Philly writer complaining about Eagles O-line

[Ramius]

This debate reminds me of the people who were crowing about Mike Williams being a decisively better pick than Bryant McKinnie. It was two years after the draft and most Bills fans were still defending the pick. McKinnie gave up a lot of sacks and he had held out as a rookie. Williams was a seemingly adequate player, albeit at a much easier and less valuable position.

 

Williams has since kicked around, been out of the league and back, then injured..........McKinnie went to the Pro Bowl last year. Great player? No. A very good draft pick who is going to put in 10-12 years of good football for the Vikings at a critical position? Yeah.

 

Fact is, the Bills likely screwed an entire season away because they didn't want to pay Peters. The Bills LT play was epically bad, which made having two great downfield receivers on the roster an incredible waste.

 

In return they got an offensive guard with a titanium rod in his leg and a TE who has done nothing and has already been suspended. I don't think the haul has been all that impressive to date. Even if Wood does turn into a very good player, he is still just a guard and we will still have to wait for him to develop.

 

Folks, chances are that Jason Peters will be back in the Pro Bowl this year, and probably many times thereafter. He's talented and at times dominant and still very young. Probably the most talented OT in the NFL from a physical standpoint which is why he gets the players respect come Pro Bowl voting.

 

He's a failure in the same way that good players are failures in a lot of places when they get paid: relatively. You get $11M/yr you are expected to be Tony Boselli in his prime.

 

The Bills completely mishandled the situation to start with, then turned around and showed their brilliance by replacing him with Langston Walker. Then they cut him. Yup. Very smart, Promo. You are right. Why aren't the experts hailing the Bills?

 

If the Bills are ever going to get turned around and STAY turned around they need to get used to keeping their best players, not trading them or letting them walk. There are going to be times when you think you have overpaid. That's the nature of the game. If you want to win, you often have to pay the talent. The Bills have saved a lot of money in recent years. They also lose a lot more than they win.

 

The biggest mistake the Bills made was not selecting Oher or someone else to fill in Peters shoes.

 

However, trading a fat, cheeto-munching, lazy, mentally retarded tackle who wanted 10M per year was most definitely NOT a mistake.

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

Given the nature and the risks of this game, I'm usually supportive of players who are playing at a high level and who seek to have their contracts re-negotiated based on their play. But these losers who get the massive contracts and then mail it in from there are total losers. I'd want the big money for my play too, but once I had it and I didn't have to worry about it anymore, I'd be balls to the wall every day trying to continue earning that money. How anyone can take MILLIONS from a team/company/etc and not feel obligated to go out there and give their best is just unfathomable to me. I know it happens, and it happens a lot....but wow, that's just not in my wiring I guess.

 

 

hence the argument re: the risk owner's take from a financial perspective. i'd think it's a major part of the thought process a team goes through when evaluating a player like jason peters.

[BADOLBILZ]

The biggest mistake the Bills made was not selecting Oher or someone else to fill in Peters shoes.

 

However, trading a fat, cheeto-munching, lazy, mentally retarded tackle who wanted 10M per year was most definitely NOT a mistake.

 

That's why you make a good sheep. Keep getting exercised about good players getting paid elsewhere while the Bills keep losing.

 

Meanwhile a guy who makes zero impact like Chris Kelsay is making $6M this year. Kelsay's production literally could be replaced by any number of veteran minimum players available every winter. It's been a $5M donation to the Kelsay household from OBD for several years now.

 

Yet more wall space is spent griping about the contract of a pro bowl LT playing for another team. I wonder why that is? Seems irrational.

[Bill from NYC]

interesting idea for an exercise!

 

according to this guy, the top 5 all time tackles are:

 

Anthony Munoz

Art Shell

Jackie Slater

Dan Dierdorf

Ron Yary

 

Munoz was picked 3rd OVERALL, in the 1st round

Shell was picked 80th overall, in the 3rd round

Jackie Slater was picked 86th, in the 3rd round

Dan Dierdorf was picked 43rd, in the 3rd round

Ron Yary was picked #1 OVERALL, in the 1st round

 

DD, I have watched a lot of football. I think tht Pace, Walter Jones and Ogden were better than any of the above except perhaps Munoz.

 

Shell was the second best of that list, and he played next to Upshaw, an all time great OG. In fact, there were 4 Hall of Fame players on that OL.

Slater lasted 20 years but was never as good as the guys I mentioned. Imo, Slater, Dierdorf and Yary don't even belong in the conversation but again....this is merely my opinion.

Do note that the 3 I mentioned were on teams that won, or at least made a superbowl. Same applies to Jumbo Elliot and many other talented LTs.

There are obscure exceptions, but cold weather teams need a talented, physical OL to take it to the highest level, and LT is the most important position. This won't change.

 

Btw, thanks for the great dialogue.

 

That's why you make a good sheep. Keep getting exercised about good players getting paid elsewhere while the Bills keep losing.

