Jairus Byrd [was Jarius Byrd]

[RealityCheck]

I find it funny that the issue that will ultimately drive me from this board (not that my presence matters) is people comparing what they make to athletes. Yes, in an ideal world income inequality would be a lot smaller but we don't live there so it doesn't matter. If fans are really rustled about the earnings of athletes they should stop watching/going to games/buying memorabilia since that is what generates the revenue, it won't matter but at least I won't have to listen to it anymore. NFL players are lucky to get ONE large deal and to not take advantage would be foolish. I hope Byrd resigns but I won't blame him if he leaves as long as he doesn't do anything to hurt the team. I don't think he was wrong to sit out with PF last season since he was under a one year deal and had played through it the year before in hopes of getting a big contract.

I could not agree more. I am a fan of Byrd's, I am wearing his jersey right now, and I would love to see a team give him 10 million plus per year. I doubt the Bills are the team to do it, and I would not blame them. If they were gonna drop 10 million a year on someone, then I can think of a couple of FA DEs that I would prefer. Fans need to understand that teams that make playoff runs have genuine gamers at QB and a variety of players who vastly outperform their pay. Sometimes it's the QB that is one of those guys. No team sniffs the playoffs by paying all of their contributors fair market value. If Byrd is franchised again, my gut tells me it would set the stage for a trade before September.

[thurst44]

How do you use a speed RB with only one leg? He was playing hurt all year. Every time he got in and got a decent run, he'd have to hobble off. Let him heel up that high ankle sprain and he'll be fine.

Plus a high ankle sprain may have been the WORST possible injury for a runner of his style. I'm looking forward to seeing what he does this year, healthy, and hopefully with upgrades on the line.

 

That being said, if the start is 5-2 and he's nearing 1000 yards already, and contract talks start heating up, as ecstatic as I'd be, my superstitious side might begin to get a bit woozy.

 

And, back to the subject of the thread, agreed that the Bills should just pay him the top salary. We are too close to being an elite defense to let a key piece (likely the most important one) go.

[BillsVet]

You can do the exact same thing for every team and it would look like what you typed. (you forgot Winfield and Big Pat) Go ahead and start with the Patriots from the year they dealt Seymour. Every team in the league drafts guys and signs guys that they don't keep for various reasons. Are you implying that keeping Nate Clements was smart for the Bills? Or Willis or Lynch the nightmare teammates?

 

I hated to see Levitre go, and Greer and Poz. But every team has good guys go elsewhere all the time, it's a reality of the league.

 

I wanted to look at the team post-Donahoe and to present day. Williams and Winfield are ancient history.

 

Since 2006 the team has flat lined into football mediocrity, winning between 4 and 7 games every season. It is their inability to retain talent that puts them into this category, which has been exacerbated with poor drafts. And the one time they were good on draft day they may be allowing 2 of those 3 players out the door in UFA.

 

That's not how you maintain a good team, let alone build one. The onus remains in them to prove things are different now.

[YoloinOhio]

How do you use a speed RB with only one leg? He was playing hurt all year. Every time he got in and got a decent run, he'd have to hobble off. Let him heel up that high ankle sprain and he'll be fine.

 

 

 

Give him what he wants plus 10%. You win with talent, not cheap guys. I swear, some of yall sound like Ralph, cheap.

Probably not running him up the middle.

[K-9]

Plus a high ankle sprain may have been the WORST possible injury for a runner of his style. I'm looking forward to seeing what he does this year, healthy, and hopefully with upgrades on the line.

 

That being said, if the start is 5-2 and he's nearing 1000 yards already, and contract talks start heating up, as ecstatic as I'd be, my superstitious side might begin to get a bit woozy.

 

And, back to the subject of the thread, agreed that the Bills should just pay him the top salary. We are too close to being an elite defense to let a key piece (likely the most important one) go.

 

I don't know of any defense EVER whose FS was "the most important" piece. Great player to be sure, perhaps a vital cog, but not the most important piece.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[NoSaint]

 

 

I don't know of any defense EVER whose FS was "the most important" piece. Great player to be sure, perhaps a vital cog, but not the most important piece.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

right, and thats why the debate is 7-10m, and not 12-16m like a pass rusher or corner.

