Your Gut Instinct: Are Beane/McDermott On Track to Win Championship(s) or Wasting J. Allen's talent?

[elijah]

16 minutes ago, BillsPride12 said:

You're leaving out a glaring omission with your post....Offensive and Defensive Lines.  I have not been impressed with this regime's ability to stock up the trenches on either side of the ball.  Until Beane shows he's capable of building much better lines I can't see them getting over the hurdle to winning the whole thing. 

The defensive line started the year off phenomenally until Von’s injury, after a disappointing playoff loss last year Beane knew what he needed to address and he did so. It’s unfortunate that Von got injured at the same time that Rousseau and Oliver seemed to hit a regressive stretch, but he sought out to address the defensive line last year and without injury he would have done so successfully. Has he missed on Boogie and Epenesa? Yeah, he has. Tell me a GM that hits at 100% and I’ll show you how you’re wrong. Tell me a GM that hits at a rate higher than Beane and I’ll argue to my grave that Beane is better than almost every other GM in the league. 

 

The issue this offseason is the offensive line and wide receiver. Beane has earned my trust and confidence that he will set out to address the offensive line this offseason and he will do so. Might he draft a third round pick that turns into a bust in the process? Yeah, he might. It’s the NFL, it happens. But where he’s earned my faith is that he’ll over address it to the point that if he does draft a bust, there will be so many other additions on the line made that overall it will still display vastly improved play. 

 

My only issue with Beane thus far was the decision to go into the season with Gabe Davis as your WR2. It was short sighted and ignorant at the time, and it only looks worse after the season. Drafting a cornerback in the first round when you already had 3 All-Pro’s in your secondary, for a coach that has shown an ability to specialize in secondary development and get maximum contributions out of his players just made no sense then, and makes even less sense in hindsight after he split snaps with Benford and Jackson all season. 

 

We need to step back as fans, take a deep breath and evaluate the organization as a whole IN COMPARISON to the rest of the league. Very few teams are doing it better than our front office and coaching staff right now, and I might argue that with this consistency and longevity it may only be the Chiefs (and maybe the 49ers) doing it better. If you want to nitpick, then do just that, nitpick away. But leave it at that, it’s just nitpicking.

 

The fire everybody, we’re never going to see success crowd and hot takes are out of control right now. We’ve turned into a spoiled fan base losing sight of what we have in front of us. From top to bottom, front office, coaching staff, roster talent, structure and etc, we are a top 5 organization in the NFL and we will be a top 5 organization in the NFL for years to come. Unfortunately we’re not the Chiefs, but when you’re a top 5 organization in the NFL for a decade plus, that level of consistency is going to get you a Lombardi, and maybe a few of them if luck strikes the right way. 

Edited February 4, 2023 by elijah

[IndyMark]

I have to believe Beane and McD have done, and are doing, some deep soul searching and reflection on why they just cannot seem to take that next step. I firmly believe they are. 

 

What I am not convinced is that they are accurate in the conclusions they are forming.  But, maybe this past year forces them to see some ugly truths about their decisions to date.  At least, that is why I am hopeful.  I think smart people eventually can realize they are a problem.  And if they are secure enough in themselves they can accept it and get better. 

 

While there are things Beane and McD display that I just do not like or get, one thing you cannot argue is that they are super defensive.  Protective? Yes, absolutely.  Defensive?  Not yet. If you are defensive you are not reflective, this is why I think deep down both Beane and McD have realized, "f*&$, what was I thinking?".

 

If Beane can get out of his own way and finally accept that investing in a quality OL is a priority and if McD can get past his (very genuine and respectful) allegiance to Leslie Frazier then that is a start.  A good start.  Will they? Who knows. I am a Bills fan, so I am going to believe.....not with rose colored glasses, but I will believe.  If not, why would anyone continue to be a fan?

 

 

 

 

[SoCal Deek]

2 minutes ago, elijah said:

The defensive line started the year off phenomenally until Von’s injury, after a disappointing playoff loss last year Beane knew what he needed to address and he did so. It’s unfortunate that Von got injured at the same time that Rousseau and Oliver seemed to hit a regressive stretch, but he sought out to address the defensive line last year and without injury he would have done so successfully. Has he missed on Boogie and Epenesa? Yeah, he has. Tell me a GM that hits at 100% and I’ll show you how you’re wrong. Tell me a GM that hits at a rate higher than Beane and I’ll argue to my grave that Beane is better than almost every other GM in the league. 

