For those that want to draft something other than QB

[drewfla]

They are about to go to 3-3 with the addition of Bradford. It is crazy to talk about drafting tackles if a QB available at 1. Having a great QB makes everything else better.

[b stein 22]

They are about to go to 3-3 with the addition of Bradford. It is crazy to talk about drafting tackles if a QB available at 1. Having a great QB makes everything else better.

Dolphins

They went to the playoffs with an 11-5 record with the addition of Jake Long. It is crazy to talk about drafting a QB if a LT is available at 1. Having a great LT makes everything else better.

[DrDawkinstein]

Dolphins

They went to the playoffs with an 11-5 record with the addition of Jake Long. It is crazy to talk about drafting a QB if a LT is available at 1. Having a great LT makes everything else better.

 

What LT coming out this year is "Jake Long #1" worthy?

[b stein 22]

What LT coming out this year is "Jake Long #1" worthy?

I dont know I was just giving an example of why you dont need a great QB to win.

[gobillsinytown]

They are about to go to 3-3 with the addition of Bradford. It is crazy to talk about drafting tackles if a QB available at 1. Having a great QB makes everything else better.

 

Unfortunately, it's a lot more complicated than that. What makes it so hard is the fact that all first round draft picks, regardless of position, have a success rate of about 50-50. What makes this such a problem is the amount of money and time invested in a first round pick. A franchise QB can turn a team around in a hurry, but he doesn't play by himself. He depends on the O line in front of him to give him time to adjust to the speed of the pro game. So if you draft a QB and he's getting killed behind a bad O line, it hampers his development at best. At worst, it can ruin him altogether.

 

So should you always draft a QB in the first round? Is that a sure fire way to turn a team around? Hard to say. It's worked with some teams (Colts) and not with others (Raiders).

 

I think you need to time the development of the offense (especially the line), with the development of the QB.

[aristocrat]

Dolphins

They went to the playoffs with an 11-5 record with the addition of Jake Long. It is crazy to talk about drafting a QB if a LT is available at 1. Having a great LT makes everything else better.

 

the rams drafted jason smith near the top in 2009 then saffold at the top of the 2nd round this year. so they went with the sexy lt pick in smith last year and still ended up with the top pick. safforld ended up beating smith for the lt spot. we need an elite lt and a vet like mankins inside and then we can think about a qb.

[The Senator]

What LT coming out this year is "Jake Long #1" worthy?

Just to play 'devil's advocate' - which QB's coming out are 'Sam Bradford #1' worthy? (I think Mallett is the only one - IF he comes out. JMO.)

[Wilson from Gamehendge]

They are about to go to 3-3 with the addition of Bradford. It is crazy to talk about drafting tackles if a QB available at 1. Having a great QB makes everything else better.

How did Danario Alexander do today with Bradford?

[buffaloaggie]

What LT coming out this year is "Jake Long #1" worthy?

That's the problem, there is no LT that is #1 worthy. You look at various mock drafts, and they have 2-4 OTs going in the 1st round, and most are later in the 1st. Anthony Castonzo seems to be the top LT prospect.

[Geno Smith's Arm]

They are about to go to 3-3 with the addition of Bradford. It is crazy to talk about drafting tackles if a QB available at 1. Having a great QB makes everything else better.

 

This topic has been run into the ground. There is no point arguing anymore. People are so dug in at their position, that they won't budge (some guys want a linebacker instead. How can you reason with that person?).

 

There are still people out there that don't recognize that the NFL is completely based around the QB. And that even if the line sucks, if a top shelf prospect is available, the sooner he gets in Buffalo the better.

[Stl Bills]

How did Danario Alexander do today with Bradford?

Danario is going to be a beast if he can stay healthy. 4 catches 73 yards including a 33 yard diving touchdown. We should have absolutely took a flyer on that kid.

[KD in CA]

They are about to go to 3-3 with the addition of Bradford. It is crazy to talk about drafting tackles if a QB available at 1. Having a great QB makes everything else better.