Edited February 18, 2014 by NoSaint

[K-9]

right, and thats why the debate is 7-10m, and not 12-16m like a pass rusher or corner.

 

True.

 

But I don't think there's much of a debate anymore. If there's truth to the $10m demand, then Parker, assuming he sticks to his previous negotiating stances, will not budge. That figure is far north of Polamalu's average and I suspect he wants north of Berry money in guaranteed salary as well. I remember when we thought that somewhere between 8-8.5 and 20m guaranteed would get it done. I doubt that now.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[YoloinOhio]

True.

 

But I don't think there's much of a debate anymore. If there's truth to the $10m demand, then Parker, assuming he sticks to his previous negotiating stances, will not budge. That figure is far north of Polamalu's average and I suspect he wants north of Berry money in guaranteed salary as well. I remember when we thought that somewhere between 8-8.5 and 20m guaranteed would get it done. I doubt that now.

 

GO BILLS!!!

Byrd is going to get 5yrs/50mill with a ton guaranteed from some team. This year or next. Earl Thomas is going to get extended though this year and it may be for more than that. So if the Bills want to keep Byrd, they should not tag him again. They will just end up paying more in the long run, as Parker will ask for more than Thomas got. If both sides want the deal to happen, it will. I have a feeling it won't. Despite my daily novena. lol. Edited February 18, 2014 by YoloinOhio

[K-9]

Byrd is going to get 5yrs/50mill with a ton guaranteed from some team. This year or next. Earl Thomas is going to get extended though this year and it may be for more than that. So if the Bills want to keep Byrd, they should not tag him again. They will just end up paying more in the long run, as Parker will ask for more than Thomas got. If both sides want the deal to happen, it will. I have a feeling it won't. Despite my daily novena. lol.

 

If both sides want it to happen? Interesting concept. Parker doesn't play that way. It's his number or bust. And I can't see the Bills agreeing to that type of negotiation. For lots of reasons.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[NoSaint]

Byrd is going to get 5yrs/50mill with a ton guaranteed from some team. This year or next. Earl Thomas is going to get extended though this year and it may be for more than that. So if the Bills want to keep Byrd, they should not tag him again. They will just end up paying more in the long run, as Parker will ask for more than Thomas got. If both sides want the deal to happen, it will. I have a feeling it won't. Despite my daily novena. lol.

 

i dont know that you see numbers like that ever, yet alone next year. he would be turning 29 in the 2015 season and a 5 year deal would send him through 33 years old. theres a bit of a crossroads here where the bills are losing leverage as the tag isnt an option next year, but byrd is aging quickly as well and will start seeing fewer years/less money if he keeps waiting.

 

last year i thought low 8s gets it done, this year ill say mid/high 8s would but with those numbers itll drag til july.

[papazoid]

 

 

True.

 

But I don't think there's much of a debate anymore. If there's truth to the $10m demand, then Parker, assuming he sticks to his previous negotiating stances, will not budge. That figure is far north of Polamalu's average and I suspect he wants north of Berry money in guaranteed salary as well. I remember when we thought that somewhere between 8-8.5 and 20m guaranteed would get it done. I doubt that now.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

that ship has sailed...

 

even if the bills offered 5 yr / $50 mil with $30 mil GUARANTEED it would be REJECTED. Byrd is getting to free agency sooner or later.

 

it's all a charade....NEITHER SIDE WANTS THE OTHER !!!

 

if the Bills really wanted Byrd, they would have paid him what he asked for last year. if byrd really wanted to stay he would have accepted the bills low ball offer last year.

[K-9]

that ship has sailed...

 

even if the bills offered 5 yr / $50 mil with $30 mil GUARANTEED it would be REJECTED. Byrd is getting to free agency sooner or later.

 

it's all a charade....NEITHER SIDE WANTS THE OTHER !!!

 

if the Bills really wanted Byrd, they would have paid him what he asked for last year. if byrd really wanted to stay he would have accepted the bills low ball offer last year.

 

The Bills really want Byrd. That doesn't mean you automatically give what he wants, no questions asked. The problem is Parker and his intractable negotiating tactics.

