A Few Random Thoughts about the Dolphins Game (Sorry, not in no particular order)

[Virgil]

42 minutes ago, Sweats said:

 

 

 

 

Nice write up and i'm happy you're putting this thread back together.........can i look forward to this on a weekly basis?

 

I hope that someone starts a thread like this after every game, I just can't promise it will be me.  

[PoundingDog]

5 minutes ago, dorquemada said:

 

Yeah but we came pretty close to throwing the game away last night.  We come out hard first couple drives then get cute for the next 30 minutes of gametime.  That's not going to work against better teams, we dont get to play the Jets and Dolphins every week

How many times we, including pundits, said that of the Chiefs in the past, like they barely squeezed by the Raiders etc. Oh they surely would lose against better teams. Yet they went on to Superbowls and continued to go to the AFC championship game 7, 8 years in a row. 

 

My advice is stop worrying about how the Bills measure up on paper against teams. You know the Bills are one of the top superbowk challengers. One game at a time just like the players do.

[billsfan89]

1 minute ago, dorquemada said:

 

Yeah but we came pretty close to throwing the game away last night.  We come out hard first couple drives then get cute for the next 30 minutes of gametime.  That's not going to work against better teams, we dont get to play the Jets and Dolphins every week

 

I think the coaching staff is playing the long game. I think the Jets game is ideally how they would like to have these games go. Dominant James Cook game, defense is shut down, Josh is needed only here or there and they build a 2 score lead at half and then put it away in Q3 building to a 3 score lead in Q4 and grind the game out (of course the Jets game went way better as they had a 3 score lead at the half and built a 4 score lead and went into garbage time in Q4). 

 

But the missed kick by Prater and the early TD by the Fins threw that script off. The Prater miss didn't give Miami awesome field position (I think they took over somewhere around their own 33). But only being down "one score" and getting a break pushed them to try to make it a game again. Of course the Bills took advantage of the Fins miscues later in the game scoring a TD after the roughing the punter and then making the INT on the Tua bad decision. The Bills even erased the holding penalty on the "grinding out" drive after the INT by taking the 2nd and 16 and converting into a first down in field goal range. 

 

The Bills made 2 very critical mistakes (the missed field goal and the holding on Kincaid) and they were able to erase one of those mistakes. The Fins made 2 very big mistakes and the Bills took advantage of both.

[PoundingDog]

13 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

I think the coaching staff is playing the long game. I think the Jets game is ideally how they would like to have these games go. Dominant James Cook game, defense is shut down, Josh is needed only here or there and they build a 2 score lead at half and then put it away in Q3 building to a 3 score lead in Q4 and grind the game out (of course the Jets game went way better as they had a 3 score lead at the half and built a 4 score lead and went into garbage time in Q4). 

Tua is a much better QB than Fields and the Dolphins team is built around Tua skillset. The same can't be said for the Jets. Glenn is still trying to figure who his team is like who he wants to keep, who needs to go. Bottomline the Dolphins are a better team than the Jets; hence harder for the Bills to deal with. Right now, I just want to deal with them as they come.

[Mango]

1 hour ago, Virgil said:

After the week one game, there were a few threads that people posted their random thoughts and I liked how collaborative it was.  Sorry, this isn't the start of me posting the old Few thoughts thread, but figured maybe we could get something new going.  So please, post your own thoughts and see what comes of it.  And if anyone likes the idea, feel free to start one each week after the game.

 

1 - Was anyone surprised to see Strong not get some more reps at DB over White?  While Tre had a couple of decent plays, he really struggled to keep up with Waddle.  That crossing route in the 4th was painful to watch and you could see in Tre's body language that he was just toast.  I love Tre, and I know we get Hairston back soon, but Tre should not be out there against any team with speed.

 

2 - What happened in the second half to the offensive line?  In the first half, they were pushing the defensive line off the ball 2-3 yards on almost ever rushing play.  In the second half, did they get tired or did the Dolphins make adjustments.  Our rushing was less effective and Josh was getting pressured more.  It felt like a dramatic switch.