 

The difference is the Rams have been building smartly by using high picks on fixing their lines for the past several years. Rams 1st and 2d round picks the last four years (note the absence of RBs taken with early first round picks):

 

1st:

Carriker DT - traded after injury, currently starting for Redskins

Long DE - starter

Smith OT - starter

Bradford QB - starter

 

2nd:

Leonard FB - traded after injury

Avery WR - starter

Laurinaitis LB - starter

Safford OT - starter

[Another Point of View]

They are about to go to 3-3 with the addition of Bradford. It is crazy to talk about drafting tackles if a QB available at 1. Having a great QB makes everything else better.

 

How is Jamarcus Russell doing in Oakland?

 

I can't find him on the sidelines

[C.Biscuit97]

I don't think you should ever go into a draft thinking you absolutely need one position. That's how you end up with JP Losman. But I do think this is a very good year for a franchise QB.

 

As for the Rams, I think a lot of their successful comes from drafting in the top 5 for the last 5 years or so. And they play in the worst division (NF West) and play 4 games against the 2nd worst division (AFC West). The Rams are improved but they play a joke schedule. If we switched schedules with them, they probably are 0-5 or 1-4.

[Ramius]

The difference is the Rams have been building smartly by using high picks on fixing their lines for the past several years. Rams 1st and 2d round picks the last four years (note the absence of RBs taken with early first round picks):

 

1st:

Carriker DT - traded after injury, currently starting for Redskins

Long DE - starter

Smith OT - starter

Bradford QB - starter

 

2nd:

Leonard FB - traded after injury

Avery WR - starter

Laurinaitis LB - starter

Safford OT - starter

 

And yet, after all that "fixing the lines" BS, the Rams didn't get any better until they got a franchise QB. Long, Smith, etc led that team to 1 and 2 win seasons. They get a franchise QB, and bam, they've won as many games in 6 so far this season (3) as they had won in the past 2 seasons combined.

 

Also, the argument is a bit mis-leading. Smith was drafted, and was so bad at LT, they had to spend another pick on Saffold, who then beat out Smith for LT. Think the rams really wanted to spend the #2 pick on a RT?

[KD in CA]

And yet, after all that "fixing the lines" BS, the Rams didn't get any better until they got a franchise QB. Long, Smith, etc led that team to 1 and 2 win seasons. They get a franchise QB, and bam, they've won as many games in 6 so far this season (3) as they had won in the past 2 seasons combined.

 

Also, the argument is a bit mis-leading. Smith was drafted, and was so bad at LT, they had to spend another pick on Saffold, who then beat out Smith for LT. Think the rams really wanted to spend the #2 pick on a RT?

 

Smith is still their starting RT, no?

 

My point is, drafting a QB without addressing the other areas isn't going to fix much. They need to address all those areas, so the smartest way to draft -- as always -- is to take the best player. I have no idea if that is a QB, LT, DE or LB, but that's what they need to do. The reason the Bills are a laughingstock is because they make franchise crushing decisions like Losman and Maybin based on a narrow position focus, or because they make picks like Spiller to 'generate excitement'. If the best player in April is a QB, I'll be thrilled if they take him, but I don't want them to risk another bust and watch the next Oher/Orakpo slip past.

[Ramius]

Smith is still their starting RT, no?

 

My point is, drafting a QB without addressing the other areas isn't going to fix much. They need to address all those areas, so the smartest way to draft -- as always -- is to take the best player. I have no idea if that is a QB, LT, DE or LB, but that's what they need to do. The reason the Bills are a laughingstock is because they make franchise crushing decisions like Losman and Maybin based on a narrow position focus, or because they make picks like Spiller to 'generate excitement'. If the best player in April is a QB, I'll be thrilled if they take him, but I don't want them to risk another bust and watch the next Oher/Orakpo slip past.

 

Spiller was the unquestioned best player available. In the long run, you are much better off drafting the best talent as opposed to drafting for need. Drafting for need gets you guys like McCargo, etc. The Bills do need to get some help along the lines, but are much better off getting the franchise QB while we have a chance to get one. If all the players are at a similar talent level, you take the QB.

[rpcolosi]

They are about to go to 3-3 with the addition of Bradford. It is crazy to talk about drafting tackles if a QB available at 1. Having a great QB makes everything else better.

