EJ just was not ready and still isn't. An the Marrone said it was his decision alone and he told Whaley he was playing Orton because he gives them the best chance to win... If you look back you see what a pompous ass Marrone was all year long Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Whaley has had TWO years to fix the line. And that is not counting a year with nix at the helm and everyone knowing full well Levitre would walk. Whaley has failed big time there, and it affected his prize rookie QB and Orton. And the running game. And the passing game. Chris Williams 5 mil guaranteed. really? The guy was unemployed sitting on a couch when Whaley called him. A bust cut mid seaon once. Did he or his scouts even do any homework? And his predecessor was worse. legursky looked like a stud compared to those guards. Whaley is not without blame for the offensive woes. In fact IMO the biggest reason for them. Again who are his scouts on the offensive side of the ball? They suck. I don't necessarily know who is more to blame in this situation, but I know one thing -- you'll always come down on the side of the guy who leaves the organization. Does anyone really believe Whaley ignored Marrone and told him "deal with it" with respect to the players they brought in? That, my friends, is absolutely absurd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Back when I still liked Marrone, and had no clue of any friction between him and Whaley, I believed and postulated that Whaley probably acquiesced a little to Marrone as far as OL guys go, and even QBS. Not that he would draft players he didn't like, but he would hold Marrone's opinion of those positions highly and more likely, maybe much more likely to lean toward who Marrone wanted. I know that happened with Tuel. It's impossible to believe that Marrone would tell Whaley or manos that I don't want Kujo, I don't think he will pan out, and they drafted him anyway.And I think that sounds entirely reasonable and plausible. Whaley has always seemed like someone with a level head that listened to the people arund him. It makes this whole power struggle and idea that Whaley needs to listen to his HC even more baffling. Unless I conclude that Marrone was a complete egomaniac and insisted every player be his, even the ones he knew little of and every assistant remain, even if they were coaching historically inept systems. What's puzzling as well... When did Polian and Marrrone become BFFs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark80 Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 I don't necessarily know who is more to blame in this situation, but I know one thing -- you'll always come down on the side of the guy who leaves the organization. Does anyone really believe Whaley ignored Marrone and told him "deal with it" with respect to the players they brought in? That, my friends, is absolutely absurd. I agree, completely. You don't rise to the level of GM in the NFL with an attitude like that. This is even more true considering he is a first time GM who has proved nothing as of yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superb Owl Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Well, boom, there you go - gracias BTW, Whaley has the worst Wiki page ever: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doug_Whaley Best thing about this is it says Whaley is best known for scouting ability of defensive players. He is great at that, but we also need to find someone who can scout offensive players Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 And I think that sounds entirely reasonable and plausible. Whaley has always seemed like someone with a level head that listened to the people arund him. It makes this whole power struggle and idea that Whaley needs to listen to his HC even more baffling. Unless I conclude that Marrone was a complete egomaniac and insisted every player be his, even the ones he knew little of and every assistant remain, even if they were coaching historically inept systems. What's puzzling as well... When did Polian and Marrrone become BFFs? I think you can pretty safely conclude the bolded...The dude has serious issues...And he's not even close to being as smart as he thinks he is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 When a coach is forced on you like Marrone was on Whaley there is going to be a disconnect. I am hoping that since Whaley is getting to pick his coach there will be a more positive connection between the front office and the coaching staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 I don't know who specifically Marrone wanted. It's pretty clear who he didn't want: Mike Williams, Bryce Brown, perhaps EJ Manuel, perhaps he wanted next year's first-round pick and Eric Ebron or Zack Martin. He probably wanted more than Chris Williams and some rookies and washed-up vets at the guard positions. Again, Marrone is a jerk. But he and Whaley were not even close to being on the same page last year and that's just as much on Whaley. Was he as in love with Watkins as Whaley is/was? I'm wondering if anyone in the war room really understood exactly how deep this last draft was at the WR position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwight in philly Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 (edited) Thats why we love them never a dull moment. agree for sure, but it would be nice to reflect on a playoff season, discussing players needed, etc, but every 3 years its the same old.. wish they could just get it right for the first time in this century.. Edited January 3, 2015 by dwight in philly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Whaley has had