 

3 - Anyone regretting paying Cook now?  The visual and production difference between Cook, Davis, and Johnson is night and day this season.  I'd argue Cook is legitimately a top 5 back in the league now.  His vision, cuts, speed, and even power seems to have taken another step with his contract.  

 

4 - Groot - I saw the other threads on Groot, and while the defensive line didn't get a sack against a terrible offensive line, I feel like Groot hasn't shown up all season after getting paid.  I could at least see Bosa making an effort and getting close.  Even the rookies on the inside showed some flashes.  I'm wondering if Groot is getting in his head too much on all the contain possibilities that it's slowing down his rush.  Josh was sacked more than Tua, let that sink in.

 

5 - Safety Play - This might have been the first game I didn't complain about Rapp or Bishop, but I don't know if it's because they did their job well or if the Dolphins never tested them.  On the Dolphins side, I have to tip my hat.  Their safeties were the last line of defense on a few plays that could have been taken to the house.  

 

6 - The Prater Miss - Was Prater asked what happened with that miss?  That was such a momentum swing.  There were so many in this game, but that's where I feel like the Dolphins got the most life.  To go from being up 10 to tied at half was interesting (and yes, the Dolphins still could have scored).

 

7 - Offensive game plan - For anyone at the game, I'm curious to know how often the Dolphins played with at least two high safeties.  For a defense that is decimated at DB, I was really surprised at the lack of deep shots we took.  Yes, I know we were running well in the first half, but once that slowed in the second, why did we not test their secondary more?

 

8 - Kincaid - Have to show some love here as he finally looked like a 1st round pick.  If he had pulled in that second touchdown, that may have been the game of his career.

 

9 - Married life has calmed Josh in the best way possible.  I don't know how to explain it really, but Josh always looks so calm and in control, but you can also tell he expects to score on every drive.  There really isn't a single throw he can't make and I find myself just basking in the glow of his ability every game now.  Which randomly makes me hate the Packers for somehow going straight from Favre to Rodgers to Love.  How is that fair?  

 

10 - This season reminds me of the Chiefs that past few years where they didn't win pretty, but they still won and learned a little from each loss.  No one gave the Dolphins a chance in this game, but you never corner a caged animal.  These are all professional athletes and sometimes desire is as important as skill.  That was easily the best effort the Dolphins could give, and while we didn't play our best, we figured it out.  There's a ton of takeaways and lessons the Bills can get here, all while still 0-3.  We have Oliver and Milano coming back, Hairston in two weeks, and then the suspensions are over.  Keep Bosa healthy, keep tweaking and from these lesser opponents, and get ready for when the games really matter.

 

 

Go Bills!

 

1. I didn't think Strong was ever coming in. I thought Tre had a fine day. Yes that crosser was brutal, but all in all I give Tre a passing grade. I was surprised at how often we manned up on Hill/Waddle. To me that was more the glaring weakness than Tre himself. Benford was burned by Hill on a few occassions because of it. 

 

4. Groots career seems to be trending towards the "Hall of Meh". 

 

5. Rapp had a good game. I like him overall. I know the board has treated him as a bit of a whipping boy, but he is fairly low on the list of defensive upgrades for me. 

 

6. I totally assumed that it had to be tipped. But I think I assumed wrong. Kinda crazy. 

 

7. Fully agreed. It was wild. I think part of it was that we didn't want to put the defense back on the field. But still, go up two scores and everything changes. 

[Low Positive]

On point 7. All 22 is out. As an example, here is a play where Josh took the underneeth throw to Kincaid in the third quarter on 3-9 when the Fins forced a punt. They dropped everyone deep. It has to be on Kincaid to convert that by making someone miss.

