Fred Jackson

[bkc]

Funny thing has happened to fan favorite Fred Jackson. For whatever reason and there could be many, age, scheme changes, game planning but he does not look anything close to the player he was last year. When looking back at the offseason perhap Chan knew something because from day one he mentioned a need for an upgrade at runing back. It started with him saying we could use a scat back type. During free agency they talked to chester taylor. Then they drafted Cj spiller and finally they refused for many months to trade Lynch. In the end Chan may have noticed on film that Fred would not be a great fit for his offense . Funny thing in April a position that looked rock solid may require a mid round draft pick to upgrade this offseason.

[Another Point of View]

Nope, Fred looks fine to me. I see no changes at all!

[ACor58]

I am a huge Fred Jackson fan. I will admit that he looked great against Baltimore but has looked slow against KC and Chicago. I wonder if he is injured?

[PromoTheRobot]

Fred can't run with 5 guys hanging on him.

 

PTR

[The Big Cat]

Fred can't run with 5 guys hanging on him.

 

PTR

 

+1

 

Our line can't hold up long enough to block out of the pistol formation.

 

Here's how we line up:

 

two backs under center = run or pass

 

empty backfield = pass

 

pistol = run or pass, but with back providing always much needed pass protection. when he's handed the ball, flat-footed, 8 yards behind the line, he inevitably has 2 or 3 defenders in his lap, everytime.

[BillsVet]

It helps when (insert OT here) isn't getting blasted into the backfield. Howard and Wrotto have been particularly bad in the run game, and Bell isn't much better. Finding quality OT's not snagged from other team's practice squads, are late round draft picks or UDFA's would help.

 

I don't think Jackson has lost a step, but when Gailey goes away from the running game and gets into pass-happy mode, Jackson doesn't get a chance to work into a rhythm.

[I hate the Bills !]

I don't think Fred hast gotten the touches he had last year since they have behind by so much, but he does look a step slower this year !

[1billsfan]

Fred Jackson is a very good backup. He just doesn't posses the break away speed and cutting ability needed to be an every down back. The guy is a great at picking up the blitz and runs strong, but that unfortunately is not going to cut it.

 

Now is clearly time for the Bills to insert CJ Spiller as the starter and see if he can be the future star runningback he was drafted for. Will this put Fitzpatrick in danger on passing plays? Perhaps, but that's the risk you have to take at this point and time. Jackson obviously isn't the answer, we need to see if Spiller is the answer before heading into the offseason.

Edited November 10, 2010 by 1billsfan

[Dorkington]

He looks hobbled by something to me. Like a back injury sort of thing.

[weso1378]

Funny thing has happened to fan favorite Fred Jackson. For whatever reason and there could be many, age, scheme changes, game planning but he does not look anything close to the player he was last year. When looking back at the offseason perhap Chan knew something because from day one he mentioned a need for an upgrade at runing back. It started with him saying we could use a scat back type. During free agency they talked to chester taylor. Then they drafted Cj spiller and finally they refused for many months to trade Lynch. In the end Chan may have noticed on film that Fred would not be a great fit for his offense . Funny thing in April a position that looked rock solid may require a mid round draft pick to upgrade this offseason.

 

It is actually quite simple....Freddy ran over Chan's dog in the offseason. That is the only plausible explanation

[mikef272002]

I watched a few run plays last game in slow motion, all 3 times the Right Tackle let his man make the tackle, on two plays he was supposed to block Urlacher and 1 timed woofed on him and the other time got driven into the gap and urlacher made the tackle after shedding off him. On the third time the right tackle was blocking the end lined up to his outside shoulder and again got driven back and the end shed off and made the tackle for a 2 yard gain... I don't think Fred is the problem, I think it's the right tackle that sucks, I couldn't read the name and didn't really watch to see who it was anyway, but it must of been Howard or the other guy that spells him once in awhile...

[The Big Cat]

I watched a few run plays last game in slow motion, all 3 times the Right Tackle let his man make the tackle, on two plays he was supposed to block Urlacher and 1 timed woofed on him and the other time got driven into the gap and urlacher made the tackle after shedding off him. On the third time the right tackle was blocking the end lined up to his outside shoulder and again got driven back and the end shed off and made the tackle for a 2 yard gain... I don't think Fred is the problem, I think it's the right tackle that sucks, I couldn't read the name and didn't really watch to see who it was anyway, but it must of been Howard or the other guy that spells him once in awhile...

 

On Sunday Howard played the first half, Wrotto the second.

[mikef272002]

I watched a few run plays last game in slow motion, all 3 times the Right Tackle let his man make the tackle, on two plays he was supposed to block Urlacher and 1 timed woofed on him and the other time got driven into the gap and urlacher made the tackle after shedding off him. On the third time the right tackle was blocking the end lined up to his outside shoulder and again got driven back and the end shed off and made the tackle for a 2 yard gain... I don't think Fred is the problem, I think it's the right tackle that sucks, I couldn't read the name and didn't really watch to see who it was anyway, but it must of been Howard or the other guy that spells him once in awhile...

