Miyagi-Do Karate Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 if interested in reading about the seahawks, this is a good breakdown/introduction to the concepts in their scheme. while they are elite talents, they also have a pretty nifty scheme that goes beyond "lineup and be better than the guy across from you" http://www.sbnation....efensive-fronts Thanks for posting; interesting read. It confirms some of what I had previously read about the Seahawks defense. But even the wrinkes in the fronts that they use-- the big DE playing 2-gap so they can keep the "LEO" on the field, using the "bear" front, etc.-- strikes me as pretty simple tweaks. It's certainly effective and smart coaching. But, in my mind, guys like Rex and Pettine are better tacticians--seems like a lot of what they try to do is be more unpredictable and create schemes that are harder to read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Thanks for posting; interesting read. It confirms some of what I had previously read about the Seahawks defense. But even the wrinkes in the fronts that they use-- the big DE playing 2-gap so they can keep the "LEO" on the field, using the "bear" front, etc.-- strikes me as pretty simple tweaks. It's certainly effective and smart coaching. But, in my mind, guys like Rex and Pettine are better tacticians--seems like a lot of what they try to do is be more unpredictable and create schemes that are harder to read. Even if what you think is true, are they interviewing for a HC job or a DC job? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Pettine's the #2 guy... the Brownies are waiting for the SB to finish so they can interview the guy they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 5) The AV guy that couldn't get the damn microphones to work during the presser haha--so classic. The staple of every major Bills' announcement is the inept AV at the pressers. I recall watching a black screen for a presser a few years ago (might have been marv's re-hiring). Even if what you think is true, are they interviewing for a HC job or a DC job? Great point. People kind of forget that the skill set is different for HC versus a coordinator. It seems like the best HC's are effective managers/CEO's, and the guys that get themselves into trouble are the ones that have to call all their plays or cede control to one side of the ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsForever Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 (edited) Thanks for posting; interesting read. It confirms some of what I had previously read about the Seahawks defense. But even the wrinkes in the fronts that they use-- the big DE playing 2-gap so they can keep the "LEO" on the field, using the "bear" front, etc.-- strikes me as pretty simple tweaks. It's certainly effective and smart coaching. But, in my mind, guys like Rex and Pettine are better tacticians--seems like a lot of what they try to do is be more unpredictable and create schemes that are harder to read. I agree. ...and if we would read any articles about the Bills defensive scheme the article would focus on Mike Pettine and not doug marrone. That Seattle article focused on Pete Carroll. Not a single mention of Quinn. I find that there are too many unproven/unanswered questions about Quinn and his philosphy, experience, scheme, playcalling etc I find that Quinn is a MUCH more riskier candidate than Pettine although the "casual" football fan will look at Pettine and say to themselves he is the current DC of the Bills. Edited January 22, 2014 by BuffaloBillsForever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I'm going to to flip this on it's head for a minute. At what point in time does Pettine owe it to Buffalo to pull his name out? It is already late January! How long should he keep this team on the hook for? At what point in time does he owe it to Buffalo to stop playing the Browns game? Is there a point in time where this happens? He has to have already realized he isn't there first choice. I'm thinking they are keeping his name out there for leverage. I think it's totally valid for Dougie squared to hop on the blower and ask just WTF is going on here? I like Pettine and hope he's around next year, but let's not overreact and make him and the Bills 2013 defense out to be the 85 Bears or 00 Ravens. Buffalo's Defense had a nice year. Pettine was a contributor to that. But our standards and expectations are so low we are making him out to be irreplaceable. Buffalo ranked: 10th in yards allowed 4th in passing yards allowed 28th in rushing yards allowed 20th in points allowed In many ways, you could make the argument that the defense was so focused on getting sacks and turnovers that they ended up with glaring holes in the running game and the result was a below average defense in the stat that matters, points allowed. Again, I want Pettine to stay and I like what the defense has done, but I am not going to lose all hope if he leaves. And lest we forget that the statistical aberration that really boosts those rankings didn't come until week 16. Why do I get the feeling that everyone who says we're !@#$ed if he leaves also spent a lot of time during the regular season telling us how bad the defense was? Why do I get the feeling that everyone who says we'll be fine is NOW starting to do the math on how bad the defense was...