 

 

[Sojourner]

Nice job @Virgil

 

Im surprised nobody is giving credit to the safety play like you credit in part 5. 
they like to lump it on when they have a bad one…

 

You gave credit to the safeties for the Fish (Minkah/Davis) for stopping some plays from going all the way but given the breakdowns that happened in front of them a few times throughout the game, Rapp/Bishop stopped their own share!

 

 

[Coach Tuesday]

1 hour ago, Low Positive said:

The Bills' defense, which is getting roasted on here this morning, prevented the moonshots to Hill and Waddle, got Tua off his first read, and forced him from the pocket. That is usually what you want to do against them. The fact that he made plays that he usually doesn't make is what made the game close. As you say in point 10, they were a desperate team last night and Tua played very well. Or at least he did until all 6'7'' and 331 pounds of Deone Walker got in his face. 

 

And the plays Tua made where he was running and chucking, he can't make those throws in inclement weather - at all.  He can only do that on the road in September or in a home playoff game (which ain't happening).

[Low Positive]

1 hour ago, Big Turk said:

 

Yeah...I was so irritated how often they had Tua running around and couldn't make the play...none more so than Tre coming in as a free runner out of control and allowing him to spin away and complete a pass to Hill for a 1st down on 3rd and 12.

I just watched that one. The Bills did well on that play to force Tua off his mark. What they didn't do well was lose track of Hill as he cut across the middle as Tua scrambled. Benford, who had him, released him to help on Waddle deep. There was no way that Tua, on the run, could throw 40 yards downfield across his body. As it was, he threw across his body on the run. The pass was behind Hill and way too high. Hill made one heck of a catch. He had to reach behind him to get it and was so high off the ground that he probably could have dunked a basketball. 

Edited September 19 by Low Positive

[Big Turk]

5 minutes ago, Low Positive said:

I just watched that one. The Bills did well on that play to force Tua off his mark. What they didn't do well was lose track of Hill as he cut across the middle as Tua scrambled. Benford, who had him, released him to help on Waddle deep. There was no way that Tua, on the run, could throw 40 yards downfield across his body. As it was, he threw across his body on the run. The pass was behind Hill and way too high. Hill made one heck of a catch. He had to reach behind him to get it and was so high off the ground that he probably could have dunked a basketball. 

 

Don't forget that he is a lefty tho, so unlike Allen, that's his preferred side to roll out to...essentially it's like allowing Allen to roll right.

[RichRiderBills]

I agree with most these items and thoughts. 

 

I will say...the offense performed. So it is different from those sneaky lackluster chiefs wins.  They were not perfect but they moved the ball well and didn't take big risks. They put up 31 points....w missed Field goal. 

 

I guess you can say it's the opposite of chiefs, who generally win with defense during that stretch. 

 

I'd honestly say this game looked similar to a lot of games vs the Tua / McD phins. The only thing separating it from that burner in September a couple years ago is Miami made less mistakes. 

 

One more mistake and this game was 38 - 14 or something. So I personally think it's a solid win and another to build on. 

 

 

[transient]

1 hour ago, dorquemada said:

 

Yeah but we came pretty close to throwing the game away last night.  We come out hard first couple drives then get cute for the next 30 minutes of gametime.  That's not going to work against better teams, we dont get to play the Jets and Dolphins every week

Saints

Patriots

Falcons

Panthers

Chiefs

Dolphins

Buccaneers

Texans*

Steelers*

Bengals*

Patriots

Browns

Eagles

Jets

 

Despite the score, they never felt like they were going to lose the game last night unless they made a huge mistake along the way.

 

Half of their schedule above (bolded, italicized) they will likely be able to play like that and win. Possibly throw the Bengals into that mix once there's more tape on Browning. I also don't think the Steelers are destined for greatness. The Texans still have a great defense, but Stroud looks lost. I expect us to beat the Falcons, but we may have to work a bit harder on offense than we have aside from the Ravens game.