I also want to note that the two times he was supposed to block Urlacher that if he had done his job and blocked him Fred had alot of daylight ahead of him, instead of a 1 yard gain or no gain Fred would have had atleast 8 yards...Thats the diffrence between a R that sucks and a good RT, we definitly need to draft a RT, Bell actually is play the run and pass well..

[Sisyphean Bills]

It helps when (insert OT here) isn't getting blasted into the backfield. Howard and Wrotto have been particularly bad in the run game, and Bell isn't much better. Finding quality OT's not snagged from other team's practice squads, are late round draft picks or UDFA's would help.

 

I don't think Jackson has lost a step, but when Gailey goes away from the running game and gets into pass-happy mode, Jackson doesn't get a chance to work into a rhythm.

Kind of bizarre when you think that the plan going into the season was to use three running backs in a platoon when you see that the implementation barely gets the rock to even two backs.

[Buftex]

I don't think Fred hast gotten the touches he had last year since they have behind by so much, but he does look a step slower this year !

 

 

You know, since Marshawn was trdaded, and Freddie became the starter, the Bills haven't really had any huge scoring deficits to make up. I think, honestly, speed was never Jackson's thing, it was elusiveness and vision. The line isn't run blocking as well, and, despite lip service to the running game, this Bills offensive unit has developed into a pass-first offense. The line, and perhaps the running backs, are just not an "impose your will" type of unit. Still some pieces missing.

[mikef272002]

On Sunday Howard played the first half, Wrotto the second.

 

I don't remember what half the plays were in, I just rewinded as I was watching so I could see what happened..Then quickly went back to the game..

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

No matter what happens with spiller, they are going to need to pick up a replcement for Freddie. Almost all NFL running backs, no matter the milage seem to hit a wall at some point near 30. It is coming for FJ.

[The Big Cat]

Kind of bizarre when you think that the plan going into the season was to use three running backs in a platoon when you see that the implementation barely gets the rock to even two backs.

 

Plans going into the season, meet the window.

[Dan]

Jackson's biggest problem is... Gailey is as pass happy as Gilbride or Martz has ever been. It's hard for the RB to look good when the QB is throwing the ball 51 times. Then add in splitting carries between Fitz (2 rushes/scrambles), Spiller (7 carries), and McIntire (1 carry); how is Jackson ever supposed to get into a rhythm? He ran the ball 8 times last week.... 8 times.

 

For all Chan's genius (that's sarcasm) and for all the offense's improvement (that's serious); the one thing Chan hasn't figured out how to do is get our running game going. Perhaps it's the run blocking, perhaps it's the "packages", perhaps this is just the offense Chan wants. All I know is we're becoming an extremely unbalanced offense and opposing teams are picking up on it.

[Sisyphean Bills]

Plans going into the season, meet the window.

True.

 

Nothing inspires more confidence than a new regime backtracking on all fronts.

[The Big Cat]

Jackson's biggest problem is... Gailey is as pass happy as Gilbride or Martz has ever been. It's hard for the RB to look good when the QB is throwing the ball 51 times. Then add in splitting carries between Fitz (2 rushes/scrambles), Spiller (7 carries), and McIntire (1 carry); how is Jackson ever supposed to get into a rhythm? He ran the ball 8 times last week.... 8 times.

 

For all Chan's genius (that's sarcasm) and for all the offense's improvement (that's serious); the one thing Chan hasn't figured out how to do is get our running game going. Perhaps it's the run blocking, perhaps it's the "packages", perhaps this is just the offense Chan wants. All I know is we're becoming an extremely unbalanced offense and opposing teams are picking up on it.

 

If they're picking up on it, they're not doing much to stop it.

 

Our "career" backup Fitz posted another 300 yard game last week (299, really) against an unquestionably good defense bolstered by the extra prep and rest time of the bye week.

 

So I guess we have to ask ourselves, is establishing the run a thing of want, or a thing of need?

 

True.

 

Nothing inspires more confidence than a new regime backtracking on all fronts.

 

That's one way to look at it, sure.

 

But said back tracks sure have made for some watchable football!!

[Dan]

If they're picking up on it, they're not doing much to stop it.

 

Our "career" backup Fitz posted another 300 yard game last week (299, really) against an unquestionably good defense bolstered by the extra prep and rest time of the bye week.

 

So I guess we have to ask ourselves, is establishing the run a thing of want, or a thing of need?

