Bills running West Coast Offense?

[TH3]

I mean…..we are running the west coast offense at this point..right?
 

Not that there is anything wrong with that…

Edited 1 hour ago by TH3
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[boyst]

We are running some mutant of scheme that is putting us on the field with three tight ends for a couple plays, then an empty set, then pulling our star running back on third down to put in a pass catching running back, and not looking anywhere down the field. 

 

This offense is just like our defense which is the way the NFL is shifting. It is hybrid as *****. 

[SoonerBillsFan]

12 minutes ago, boyst said:

We are running some mutant of scheme that is putting us on the field with three tight ends for a couple plays, then an empty set, then pulling our star running back on third down to put in a pass catching running back, and not looking anywhere down the field. 

 

This offense is just like our defense which is the way the NFL is shifting. It is hybrid as *****. 

At some point not attacking deep is gonna bite us.   But not yet.

[Marcus Aurelius]

29 minutes ago, boyst said:

We are running some mutant of scheme that is putting us on the field with three tight ends for a couple plays, then an empty set, then pulling our star running back on third down to put in a pass catching running back, and not looking anywhere down the field. 

 

This offense is just like our defense which is the way the NFL is shifting. It is hybrid as *****. 

I don't know how you'd describe it.

It is remarkably disjointed to be sure.

 

In my opinion, only successful because of one man and he wears a cape.

[Not at the table Karlos]

21 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

At some point not attacking deep is gonna bite us.   But not yet.

Theres no one open deep. Theres deep shots called a lot but they’re covered. Beane really needs to find receivers that can get open. 

Edited 51 minutes ago by Not at the table Karlos

[dave mcbride]

21 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

At some point not attacking deep is gonna bite us.   But not yet.

You just know they are saving it. We will see deep shots soon enough.

[Augie]

20 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

At some point not attacking deep is gonna bite us.   But not yet.

 

If we can stay successful running the ball we should force a safety down into the box to help open things up. The long ball doesn’t have to be a staple of the offense, but it has to be a legit threat. 

[strive_for_five_guy]

Very few teams are connecting deep anymore, because everyone is playing the shell defense now.  I’ll take 10 yard runs by Cook all day, if that’s how opposing teams want to play us.

[Not at the table Karlos]

Just now, dave mcbride said:

You just know they are saving it. We will see deep shots soon enough.

What do you mean by saving it? They have called a decent amount of deep shots in every game. They’re not open and Josh smartly goes elsewhere. You can watch Josh wait for them to come open but they never do in the dolphins game. He then takes the check down. 

[WideNine]

I think we got a little predictable on situations when we were going to run the ball and the Dolphins were timing their run blitzes and when to crowd the box pretty well after the first 2 series. So, some self-scouting and looking at what they were keying on - was it down and distance or simply our personnel/formations? Perhaps mixing in a bit more play action when teams are expecting runs.

On passing plays I thought I saw more single high, but I think that was only when I was paying attention on some downs where they expected run. Looks like Miami was using 2-3 deep shells to cap all the deeper routes that forced Allen to take what was under the sticks. We have some good RAC receivers, but there were times the routes were too short of the sticks to convert, so perhaps some work there on concepts that get those guys open a bit closer to the 1st down markers.

Give the Dolphins defense some credit for how many open-field and shoe-string tackles they made in space.

Allen was patient and taking what they were giving, this is far better than forcing it and turning it over, but I get it. It was frustrating watching drives stall out so our offense could not put them away, and our defense letting them convert on every 3rd down to hang around down to the wire.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited 38 minutes ago by WideNine

[MasterStrategist]

36 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

At some point not attacking deep is gonna bite us.   But not yet.

Those deep shots have to be well timed.  Miami ran 2 high safeties on a lot of 3rd downs.

 

We need to be more aggressive in early downs, but difficult to go away from Cook early.

 

Our offense can beat teams in alot of ways.  Easiest thing is to pound the rock if its working, and stay with a relatively simple passing attack/short. 

 

We didnt adjust well during early downs in 2nd half - far less efficient and too many 3rd and 7+.  Brady called an excellent 1st half tho, and first drive of 2nd half

[Dr Krentist]

I think in a recent interview, Josh said he was taking what the defense is giving him. So I assume the deep ball is covered and they're letting them have the underneath. I think it was on Pat McAfee yesterday.

[Kaenon]

48 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

At some point not attacking deep is gonna bite us.   But not yet.

They're just saving the deep ball and Gabe Davis till the playoffs 😂 

[cas22]

1 hour ago, TH3 said:

I mean…..we are running the west coast offense at this point..right?
 

Not that there is anything wrong with that…

no we are not running west coast offense, in a west coast your QB is under center 98% of the time and you have a fullback in the backfield, we are running a hybrid type of scheme, really no particular system, I would say its a  more read option , even Daboll didn't run a true system, he was suppose to run a Erhardt Perkins system which it wasn't, over the years OCs run a majority of there plays out of the shotgun, if any label used I would say read option.

