rockpile Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Continued from my "another one bites the dust" thread... I broke my previous record. In 2006 I was laid off and had another job in 10 weeks. After 20 months as a temp, I was again dumped and 6 weeks later I have a full time professional offer on the table. Not to shabby for a mid-fifties boomer! I have been given a written offer for close to the salary I wanted, but a little short. Considering the current job market, considering it is in Rochester, and considering it is a job that I really want, I can agree on *base salary* but need to find a way to maximize total compensation. I will be a Quality Manager, reporting directly to the VP. It is a small company (less than 30 people) but a strong manufacturing group. Basically I will be defining the quality system. The people I have met are very cool, and they work hard but like to have fun doing it. Any ideas on how to improve *total compensation*? I do not see much if any flexibility (leverage) in the salary. Pulling up comparables from the past two years does not mean a lot with unemployment so high today! It is a job I want in a shiddy market. Things so far have fallen in line. I need to go talk to them tomorrow or Friday to "sign zee papers" but as I said little more than the salary, job title, and start date (Monday) are in the signed offer sent to me. I am paying through the ass for medical benefits now, so if that can be kept low, that is a big plus. I will also have paid vacations and more holidays. As a temp, if the plant shut down Christmas week, I got 8 hours pay! Any and all angles are appreciated! I need to make sure all responsibilites and goals are documented, too. Tanstaafl, Rock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim in Anchorage Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Continued from my "another one bites the dust" thread... I broke my previous record. In 2006 I was laid off and had another job in 10 weeks. After 20 months as a temp, I was again dumped and 6 weeks later I have a full time professional offer on the table. Not to shabby for a mid-fifties boomer! I have been given a written offer for close to the salary I wanted, but a little short. Considering the current job market, considering it is in Rochester, and considering it is a job that I really want, I can agree on *base salary* but need to find a way to maximize total compensation. I will be a Quality Manager, reporting directly to the VP. It is a small company (less than 30 people) but a strong manufacturing group. Basically I will be defining the quality system. The people I have met are very cool, and they work hard but like to have fun doing it. Any ideas on how to improve *total compensation*? I do not see much if any flexibility (leverage) in the salary. Pulling up comparables from the past two years does not mean a lot with unemployment so high today! It is a job I want in a shiddy market. Things so far have fallen in line. I need to go talk to them tomorrow or Friday to "sign zee papers" but as I said little more than the salary, job title, and start date (Monday) are in the signed offer sent to me. I am paying through the ass for medical benefits now, so if that can be kept low, that is a big plus. I will also have paid vacations and more holidays. As a temp, if the plant shut down Christmas week, I got 8 hours pay! Any and all angles are appreciated! I need to make sure all responsibilites and goals are documented, too. Tanstaafl, Rock Go for it it. If you no like, that xx/xx/xxxx to present looks good on the next app. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Take the job, prove your worth and the money will take care of itself if the company is any good. That's always been my experience. I'd never pass up a job in a good company with good people over "a little" money. And that's magnified in this economy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Jack Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Ask for Bills season tickets to be added. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Adams Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Take the job, prove your worth and the money will take care of itself if the company is any good. That's always been my experience. I'd never pass up a job in a good company with good people over "a little" money. And that's magnified in this economy. What he said. Get your bird in the hand. Do a good job and worry about negotiating next year when you have leverage and know the politics of the place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOR Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Take the job, prove your worth and the money will take care of itself if the company is any good. That's always been my experience. I'd never pass up a job in a good company with good people over "a little" money. And that's magnified in this economy. Bingo. My uncle was offered a job and thought about nickel and diming them for more, but his recruiter looked him in the face and asked him if he was crazy. Take the job and be happy with your luck instead of trying to push it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philly McButterpants Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Annual Bonus/performance bonus potential? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Ask for Bills season tickets to be added. He said he wanted to raise the value of his compensation package, not lower it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PastaJoe Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Think about the opportunity cost of not taking the job; when will you find another one like this that's a good fit. As long as you're getting a decent wage, take the job. Being happy is more important than money. And try asking for something like vacation time. Some places make you wait a year before you get 2 weeks, ask for it in the first year. Or if they give 2 weeks, ask to start at 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in Chicago Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Continued from my "another one bites the dust" thread... I broke my previous record. In 2006 I was laid off and had another job in 10 weeks. After 20 months as a temp, I was again dumped and 6 weeks later I have a full time professional offer on the table. Not to shabby for a mid-fifties boomer! First of all - congratulations. Way to go landing a job so quickly in this economy. As others have said, don't think twice because of the money. However, you are asking how to make it sweeter for yourself while still staying within the company's limited negotiation stance: - See if you can get more base paid vacation. My last 2 employers had given me an extra week. - Incentives. See if you can structure a goal based bonus structure. Sounds like you are quite experienced and the economy will eventually get better. So you should be able to exceed your goals fairly easily aided by a recovery - As it is a quality job, talk about instilling a Six Sigma type culture if they don't have it already. Link some bonus to making your company Six Sigma compliant in, say, 18 months. - See if an ISO certification will help your company's business. If yes and they aren't already, that is another bonus oriented goal you may want to pursue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dante Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 He said he wanted to raise the value of his compensation package, not lower it. ouch! