Guelli says Bills “would absolutely consider” playing games in Canada again

[Richard Noggin]

5 hours ago, Billsatlastin2018 said:

And the POS trash product from OBD for those games, was the same POS trash product that played in Orchard Park… for the lost years of this Millennium.

 

Having the 2025 franchise visit is an entirely different question. Still, a number of Ontario laws, particularly around tailgating would need to change. 
 

in the end, they should have got a franchise decades ago and the rivalry would be intense.
 

 

I'd certainly have no difficulty rooting against a Toronto team! 

Edited September 17 by Richard Noggin

[transient]

Isn't this the guy that whacked Nancy Kerrigan in the knee with a pipe?

 

I have only one thing to say to you, sir...

 

[HIT BY SPIKES]

1 hour ago, ControllerOfPlanetX said:

Well….there is always Hamilton.

 

 

I live in Hamilton and nothing NFL related will ever happen in Hamilton.

[HIT BY SPIKES]

6 hours ago, HaldimandBills said:

Would Toronto want in on the NFL action? 

 

Of course.

 

Does the NFL want Toronto? Not really. They have the market through Buffalo and would rather those Toronto corporate dollars come to Highmark Stadium on game day. You'd have to have really deep pockets to make it worth it for the NFL. 

 

In short the NFL is never coming to Toronto unless some massive NFL fanatic Canadian with 10 billion to spare decides they want one. 

 

I disagree that the NFL does NOT want Toronto.

 

They want any major world class city.

 

Those Canadian corporate dollars will not continue to flow to Buffalo under the current climate and would really really flow expotentially more if there was a NFL for Toronto in Downtown Toronto.

 

When I managed a large law firm in Toronto there was no way I could organize a client function to attend a Bills game yet we had a suite at both the ACC and Rogers Centre.  If there was a NFL team in Toronto, it would be in very very high demand for professionals wishing to entertain clients and potential clients.

 

I don't believe it would take $10B.  Probably $5B does it -- $2.5B for the NFL Franchise Fee and $2.5B for a new Downtown Toronto stadium -- however that may be $6B now due to the rising cost of Downtown Toronto real estate the cost of the doomed stadium may now cost closer to $3.5B.

[Mr. WEO]

7 hours ago, HIT BY SPIKES said:

 

I disagree that the NFL does NOT want Toronto.

 

They want any major world class city.

 

Those Canadian corporate dollars will not continue to flow to Buffalo under the current climate and would really really flow expotentially more if there was a NFL for Toronto in Downtown Toronto.

 

When I managed a large law firm in Toronto there was no way I could organize a client function to attend a Bills game yet we had a suite at both the ACC and Rogers Centre.  If there was a NFL team in Toronto, it would be in very very high demand for professionals wishing to entertain clients and potential clients.

 

I don't believe it would take $10B.  Probably $5B does it -- $2.5B for the NFL Franchise Fee and $2.5B for a new Downtown Toronto stadium -- however that may be $6B now due to the rising cost of Downtown Toronto real estate the cost of the doomed stadium may now cost closer to $3.5B.

 

there's no way that the new franchise fee would be 2.5 B when the average valuation is over 7 B.  

[HIT BY SPIKES]

54 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

there's no way that the new franchise fee would be 2.5 B when the average valuation is over 7 B.  

 

What was the average valuation when the NFL sold its last franchise?

 

I recall the move to LA cost the Rams 2.0B

 

When Pegula bought the Bills, the valuation by Forbes was less than $1M and he bought them for $1.4B with no serious competitive bid against him since he knew he could write off the $1.4B over 10 years as a depreciating asset against all of his business income including fracking.  Special NFL tax exception.

 

How is the average valuation now over $7B?

[Mr. WEO]

3 hours ago, HIT BY SPIKES said:

 

What was the average valuation when the NFL sold its last franchise?

 

I recall the move to LA cost the Rams 2.0B

 

When Pegula bought the Bills, the valuation by Forbes was less than $1M and he bought them for $1.4B with no serious competitive bid against him since he knew he could write off the $1.4B over 10 years as a depreciating asset against all of his business income including fracking.  Special NFL tax exception.

 

How is the average valuation now over $7B?

 

Rams was a relocation fee, not new franchise fee.  

 

The average team valuation in 2023 when the Commanders were bought for 6B was 5.1B.   All values go up each year.  So...7B is the most common figure sited in search..

