2023 MVP: Lamar will win it with 15 fewer TDs than Josh Allen (end of season talk pg 75+)

[finn]

7 hours ago, folz said:

Josh needs 142 total yards and 3 TDs over the last two games to equal Lamar's MVP season. Yes. he has 9 more INTs than Lamar did that season, but if you take Josh's 2023 game averages (279.4 yards and 2.66 TDs) for the next two games, Josh would have 417 total yards and 2-3 TDs more than Lamar did in his MVP season...just sayin'.

In one more game than Lamar, to be fair. But Allen could easily surpass Lamar's yards and total TDs with just the NE game (16 games). 

[finn]

1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

I also think we going crazy with the Td stat. If instead of giving the ball to JAG Gus Edwards for 11 tds this year, they tush pushed him for like 7 more, does that really matter? 

Doesn't really work like that or else every QB would do rush for TDs themselves instead of handing the ball off. It takes a rare talent--a Hurts, Allen, Lamar, etc.--to score that many TDs on the ground, creating a dual threat that teams have to account for. If anything, QB rush TDs should be valued MORE than pass TDs. 

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

35 minutes ago, Ya Digg? said:

Actually yes I do have a big problem with you saying you would rather have an MVP than a Super Bowl. Who would rather have that? 
Wanting to see Josh win the MVP (or at least debating it) also doesn’t mean no one wants to win the Super Bowl-who thinks that linearly?

you on drugs?

 

I never said I would rather have an mvp than a sb.

 

I said.

 

mvp or lombardi?

 

 

lombardi all day.

 

 

mvp means nothing really.

 

as for debating, fine, debate all day. it still stands that a lombardi is way more important than mvp.

 

 

[Ya Digg?]

8 minutes ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

you on drugs?

 

I never said I would rather have an mvp than a sb.

 

I said.

 

mvp or lombardi?

 

 

lombardi all day.

 

 

mvp means nothing really.

 

as for debating, fine, debate all day. it still stands that a lombardi is way more important than mvp.

 

 

Go back and read our messages then come back and answer, otherwise there’s nothing more to discuss

 

There’s not a single person who would say they want the MVP over the Super Bowl, we agree on that. You make it seem like it’s ludicrous that people even want to debate the MVP though 

[Strethor]

Most likely will be CMC co-mvp /w one of  Lamar/Tua/Allen 

 

The narrative is against Allen 

[Warcodered]

Would you look at that some logical thinking.

 

 

[YoloinOhio]

17 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

Would you look at that some logical thinking.

 

 

Anyone who doesn’t understand this simply does not watch Bills games 

[BuffaloBillyG]

53 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

Would you look at that some logical thinking.

 

 

Never liked Sherman as a player. However the last couple of years he's really impressed me as a talking head. Not just on this topic, but he does provide well thought out and insightful thoughts and analysis. 

58 minutes ago, Strethor said:

Most likely will be CMC co-mvp /w one of  Lamar/Tua/Allen 

 

The narrative is against Allen 

Here's the problem. And this is also why Allen will NEVER win an MVP unless he's by far undisputed no questions able to be asked the best player in a season.

 

Too many that have votes for MVP bashed Allen coming into the league. Said he would never pan out. They CANNOT let him have an MVP. Would prove them wrong. So they will latch on to whatever they can year in and year out to deny him. 

[Process]

The Ravens went 3-2 last year without Lamar and if it weren't for a fumble at the 1 yard line would have beat the Bengals in the playoffs. 

[paulmm3]

Love Josh but he single handedly lost us too many winnable games earlier in the season to be worthy of MVP. Not his best year. 

[Ya Digg?]

5 minutes ago, paulmm3 said:

Love Josh but he single handedly lost us too many winnable games earlier in the season to be worthy of MVP. Not his best year. 

Outside of the Jets game, what game did Josh lose for the team???

[jlgarsh]

5 minutes ago, paulmm3 said:

Love Josh but he single handedly lost us too many winnable games earlier in the season to be worthy of MVP. Not his best year. 

He lost them the Jets game. That's it. Gave them the lead in the last 2 minutes 5 times this year, and the team is 1-4 in those games. That's on defensive coaching.

[Warcodered]

4 minutes ago, jlgarsh said:

He lost them the Jets game. That's it. Gave them the lead in the last 2 minutes 5 times this year, and the team is 1-4 in those games. That's on defensive coaching.

That is fair, though even in that game after losing the lead he still got them in FG range at the very end of regulation to get them to OT.

 

 

 

[34-78-83]

1 hour ago, Warcodered said:

Would you look at that some logical thinking.

 

 

Keyshawn sure hates him some ‘all things Buffalo Bills’. Always has. Not sure why exactly. He’s also pretty dumb as media members go, so that’s fun too.

[C.Biscuit97]

2 hours ago, finn said:

Doesn't really work like that or else every QB would do rush for TDs themselves instead of handing the ball off. It takes a rare talent--a Hurts, Allen, Lamar, etc.--to score that many TDs on the ground, creating a dual threat that teams have to account for. If anything, QB rush TDs should be valued MORE than pass TDs. 

It’s real football and not fantasy. 
 

Jackson is the qb of the best team in the nfl who just stomped the team everyone thought was the best team in the nfl on the road. Their only losses were flukes games they choked at the end. They are a top 5 team in history of how much they have led games this year. They are down to their 3rd string rb. Lamar has been doing it without their next best offensive player for the last 3 games. He has a career record of 57-19 while his backups have a losing record.  
 

I think this is the year a non qb should win. But considering the Ravens stomped the crap out of the 49ers, it is hard to make the argue for CMC today. 
 

it’s just weird we are penalizing him for dominating the games early so they don’t have to come back or stat pad. 