 

You are dead-on about if Byrd really wanted to stay. And the Bills didn't low ball him, either. That is if making him a top 5 paid FREE safety isn't considered low-balling. And that was there OPENING offer. But if the other side isn't willing to negotiate, it really doesn't matter what your OPENING offer is.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Doc]

Tag him and if you can't trade him, play him. He can't use the PF excuse anymore.

[K-9]

Tag him and if you can't trade him, play him. He can't use the PF excuse anymore.

 

I agree. He's a pretty good bargain at $8.3 still.

 

I'd like to think the PF is a thing of the past, too.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[thewildrabbit]

that ship has sailed...

 

even if the bills offered 5 yr / $50 mil with $30 mil GUARANTEED it would be REJECTED. Byrd is getting to free agency sooner or later.

 

it's all a charade....NEITHER SIDE WANTS THE OTHER !!!

 

if the Bills really wanted Byrd, they would have paid him what he asked for last year. if byrd really wanted to stay he would have accepted the bills low ball offer last year.

Nobody wants to play for a constantly losing team, unless of course the team makes it worth their while. Meaning the highest paid player at the position. Even Super Mario balked at Buffalo for days until 100 mill was on the table.

 

The Bills should put the franchise tag on him again and build the offense up so it supports that #10 defense by controlling the clock, and help keeping the defense off the field and fresh.

 

I think the two will want each other once the team starts winning games.

[boyst]

I'd do a 7 year deal. $10mm this year with $8mm guaranteed. Next year same thing. Year three flat our $8mm all guaranteed with $2mm in clauses.

 

FS last a while in this league and he plays smart football not to injure himself.

 

 

 

I agree. He's a pretty good bargain at $8.3 still.

 

I'd like to think the PF is a thing of the past, too.

 

GO BILLS!!!

tag him. Play him. Hang year 3 over his head and trade him

[NoSaint]

 

 

The Bills really want Byrd. That doesn't mean you automatically give what he wants, no questions asked. The problem is Parker and his intractable negotiating tactics.

 

You are dead-on about if Byrd really wanted to stay. And the Bills didn't low ball him, either. That is if making him a top 5 paid FREE safety isn't considered low-balling. And that was there OPENING offer. But if the other side isn't willing to negotiate, it really doesn't matter what your OPENING offer is.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

if your opening offer is 20-30% below what the other side believes the market value is than you may not be considered negotiating in good faith yourself, if their assessment is fair/accurate.

[boyst]

One other thing to point out. A top paid safety in 2013 is less then one in 2014..2015...2016... so on. In 4 years he will probably be paid top 6-8. That's it

[NoSaint]

One other thing to point out. A top paid safety in 2013 is less then one in 2014..2015...2016... so on. In 4 years he will probably be paid top 6-8. That's it

 

and if he was 4th-5th in 2013, in 4 years hed barely be top 10 potentially.

[boyst]

 

 

and if he was 4th-5th in 2013, in 4 years hed barely be top 10 potentially.

Whitner, Berry, the duo in Seattle and a few others I can't think of at this moment will command much higher salaries in the next 4 years. Whitner, arguably, deserves a lot of money.

[K-9]

if your opening offer is 20-30% below what the other side believes the market value is than you may not be considered negotiating in good faith yourself, if their assessment is fair/accurate.

 

What was the market value for FREE safeties again?

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

I'd do a 7 year deal. $10mm this year with $8mm guaranteed. Next year same thing. Year three flat our $8mm all guaranteed with $2mm in clauses.

 

FS last a while in this league and he plays smart football not to injure himself.

 

tag him. Play him. Hang year 3 over his head and trade him

 

I've got no problem with that. Although a year 3 tag would pay him top 5 QB money so I can't see them doing that. But he's a bargain at 8.3 this year.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Doc]

I agree. He's a pretty good bargain at $8.3 still.

 

I'd like to think the PF is a thing of the past, too.

 

GO BILLS!!!

He said he wouldn't play last year until he was healthy, and he came back after game 5, when he could have waited until game 8. That tells me his PF is over and he can't use it as an excuse.

[NoSaint]

 

 

What was the market value for FREE safeties again?

 

 

what was the bills highest offer is just as easy a leading question... and ill again say we dont know other than there is a large gap between the two sides seemingly.