 

The last new franchise in the NFL was 23 years ago.  Pegula bought the team over 10 years ago--and obviously the price he paid had nothing to due with the AVERAGE team valuation, as the Bills had the lowest team value at that time.

 

 

 

 

[May Day 10]

I would think the NFL would want in Toronto bad.  It is a behemoth of a city with many different cultures within.... in a new country. 

To a man, I would bet the NFL owners wanted/planned on the Bills relocating, but the timing of Rogers' death, Wilson's death (in relation to the brand new lease extension and renovations), and Pegula being on the scene with enough liquid wealth made that an impossibility.  Now we have a new stadium, which likely secures the team for at least 2 decades.  

 

The best thing for the future of the Bills in the mean time may be an expansion team in Toronto over the next decade to 15 years.  I do not believe it would hurt the Bills at the turnstiles or corporate involvement.  If anything, it may help.  Southern Ontario could get NFL-mad, and there is only so much inventory 1 team could have, and Buffalo could enjoy a runoff.  Toronto is plenty large enough and sports-crazy enough to have ample support for 2 teams like NYC and LA.

 

Without a Toronto team, I think we could hear the murmurs of relocation again down the line, well before New Highmark hits its 30-year "life-cycle".  

Edited September 17 by May Day 10

[HIT BY SPIKES]

29 minutes ago, May Day 10 said:

I would think the NFL would want in Toronto bad.  It is a behemoth of a city with many different cultures within.... in a new country. 

To a man, I would bet the NFL owners wanted/planned on the Bills relocating, but the timing of Rogers' death, Wilson's death (in relation to the brand new lease extension and renovations), and Pegula being on the scene with enough liquid wealth made that an impossibility.  Now we have a new stadium, which likely secures the team for at least 2 decades.  

 

The best thing for the future of the Bills in the mean time may be an expansion team in Toronto over the next decade to 15 years.  I do not believe it would hurt the Bills at the turnstiles or corporate involvement.  If anything, it may help.  Southern Ontario could get NFL-mad, and there is only so much inventory 1 team could have, and Buffalo could enjoy a runoff.  Toronto is plenty large enough and sports-crazy enough to have ample support for 2 teams like NYC and LA.

 

Without a Toronto team, I think we could hear the murmurs of relocation again down the line, well before New Highmark hits its 30-year "life-cycle".  

 

EXACTLY

 

AGREE 100%

[Ned Flanders]

34 minutes ago, May Day 10 said:

Without a Toronto team, I think we could hear the murmurs of relocation again down the line, well before New Highmark hits its 30-year "life-cycle".  

[HIT BY SPIKES]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

Rams was a relocation fee, not new franchise fee.  

 

The average team valuation in 2023 when the Commanders were bought for 6B was 5.1B.   All values go up each year.  So...7B is the most common figure sited in search..

 

The last new franchise in the NFL was 23 years ago.  Pegula bought the team over 10 years ago--and obviously the price he paid had nothing to due with the AVERAGE team valuation, as the Bills had the lowest team value at that time.

 

 

 

 

 

So what is your theory on why Pegula paid $1.4B for the Bills that were then evaluated according to Forbes for less than $1B when Trump NEVER produced the financial disclosure and was out and the group led by Bon Jovi did NOT make an offer?

[May Day 10]

I think an NFL property in Toronto would break the record by a sizeable mark.  Expansion fee would probably be $10 Billion or more for that.  Huge untapped market in an un-tapped country (I believe the rest of Canada would support the NFL team in Toronto despite hating Toronto like they do the Blue Jays, but not the Leafs).   

 

And the $10 Billion (plus stadium) would be a good investment.   The way to make that work would probably be some sort of collaboration/partnership between the Thomson family and MLSE.  

 

 

I anyone hasn't been to Toronto in the last 10 years or so, go up there and try to pick your jaw up off the floor.   

Edited September 17 by May Day 10

[Mat68]

On 9/16/2025 at 11:16 AM, Dillenger4 said:

Well he just signed a deal with MLSE a few weeks ago. Vince Carter was in Toronto pushing this Bills/MLSE thing hard! All over the news in Canada. It doesn't mean they will play in Toronto - but it surely is a step towards "something" happening with Bills in Toronto.

The stadium where the Argos play is undergoing a massive upgrade for the world cup. I can see the Bills playing there in the next few years.

Weird take again. It was sold out dude....