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 honestly, i think in the next day or two would be the professional courtesy to the bills, and even himself. if they cant close a deal with him with atleast 2 interviews and over a week of follow up this late in the process, youd think itd be time to say enough is enough from his side. will that happen? no clue. as for a second year in a row it appears they are not getting their dream guy, or even like the 5th guy on the list, i would imagine job security will be hard to sell unless Gase changes his mind (or is just playing coy to keep the distractions away from super bowl prep and has a handshake agreement behind the scenes). Yeah... kind of embarrassing for MP's pride. But heck, he may not care. He sees dollar signs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Thanks for posting; interesting read. It confirms some of what I had previously read about the Seahawks defense. But even the wrinkes in the fronts that they use-- the big DE playing 2-gap so they can keep the "LEO" on the field, using the "bear" front, etc.-- strikes me as pretty simple tweaks. It's certainly effective and smart coaching. But, in my mind, guys like Rex and Pettine are better tacticians--seems like a lot of what they try to do is be more unpredictable and create schemes that are harder to read. i think you are right that the ryan defenses are a little more.... i dont know that complex is the word im looking for... maybe exotic.... but i think that seattle does a pretty good job tailoring their schemes, finding weaknesses, creating advantages etc... The other thing i like is that it seems they looked hard at roster composition and finding where there was undervalued talent around the league when creating the schemes (ie the scheme lends itself to being able to bring in more talent per dollar spent). really, i have no idea how quinn vs pettine would do with game management, or even how they set up day to day operations at the facility but i think both have definite pros on their resumes for why they would be possible good choices (i know you werent saying quinn didnt) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I agree. ...and if we would read any articles about the Bills defensive scheme the article would focus on Mike Pettine and not doug marrone. That Seattle article focused on Pete Carroll. Not a single mention of Quinn. I find that there are too many unproven/unanswered questions about Quinn and his philosphy, experience, scheme, playcalling etc I find that Quinn is a MUCH more riskier candidate than Pettine although the "casual" football fan will look at Pettine and say to themselves he is the current DC of the Bills. Carroll is a defensive HC. Marrone is a offensive HC. Carroll's DC is going to run a version of his defense. Marrone's OC is going to run a version of his offense. Not unusual to see the articles focus that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I agree. ...and if we would read any articles about the Bills defensive scheme the article would focus on Mike Pettine and not doug marrone. That Seattle article focused on Pete Carroll. Not a single mention of Quinn. I find that there are too many unproven/unanswered questions about Quinn and his philosphy, experience, scheme, playcalling etc I find that Quinn is a MUCH more riskier candidate than Pettine although the "casual" football fan will look at Pettine and say to themselves he is the current DC of the Bills. quinn had only been DC for a short stretch at the point the article was written (early this season), with bradley having left for jax last year. carroll definitely had more of a hand in building the unit and schemes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsForever Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 (edited) Carroll is a defensive HC. Marrone is a offensive HC. Carroll's DC is going to run a version of his defense. Marrone's OC is going to run a version of his offense. Not unusual to see the articles focus that way. It just begs the question what kind of coattails he has been riding on the success of the defense. Although it shows nothing about in-game management, how he would run a team etc these type of things raise more questions about him. I just find Quinn is more inexperienced and unproven than Pettine...though it isn't to say he isn't a better candidate...we all have no idea... Edited January 22, 2014 by BuffaloBillsForever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I am sad I missed the Mario thread. Sounds like it was a good time! http://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/143043-mario-williams-officially-a-buffalo-bill/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBuff423 Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 As of last night I was convinced that Pettine would be leaving the Buffalo area for the Brown-stains, but now...I'm not so sure. If the brass really, truly wanted Pettine, they would have made the offer last night, and consumated the deal with a press conference today. Given the overall discussion about Quinn and Atlanta OC being in the mix, it seems they may "like" Pettine and consider him a viable alternative, but their true intent is for someone else...like most have said, Quinn. Just a guess, have NO inside information it's an absolute shot in the dark at trying to read their behavior for indications of intent...don't think we're going to find out before Sunday though...wish that weren't the case, but ....on it goes. Meanwhile, Pepper Johnson is still lingering out there and would love the BILLS to go get him! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 http://forums.twobil...a-buffalo-bill/ haha--awesome. That's like handing someone a copy of "war and peace" and saying, "go, get 'em!