NewEra Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 Obviously they're the pros and I'm not but my faith in the new regime will be very shaken if they retain Kelsay. I'm becoming very concerned because he's still on the roster. And it's possible that I've mis-evaluated Kelsay over these many years but I really don't think so. Let me put it this way, no other team in this universe would have paid Kelsay over $50 million for the "performances" he's turned in. My thoughts exactly. I'm happy with the cuts they've made, but the fact that they haven't cut Kelsey yet really has me baffled. He isn't worth what he's paid. Not even close. I thought the new system would take in account risk vs reward. 4+ million cap space vs a player that is worth about 1 million cap space (if that). Makes no sense to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 Nix's influence has been reduced significantly. Brandon will say otherwise, but this was done because Buddy is above his pay grade as a GM. He may have slight value in a scouting role, but building a plan and seeing it through is not his strong-suit. 16 wins in 48 games should demonstrate this beyond dispute. Decisions made on personnel people aren't as visual as say, the HC or DC. At the same time, I'm more concerned with who's picking the players than those coaching them. That's not to say a HC, DC, or OC is irrelevant, but Gailey gets plenty of blame (deservedly so) yet it is Nix more responsible for this mess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 My thoughts exactly. I'm happy with the cuts they've made, but the fact that they haven't cut Kelsey yet really has me baffled. He isn't worth what he's paid. Not even close. I thought the new system would take in account risk vs reward. 4+ million cap space vs a player that is worth about 1 million cap space (if that). Makes no sense to me. ive been saying these things for the last 3 coaching staffs now. I can't figure it out either. Never have been able to. The only thing thy comes to mind is... Kelsey must have incriminating pictures of Ralph and a ball boy Or Regardless of what we all say or want to believe, he is really one hell of a locker room leader. (Which IMO is more of a reason why he should be gone, but as a new HC of a team, I get why they might want that ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincec Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 (edited) I feel that it's become very clear over the past month that the Bills is going through a large change in both identity and roster. Yes, we still have Nix, but I feel like Marrone and Pettine are very much in control and Brandon is looking to separate himself from his predecessor. With that, I'm curious to know what others think is the thought process right now with the changes you've seen made. Here's mine: 1 - Pettine has a very specific idea of the defense he wants to run and knows exactly the people he wants for it. I feel like he is watching tape right now and evaluating these guys one at a time. We will still see cuts and I expect to see him be active in FA, which goes against traditional Buddy ways. I think Kelsay has a chance to stay just for his ability to play the run. As has been stated, so far the cuts are pretty straight forward. They probably would've even been made by Wannstedt. Barnett is the only slight surprise to me but if he failed his physical then that explains it. 2 - Marrone doesn't have a qb plan yet. I don't think he's sold on anyone, even in the draft. Tjax intrigues him the most, hence the one year deal, but doesn't know if he can handle it. Money isn't a huge issue, or Fitz would have been shown the door. Remember with Fitz that we don't save any cap money really to cut him. Some, but not drastic. It's only real money that is saved. Marrone is just going to take his time, draft someone, and see who handles the offense the best. I think they tipped their hand regarding QB by resigning Jackson. I don't expect them to take a QB in the first two days of the draft. I think that they just don't see an NFL starter in this class and are looking for other options to shake up the position. 3 - We are cutting money for someone. I don't know if it's to re-sign Levitre or Byrd, but I hope so. Maybe Pettine wants to make a run at more defensive guys than I realize. I know it's not for the draft. It just seems like we are preparing for something. Agree. They will sign a couple of defensive free agents, maybe three if they don't resign Levitre. Overall, win or lose, this team will have a personality to it. If anything, the changes being made are to send that message. We will not be the same push around team we were. Now, will we end up like the Jets, who were all talk (even though I would take an AFC Championship game), I don't know. I don't know how you can say this at this point. Marrone hasn't really said anything about this team besides that they will play hard, which should be a given. Edited February 17, 2013 by vincec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanInUticaTampa Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 Obviously they're the pros and I'm not but my faith in the new regime will be very shaken if they retain Kelsay. I'm becoming very concerned because he's still on the roster. And it's possible that I've mis-evaluated Kelsay over these many years but I really don't think so. Let me put it this way, no other team in this universe would have paid Kelsay over $50 million for the "performances" he's turned in. Kelsey is one of the key things I am looking for as well during this offseason process. The thing about Kelsey is, he must have some kind of value. this guy has survived a ton of coaching changes, so coaches must like the guy. How hard can it be to trade him for a 6th/7th pick? I don't see a spot here for kelsey anymore with these new coaches. they are going to be running multiple fronts, and he is only usefull in a 4-3. in a 3-4, the guy is worthless. we have plenty of options on the outside, and mitght even draft another one. he just isn't worth keeping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Trooth Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 I read into it that there's a new coaching staff in the beginning stages of assembing 85 players which they believe will yield 53 productive players by Sept. 2013. And, I bet I'm spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 Rookie NFL HC finding his way. Second class NFL supporting coaching staff finding their way. We've been here before, though the media and fans are a few steps ahead of the new boys in town. They've got a lot to prove. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 ive been saying these things for the last 3 coaching staffs now. I can't figure it out either. Never have been able to. The only thing thy comes to mind is... Kelsey must have incriminating pictures of Ralph and a ball boy Or Regardless of what we all say or want to believe, he is really one hell of a locker room leader. (Which IMO is more of a reason why he should be gone, but as a new HC of a team, I get why they might want that ) I have never seen an NFL team play with less heart than the one that showed up in San Francisco last season. Any player involved in maybe the worst defensive effort ever put forth on an NFL field isn't worth keeping for a "leadership" reason. A lack of mental toughness has permeated this team since Donahoe surgically removed the Bills identity in the name of eliminating all cap debt in one offseason. The final nail in the coffin was cutting Ted Washington. Haven't had a positive identity since. Kelsay has been part of the problem. If anything, he should be extracted like a rotten tooth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 My predictions: - Defense starts to demonstrate that talent is there and Wannstedt had even less of a clue than first imagined. - Somebody emerges at LB, but we can't say we have three solid starters - McKelvin, if re-signed, will start - Nelson hangs on to the roster and makes a bit of a difference - A rookie QB starts sometime this season - Spiller gets more carries - The run D is an improvement but not top 10 Beyond that, it's hard to say anything because there are so many balls in the air at the moment. Levitre, Byrd, McKelvin, the QB question, who plays LB, whom we draft, who we sign...? I am not happy at all about the Fitz and TJ show, and I hope that a real viable rookie contender is brought into that mix and that Fitz does not see the field this year. If not, I expect a lot of open receivers missed yet again. Seeing this team get to the playoffs would surprise me. This Bills team played so unevenly last season that the ceiling would be a playoff appearance if all phases of the team were actually clicking at the same point, but it seemed like every time the offense was taking a step, the defense was collapsing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 I'm not watching another game until Fitz is replaced as the starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 Kelsey must have incriminating pictures of Ralph and a ball boy [/Quote] It always comes back to perenniel TBD whipping boy, Chris Kelsay. LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockinon Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 I'm not watching another game until Fitz is replaced as the starter. I guess you'll be waiting a while. He's likely going to start this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 A lack of mental toughness has permeated this team since Donahoe surgically removed the Bills identity in the name of eliminating all cap debt in one offseason. The final nail in the coffin was cutting Ted Washington. Haven't had a positive identity since. Kelsay has been part of the problem. If anything, he should be extracted like a rotten tooth. Donahoe has been gone for seven years. When he came on board he did what he told the owner he was going to do i.e. quickly gettting out of cap jail and then moving forward. His five year stint was a failure. Seven years have passed since his departure. The team is still in the doldrums. Multiple front office and coaching changes and the standard poor drafting of players and free agent acquisitions that were demonstrably on their downside.continue to plague this francise If an organization has a quality GM who makes good staffing and coaching hires there should be a major improvement after three years or so. The Bills currently have the same GM who has been very lackluster.. Many people make the claim that his authority has been eroded. If that is the case then it is absurd to have him still in his position. Brandon has been in his position as the president of the franchise for a very short period of time . So far the organization has been functioning in a reasonable manner as exhibited by the HC hiring process. That sure is a much more professional approach than Nix's hire of Gailey without much of a hiring process other than resorting to the archaic crony approach. As it stands I am very uncomfortable having a GM who already has had three years to demonstrate his judgments. His player evaluations have been poor. But what bothers me even more about him is that there is little energy and creativity that comes from a position that is the centerpiece of a franchise. Losing is bad enough but being boring makes things even more intolerable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 McGee, Barnett, Wilson, and the other cuts non-resigns all make sense to me. We need the cap space to resign Levitre and Byrd and go after better free agents like Landry (Who I think will be the Bills big free agent signing if you consider that a big signing). The Travaris Jackson signing makes zero sense to me, TJ sucks. I hope they try to bring in a few vets on defense to help transition to the new defense and if we spend on offense I hope we make a splash at WR. I am not expecting much out of free agency outside of a couple of mid level guys on defense (I am thinking Jets castoffs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 (edited) I guess you'll be waiting a while. He's likely going to start this year. It certainly looks like a possiblity, and that's why I mentioned that I wouldn't be watching. If they have a rookie that is obviously going to get the job midseason, I MIGHT watch. But frankly, if the rookie is that close, I wouldn't see a point in waiting to put him in. No way am I watching if Fitz is presented as the expected full season starter. Eff that! I skipped the final 9 games last season, something I had NEVER done before (30 years of fandom). That Tennessee game was IT! No more Fitz for me. Edited February 18, 2013 by Marauder'sMicro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Brandon's "predecessor" was a guy named Russ Brandon... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webster Guy Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Cutting someone like Kelsay only makes sense if he says no to a restructure and if you think he can't make the team in camp over a rookie LDE. They aren't going to invest any more money in that position with Anderson and Mario getting paid heavy money, so unless we draft someone better in the late rounds (which rarely pans out), I think Kelsay is still good enough to make the team and worth having on board for a reasonable salary. He seems like a smart guy, he knows nobody is going to sign him for big money and he's obviously banked enough to not worry about cash the rest of his life anyway. Kelsay is long time Buffalo guy with a family that likes it here. The reason he's not released is because he either hasn't been approached by the front office with a restructured deal or he's already agreed to a modification and it is being hashed out. If he doesn't do well in camp he gets cut and probably retires. Our front office is done with putting any more resources into the Dline. We're focused on LB's and Corners on defense, receivers and QB's on offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Yes but we also had a coach who continually would put Fitz in a position to make those terrible passes as opposed to handing the ball off more. I agree that Fitz is in no way a franchise QB, but also agree that the biggest problem with the team was giving up 30 points a game and then asking Fitz to go down the field in the last two minutes. It certainly didn't help that besides SJ, the team had weak WR overall. As to your comment abut QB competition, you list 12 teams, that's the problem in the NFL, there are 32 teams and less than 15 legit franchise QB's, so the teams without will go to greater lengths to try and find that guy. I'm sure the Bill's front office never thought that Fitz would be another Tom Brady or Rogers, but were hoping he'd be serviceable. For the most part he's been on the lower end of that. We can get rid of Fitz, bring in another retread who may look like an improvement for a year or so, or bring a rookie who may be the next Tom Brady, but much better chance he's the next Ryan Leaf. That's not a knock at the Bill's front office either, just a fact that for all teams in the league, they find more Ryan Leafs than Brady's, again goes back to the point of not enough legit QB's to go around. I've said it before and will say it again, the league needs to develop Stepford QB's. uHHH- Yawn-Uggh.....C'mon Fitz was having a difficult time throwing to receivers wearing his teams colors in the second half of the season. Often when he threw a 10 yard toss it would hit the ground or be above the receivers head on a given play. Almost everytime he went deep he would overthrow his receiver by about 5 yards. Have you been watching the same QB the past couple of years?? Of course he always has a nice training camp and even the preseason was pitiful. Everyone said the Bills were holding back and keeping the playbook scaled down until the opening game! C'mon you watched the same games, and when it's getting late in the game Ryan Fitzpatrick can get you close, but cannot close out a game with a WIN period! He is nothing but a quality backup for most teams that can win a game or two a season if the weather is good, he isn't hanging his head, and making some dumb throws. That is why he is willing to restructure his contract and wants to stay in Buffalo at all costs, because he knows their is no market for his services. Could you envision New England, Denver, Pittsburgh, Atlanta, New Orleans, Seattle, Cincinatti, Detroit, St. Louis, Indianapolis, Washington, Minnesota, and several other teams having a QB Competition in training camp???? The answer is NO!!! The reason is they have legitimate starters and we don't! If Ryan Fitzpatrick was a legitimate starter he would not settle on negotiating to stay here to be in a competition to decide if he should hold a clipboard or not! If he had the cahoonas and confidence of a Jim Kelly he would threaten to take his services somewhere else and actually do it!!! Could you see Jim Kelly or Elway, or Marino, or Steve Young, or Rothlisberg sticking around for a QB competition? You know the answer to that..and I think it is ridiculous after having plenty of time watching Fitz to want to subject yourself to anymore of this silliness! C'mon Man!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Cutting someone like Kelsay only makes sense if he says no to a restructure and if you think he can't make the team in camp over a rookie LDE. They aren't going to invest any more money in that position with Anderson and Mario getting paid heavy money, so unless we draft someone better in the late rounds (which rarely pans out), I think Kelsay is still good enough to make the team and worth having on board for a reasonable salary. He seems like a smart guy, he knows nobody is going to sign him for big money and he's obviously banked enough to not worry about cash the rest of his life anyway. Kelsay is long time Buffalo guy with a family that likes it here. The reason he's not released is because he either hasn't been approached by the front office with a restructured deal or he's already agreed to a modification and it is being hashed out. If he doesn't do well in camp he gets cut and probably retires. Our front office is done with putting any more resources into the Dline. We're focused on LB's and Corners on defense, receivers and QB's on offense. I think a going-to-be 34 year old undersized DE....who never really was a big producer as a pass rusher and was always a liability against the run.....is a prime case for not being given the benefit of the doubt that he can rebound from a season where he basically missed half of the gametime. I really don't care if they release him or not, I don't expect them to be smashing the piggy bank for the last few pennies of cap space either way............but it seems to be quite a leap of faith that this guy is going to be worth a roster spot at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsCelticsAngelsBama Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 The signing of T.J. and Colin Brown have me very excited. Can't wait until we start signing guys that actually get on the field Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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