TWO years to fix the line. And that is not counting a year with nix at the helm and everyone knowing full well Levitre would walk. Whaley has failed big time there, and it affected his prize rookie QB and Orton. And the running game. And the passing game. Chris Williams 5 mil guaranteed. really? The guy was unemployed sitting on a couch when Whaley called him. A bust cut mid seaon once. Did he or his scouts even do any homework? And his predecessor was worse. legursky looked like a stud compared to those guards. Whaley is not without blame for the offensive woes. In fact IMO the biggest reason for them. Again who are his scouts on the offensive side of the ball? They suck. Does anyone remember when Marv stepped down and Brandon got the GM tag stuck by his name? Between 08 and 09, they gutted the entire OL and the TE. All 6 positions had new starters. They also switched systems to go to an up-tempo no-huddle attack and fired the then OC 10 days before the season opener. The team regressed in every major offensive category. There is a track record of placing little to no value on OL. Unfortunately, there is an old football adage: "You are only as good as your offensive line." It sure does seem like someone either can't or refuses to grasp the meaning beneath that. Like Yvel Vram used to say, "they ain't just tinker toys." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DLH 9 Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Translated - what Polian says is that Whaley didn't listen to Marrone and he did the best he could with the cast of misfits Whaley gave him and what happened wasn't Marrone's fault. In most places I think it works the other way. The GM calls the shots and the HC works with the players provided. This isn't college where coaches do the recuiting, its the pro's. This is a lame excuse by Marrone delivered by Polian. Funny we didn't see any impact on the performance of the defense or special teams, just the offense. His area of expertise. A good coach works with what he has and adapts to the constaints and conditions including the players around him and its a head scratcher why people think Marrone is some kind of amazing coach when his lifetime record Syracuse/Buffalo is below .500. Um, excuse me... Why were we carrying 4 running backs on our roster? Plus a FB too? This has a lot to do with the inactives Marrone was playing. I am sure he would have tooled things differently, one roster spot can change the game plan design on any given Sunday. Who really has the power there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlbillsfan1975 Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 I was very impressed by Polian's comments today. And, while I'm sure he isn't sharing everything, he seemed to be sincere and rather complete. As Tuesday already said" The job became a bigger when Marrone left. Now the Bills are in major "retooling" mode. Was planning on being an "adviser" to the team. The new HC should be assured the guy who hired him will be around for awhile, but he wasn't ready for a long term commitment--nor the extra time commitment. Also his family was against it (holding signs that read ESPN) when he entered the room. Thought the offense needed more Quality players. Says the D has them. Need a QB, of course. Said there doesn't look to be a QB in the later rounds (like Garraffalo or Metz) this year. Said Bill will bring in a vet as #1 or #1a (I think I'm remembering that correctly) Said EJ is, for all intents and purposes, is a still a rookie. (BTW, Polian just mentioned Marrone as a "wise choice" for Atlanta.) Funny thing about that. When he went to Miami didn't he get very involved with the groceries? As someone who lives in Atl i do not want this at all. I would not be surprised if Polian is helping Marrone drive the price up a little for the Jets. I thoroughly do not have a lot of respect for Marrone and think he would set the Falcons back. The Falcons need Rex Ryan and Rex needs the Falcons. Rex would have the QB and offense support he never had in NY. Marrone goes to the Jets and after 8 games the media and everyone is ready to run him out of town. The fact that Marrone is from the Bronx should have no bearing on him landing the job. The fact that Marrone's offense in Buffalo got worse under him should. IF Woody hires Marrone for the Jets he will prove he is a moron! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleed Bills Blue Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Polian/Marrone have succeeded in undermining Whaley's position. Not good Maybe with some media, but the only two whose opinions of Whaley really matter seem to be backing his vision of the team's future. Ralph Wilson, God bless him, was increasingly weak and distant in his long, declining years; and, it would seem, a culture of division and contention brewed behind the scenes in the the absence of strong leadership. But times have changed. I believe Terry and Kim Pegula will not hesitate to root out the rot and establish a new culture of cooperation and winning. Let's hope this is the way it plays out. Go Bills! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphean Bills Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Um, excuse me... Why were we carrying 4 running backs on our roster? Plus a FB too? This has a lot to do with the inactives Marrone was playing. I am sure he would have tooled things differently, one roster spot can change the game plan design on any given Sunday. Who really has the power there? Normally, the head coach decides the composition of his roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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