 

in the 8s seems like the market value in my book, but i will point out hes better than a goldson who got over 8 last year, so what byrds actual value is hasnt really been tested. if teams believe he is solidly better than goldson, perhaps the fair market value is in the 9s (or maybe even 10 if the report is true). if it is in the 9s and we may have offered him low 7s thats a substantial 20-30% discount we were asking him to take in order to stay with us. thats not peanuts.

 

But he's a bargain at 8.3 this year.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

if hes a bargain at 8.3... what is market value? and why were we seemingly offering low/mid 7s if 8.3 is a bargain

Edited February 18, 2014 by NoSaint

[YoloinOhio]

i dont know that you see numbers like that ever, yet alone next year. he would be turning 29 in the 2015 season and a 5 year deal would send him through 33 years old. theres a bit of a crossroads here where the bills are losing leverage as the tag isnt an option next year, but byrd is aging quickly as well and will start seeing fewer years/less money if he keeps waiting.

 

last year i thought low 8s gets it done, this year ill say mid/high 8s would but with those numbers itll drag til july.

That was what was tweeted out yesterday - there were 5-6 teams in play to pay him 5yrs/50 mill.

[Kirby Jackson]

That was what was tweeted out yesterday - there were 5-6 teams in play to pay him 5yrs/50 mill.

If that is the case then you should be able to tag and trade him for decent value (better than what was offered last year).

[Canadian Bills Fan]

Why hasnt he been tagged yet?????

 

 

lol

 

CBF

[NoSaint]

That was what was tweeted out yesterday - there were 5-6 teams in play to pay him 5yrs/50 mill.

 

and i was saying that

 

A) that might not be true, lots of things get tweeted especially when someone like parker might be trying to build leverage in the media.

B) in a year its less likely to be true as he is an aging product that will sometime soon cross over his peak and enter a decline.

 

with a 5 year deal at 27/28 youll likely see more prime years than at 29

Edited February 18, 2014 by NoSaint

[YoloinOhio]

and i was saying that A) that might not be true, lots of things get tweeted B) in a year its less likely to be true as he is an aging product that will sometime soon cross over his peak and enter a decline.

 

with a 5 year deal at 27/28 youll likely see more prime years than at 29

Oh OK - yeah, no idea if it is really the case, anyone can tweet anything

[NoSaint]

Oh OK - yeah, no idea if it is really the case, anyone can tweet anything

 

i edited a little to add that especially in a contract negotiation you have to weigh the source of that info. i doubt that the reporter approached teams and got 6 to confirm, odds are parker said "yea i got 6 teams that want to offer 10m+" in advance of negotiations going in the next few weeks.

[K-9]

what was the bills highest offer is just as easy a leading question... and ill again say we dont know other than there is a large gap between the two sides seemingly.

 

in the 8s seems like the market value in my book, but i will point out hes better than a goldson who got over 8 last year, so what byrds actual value is hasnt really been tested. if teams believe he is solidly better than goldson, perhaps the fair market value is in the 9s (or maybe even 10 if the report is true). if it is in the 9s and we may have offered him low 7s thats a substantial 20-30% discount we were asking him to take in order to stay with us. thats not peanuts.

 

 

 

if hes a bargain at 8.3... what is market value? and why were we seemingly offering low/mid 7s if 8.3 is a bargain

 

I'm not asking it as a leading question, but let's say "the market" was 8.5 for free safeties, although I don't hold any illusions that Parker doesn't include the Berry's and Polamalu's as reference points even though they play a different position. If the reports of the Bills offering somewhere between 7-7.5 are true, that doesn't come close to the 20-30% low ball offer you suggested.

 

Given the Bills' recent history of re-signing their own to fair contracts, I don't buy that they negotiated in bad faith. Not at all.

 

I firmly believe Parker doesn't budge from whatever number he deems to be his clients' worth. That may not be bad faith per se, but it leave no room for negotiation.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[enlightener]

What is taking Russ so long to get this done. Pay the man. He had 10 starts and still made the Pro Bowl.

very cleverly thought out post title....

[K-9]

what was the bills highest offer is just as easy a leading question... and ill again say we dont know other than there is a large gap between the two sides seemingly.

