dave mcbride Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 (edited) Warner's journeyman appearance was only due to an injury. Warner was a 2 times league MVP. He slumped because he broke a finger on his throwing hand. He started to look good again at the Giants(2 years later).....but since they had just drafted Eli Manning(#1 pick), Warner was given the bench. He then played extremely well at the Cardinals taking their sorry franchise to the SB and nearly won it. He was great for 2 teams.....and is the only QB ever to take 2 different teams to the SB. Warner wasn't a journeyman. Whatever people want to call him, I think Warner deserves to go to the hall of fame. Edited March 31, 2013 by dave mcbride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transient Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 I would still argue that Warner was a journeyman. After his great Superbowl year he slumped and was cut, went to the Giants and lost out on the job to Eli manning, went to the Cardinals, lost out on the job to Matt Leinhart, and then led them to the playoffs in '08 and the Superbowl in '09. If that doesn't speak to being a journeyman, I don't know what does. Not to mention his arena league pedigree before joining the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Trent Green? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Brad Johnson. Chris Chandler. There we go.....more company for Gannon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 The Bills wanted to restructure/keep Fitz (per Nix recorded call). Fitz didn't want to restructure. Fitz left. Everyone was jumping for joy. The Bills were left with a Fitz-sized hole in their roster. Kolb fills that hole. He will be a marginal improvement over Fitz. Yet here we are jumping for joy again. As far as I can tell and as far as the Bills go, they're stil back at zero, as this is the equivalent of re-signing Fitz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 NFL.com's take on the move. If you look in that video, it says Kolb had been sacked 23 times in the last 3 games, including 6 against the Bills that day. That's just about 8 sacks per game for three straight games. Yikes. Any QB would be "injury-prone" (my least favorite football phrase) behind that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSBill Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 http://m.espn.go.com...fceast&id=34313 Ironic how about prophetic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Yet here we are jumping for joy again. We are? Who? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondo in seattle Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 At one point earlier this year we had ZERO QBs under contract. That was scary. Now we have two former NFL starters as well as Aaron Corp. Jackson was signed for one year and Kolb for two. Clearly Buddy is looking for band aids to get us through the next year or so while he searches for a franchise QB in the draft. Kolb and Jackson are not great but none of our options were. Altogether, I'm much happier with our QB situation than I was a couple months ago. Kolb + Jackson + Rookie... it could have been much worse. Arguably, it was worse last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSBill Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 (edited) I would still argue that Warner was a journeyman. After his great Superbowl year he slumped and was cut, went to the Giants and lost out on the job to Eli manning, went to the Cardinals, lost out on the job to Matt Leinhart, and then led them to the playoffs in '08 and the Superbowl in '09. If that doesn't speak to being a journeyman, I don't know what does. Wow, wish he would have "journeyed" to Buffalo. Warner is one of the top QB's of the current NFL era (that is, after 2000). 4-time Pro Bowler & 2-time First-Team All-Pro Link Edited March 31, 2013 by CSBill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 We are? Who? Sorry, I can concede that. But the overall response is positive, whereas the overall respond to restructuring Fitz (I'm speculating here) would probably have been negative when the two moves (signing Kolb/restructuring Fitz) are more or less the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Sorry, I can concede that. But the overall response is positive, whereas the overall respond to restructuring Fitz (I'm speculating here) would probably have been negative when the two moves (signing Kolb/restructuring Fitz) are more or less the same. I'll agree with that. It seems that Kolb and Fitz are pretty much the same guy, although I'd give Fitz slightly higher marks for durability and Kolb slightly higher marks for potential. In the end, it balances. But at the very least, we have somebody who can play, and who probably won't embarrass us. Yeah, that's how far we've fallen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Doug Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 I have absolutely no problem with this signing, just the way it went down. Kolb was cut by the Cards 2 weeks ago. He could have easily been picked up by a number of teams. Why did it take so long for the Bills to come to the conclusion he would be a viable option? Either the Bills haven't prepared themselves for multiple possibilities (i.e. the possibility of the Cards cutting Kolb and how they would respond), don't have a general plan to improve their QB position, or just don't plain know what they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 (edited) He was a journeyman before he even got to the Rams. He was on the Packers and got cut. He was in the Arena League. He got a tryout with the Bears and got cut. He was in NFL Europe. And then played for the Rams. Sorry, that's a journeyman. That's not quite the case. He was on the Packers directly after college(1994). He was competing against Favre, Brunell & Detmer....and didn't make the cut. He was then out of football. In 1997 he got a tryout for the Bears but an injury(spider bite of all things) prevented him from attending. He was finally signed by the Rams in 1998(his first NFL contract). He certainly could be called a journeyman.....but his situation was quite unique for a QB. He didn't bounce around