12 minutes ago, 34-78-83 said:

Keyshawn sure hates him some ‘all things Buffalo Bills’. Always has. Not sure why exactly. He’s also pretty dumb as media members go, so that’s fun too.

Keyshawn is a moron for a million reasons but you could make that statement for almost every top qb.

28 minutes ago, jlgarsh said:

He lost them the Jets game. That's it. Gave them the lead in the last 2 minutes 5 times this year, and the team is 1-4 in those games. That's on defensive coaching.

But what about the halves the offense completely sucked and the defense keep us in the game - jags, Jets, broncos, pats, chargers? 
 

everyone knows Allen is awesome and our best player. But it still is a team game. This whole season has been really inconsistent and I think for a MVP, you need to be the most consistent player through the year. Allens has higher highs than everyone except maybe Mahomes. But there have been too many lows. 
 

that said, he can lead us to a SB and who cares about a MVP?

[C.Biscuit97]

1 hour ago, Process said:

The Ravens went 3-2 last year without Lamar and if it weren't for a fumble at the 1 yard line would have beat the Bengals in the playoffs. 

Liar. They went 2-4 without Lamar (who was 8-4). Their backups accounted for 5 tds and 6 ints as opposed to Lamar’s 20 tds and 7 ints. 
 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/rav/2022.htm

[BeastMaster]

2 hours ago, Warcodered said:

Would you look at that some logical thinking.

 

 

Keyshawn Johnson has some of the most trash takes you will hear or see on television, and that's saying quite a bit with what is on nowadays. This particular take though seems like it may have a racial component to it for Keyshawn. 

 

The media hate and reluctance to ever give Josh his due kind of reminds me of a man that the media vilified for years and told you he would start WW3 and that anyone who thought that man was good was not good for democracy. 

 

Hopefully the voters don't fall for the media narrative that comes from a place of prejudice in the case of personalities like KJ, Nick Wrong, and Skip Bayless

[FireChans]

17 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

It’s real football and not fantasy. 
 

Jackson is the qb of the best team in the nfl who just stomped the team everyone thought was the best team in the nfl on the road. Their only losses were flukes games they choked at the end. They are a top 5 team in history of how much they have led games this year. They are down to their 3rd string rb. Lamar has been doing it without their next best offensive player for the last 3 games. He has a career record of 57-19 while his backups have a losing record.  
 

I think this is the year a non qb should win. But considering the Ravens stomped the crap out of the 49ers, it is hard to make the argue for CMC today. 
 

it’s just weird we are penalizing him for dominating the games early so they don’t have to come back or stat pad. 

Keyshawn is a moron for a million reasons but you could make that statement for almost every top qb.

But what about the halves the offense completely sucked and the defense keep us in the game - jags, Jets, broncos, pats, chargers? 
 

everyone knows Allen is awesome and our best player. But it still is a team game. This whole season has been really inconsistent and I think for a MVP, you need to be the most consistent player through the year. Allens has higher highs than everyone except maybe Mahomes. But there have been too many lows. 
 

that said, he can lead us to a SB and who cares about a MVP?

I think if I had a vote today, I would vote for CMC. 
 

Lamar just doesn’t have the numbers, as awesome as he’s been, just like Josh doesn’t have the wins.

 

CMC has both, and imo, no QB has run away with the award.

[BeastMaster]

11 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

It’s real football and not fantasy. 
 

Jackson is the qb of the best team in the nfl who just stomped the team everyone thought was the best team in the nfl on the road. Their only losses were flukes games they choked at the end. They are a top 5 team in history of how much they have led games this year. They are down to their 3rd string rb. Lamar has been doing it without their next best offensive player for the last 3 games. He has a career record of 57-19 while his backups have a losing record.  
 

I think this is the year a non qb should win. But considering the Ravens stomped the crap out of the 49ers, it is hard to make the argue for CMC today. 
 

it’s just weird we are penalizing him for dominating the games early so they don’t have to come back or stat pad. 

Keyshawn is a moron for a million reasons but you could make that statement for almost every top qb.

But what about the halves the offense completely sucked and the defense keep us in the game - jags, Jets, broncos, pats, chargers? 
 

everyone knows Allen is awesome and our best player. But it still is a team game. This whole season has been really inconsistent and I think for a MVP, you need to be the most consistent player through the year. Allens has higher highs than everyone except maybe Mahomes. But there have been too many lows. 
 

that said, he can lead us to a SB and who cares about a MVP?

The RAVENS stomped the best team on the road...not just Lamar. That's why their defense has been top notch all season and Lamar has mediocre to good numbers. He has complimented the defense very well this season.

 

Lamar didn't outduel Brock Purdy in a battle that showcased who the better QB was...Purdy imploded and the Ravens capitalized on turnovers and great field position. Lamar had a fine game, but this wasn't a demonstration as to how high of a level Lamar Jackson was on. The Niners did everything they could to hand Baltimore the win, and even with all those turnovers, Lamar didn't close the door and the defense had to get yet another INT late to seal it.

 

Josh has 16 more TD's than Lamar and is accounting for 83% of his teams touchdowns, while LJ is at 55%.

 

If Josh plays well and the Bills beat Miami after Baltimore beats them and they get the two seed, it would be criminal to give Lamar the MVP over Josh

[C.Biscuit97]

Just now, FireChans said:

I think if I had a vote today, I would vote for CMC. 
 

Lamar just doesn’t have the numbers, as awesome as he’s been, just like Josh doesn’t have the wins.

 

CMC has both, and imo, no QB has run away with the award.

Can’t disagree except that the Ravens stomped them. But this should be a non qb year.