 

in the 8s seems like the market value in my book, but i will point out hes better than a goldson who got over 8 last year, so what byrds actual value is hasnt really been tested. if teams believe he is solidly better than goldson, perhaps the fair market value is in the 9s (or maybe even 10 if the report is true). if it is in the 9s and we may have offered him low 7s thats a substantial 20-30% discount we were asking him to take in order to stay with us. thats not peanuts.

 

 

 

if hes a bargain at 8.3... what is market value? and why were we seemingly offering low/mid 7s if 8.3 is a bargain

 

He's a bargain at 8.3 if Parker is insisting on 10m plus. He's a downright steal by comparison.

 

HIs market value is whatever anyone is willing to pay him.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[NoSaint]

 

 

I'm not asking it as a leading question, but let's say "the market" was 8.5 for free safeties, although I don't hold any illusions that Parker doesn't include the Berry's and Polamalu's as reference points even though they play a different position. If the reports of the Bills offering somewhere between 7-7.5 are true, that doesn't come close to the 20-30% low ball offer you suggested.

 

Given the Bills' recent history of re-signing their own to fair contracts, I don't buy that they negotiated in bad faith. Not at all.

 

I firmly believe Parker doesn't budge from whatever number he deems to be his clients' worth. That may not be bad faith per se, but it leave no room for negotiation.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

Bad faith may have been a poor term but overall not productively negotiating (which doesn't always make either party wrong if the values for the individuals simply don't lineup) may fairly characterize both sides.

 

8.5 would be the type of offer if they walked away I'd say the bills took an honest shot at resigning him. Id guess if we don't tag him and let him become an ufa he tops that 8.5 number though (heck, sounds like Parker says it tops 10m!)... And even at 8.5 vs 7 you are getting pretty close to that 20-30% range I gave. No idea where the bills fell but if we found out they offered 7.5 and byrd signs elsewhere for 8.5 I don't know how long Parker will have a job if he had JB play ball that hard and risk so much over that little. We will see, maybe.

Edited February 18, 2014 by NoSaint

[K-9]

Bad faith may have been a poor term but overall not productively negotiating (which doesn't always make either party wrong if the values for the individuals simply don't lineup) may fairly characterize both sides.

 

8.5 would be the type of offer if they walked away I'd say the bills took an honest shot at resigning him. Id guess if we don't tag him and let him become an ufa he tops that 8.5 number though (heck, sounds like Parker says it tops 10m!)... And even at 8.5 vs 7 you are getting pretty close to that 20-30% range I gave. No idea where the bills fell but if we found out they offered 7.5 and byrd signs elsewhere for 8.5 I don't know how long Parker will have a job if he had JB play ball that hard and risk so much over that little. We will see, maybe.

 

Yeah, I thought suggesting the Bills negotiated in "bad faith" was a bit strong especially when we know that if a party is not willing to budge then by definition you can't have a good faith negotiation. I'm comfortable saying Parker is that party.

 

Just to be clear, I was strictly talking about last years numbers, not this year. I believe 8.5 was that number last year and the Bills had a good jumping off point between 7-7.5.

 

But at at 8.3, he's a huge bargain if that $10m number is to be believed. That number was floated by someone and I have to wonder who that best serves at this point.

 

I also look for the next Tim Graham shill piece to be out soon.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[NoSaint]

 

But at at 8.3, he's a huge bargain if that $10m number is to be believed. That number was floated by someone and I have to wonder who that best serves at this point.

 

I also look for the next Tim Graham shill piece to be out soon.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

oh for sure, i think i was the first to question it when reported. were ramping up for some media attention to the situation again, both real and fabricated for leverage. im sure we have some meltdowns in either direction coming soon with any tweet.

[shibuya]

What was the market value for FREE safeties again?