[WideNine]

5 minutes ago, MasterStrategist said:

Those deep shots have to be well timed.  Miami ran 2 high safeties on a lot of 3rd downs.

 

We need to be more aggressive in early downs, but difficult to go away from Cook early.

 

Our offense can beat teams in alot of ways.  Easiest thing is to pound the rock if its working, and stay with a relatively simple passing attack/short. 

 

We didnt adjust well during early downs in 2nd half - far less efficient and too many 3rd and 7+.  Brady called an excellent 1st half tho, and first drive of 2nd half

Agree - I said we were predictable on most of our running plays, but that is not really anything new this season.

We have lined up in 13 personnel and dared teams to stop our runs and many times they can't - even when they know they are coming. Hard to fault Brady for making teams prove they can beat our run blocking and Cook's abilities behind that.

Would be nice to see a few more play-action passes to the TE down the seam on those plays - just to keep them honest. Perhaps if our defense could come up with a few more stops on 3rd and long we would not be talking about an offense that puts up 30+ points a week.

Give my poor heart the games where we bury them early and Trubisky comes in for mop-up duty

[Rubes]

28 minutes ago, strive_for_five_guy said:

Very few teams are connecting deep anymore, because everyone is playing the shell defense now.  I’ll take 10 yard runs by Cook all day, if that’s how opposing teams want to play us.

 

While I agree with you, I also haven't heard anyone describe what happened in the second half. We were much less successful running the ball...I figured it was because they were loading the box more, but if that's the case, where were the openings in the defense?

 

I'm also a little bit (only a little bit) concerned about our offensive line's pass blocking. I think this is one of the best OLs in the league, but I think at least part of the problem, even if it's a small part, is that they're not giving Josh the time for those intermediate and long routes to develop. He was under some pressure in that game.

 

[cas22]

5 minutes ago, WideNine said:

Agree - I said we were predictable on most of our running plays, but that is not really anything new this season.

We have lined up in 13 personnel and dared teams to stop our runs and many times they can't - even when they know they are coming. Hard to fault Brady for making teams prove they can beat our run blocking and Cook's abilities behind that.

Would be nice to see a few more play-action passes to the TE down the seam on those plays - just to keep them honest. Perhaps if our defense could come up with a few more stops on 3rd and long we would not be talking about an offense that puts up 30+ points a week.

Give my poor heart the games where we bury them early and Trubisky comes in for mop-up duty

when something is working no need to change, we have become a run 1st team which I'm good with, keeps Allen healthy, I wish they would fix there short yardage plays or play calling, Josh isn't getting it down with these hurry up so called sneaks,

[QLBillsFan]

56 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

At some point not attacking deep is gonna bite us.   But not yet.

Why? Brady and Josh are intelligent enough to not take the bait and throw deep into coverage. He’s seen that D scheme so often he’s expert at throwing it to whoever is open. They may not execute perfectly every game. For example Josh missed Shavers and even Kincaid for a TD in the Jets game. But that’s execution, they seem to be able to make this work. Josh has even said he’s way more patient and won’t just throw deep because he certainly wants to. He will when it’s open but not force it.

[WideNine]

3 minutes ago, Rubes said:

 

While I agree with you, I also haven't heard anyone describe what happened in the second half. We were much less successful running the ball...I figured it was because they were loading the box more, but if that's the case, where were the openings in the defense?

 

I'm also a little bit (only a little bit) concerned about our offensive line's pass blocking. I think this is one of the best OLs in the league, but I think at least part of the problem, even if it's a small part, is that they're not giving Josh the time for those intermediate and long routes to develop. He was under some pressure in that game.

 

 

I am curious about that as well.

I don't have All-22, but it seemed like on our bread & butter zone runs where Cook normally takes a cutback lane they had backside defenders able to knife down the line and catch Cook from behind before he got rolling. I think that is why Brady went with a few toss plays down the stretch to try to get the ball to Cook on the outside in space, but it seemed like they were looking for that and turned those runs back inside towards pursuit.

I am confident there is nothing that Kromer has not seen before and they come up with a counter for that. Perhaps some kind of wham concept to plant that backside pursuer into the turf.


 

[BigAl2526]

I'm sure everybody knows, but the West Coast offense is a language/system for calling plays, originally employing a philosophy of moving the chains by stretching the field horizontally using a short passing game.  Early proponents of the West Cost did not tend to rely on the run, but mixed it in to contribute to the general strategy.  As it has evolved, there are coaches using the West Coast terminology who actually like running the ball and/or mixing in a deep passing game.  Anybody can avoid a deep passing game.  Buffalo, of course, uses Erhardt-Perkins terminology and Brady certainly likes running the ball.