 

 

wait.... what did the rams draft the few years before Bradford??? and Offensive and Defensive line, thats it (and yes they got Saffold as well this year). what did the Jets draft before sanchez? you guess it the same thing!!! how about the dolhpins? Yup - Jake Long came first...

 

I'm just saying....Bills need to go line and/or linebacker these next couple years before the "franchise saviour" in 2012.

 

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/draft/ram.htm

[Ramius]

wait.... what did the rams draft the few years before Bradford??? and Offensive and Defensive line, thats it (and yes they got Saffold as well this year). what did the Jets draft before sanchez? you guess it the same thing!!! how about the dolhpins? Yup - Jake Long came first...

 

I'm just saying....Bills need to go line and/or linebacker these next couple years before the "franchise saviour" in 2012.

 

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/draft/ram.htm

 

How many wins did the OL picks generate. None. The Rams didn't start winning until they got the QB.

[It's in My Blood]

How is Jamarcus Russell doing in Oakland?

 

I can't find him on the sidelines

 

There always going to be the potential for a Ryan Leaf/David Carr/Alex Smith type pick , but I think the reward outweighs the risk. The Manning Brothers , Phillip Rivers, Donovan Mcnabb just to name a few are glowing examples of making QB top priority when you have a top 5 pick , only if there is a need at the position.

 

Im all for shoring up the Oline , but I think if I'm Buddy Nix and I feel as though there is future All-pro QB available , I take him first and foremost , then address the oline. Trade back into the 1st if theres a tackle you like , or look to free agency to fix the lines.

[rpcolosi]

And yet, after all that "fixing the lines" BS, the Rams didn't get any better until they got a franchise QB. Long, Smith, etc led that team to 1 and 2 win seasons. They get a franchise QB, and bam, they've won as many games in 6 so far this season (3) as they had won in the past 2 seasons combined.

 

Also, the argument is a bit mis-leading. Smith was drafted, and was so bad at LT, they had to spend another pick on Saffold, who then beat out Smith for LT. Think the rams really wanted to spend the #2 pick on a RT?

 

 

um you need to build the machine before you put a guy at the controls - that means, until the big pieces are in place like RT, LT, DE and MLB - there is no point in having a master at the control switch.

[agardin]

Draft the best player available but there is an old saying...potential franchise Qbs trumps all. The best player last years draft was Suh and he looks awesome in Detroit. Rams needed a QB and had to draft Bradford. The team was sold and the franchise was suffering, Bradford helped fill the stadium.

 

QB 8 Bradford, Sam ACT TDS 7 INT 8 YDS 1,357 RTG 69.3 STL

 

The Rams are winning because of their D ( the detroit game aside) if you take out the Detroit game they are a top ten D in the league

 

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&defensiveStatisticCategory=GAME_STATS&conference=ALL&role=OPP&season=2010&seasonType=REG&d-447263-s=TOTAL_YARDS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=1&d-447263-n=1

 

 

I am not knocking Bradford because he is doing reasonably well for a rookie but if Fitz was on the Rams they would likely have the same record or better. If there is a franchise QB draft him, if not, then fill with the best available player. Need and position always play apart but lets face it we have holes almost everywhere.

 

I guess that is a good question. Knowing what we think we know now who would you take Suh or Bradford?

[b stein 22]

I have finally understood that we need offensive linemen this year instead of a QB.

Good for you

Edited October 18, 2010 by b stein 22

[apuszczalowski]

A Franchise QB will make the offence look alot better then a top LT with a mediocre QB.

 

You can't go by what the Rams, or Lions, or some other bottom feeder teams have done because it took them YEARS of drafting to get to a couple of wins this year.

 

Yes you need a good o-line, but you also need a franchise QB to succeed in this league, unless you have something even better to back you up. The Jets aren't where they are because of the o-line or Sanchez, they are what they are due to their defence. Teams like the Ravens are good because they can rely on their defence to hold games really close. The Patriots lived off of a mediocre/alright defence because they have an offence that can go into a shootout against teams and win, along with the Colts.

 

Theres no right or wrong way to go, both could use major upgrades. But a Franchise QB will make a mediocre o-line look better then a good o-line making a mediocre QB look good

[Chilly]

The bottom line is it's way easier to get a sufficient LT than it is a sufficient QB. You need both, so if you have a choice between the two, you go with the one thats harder to find.