Considering we're 0-8 and the offensive scoring has dropped off the last 2 weeks, I'd suggest defenses are doing just enough to stop it especially late in the game when it's most critical. Name one offense, other than one lead by Brady or Manning, that can be one-sided and be consistently good. Even if we're not running the ball with much success, we still have to show them the run to keep the defense guessing.

[Geno Smith's Arm]

I couldn't care less about Fred Jackson's running. Why? Because the team is rebuilding and looking for a QB. I'm just happy that they have found a passing game, something that has been missing for way too long. If they get the passing game under control I'm happy. They can get better at running the ball for next year.

 

Really, Fred Jackson isn't that important. Remember Rob Riddick? He is kinda that guy, the decent RB a team has in bad years before a team has (hopefully) rebuilt.

[Sisyphean Bills]

That's one way to look at it, sure.

 

But said back tracks sure have made for some watchable football!!

If you are willing to settle for "watchable football" then, I agree. So far Chan Nix have delivered and things are going great.

 

Personally, I'd rather win. I'm probably in the minority here, but winning football is far more enjoyable to me.

[Geno Smith's Arm]

If you are willing to settle for "watchable football" then, I agree. So far Chan Nix have delivered and things are going great.

 

Personally, I'd rather win. I'm probably in the minority here, but winning football is far more enjoyable to me.

 

Is 6 wins a year with a team averaging 7 points a game better than 3 wins a year with a team averaging 21 points a game (no, I don't have the exact stats)? Not to me, and that's kinda what we're comparing here.

 

They haven't had a passing game in 10 years, and during that time the running game was nothing special. They needed get the passing game going. One thing at a time. At least it feels like they have a chance to win.

 

Sitting through games the last few years particularly, has been BORING, BORING, effin BORING! Mind numbingly boring. It was like trying to lull the opposition into playing poorly, bring them down to the Bills pathetic level.

 

The Rope-a-Dope Offense!

Edited November 10, 2010 by Matthews' Bag

[bowery4]

Is 6 wins a year with a team averaging 7 points a game better than 3 wins a year with a team averaging 21 points a game (no, I don't have the exact stats)? Not to me, and that's kinda what we're comparing here.

 

They haven't had a passing game in 10 years, and during that time the running game was nothing special. They needed get the passing game going. One thing at a time. At least it feels like they have a chance to win.

 

Sitting through games the last few years particularly, has been BORING, BORING, effin BORING! Mind numbingly boring. It was like trying to lull the opposition into playing poorly, bring them down to the Bills pathetic level.

The Jauron's-a-Dope Offense!

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

If you are willing to settle for "watchable football" then, I agree. So far Chan Nix have delivered and things are going great.

 

Personally, I'd rather win. I'm probably in the minority here, but winning football is far more enjoyable to me.

 

 

3-5 and utterly boring and incompetent Offense vs. 0-8 watchable football with some scoring and nice plays. Since I don't see a world of difference between 0-8 and 3-5, I guess I at least it is nice to enjoy the games.

[Sisyphean Bills]

3-5 and utterly boring and incompetent Offense vs. 0-8 watchable football with some scoring and nice plays. Since I don't see a world of difference between 0-8 and 3-5, I guess I at least it is nice to enjoy the games.

For those new to the board, I was never a Jauron fan and never supported him as the football mind of the Bills. My commnets about winning are not in any way a reflection of Jauron football or Gailey football. Neither coach ever fielded a winning Buffalo Bills football team to date.

[UConn James]

Fred Jackson is a very good backup. He just doesn't posses the break away speed and cutting ability needed to be an every down back. The guy is a great at picking up the blitz and runs strong, but that unfortunately is not going to cut it.

 

Now is clearly time for the Bills to insert CJ Spiller as the starter and see if he can be the future star runningback he was drafted for. Will this put Fitzpatrick in danger on passing plays? Perhaps, but that's the risk you have to take at this point and time. Jackson obviously isn't the answer, we need to see if Spiller is the answer before heading into the offseason.

 

Not last week....

[Bob in STL]

Funny thing has happened to fan favorite Fred Jackson. For whatever reason and there could be many, age, scheme changes, game planning but he does not look anything close to the player he was last year. When looking back at the offseason perhap Chan knew something because from day one he mentioned a need for an upgrade at runing back. It started with him saying we could use a scat back type. During free agency they talked to chester taylor. Then they drafted Cj spiller and finally they refused for many months to trade Lynch. In the end Chan may have noticed on film that Fred would not be a great fit for his offense . Funny thing in April a position that looked rock solid may require a mid round draft pick to upgrade this offseason.

 

Fred is fine. He is pass blocking quite well which is great because we throw 60% of the time.

 

His running is good when he has even a slight seam to work with. He is still a North-South runnign and running very hard. The holes have been few and far between. Look at how many times he gets hit behind the line of scrimmage.

