Biden Impeachment Inquiry: The Walls Be Closing.

[aristocrat]

9 hours ago, BillStime said:

 

But you keep changing your story after every speed bump.

 

Enjoy your 2019 psyop.

 

 

What story did I change? Bad guys hired hunter and rode off into the sunset with the stolen loot. 

[Doc]

15 hours ago, ChiGoose said:

It's not a pesky fact. It's just reality. Many people commit crimes who are never prosecuted. There's a difference between "this guy is obviously doing crimes" and "I can prove in a court of law that this person is doing crimes." And both of those are certainly different than "This guy is just not doing his job".

 

This is all pretty straightforward. And the actual explanation makes a lot more sense than "Joe Biden is publicly bragging about something he did to corruptly benefit his son."

 

Sure it's a pesky fact.  It's THE pesky fact that destroys your whole "the Obama policy was anti-corruption" when Shokin was fired for being corrupt (Joke's exact word, irrefutable) and not a single person after Shokin was fired, including Shokin himself, was prosecuted for corruption. 

 

So when did the alleged policy exist?  Ukraine was a corrupt country after Shokin was fired because no one was prosecuted.  Which is what Trump wanted to investigate before throwing more good money after bad and funding what could be a still corrupt country.  And he got impeached over it.

 

In this case, Joke fires a guy investigating his son's company claiming corruption and then...nothing.  So the appearance, just like in Trump's impeachment, was terrible, depending on which side of the aisle you fall.  And again, impeachment is political and not a trial where anything has to be proven (like it wasn't in the phone call impeachment)

[B-Man]

 

 

                                           

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

                                             

[BillStime]

1 hour ago, aristocrat said:

What story did I change? Bad guys hired hunter and rode off into the sunset with the stolen loot. 

 

First you tell us the company stole "tens and tens of millions" - you provided a source that did not support that - shocker.

 

Then you tell us that the next prosecutor doesn't investigate or "cooperate" - yet the new prosecutor did in fact investigate and Burisma paid fines.

 

Again, enjoy your 2019 debunked psyop.

 

It's literally all you, Doc, Chris, Karen, and Bonnie have.

 

Desperate, as always.

 

 

12 hours ago, aristocrat said:

willfully ignorant useful idiot 

 

Awe, that's so cute.  Touching.

 

[ChiGoose]

21 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Sure it's a pesky fact.  It's THE pesky fact that destroys your whole "the Obama policy was anti-corruption" when Shokin was fired for being corrupt (Joke's exact word, irrefutable) and not a single person after Shokin was fired, including Shokin himself, was prosecuted for corruption. 

 

So when did the alleged policy exist?  Ukraine was a corrupt country after Shokin was fired because no one was prosecuted.  Which is what Trump wanted to investigate before throwing more good money after bad and funding what could be a still corrupt country.  And he got impeached over it.

 

In this case, Joke fires a guy investigating his son's company claiming corruption and then...nothing.  So the appearance, just like in Trump's impeachment, was terrible, depending on which side of the aisle you fall.  And again, impeachment is political and not a trial where anything has to be proven (like it wasn't in the phone call impeachment)

 

Putting aside the fact that the idea that Joe Biden went against US policy to corruptly help his son and then went public bragging about it is absolutely idiotic....

 

Ukraine, as a former Soviet state has had a long history of corruption. Many countries wanted them to clean up their act if they wanted aid in the wake of Russia's 2014 invasion. Now, in the real world and not the fantasy you seem to live in, corruption isn't an on/off switch. You don't just take an action and solve corruption. It's a long process of unwinding the way things were done in the past. The idea that corruption wasn't solved after one guy was fired doesn't mean that firing that guy wasn't part of cleaning up corruption.

 

As to when the policy existed, shouldn't be too hard to look up:

 

In 2016, the IMF conditioned aid on Ukraine fighting corruption.