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 http://forums.twobil...a-buffalo-bill/ Welp.. there goes any productivity I was going to have today! [grabs popcorn] As of last night I was convinced that Pettine would be leaving the Buffalo area for the Brown-stains, but now...I'm not so sure. If the brass really, truly wanted Pettine, they would have made the offer last night, and consumated the deal with a press conference today. Given the overall discussion about Quinn and Atlanta OC being in the mix, it seems they may "like" Pettine and consider him a viable alternative, but their true intent is for someone else...like most have said, Quinn. Just a guess, have NO inside information it's an absolute shot in the dark at trying to read their behavior for indications of intent...don't think we're going to find out before Sunday though...wish that weren't the case, but ....on it goes. Meanwhile, Pepper Johnson is still lingering out there and would love the BILLS to go get him! I agree with all of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 (edited) As of last night I was convinced that Pettine would be leaving the Buffalo area for the Brown-stains, but now...I'm not so sure. If the brass really, truly wanted Pettine, they would have made the offer last night, and consumated the deal with a press conference today. Given the overall discussion about Quinn and Atlanta OC being in the mix, it seems they may "like" Pettine and consider him a viable alternative, but their true intent is for someone else...like most have said, Quinn. Just a guess, have NO inside information it's an absolute shot in the dark at trying to read their behavior for indications of intent...don't think we're going to find out before Sunday though...wish that weren't the case, but ....on it goes. Meanwhile, Pepper Johnson is still lingering out there and would love the BILLS to go get him! generally agree on the pettine speculation - its clear he isnt #1 but that they dont want to close the door on pettine until someone (more than one maybe) finalizes their decision. of course even if the bills were interested in johnson - would we want to add him before knowing what our plan this year is, and would he want to join not knowing who his boss would be? Edited January 22, 2014 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Braedenstearns Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 No job offered... per bills app Bills Mobile: Browns have no offer for Pettine yet | http://bit.ly/1bhPXcL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section122 Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 honestly, i think in the next day or two would be the professional courtesy to the bills, and even himself. if they cant close a deal with him with at least 2 interviews and over a week of follow up this late in the process, youd think itd be time to say enough is enough from his side. will that happen? no clue. This is exactly my feeling. I think he kind of owes it both the Bills and himself to put a clear deadline. If you want me I need to know by this date. I know he wants to be a HC but there has to come a point in time where he is damaging his chances at success if he takes the job and/or damaging the Bills chances of success next season. I think it's totally valid for Dougie squared to hop on the blower and ask just WTF is going on here? I would hope he is keeping them in the loop but if I were them my patience would certainly be wearing thin. haha--awesome. That's like handing someone a copy of "war and peace" and saying, "go, get 'em!" I was going to say the same thing. Yolo might be posting a lot more here as that classic might cost him his job! That was some of the most fun I have ever had as a Bills fan. Especially when they signed him. My wife doesn't care much about football but everyday would ask about it because I was on edge (and couldn't stay away from tbd). When they finally signed him she was as happy as I was (because then I could you know actually pay attention to her) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBuff423 Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 generally agree on the pettine speculation - its clear he isnt #1 but that they dont want to close the door on pettine until someone (more than one maybe) finalizes their decision. if course even if the bills were interested in johnson - would we want to add him before knowing what our plan this year is, and would he want to join not knowing who his boss would be? Fair question, and I'm certainly not saying I know all the logistics involved. But I would think that the BILLS could approach Pepper Johnson (which I know is being discussed in another thread so I'll make it my last about him) by saying something to the effect they recognize his accomplishments and that they feel they "need" him on their team to improve the current Defense and that as Pettine is garnering a great deal of interest, it's more a matter of when not if he leaves for a HC position and at such time the BILLS organization and Coach Marrone would very strongly consider promoting PJ to the DC position at the time it becomes available given his experience and of course dependent on how well he does upon joining the BILLS...furthermore, I don't know what other DC positions are available to him at this point given the lateness of all these developments relative to the "Off-Season" for both college and NFL....?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 No job offered... per bills app Bills Mobile: Browns have no offer for Pettine yet | http://bit.ly/1bhPXcL Poor Mike Pettine. He's the last girl at bar close. You keep hoping for someone better, but you're drunk and desperate, so you'll just have to settle and set your alarm early. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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