Edited October 18, 2010 by BlueFire

[Astrobot]

DraftTek's latest mock, not yet posted, will have the Bills picking:

1 Buffalo Andrew Luck QB Stanford P1

33 Buffalo Marcus Cannon ROT TCU P2

65 Buffalo Aldon Smith OLB34 Missouri P2

 

(Just the first 2 rounds will be posted tomorrow)

 

I'd consider this a good draft, because it takes BPA each time (although I like Luke Stocker TE who was drafted #68), while addressing big needs.

 

Some of the QB's who fell, based on teams' needs not being in the QB arena, were:

11 Jacksonville Jake Locker QB Washington P2

35 San Francisco Ryan Mallett QB Arkansas P1

40 Seattle Christian Ponder QB Florida State P2

44 Arizona Nick Foles QB Arizona P2

55 Kansas City Pat Devlin QB Delaware P3T

[Doc]

It's a QB league nowadays. I'll take the good QB, who can make the rest of the O-line look better.

[JPS]

Considering our recent draft history, I will take either if they are good football players. The Bills are like a guy who's an ofer at the plate for 5 games. I just want to hit on a 1st rounder at one of the many positions we need. The Bills do not have enough talent on the roster to lock into ANY position.

[DanInSouthBuffalo]

This argument can be skewed any way you would like. I'll just say this, Sam Bradford looks mature and seems to be doing a good job right now. If the right QB falls to the Bills #1 pick, it would be a good idea for them to take one.

 

Having said that, one of the reasons the Rams won a close game is that they put up SEVEN SACKS (and one INT) today against the Chargers. The Bills have only six sacks ALL SEASON!!!! The Rams only gave up 79 yards rushing as well.

 

Do you think the Bills even with Fitz could be at least 2-3, maybe 3-2, if they only gave up 79 yards a game and had a pass rush?

 

I do.

[Geno Smith's Arm]

The bottom line is it's way easier to get a sufficient LT than it is a sufficient QB. You need both, so if you have a choice between the two, you go with the one thats harder to find.

 

 

It's such a simple answer, but for some reason people want to figure out a way to dispute it.

[BillsFan74]

They are about to go to 3-3 with the addition of Bradford. It is crazy to talk about drafting tackles if a QB available at 1. Having a great QB makes everything else better.

 

Their starting RT is Jason Smith 1st rd pick at LT Rodger Saffold 2nd rd pick.

[May Day 10]

I don't think you should ever go into a draft thinking you absolutely need one position. .

 

this is how I feel x1000. I really hope they arent pressured to take a QB for the sake of taking a QB. If they spot a guy they know they could mold into the Bills QB... by all means.

 

But if that guy doesnt declare for the draft or isnt available... dont take one for the sake of taking one.

 

Face it, we likely have a few more shots at a franchise QB.

[Punch]

It's such a simple answer, but for some reason people want to figure out a way to dispute it.

 

FWIW, when the Bills had an above average to "dominant" LT in Jason Peters and a stable of average at best QBs the results were pretty mediocre. A legitimate franchise QB certainly would have elevated those teams (roughly 2005-08*) despite other obvious flaws.

 

*yes, I realize Peters was moved from RT to LT at some point early on and he struggled mightily in parts of 2007 and most of 2008, but he more or less fits the bill for the type of production that could reasonably be expected from a top draft pick at OT in his first few years.

 

this is how I feel x1000. I really hope they arent pressured to take a QB for the sake of taking a QB. If they spot a guy they know they could mold into the Bills QB... by all means.

 

But if that guy doesnt declare for the draft or isnt available... dont take one for the sake of taking one.

 

Face it, we likely have a few more shots at a franchise QB.

 

Then there's this part... if the right QB isn't there then I absolutely wouldn't want the Bills to take one of the wrong ones just for the sake of drafting a QB. We've already had more than our share of the wrong ones at QB and would rather see us fortify other positions of need until the right passer comes along.

Edited October 18, 2010 by Punch

[Hapless Bills Fan]

How many wins did the OL picks generate. None. The Rams didn't start winning until they got the QB.