 

EU officials were trying to get Shokin fired before Biden was involved

 

By late fall of 2015, the EU and the United States joined the chorus of those seeking Mr. Shokin’s removal as the start of an overall reform of the Procurator General’s Office

 

[2016] The United States and other Western nations had for months called for the ousting of Mr. Shokin, who was widely criticized for turning a blind eye to corrupt practices and for defending the interests of a venal and entrenched elite. He was one of several political figures in Kiev whom reformers and Western diplomats saw as a worrying indicator of a return to past corrupt practices, two years after a revolution that was supposed to put a stop to self-dealing by those in power.

 

[2016] On the other hand, some reforms have been slow. According to Secretary Nuland, much difficult work remains to clean up endemic corruption throughout government and society, at every level; to stabilize the economy; break the hold of corrupt state enterprises and oligarchs; and reform the justice system. She also noted that currently only 5% of the Ukrainian population completely trusted the judiciary. Secretary Nuland stated, “like Ukraine’s police force, the Prosecutor General’s Office (PGO) has to be reinvented as an institution that serves the citizens of Ukraine, rather than ripping them off.” For the secretary, that means the PGO “must investigate and successfully prosecute corruption and asset recovery cases – including locking up dirty personnel in the PGO itself.” And, the newly created Inspector General’s Office within Ukraine’s prosecution service must be able to work independently and effectively, without political or judicial interference.4 Nuland’s comments were given renewed importance when on February 14, 2016, the reform-minded deputy prosecutor resigned, complaining that his efforts to address government corruption had been consistently stymied by his own prosecutor general, Viktor Shokin, as well as other government officials. This led to the February 16 resignation of Shokin after President Poroshenko complained that Shokin was taking too long to clean up corruption even within the PGO itself.

 

[2016] The European Union has welcomed the dismissal of Ukraine's scandal-ridden prosecutor general and called for a crackdown on corruption, even as the country's political crisis deepened over efforts to form a new ruling coalition and appoint a new prime minister.

 

As to the efforts to fight corruption in Ukraine:

 

[2016] Ukraine is waging two wars: one against Russian-backed separatists in the East and one against its own internal corruption.

 

[2018] Mayor Klitschko on Transforming Kyiv and Fighting Corruption in Ukraine

 

[2022] To an outsider, it may seem an unlikely time for Ukraine to double down on the battle against corruption, as missiles rain down on cities and citizens fight for their lives.  Nonetheless, anti-graft agencies have revived a years-old investigation into an official scheme they say led to electricity customers overpaying by more than $1 billion, plus a case that stalled in 2020 into the alleged theft of over $350 million in assets and funds from a state-controlled oil company.

 

[2022] Ukraine takes two steps forward, one step back in anti-corruption fight

 

[2023] Ukraine's anti-graft police zero in on major wartime corruption

 

[2023] Ukraine's fight against corruption isn't new. It's still trying

 

[2023] As well as fighting Russia, Ukrainians are battling corruption at home

 

 

[Doc]

1 minute ago, ChiGoose said:

Putting aside the fact that the idea that Joe Biden went against US policy to corruptly help his son and then went public bragging about it is absolutely idiotic....

 

Ukraine, as a former Soviet state has had a long history of corruption. Many countries wanted them to clean up their act if they wanted aid in the wake of Russia's 2014 invasion. Now, in the real world and not the fantasy you seem to live in, corruption isn't an on/off switch. You don't just take an action and solve corruption. It's a long process of unwinding the way things were done in the past. The idea that corruption wasn't solved after one guy was fired doesn't mean that firing that guy wasn't part of cleaning up corruption.

 

As to when the policy existed, shouldn't be too hard to look up:

 

In 2016, the IMF conditioned aid on Ukraine fighting corruption.

 

EU officials were trying to get Shokin fired before Biden was involved

 

By late fall of 2015, the EU and the United States joined the chorus of those seeking Mr. Shokin’s removal as the start of an overall reform of the Procurator General’s Office

 

[2016] The United States and other Western nations had for months called for the ousting of Mr. Shokin, who was widely criticized for turning a blind eye to corrupt practices and for defending the interests of a venal and entrenched elite. He was one of several political figures in Kiev whom reformers and Western diplomats saw as a worrying indicator of a return to past corrupt practices, two years after a revolution that was supposed to put a stop to self-dealing by those in power.