 

His recieving is down because Captain Checkdown is gone. Because of that, Johnson and Parish get to catch some passes.

 

No upgrade needed with Spiller and Jackson at the helm. Time to work on the trenches.

[BillsfaninFl]

Kind of bizarre when you think that the plan going into the season was to use three running backs in a platoon when you see that the implementation barely gets the rock to even two backs.

 

Of greater concern to me is the credibility of the HC and GM. They use the spin continuously. Whether it is Chan saying that he doesn't believe in drafting "one year wonders", or the multiple quotes from both of them about needing three running backs, or the promises to fill our biggest holes in the draft as they begin their rebuilding process. All of that and more was just BS, as they changed their tune in every case. The only statements you can hang your hat on is when Ralph Wilson inadvertently indicates how clueless he is about hiring and planning.

 

The honeymoon is over guys. Stop saying give them a chance. They have already botched too many decisions. Jackson is still a good running back, C.J. is just a rookie learning the ropes and the upgrade the team needs is up front (as in line and office).

[Rockinon]

Has anyone been looking at the handoffs between Fitz and Fred? The ball is hiked, Fitz extends the ball out for Fred and there is this unbelievable amount of time that Fitz is standing there with the ball extended out waiting for Fred to take the ball and run with it. It almost looks like they are telegraphing the play so the defense can sniff it out and blow up the play. After seeing it once, I couldn't believe it, but it happened that way repeatedly. I think there is some bad communication going on here.

[Fan in San Diego]

Fred is fine. He is pass blocking quite well which is great because we throw 60% of the time.

 

His running is good when he has even a slight seam to work with. He is still a North-South runnign and running very hard. The holes have been few and far between. Look at how many times he gets hit behind the line of scrimmage.

 

His recieving is down because Captain Checkdown is gone. Because of that, Johnson and Parish get to catch some passes.

 

No upgrade needed with Spiller and Jackson at the helm. Time to work on the trenches.

 

Also against KC the saftey is coming up and taking away the last running lane available to Fred. Action Jackson is just fine.

[Fixxxer]

Of greater concern to me is the credibility of the HC and GM. They use the spin continuously. Whether it is Chan saying that he doesn't believe in drafting "one year wonders", or the multiple quotes from both of them about needing three running backs, or the promises to fill our biggest holes in the draft as they begin their rebuilding process. All of that and more was just BS, as they changed their tune in every case. The only statements you can hang your hat on is when Ralph Wilson inadvertently indicates how clueless he is about hiring and planning.

 

The honeymoon is over guys. Stop saying give them a chance. They have already botched too many decisions. Jackson is still a good running back, C.J. is just a rookie learning the ropes and the upgrade the team needs is up front (as in line and office).

 

Speak for yourself.

[nero47]

I am a huge Fred Jackson fan. I will admit that he looked great against Baltimore but has looked slow against KC and Chicago. I wonder if he is injured?

KC defense = 3.8 ypr 89 ypg

 

Chi defense = 3.5 ypr 83 ypg

 

So, do you actually believe it is just Freddy and our rushing offense?

[Pirate Angel]

Dont get me wrong ilike Fred, good hard runner with alot of heart. Let us not forget that alot of his al purpose yards last season came via captain checkdown. Hopefully we dont use a 1st rounder on a RB anytime soon..

[BillsfaninFl]

As I said, Fred Jackson is still a good running back.

[boyst]

As I said, Fred Jackson is still a good running back.

This is the first thread I wanted to find this afternoon. Fred Jackson is our version of Chester Taylor and people who do not realize the value of Taylor only need to look at the success rates of the teams he has been on.

[Nanker]

Funny thing has happened to fan favorite Fred Jackson. For whatever reason and there could be many, age, scheme changes, game planning but he does not look anything close to the player he was last year. When looking back at the offseason perhap Chan knew something because from day one he mentioned a need for an upgrade at runing back. It started with him saying we could use a scat back type. During free agency they talked to chester taylor. Then they drafted Cj spiller and finally they refused for many months to trade Lynch. In the end Chan may have noticed on film that Fred would not be a great fit for his offense . Funny thing in April a position that looked rock solid may require a mid round draft pick to upgrade this offseason.

 

So you're saying that the coaching staff that couldn't see that Trent Edwards didn't doesn't have what it takes to be a starting QB in this league through the entire training camp and preseason "saw something" in Fred Jackson (on film) and decided to draft a RB as quick as they could - even though they had Marshawn in the fold at the time. Brilliant!

How many more months before they see that Kelsay doesn't come close to earning his salary and that George Edwards should be at most a LB position coach?

[Sisyphean Bills]

This is the first thread I wanted to find this afternoon. Fred Jackson is our version of Chester Taylor and people who do not realize the value of Taylor only need to look at the success rates of the teams he has been on.

But the Bills "success rate" isn't.