 

Meanwhile a guy who makes zero impact like Chris Kelsay is making $6M this year. Kelsay's production literally could be replaced by any number of veteran minimum players available every winter. It's been a $5M donation to the Kelsay household from OBD for several years now.

 

Yet more wall space is spent griping about the contract of a pro bowl LT playing for another team. I wonder why that is? Seems irrational.

 

LOL!!!

 

This debate reminds me of the people who were crowing about Mike Williams being a decisively better pick than Bryant McKinnie. It was two years after the draft and most Bills fans were still defending the pick. McKinnie gave up a lot of sacks and he had held out as a rookie. Williams was a seemingly adequate player, albeit at a much easier and less valuable position.

 

Williams has since kicked around, been out of the league and back, then injured..........McKinnie went to the Pro Bowl last year. Great player? No. A very good draft pick who is going to put in 10-12 years of good football for the Vikings at a critical position? Yeah.

 

Fact is, the Bills likely screwed an entire season away because they didn't want to pay Peters. The Bills LT play was epically bad, which made having two great downfield receivers on the roster an incredible waste.

 

In return they got an offensive guard with a titanium rod in his leg and a TE who has done nothing and has already been suspended. I don't think the haul has been all that impressive to date. Even if Wood does turn into a very good player, he is still just a guard and we will still have to wait for him to develop.

 

Folks, chances are that Jason Peters will be back in the Pro Bowl this year, and probably many times thereafter. He's talented and at times dominant and still very young. Probably the most talented OT in the NFL from a physical standpoint which is why he gets the players respect come Pro Bowl voting.

 

He's a failure in the same way that good players are failures in a lot of places when they get paid: relatively. You get $11M/yr you are expected to be Tony Boselli in his prime.

 

The Bills completely mishandled the situation to start with, then turned around and showed their brilliance by replacing him with Langston Walker. Then they cut him. Yup. Very smart, Promo. You are right. Why aren't the experts hailing the Bills?

 

If the Bills are ever going to get turned around and STAY turned around they need to get used to keeping their best players, not trading them or letting them walk. There are going to be times when you think you have overpaid. That's the nature of the game. If you want to win, you often have to pay the talent. The Bills have saved a lot of money in recent years. They also lose a lot more than they win.

 

Bravo!!!! Every word in this post is beyond dispute.

[Kelly the Dog]

It makes me laugh when everyone complains that Peters went to the Pro Bowl and that it is a total sham. Here is the pro bowl roster for last year. Please tell me how many of these guys on the team were total shams, and one of the worst players in the league, not one of the very best.

 

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/12720440/-pro-bowl-rosters

[BuffaloBill]

The biggest mistake the Bills made was not selecting Oher or someone else to fill in Peters shoes.

 

 

 

This has been one of the biggest issues on the Bills for the past decade:

 

Magahee for Travis Henry

Lunch for Magahee

Now Spiller for Lunch or Jackson

 

How about the plethora of DB's for the DBs we let get away?

 

In the mean time - no high picks until last year on the O-line.

 

Is it any wonder this team has been a mess?

 

On the positive side, I do believe they are in the process of turning it around - finally.

[tjprime]

Thanks for Eric Wood

Don't forget about Shawn Nelson (the 4th). We'll have to see about Danny Batten (6th) next year after he recovers from injury. Figure 2 starters and at least a backup for an unmotivated guy and that's a good deal

[Buftex]

I remember listening to a Monday Night game on the radio last season, in my car. The Eagles were playing, and having a rough night. The play by play guy was going on about the Jason Peters saga, and trumpeting the fact that it was "hard to believe that a guy who was an udrafted free agent tight end, could turn into, arguably, the best left tackle in the NFL, and commanding a huge salary, in a very short period of time".... Boomer Esiason, doing the color commentating, retorted "well, he's been playing left tackle for the Eagles, like an undrafted free agent tight end...not good..." I thought it was pretty funny at the time!

[PromoTheRobot]

He's one of the best in the NFL, except when he sucks. So just keep that in mind Eagles fans. JP os one of the best!

 

PTR

[SwampD]

Who's this Jason Peters guy?

[Bob in STL]

I'm shocked...shocked and stunned...very stunned.

 

 

 

Any player who quits on a team over money is not worth a nickel.

 

PTR

 

 

Unfortunately, in todays NFL this is much more common.

Edited September 1, 2010 by Bob in STL

[cage]

I remember listening to a Monday Night game on the radio last season, in my car. The Eagles were playing, and having a rough night. The play by play guy was going on about the Jason Peters saga, and trumpeting the fact that it was "hard to believe that a guy who was an udrafted free agent tight end, could turn into, arguably, the best left tackle in the NFL, and commanding a huge salary, in a very short period of time".... Boomer Esiason, doing the color commentating, retorted "well, he's been playing left tackle for the Eagles, like an undrafted free agent tight end...not good..." I thought it was pretty funny at the time!