 

[2016] On the other hand, some reforms have been slow. According to Secretary Nuland, much difficult work remains to clean up endemic corruption throughout government and society, at every level; to stabilize the economy; break the hold of corrupt state enterprises and oligarchs; and reform the justice system. She also noted that currently only 5% of the Ukrainian population completely trusted the judiciary. Secretary Nuland stated, “like Ukraine’s police force, the Prosecutor General’s Office (PGO) has to be reinvented as an institution that serves the citizens of Ukraine, rather than ripping them off.” For the secretary, that means the PGO “must investigate and successfully prosecute corruption and asset recovery cases – including locking up dirty personnel in the PGO itself.” And, the newly created Inspector General’s Office within Ukraine’s prosecution service must be able to work independently and effectively, without political or judicial interference.4 Nuland’s comments were given renewed importance when on February 14, 2016, the reform-minded deputy prosecutor resigned, complaining that his efforts to address government corruption had been consistently stymied by his own prosecutor general, Viktor Shokin, as well as other government officials. This led to the February 16 resignation of Shokin after President Poroshenko complained that Shokin was taking too long to clean up corruption even within the PGO itself.

 

[2016] The European Union has welcomed the dismissal of Ukraine's scandal-ridden prosecutor general and called for a crackdown on corruption, even as the country's political crisis deepened over efforts to form a new ruling coalition and appoint a new prime minister.

 

As to the efforts to fight corruption in Ukraine:

 

[2016] Ukraine is waging two wars: one against Russian-backed separatists in the East and one against its own internal corruption.

 

[2018] Mayor Klitschko on Transforming Kyiv and Fighting Corruption in Ukraine

 

[2022] To an outsider, it may seem an unlikely time for Ukraine to double down on the battle against corruption, as missiles rain down on cities and citizens fight for their lives.  Nonetheless, anti-graft agencies have revived a years-old investigation into an official scheme they say led to electricity customers overpaying by more than $1 billion, plus a case that stalled in 2020 into the alleged theft of over $350 million in assets and funds from a state-controlled oil company.

 

[2022] Ukraine takes two steps forward, one step back in anti-corruption fight

 

[2023] Ukraine's anti-graft police zero in on major wartime corruption

 

[2023] Ukraine's fight against corruption isn't new. It's still trying

 

[2023] As well as fighting Russia, Ukrainians are battling corruption at home

 

Yeah because Joke's a real rocket scientist.  Again I point you to Trump publicy exhorting Russia to find Hilly's emails and used as evidence of him colluding with them. 

 

And sure the US should have had a policy of anti-corruption in Ukraine because it was and still is corrupt.  You misread by snark. 

[ChiGoose]

3 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Yeah because Joke's a real rocket scientist.  Again I point you to Trump publicy exhorting Russia to find Hilly's emails and used as evidence of him colluding with them. 

 

And sure the US should have had a policy of anti-corruption in Ukraine because it was and still is corrupt.  You misread by snark. 

 

Ok, I guess you're just content to be mislead and live in a fantasy world because it feels good. Keep ignoring reality because facts are mean. Cozy up with those sweet, sweet feelings because they make you feel so good.

[Doc]

13 minutes ago, ChiGoose said:

Ok, I guess you're just content to be mislead and live in a fantasy world because it feels good. Keep ignoring reality because facts are mean. Cozy up with those sweet, sweet feelings because they make you feel so good.

 

I accept your defeat.

[ChiGoose]

4 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

I accept your defeat.

 

LOL. Pathetic.

[BillsFanNC]

The King is King for a reason.

 

Calling others idiots while he consistently puts on his own stunning display of moronic idiocy day after day.

 

The Effin King!