 

 

problem is they lump SS and FS together.. SS IMO is the more demanding position

 

http://www.spotrac.c...afety/limit-25/

 

 

I don' think Byrd is better then Troy was at his peak. Arguments for him being as good as Berry or Gholdston

 

Troy only got $10 mil guarenteed in his contract

 

Berry got $25 mill guarenteed

 

Gholdson got $18 mil guarenteed

 

Weddle got $19 mil guarenteed

 

 

I think Byrd needs $20 mil guarenteed and $9 mil per season heavily back loaded contract

 

 

 

 

 

 

Troy Polamalu at Safety $9,866,667

Eric Berry at Safety $8,340,717

Dashon Goldson at Safety $8,250,000

Eric Weddle at Safety $8,000,000

Antrel Rolle at Safety $7,420,000

Reshad Jones at Safety $7,340,000

Kam Chancellor at Safety $7,000,502

Edited February 18, 2014 by shibuya

[papazoid]

February 19, 2014 12:25 pm

Big meeting set for Bills, Jairus Byrd

 

by Larry Hartstein | CBSSports.com

 

 

The Bills and safety Jairus Byrd's reps will meet this week in Indianapolis, and if the sides can't make progress on a long-term deal "expect the Bills to tag Byrd with the likely mindset of trying to move him," reports WGR 550 A.M. "They just can't let him go for nothing."

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/rumors

[bbb]

That sounds like a good plan to me.

[purple haze]

I don't get the Byrd hatred by some. He has been a great player for us. He's been a top tier safety since the first day he stepped on the field. It can be argued that he's now the best safety in the game. So he decided last year that he wants to get paid what he has earned. What's wrong with that?

 

Some will say that he was selfish for not playing through his plantar fasciitis last year like he has in the past. Question is, why should he have? After they weren't willing to pay him what he earned, why should he want to risk injury for the organization that wouldn't pay him? I'm sure there have been enough examples of what could happen if he did, just look at Dustin Keller. Get injured on a one year franchise tag, and he's possibly missing out on an extra 20 million in guaranteed money that usually comes with long term deals.

 

Some will say he's a jerk because he doesn't appreciate that he gets to play a game and shouldn't cry about being underpaid when he makes a lot more than the average person. This is ridiculous to me. This isn't a game to them, it is their job. They need to look out for themselves and their family and no one else. It's also amazing how some people have such a crude business mentality when it comes to the team cutting players but then get angry when the player treats it as a business. Just look at the dozens of Stevie threads. The guy for two years extremely outplayed his rookie 7th round pick contract. In 2010 he was the highest rated value player in the league. He gets the contract he earned, has one down year, and now a lot of fans want to cut him or trade him because his production didn't meet his salary in one year. Did anyone support him holding out after he completely outperformed his contract in his breakout year? I doubt it.

 

There's also the fact that he admittedly is sick of playing in a new defensive scheme every year. Can't blame him there. It's not as easy to overlook being unhappy about certain aspects of any job if you are not getting what you think you deserve.

 

Rant over.

 

Amen. And amen. People need to get over the “they get paid to play a game” mentality. It’s hypocritical. If most on this board got paid 75 thousand a year to do a specific job and they discovered someone at another firm got paid 125 thousand to do the same job, they would talk to their bosses about a raise; especially if they had received accolades for doing great work. And if someone who made 25 thousand a year said you were being selfish you wouldn’t think twice about it. In Byrd’s industry 7 million is NOT his market value. His market value is over 9 million based on accomplishment and peer salary. It’s that simple. It’s not personal. Nor does it mean he is not grateful to be making what he makes. That, however, does not mean he should accept below market value because “he would be rich anyway.” It’s business. And it’s his business.

Edited February 19, 2014 by purple haze

[NDBUFFCUSEFAN]

Amen. And amen. People need to get over the “they get paid to play a game” mentality. It’s hypocritical. If most on this board got paid 75 thousand a year to do a specific job and they discovered someone at another firm got paid 125 thousand to do the same job, they would talk to their bosses about a raise; especially if they had received accolades for doing great work. And if someone who made 25 thousand a year said you were being selfish you wouldn’t think twice about it. In Byrd’s industry 7 million is NOT his market value. His market value is over 9 million based on accomplishment and peer salary. It’s that simple. It’s not personal. Nor does it mean he is not grateful to be making what he makes. That, however, does not mean he should accept below market value because “he would be rich anyway.” It’s business. And it’s his business.

 

Agreed 100%, I think players should absolutely maximize their first big contract since it may be their only big day and this includes getting every dollar possible guaranteed. If I were an agent I would never advise my client to accept less that the absolute maximum unless the player was at the end of his career chasing a ring or if there were family issues.