I said it the day they announced it. Vince Carter and McGrady were the WORST thing for The Bills ever. Just sit back and watch.

All about the corporate $$$ with him and Pegs daughter. You'll see.

That would create a much better environment for football than what they used the previous times.  Buffalo switching to natural grass next season, the world cup is mandating grass fields too.  Close market, with a proper field I dont hate it.  More grass games instead of turf.   

[JAMIEBUF12]

Just as long as it means we are exempt from playing in London or Europe for that matter I am ok with it.

GO BILLS!

[Dillenger4]

5 hours ago, Mat68 said:

That would create a much better environment for football than what they used the previous times.  Buffalo switching to natural grass next season, the world cup is mandating grass fields too.  Close market, with a proper field I dont hate it.  More grass games instead of turf.   

I hate the thought of any Bills game outside of Buffalo. But IF it had to be... Toronto at the Argos stadium would be cool. It will seat up to 68,000'ish after the reno. It is also undergoing a large technology upgrade with the same video and IT hardware as the Bills new stadium. So it makes a lot of sense from a broadcast perspective. I guess we will see...

Google the stadium reno, it looks pretty damn cool. Vince Carter is up to something.

[TheFunPolice]

Maybe the Bills will play an annual game in Toronto but not have to travel anywhere else for international games?

 

Financial benefit

Travel benefit

Expanding market benefit 

 

It's all W's 

 

IMO the idea would be that it would lead to a Toronto expansion team or a current team moving there (not the Bills). The Toronto sports guys in Bills ownership would then move over to that team as part owners. 

 

The last deal with Toronto was about moving the Bills there, 100% IMO. It just didn't work out because of Rogers death early in the deal. 

 

This time around, it will be about demonstrating a major interest in NFL football in Toronto so that the city can get its own team. They pay exorbitant amounts to the Bills for games, and in exchange demonstrate a market to the NFL, who then awards them an expansion team. 

 

Toronto billionaires were never giving the Bills money out of the kindness of their hearts. It's about the long stated goal: A Toronto NFL team

Edited September 18 by TheFunPolice

[Warriorspikes51]

road game only. 

[RyanC883]

On 9/17/2025 at 12:01 PM, May Day 10 said:

I would think the NFL would want in Toronto bad.  It is a behemoth of a city with many different cultures within.... in a new country. 

To a man, I would bet the NFL owners wanted/planned on the Bills relocating, but the timing of Rogers' death, Wilson's death (in relation to the brand new lease extension and renovations), and Pegula being on the scene with enough liquid wealth made that an impossibility.  Now we have a new stadium, which likely secures the team for at least 2 decades.  

 

The best thing for the future of the Bills in the mean time may be an expansion team in Toronto over the next decade to 15 years.  I do not believe it would hurt the Bills at the turnstiles or corporate involvement.  If anything, it may help.  Southern Ontario could get NFL-mad, and there is only so much inventory 1 team could have, and Buffalo could enjoy a runoff.  Toronto is plenty large enough and sports-crazy enough to have ample support for 2 teams like NYC and LA.

 

Without a Toronto team, I think we could hear the murmurs of relocation again down the line, well before New Highmark hits its 30-year "life-cycle".  

I think Pegula  ended anny move talk irrespective of anything else. 

[letsgoteam]

13 hours ago, JAMIEBUF12 said:

Just as long as it means we are exempt from playing in London or Europe for that matter I am ok with it.

GO BILLS!

Yea, I dont feel like ready through 8 pages. This is the correct answer. If a game in Canada meant not traveling overseas, its a no brainer.

 

EDIT: I hate the cash grab of any game NOT being played in a teams home stadium (snow blizzards excluded haha).

However, everyone is doing it. Just look at what the WWE is doing...

Edited September 19 by letsgoteam

[Just Jack]

On 9/16/2025 at 6:31 AM, SirAndrew said:

Has something changed since the Bills last Toronto series? I only ask and make these assumptions because the Toronto series didn’t have great attendance. The other international series games don’t seem to have this issue. 

 

On 9/16/2025 at 11:16 AM, Dillenger4 said:

Weird take again. It was sold out dude....

 

It was technically sold out. Toronto paid the Bills what they would have made if the stadium in OP sold out. Then they sold tickets to Rogers Centre. I went to the games up there. Day of they would be interviewing someone from Rogers and they were always saying to come on down, plenty of seats still available.