[Joe Ferguson forever]

7 minutes ago, ChiGoose said:

 

LOL. Pathetic.

Grandiose delusions are bad...

[BillsFanNC]

 ⬆️ 

 

And his daft Quack MD sidekick. 

 

Mask up and get that booster "doc".....

[The Frankish Reich]

I thought I saw on the, umm, football portion of this, umm, football fan forum that Ol' Tarheel is in London for the Bills game. What marvelous company for those other Bills fans. Not to mention the fine people of Ol' England, hosting our favorite misanthrope, spending his time in what just might be the greatest city in the world by posting nonsense here.

Keep calm and carry on the idiocy across the pond!

[aristocrat]

8 hours ago, BillStime said:

 

First you tell us the company stole "tens and tens of millions" - you provided a source that did not support that - shocker.

 

Then you tell us that the next prosecutor doesn't investigate or "cooperate" - yet the new prosecutor did in fact investigate and Burisma paid fines.

 

Again, enjoy your 2019 debunked psyop.

 

It's literally all you, Doc, Chris, Karen, and Bonnie have.

 

Desperate, as always.

 

 

 

Awe, that's so cute.  Touching.

 

lol the charges were ultimately dropped due to deadlines missed by the prosecution. Jesus Christ can’t you read? And the money frozen was released back to the owner of the company. Hell the United Nations had an entire ***** meeting about it. Just willfully ignorant. The prosecution couldn’t just come on and do nothing. They had to make it look a little good. Bad guys hired hunter and rode off into the sunset with the money. 

[BillStime]

5 minutes ago, aristocrat said:

lol the charges were ultimately dropped due to deadlines missed by the prosecution. Jesus Christ can’t you read? And the money frozen was released back to the owner of the company. Hell the United Nations had an entire ***** meeting about it. Just willfully ignorant. The prosecution couldn’t just come on and do nothing. They had to make it look a little good. Bad guys hired hunter and rode off into the sunset with the money. 

 

And how did Hunter break any laws?

 

[aristocrat]

2 minutes ago, BillStime said:

 

And how did Hunter break any laws?

 

Conspiracy to defraud the Ukraine government. They could probably use that money to fight Russia don’t you think? 

[BillStime]

1 minute ago, aristocrat said:

Conspiracy to defraud the Ukraine government. They could probably use that money to fight Russia don’t you think? 

 

 

Get out of here man. 

 

[B-Man]

 

 

 

                               

 

 

 

[John from Riverside]

17 hours ago, aristocrat said:

Conspiracy to defraud the Ukraine government. They could probably use that money to fight Russia don’t you think? 

wouldn’t shock me if Hunter Biden did break some laws honestly

 

But getting back to the original premise Hunter, Biden is not a United States official. He is not in our government anyway he never held a security clearance like some others that had to have daddy push it along.

 

There is literally nothing linking Joe Biden to any of this, which is all that really matters and as long as this impeachment inquiry goes along, trying to on one hand, show the criminality of Hunter Biden, and on the other hand trying to link it’s a Joe Biden and they can’t put the two together the worse it’s going to get

 

When your first day witnesses are basically saying that there’s not enough there for an impeachment inquiry you’re ***** right from the start

[ChiGoose]

1 minute ago, John from Riverside said:

wouldn’t shock me if Hunter Biden did break some laws honestly

 

But getting back to the original premise Hunter, Biden is not a United States official. He is not in our government anyway he never held a security clearance like some others that had to have daddy push it along.

 

There is literally nothing linking Joe Biden to any of this, which is all that really matters and as long as this impeachment inquiry goes along, trying to on one hand, show the criminality of Hunter Biden, and on the other hand trying to link it’s a Joe Biden and they can’t put the two together the worse it’s going to get

 

When your first day witnesses are basically saying that there’s not enough there for an impeachment inquiry you’re ***** right from the start

 

But the thing that you're missing is that money went to people named Biden. So even though they don't have evidence that it went to Joe Biden, they can still pretend, can't they? Just for funsies?