 

That is funny!!

[dollars 2 donuts]

Rutles reference?

 

 

Punch, the mere fact that you know who the Rutles are shoots you into superstar status, in my opinion.

 

 

 

...don't let it go to your head.

[Section444]

If you don't think that Peters would be the best OL on the roster if he were still a Bill you're kidding yourself.

[tbonestake]

If you don't think that Peters would be the best OL on the roster if he were still a Bill you're kidding yourself.

 

 

If 'IFs' and 'BUTs' were candy and nuts we'd all have a Merry Christmas! Am I right?

[PromoTheRobot]

If you don't think that Peters would be the best OL on the roster if he were still a Bill you're kidding yourself.

When he feels like making the effort. If not he's a worthless sack of crap...but with plenty of upside!

 

Sorry, I'll go with guys who give 100% over a 3-time pro bowler thinking more about what toppings will go on his cheeseburger than the snap count.

 

PTR

[EastRochBillsfan]

This debate reminds me of the people who were crowing about Mike Williams being a decisively better pick than Bryant McKinnie. It was two years after the draft and most Bills fans were still defending the pick. McKinnie gave up a lot of sacks and he had held out as a rookie. Williams was a seemingly adequate player, albeit at a much easier and less valuable position.

 

Williams has since kicked around, been out of the league and back, then injured..........McKinnie went to the Pro Bowl last year. Great player? No. A very good draft pick who is going to put in 10-12 years of good football for the Vikings at a critical position? Yeah.

 

Fact is, the Bills likely screwed an entire season away because they didn't want to pay Peters. The Bills LT play was epically bad, which made having two great downfield receivers on the roster an incredible waste.

 

In return they got an offensive guard with a titanium rod in his leg and a TE who has done nothing and has already been suspended. I don't think the haul has been all that impressive to date. Even if Wood does turn into a very good player, he is still just a guard and we will still have to wait for him to develop.

 

Folks, chances are that Jason Peters will be back in the Pro Bowl this year, and probably many times thereafter. He's talented and at times dominant and still very young. Probably the most talented OT in the NFL from a physical standpoint which is why he gets the players respect come Pro Bowl voting.

 

He's a failure in the same way that good players are failures in a lot of places when they get paid: relatively. You get $11M/yr you are expected to be Tony Boselli in his prime.

 

The Bills completely mishandled the situation to start with, then turned around and showed their brilliance by replacing him with Langston Walker. Then they cut him. Yup. Very smart, Promo. You are right. Why aren't the experts hailing the Bills?

 

If the Bills are ever going to get turned around and STAY turned around they need to get used to keeping their best players, not trading them or letting them walk. There are going to be times when you think you have overpaid. That's the nature of the game. If you want to win, you often have to pay the talent. The Bills have saved a lot of money in recent years. They also lose a lot more than they win.

man, I tried to stay out of this conversation. till you wrote. I totally, wholeheartedly disagree with you. The bills handled the situation just fine. Maybe langston walker was a mistake, but getting rid of peters was not. We will see if he makes it to the pro bowl this year. But it certainly isn't a given. But that won't change the fact that he was a douche to us and deserves to be gone. good f'in riddance! (and believe it or not, he was once one of my favorite players) and why I have to keep hearing/writing this crap 2 years later is beyond me.

Edited September 1, 2010 by EastRochBillsfan

[PDaDdy]

I'm shocked...shocked and stunned...very stunned.

 

 

 

Any player who quits on a team over money is not worth a nickel.

 

PTR

 

Quote

As a three-time Pro Bowl selection, Peters would seem to be the guy to look to in times of adversity. Instead, he's been the worst offender. He doesn't have an excuse of injury for some of his issues during the preseason. You don't expect a player of his ability and stature to have the lapses of concentration and discipline Peters has displayed.

 

I didn't know you put so much stock in preseason? LOL

 

I guess we read this quite differently. Sounds like the guy believes Peters has "great ability and stature" but has had some lapses of concentration and discipline IN THE PRESEASON. Doesn't sound like the guy is saying Peters sucks. Sounds like the Eagles OFFENSIVE LINE, which includes Peters, is having some issues.

 

Keep up the smear tactics campaign though. Maybe you will get some converts when Peters like it or not likely gets his 4th probowl nod.

Edited September 1, 2010 by PDaDdy

[Section444]

I didn't know you put so much stock in preseason? lol

Funny how that works isn't it? Pre-season doesn't mean anything until it lends to one's biases.

[Conch]

I'm shocked...shocked and stunned...very stunned.

 

 

 

Any player who quits on a team over money is not worth a nickel.

 

PTR

 

 

I am sure Peters is still thinking about the unfair contract he had with the Bills and it is still effecting his play. He must have really been wronged here and he just cannot get over it.