 

The issue this offseason is the offensive line and wide receiver. Beane has earned my trust and confidence that he will set out to address the offensive line this offseason and he will do so. Might he draft a third round pick that turns into a bust in the process? Yeah, he might. It’s the NFL, it happens. But where he’s earned my faith is that he’ll over address it to the point that if he does draft a bust, there will be so many other additions on the line made that overall it will still display vastly improved play. 

 

My only issue with Beane thus far was the decision to go into the season with Gabe Davis as your WR2. It was short sighted and ignorant at the time, and it only looks worse after the season. Drafting a cornerback in the first round when you already had 3 All-Pro’s in your secondary, for a coach that has shown an ability to specialize in secondary development and get maximum contributions out of his players just made no sense then, and makes even less sense in hindsight after he split snaps with Benford and Jackson all season. 

 

We need to step back as fans, take a deep breath and evaluate organization as a whole IN COMPARISON to the rest of the league. Very few times are doing it better than our front office and coaching staff right, and I might argue that with this consistency and longevity it may only be the Chiefs (and maybe the 49ers) doing it better. If you want to nitpick, then do just that, nitpick away. But leave it at that, it’s just nitpicking.

 

The fire everybody, we’re never going to see success crowd and hot takes are out of control right now. We’ve turned into a spoiled fan base losing sight of what we have in front of us. From top to bottom, front office, coaching staff, roster talent, structure and etc, we are a top 5 organization in the NFL and we will be a top 5 organization in the NFL for years to come. Unfortunately we’re not the Chiefs, but when you’re a top 5 organization in the NFL for a decade plus, that level of consistency is going to get you a Lombardi, and maybe a few of them if luck strikes the right way. 

The HUGE mistake was drafting Basham. Not sure what they were thinking there but I knew it when the name was called. Another defensive lineman? That mistake became more apparent when they then felt they had to also go get Von Miller. At some point you have to draft offensive lineman. 

[IndyMark]

4 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

The HUGE mistake was drafting Basham. Not sure what they were thinking there but I knew it when the name was called. Another defensive lineman? That mistake became more apparent when they then felt they had to also go get Von Miller. At some point you have to draft offensive lineman. 

 

^^^ This.  Hard to argue here.  Yet, that ship has sailed, the question remains how to correct it?  Trade Oliver either for a OL in the same boat as him or for draft capital and use that for the OL.

 

Time for Beane to correct the mistakes.  No reason not to try.

[JROC INTEL]

I think it’s possible with these coaches, but a lot less likely. I was all for keeping all the coaches, because I believe in learning and growth along with stability. But this year has shown that maybe there is a cap to the ability to learn. I see a lot of the same mistakes over and over. Example: tossing a 30 yard pass on 3rd and 2. This is bad coaching. Hardly using any trick plays. This is coaching. 
 

i still think we have one of the best teams in the NFL but most of it is because of Josh. 
 

I believe we need a more physical team over coaching though, specifically linemen. At the end of the days, the players didn’t play well enough. 
 

the loss is on everyone. It was hard to watch, but we are still close, the mentality needs to be to get back to work and take the extra step. Get in the weight room. 

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, IndyMark said:

 

^^^ This.  Hard to argue here.  Yet, that ship has sailed, the question remains how to correct it?  Trade Oliver either for a OL in the same boat as him or for draft capital and use that for the OL.

 

Time for Beane to correct the mistakes.  No reason not to try.

Beane and McD need to stop reading the press clippings. This team is not the best team in the league. They need to get back to work with this year’s draft. There’s a lot to be done. To me, it starts with the offensive line. If they don’t fix that, everything else is fool’s gold. Protect Josh Allen in the passing game and improve the running game to take pressure off Allen. If he goes down with an injury…it’s over! 

[Chaos]

18 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

while I trust these fellas to create a winning culture

Are you sure its the "winning culture" and not simply having Josh Allen as the QB?  Pretty much every team in the NFL would expect to make the playoffs every year with Allen as their QB. 

[Dr. Who]

Just now, Chaos said:

Are you sure its the "winning culture" and not simply having Josh Allen as the QB?  Pretty much every team in the NFL would expect to make the playoffs every year with Allen as their QB. 

Well, I'm not really referring to wins and losses with that phrase. Quite a few media folks have commented on the quality of the Bills' staff and the environment they have built. Before McD was hired, the franchise was in disarray and did not have a good reputation league wide. I think that has changed. While there are real issues with the current regime, I don't think it is right not to give them credit for the genuine achievements. (I've already indicated I doubt it is enough just as it is to win championships.)