 

The legitimate question is, how many wins would the QB have generated without the drafts that built the lines?

(and would the QB have survived and developed without some kind of line to protect him)

 

The right combination of pieces is needed to make a winner.

As someone else said, the QB can't protect himself, catch his own throws, and send the other O 3 and out.

[Hplarrm]

They are about to go to 3-3 with the addition of Bradford. It is crazy to talk about drafting tackles if a QB available at 1. Having a great QB makes everything else better.

The issue here is not simply getting the best player but it is how do you build a winning team. The rap on Luck is not that he is a bad player or even that a top flight QB is not a great thing to have.

 

The problem is what are the Bills strengths and weaknesses as a team and how does a rookie QB fit into them. The prob is that our OL does have some prospects (Bell seems to have talent but is too inconsistent right now and is at least a year away if he develops, Wood shows potential to move to Center which allows Hamgartner to play the easier guard position and allow us to get by with one solid back-up), However even if this all works we are still an RT and a back-up away from adequacy and a year of chemistry building while your QB is at some risk.

 

This Buff team is not Pitts where RoboQB can enter as the difference maker. We are not even St. Louis which has been so bad so long they have gotten talented OL players and had time to build chemistry.

 

This team needs a vet QB who can anticipate where the pass rush is likely to come from and makes the reads and is brave enough to cut and run only when necessary.

 

Our rookie QB will profit most from concentrating on developing and not simply running for his life or getting blinsided because the OL is still learning and needs vet help to develop adequacy.

 

Add into this that the local media led by Sully and WGR will delight in building expectations of this rookie as a savior and then sell commercials and generate column inches tearing him down and drafting a rookie QB to be the "franchise" has disaster written all over it.

 

Do you disagree?

[Geno Smith's Arm]

This argument can be skewed any way you would like. I'll just say this, Sam Bradford looks mature and seems to be doing a good job right now. If the right QB falls to the Bills #1 pick, it would be a good idea for them to take one.

 

Having said that, one of the reasons the Rams won a close game is that they put up SEVEN SACKS (and one INT) today against the Chargers. The Bills have only six sacks ALL SEASON!!!! The Rams only gave up 79 yards rushing as well.

 

Do you think the Bills even with Fitz could be at least 2-3, maybe 3-2, if they only gave up 79 yards a game and had a pass rush?

 

I do.

 

Yes, but have you considered that the Bills would get LOTS more sacks if they played with a lead? If they played a game where the opposing offense didn't hold all the cards?

 

Right now the defense (and really the whole team) is playing their worst football. Why ? Because they know the season is OVER! It's hard to convince guys to risk bodily harm when it's obvious that the season is over. Hard to gauge just how bad this beaten down defense really is (I KNOW they suck, but these are the worst of times). They have been playing with little hope for the post season now for many years, no QB leadership at all. They go into everygame knowing that the offense is gonna suck. They can't get onto IR quick enough.

[bladiebla]

a QB needs time to develop and mature, even if you throw him in there straight from college. His first year is going to be a learning year. Exceptions aren't the rule.

[akm0404]

Buffalo Bills fans:

 

Utterly desperate to NOT have an elite-level quarterback.

 

Everyone knows that if you have an elite qb, you contend for championships year after year.

 

Many Bills 'fans' are terrified of this happening. They hope the team will continue to ignore the most important position in professional sports so they can retain the Loveable Loser moniker.

 

Sick.

[bills_fan_in_raleigh]

They are about to go to 3-3 with the addition of Bradford. It is crazy to talk about drafting tackles if a QB available at 1. Having a great QB makes everything else better.

You forget that the Rams addressed the OL for a few drafts before.

[Mike in Syracuse]

According to this, there's some QB named Ryan Fitzpatrick who's tearing it up. Seriously, the guy is in the TOP 10!!

 

http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/player/_/stat/passing/sort/quarterbackRating

 

The Bills should sign him to a HUGE multi-year deal for $50 mill or so. Hell, Bradford's a stiff, he's ranked 31st. Then again, it might have something to do with the fact that the Ram's defense doesn't play like cheese cloth.

 

 

Funny thing about numbers, they don't always tell the whole story!