 

Last week and this week, it really had the feel of a clearly superior, dominant team only opening the playbook enough to get the W. It kinda feels like we're going to try to run the ball down teams throats, take the short stuff, and shorten the game as our primary MO unless the opponent forces us to do more than that. It may be boring AF, but in the end if we're healthy and dominating going into Jan/Feb, I'll take it. 

[billsfan714]

Cant believe no mention of our continued problems on 3rd down defense, it was an issue last year and remains an issue that has to improve.

[zow2]

2 hours ago, Virgil said:

2 - What happened in the second half to the offensive line?  In the first half, they were pushing the defensive line off the ball 2-3 yards on almost ever rushing play.  In the second half, did they get tired or did the Dolphins make adjustments.  Our rushing was less effective and Josh was getting pressured more.  It felt like a dramatic switch.

 

 

This game was a great example of why the NFL is great.  I don't care how many DB's or defensive players Miami is missing.  The game is still men battling men.  Everyone is a professional and can bring it on every play.  It just looked like Miami wanted the ball back, more than Buffalo was willing to impose their will.  Also, the Bills were not going to make any risky throws and Allen wasn't going to run around and risk absorbing an injury of some sort.  Just a very safe game and Miami really wanted it.

[Virgil]

46 minutes ago, RichRiderBills said:

I guess you can say it's the opposite of chiefs, who generally win with defense during that stretch. 

 

I was more so pointing out how the Chiefs seemed to get better after each loss and slowly figuring things out before the playoffs.  But yes, I agree with you.  

[Big Turk]

2 hours ago, dorquemada said:

 

Yeah but we came pretty close to throwing the game away last night.  We come out hard first couple drives then get cute for the next 30 minutes of gametime.  That's not going to work against better teams, we dont get to play the Jets and Dolphins every week

 

And there it is "that wont' work against better teams".  Well they don't do that against better teams usually do they? Considering they have the 2nd best win percentage in pro sports over the last 6 years after the Chiefs.

2 hours ago, dorquemada said:

 

Yeah but we came pretty close to throwing the game away last night.  We come out hard first couple drives then get cute for the next 30 minutes of gametime.  That's not going to work against better teams, we dont get to play the Jets and Dolphins every week

 

And there it is "that wont' work against better teams".  Well they don't do that against better teams usually do they? Considering they have the 2nd best win percentage in pro sports over the last 6 years after the Chiefs.

[dorquemada]

Just now, Big Turk said:

 

And there it is "that wont' work against better teams".  Well they don't do that against better teams usually do they? Considering they have the 2nd best win percentage in pro sports over the last 6 years after the Chiefs.

 

And there it is "that wont' work against better teams".  Well they don't do that against better teams usually do they? Considering they have the 2nd best win percentage in pro sports over the last 6 years after the Chiefs.

 

You're not bringing up the Chiefs as an exception here though, right?  Because we've done it against them too, and it's kept us out of at least 2 super bowls.  It's a flaw in our coaching philosophy 

[Big Turk]

2 minutes ago, dorquemada said:

 

You're not bringing up the Chiefs as an exception here though, right?  Because we've done it against them too, and it's kept us out of at least 2 super bowls.  It's a flaw in our coaching philosophy 

 

No, the defense playing one way against them in the regular season allowing an average of 20 points a game over the last 5 years and then the defense allowing that same team to score 33+ points in the playoffs is the reason.

 

 

[Aesop]

On #2. I actually thought White had a good game. He made multiple plays in the run game. He took a bad angle on the CB blitz. The Waddle 4th down play was just fantastic route design vs a man concept. I blame the coaches there. I understand you typically want to play man on 3rd/4th and short, but the coaches know our DBs cant match Miami's speed, so I was surprised they didnt run a cover 2 zone there to have short middle/flats covered.

Edited September 19 by Aesop

[JerseyBills]

3 hours ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

The lack of deep shots was mind boggling. This has been going on for a couple of years now. I mean ever since Gabe Davis left (and Dorsey to an extent) we have seen this offense totally transform. 

Josh had 1 throw over 10 yards, crazy