the league as a typical journeyman does.....he basically kept being rejected by NFL teams. When he finally got signed, he became MVP in 2 seasons.....and it was only injury that caused him to be moved after that. I personally wouldn't call him a journeyman as once he was given a legitimate opportunity, he showed himself throughout his career to be of elite calibre......but I understand how some would squeeze him into the journeyman category. Whatever people want to call him, I think Warner deserves to go to the hall of fame. Me too. Edited March 31, 2013 by Dibs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xsoldier54 Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 The Bills wanted to restructure/keep Fitz (per Nix recorded call). Fitz didn't want to restructure. Fitz left. Everyone was jumping for joy. The Bills were left with a Fitz-sized hole in their roster. Kolb fills that hole. He will be a marginal improvement over Fitz. Yet here we are jumping for joy again. As far as I can tell and as far as the Bills go, they're stil back at zero, as this is the equivalent of re-signing Fitz. Couldn't disagree more. Kolb is way better than Fitz.. He has a stronger arm and can throw the deep ball. He had a terrible O-Line at Arizona, he was hurt and Whisenhunt's system was not a good fit for him. I expect him to play way better than Fitz.. Of all the FA QB's out there, this was the guy I wanted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 (edited) What a silly twist this thread has taken. Now Kurt Warner is a journeyman? I think you shed the the "journeyman" title somewhere between your second league MVP award, and your third SB appearance as starting QB. Edit: On another note, I can't believe those of you who turn your nose up at this deal. Kevin Kolb is the best QB we've had since Fitz. Seriously, it's at worst a lateral move that saves some cash and potentially eases the cap situation as it would have been had we kept Fitz. Plus, the biggest shortcoming with Fitz, contrary to popular belief, wasn't his arm strength, but his tendency to turn the ball over in the final moments with the game in reach. Perhaps Kolb is better at the last minute rally. Edited March 31, 2013 by Rob's House Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xsoldier54 Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 I have absolutely no problem with this signing, just the way it went down. Kolb was cut by the Cards 2 weeks ago. He could have easily been picked up by a number of teams. Why did it take so long for the Bills to come to the conclusion he would be a viable option? Either the Bills haven't prepared themselves for multiple possibilities (i.e. the possibility of the Cards cutting Kolb and how they would respond), don't have a general plan to improve their QB position, or just don't plain know what they want. Or they knew what they wanted and so did Kolb. They scheduled the meeting to fit everyone's schedule and got it done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 (edited) Sorry, I can concede that. But the overall response is positive, whereas the overall respond to restructuring Fitz (I'm speculating here) would probably have been negative when the two moves (signing Kolb/restructuring Fitz) are more or less the same. I think we have to wait for the contract details before we can compare the two. If Kolb's contract is a solid 2 yr/13m deal then I'll be bashing my head against the wall as it would have been cheaper to keep Fitz(with a small pay cut that he would have accepted). If Kolb's deal is half that.....with incentive bonuses, it will be a shrewd move as it means we basically kept Fitz(in the guise of Kolb) but at a much lesser cap number. Edited March 31, 2013 by Dibs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 Sorry, I can concede that. But the overall response is positive, whereas the overall respond to restructuring Fitz (I'm speculating here) would probably have been negative when the two moves (signing Kolb/restructuring Fitz) are more or less the same. The positive response is that the Bills were in a tough spot. Fitz wouldn't restructure (he wanted his release, he knew he'd have to light it up to start). So they did what they had to do which put them in a position of almost having to draft a QB (which is not how you want to pick a QB). They made a signing to get them out of a bad spot. You can say it's spinning their wheels. I don't like Kolb. I think his high end is average. The reason for the signing is to have a guy that can man the wheel while you go find the captain instead of grabbing the first guy you see in the port to captain the ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted March 31, 2013 Share Posted March 31, 2013 He was a journeyman before he even got to the Rams. He was on the Packers and got cut. He was in the Arena League. He got a tryout with the Bears and got cut. He was in NFL Europe. And then played for the Rams. Sorry, that's a journeyman. Kelly is right. Whatever people want to call him, I think Warner deserves to go to the hall of fame. He should be a first ballot HOF. What a silly twist this thread has taken. Now Kurt Warner is a journeyman? I think you shed the the "journeyman" title somewhere between your second league MVP award, and your third SB appearance as starting QB. Edit: On another note, I can't believe those of you who turn your nose up at this deal. Kevin Kolb is the best QB we've had since Fitz. Seriously, it's at worst a lateral move that saves some cash and potentially eases the cap situation as it would have been had we kept Fitz. Plus, the biggest shortcoming with Fitz, contrary to popular belief, wasn't his arm strength, but his tendency to turn the ball over in the final moments with the game in reach. Perhaps Kolb is better at the last minute rally. I think you missed the point of the thread--it asked what journeyman QB came in and turned a team around. As Kelly pointed out, Warner fit the definition before he got to the Rams. Two teams later, he was with the Cards (his 4th NFL team). But your comments about Kolb and Fitz are on target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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