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guffalo Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 See if you can get them to eat some of the medical benefits that are causing you hemeroids (I assume thats what you meant when you said you were paying through the ass). If they can cover your portion of the premium that is a way to go. But as others said, take, get ingrained, let them see you shine, then renegotiate, better than wasting what might be a great gig. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kegtapr Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 You are currently unemployed. You have a job offer that is close to the compensation you want. I don't see where the question is? The best time to look for a job is when you have a job. If they aren't meeting your needs after a period of time, you can always make a move. But to risk losing the only offer you have right now is silly. Snap out of it Rock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erynthered Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 You are currently unemployed. You have a job offer that is close to the compensation you want. I don't see where the question is? The best time to look for a job is when you have a job. If they aren't meeting your needs after a period of time, you can always make a move. But to risk losing the only offer you have right now is silly. Snap out of it Rock. His post was at 1:16 AM. He may have been Take the job, Rock!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussiew Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 You are currently unemployed. You have a job offer that is close to the compensation you want. I don't see where the question is? The best time to look for a job is when you have a job. If they aren't meeting your needs after a period of time, you can always make a move. But to risk losing the only offer you have right now is silly. Snap out of it Rock. Talk to anyone over 50 who has faced this same decision. Most of them will admit they took a big cut in pay to find another decent job. I think if you're close to your previous salary...you should jump all over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShipUPride Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Ask for a few more vacation days. If they give you 2 weeks, ask for 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 You should ask about: -Health Benefits and how much of the premiums the employer will cover -Life & Disability insurance -Retirement plan (either Defined Benefit or a 401(k) type of plan; and if so do they contribute anything to it) -Stock Options if they offer them -Company bonus plan and if so what are parameters (based on Individual performance, specific goals, overall company performance, etc.) Nothing wrong with pushing a little bit, but by all means if it's the job you want, you don't want to turn it down over the details or a few thousand bucks. Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBill Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Any ideas on how to improve *total compensation*? I do not see much if any flexibility (leverage) in the salary. Pulling up comparables from the past two years does not mean a lot with unemployment so high today! Any and all angles are appreciated! I need to make sure all responsibilites and goals are documented, too. Tanstaafl, Rock Hey Rock congrats. I am a VP of HR so I sit on the other side of the table for a living. With that said I have never worked for a company as small as the one you are talking about so the dymanics may be a little different. I can tell you that we always lay an initial offer on the table under the assumption that the individual we are making the offer to will come back and ask for more. We do not always grant their request. The most frequent reason for saying "no" is because the individual is unreasonable in their expectations. Asking to get back to your former salary given that you are close does not seem to be out of line. If you feel the need to temper it some you can ask to get it in six months after you have established your worth to newco. A note of caution here ... if you are going to ask I strongly suggest that you at least do so by voice over the phone. In all seriousness it is probably be better to do face to face. In the conversation I would begin with the fact that you are very excited about the prospect of joining their company and that you are very confident that you will do an excellent job for them. As for the bonus situation - ask questions about how they typically pay them and what the range might be. I would ask how many times in the past three years they have paid people to the high side of the range. As the same about the low side if it is not obvious from the answer to the first question. You can also ask if they have fixed targets tied to jobs or if there is flexibility. If they are fixed not much you can do. If they are flexible ask for a reasonable step up or again if you want to temper it some ask them for a step up in the second bonus cycle (i.e. if you are doing a good job after a year - assuming an annual bonus - can you from x% to X+% in year 2?) Often times companies are a bit bounded on what they can do either because of plan design or internal equity. So to figure the bounds out you have to do a little probing. I would not overdo it though. Anyway, you are in good shape .. congrats on finding the job. If you have other thoughts or questions feel free to contact me directly through the board. I happen to be off work today so I should be accessible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in San Diego Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Take the job and don't worry about a few dollars shorter than the last job. The last job didn't work out for you. A bird in the hand vs. two in the bush logic is valid here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBud Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Take it. Option would be to have some sort of performance bonus baked in (% quality improvement over X time). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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