[Chaos]

5 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

Well, I'm not really referring to wins and losses with that phrase. Quite a few media folks have commented on the quality of the Bills' staff and the environment they have built. Before McD was hired, the franchise was in disarray and did not have a good reputation league wide. I think that has changed. While there are real issues with the current regime, I don't think it is right not to give them credit for the genuine achievements. (I've already indicated I doubt it is enough just as it is to win championships.)

I guess I have a problem with any part of the measuring standard being the crappy Bills coaching staffs from yesteryear.  The standard is the current competition.  

Edited February 4, 2023 by Chaos

[Billsfan1972]

2 hours ago, elijah said:

Check the board for the first time since the Bengals game.. And you’re telling me that so far 70% of people (19-8 in the poll currently) think there’s a better chance that we don’t win a championship under McBeane and Allen? 

 

It was a rough playoff loss and embarrassing coaching, true. 

 

McDermott is still a top 8 coach in the league, true. 

 

Allen is still a top 3 quarterback in the league, true. 

 

McDermott & Allen are still a top 5 QB/Coach combo in the league, true. 

 

The first statement can be true at the same time as the next three. It’s unfortunate the way we lost, and it was outright embarrassing for the organization and the city & fans that invest their lives into this team for 5-6 months of the year, and others that do year round. But the amount of criticism I’ve seen surrounding Allen/McBeane since this loss is borderline unfathomable. Confidence and faith should still be very high that these guys bring us atleast 1 Lombardi, if not more.

 

I was having the same meltdown the day after the game, and maybe even a couple after that. But come on, it’s 2 weeks later. Level yourselves. The Bills are still in a very elite class of the NFL and have turned into a model organization. It’ll come. 

 

And on that note, I guess I’ll have to keep TBD out of my search bar a little longer if this is still the direction conversations are trending 😭 

Not sure McD is top 8.  I however think with Allen, more protection from the line and one more receiving weapon they certainly can win.

 

I too agree all the moping that Cincy & KC are "so much" better and that the Bills are now a notch below with a Jackson led Ravens, LA and Miami, NYJ and Peyton led Broncos.....  is wrong.  

 

Better coaching & scheming is needed from McD and his staff.

Edited February 4, 2023 by Billsfan1972

[Dr. Who]

8 minutes ago, Chaos said:

I guess I have a problem with any part of the measuring standard being the crappy Bills coaching staffs from yesteryear.  The standard is the current competition.  

That's fine. My guess is the BIlls organization is respected league wide relative to the rest of the NFL. I don't see McD as mediocre altogether. If you think he's the equvalent of JAG who just got lucky with Josh Allen, that is the lowest evaluation. I don't think that is accurate, but you can make that argument. I surmise the Pegulas value the character and style of leadership McD maintains on a day-to-day basis. All that is laudible, imo, but it doesn't justify keeping the status quo when the game day results for the post-season are largely disappointing. 

 

Edited February 4, 2023 by Dr. Who

[Freddie's Dead]

 

[Chaos]

55 minutes ago, elijah said:

And you’re telling me that so far 70% of people (19-8 in the poll currently) think there’s a better chance that we don’t win a championship under McBeane and Allen? 

Its more like do we have a Reeves/Elway situation of wasting nine years of a great QB, before getting Mike Shanahan and relatively promptly win a couple of Super Bowl?

[LABILLBACKER]

McDermott runs the whole show. He selected Beane, Frazier and Dorsey. The defensive scheme that has failed this team in 4 straight playoffs is his. Yes he's a man of high character,  culture and process. But beyond that his actual coaching skills leave alot to be desired. I realize why a small percentage of fans are terrified to return to a drought scenario if he is replaced.  But I'm 100x more terrified we'll waste the talents of the greatest qb Buffalo will ever see by keeping him and his failed associates around. But if your happy and content with winning regular season games then he's your Schottenheimer type leader. What's the point of competing if you don't strive for a championship. 

[Billznut]

5 minutes ago, Chaos said:

Its more like do we have a Reeves/Elway situation of wasting nine years of a great QB, before getting Mike Shanahan and relatively promptly win a couple of Super Bowl?

This may actually go down as an accurate analogy. 

[LABILLBACKER]

5 minutes ago, Billznut said:

This may actually go down as an accurate analogy. 

It is accurate and until we hire a dynamic offensive minded HC, it will be rinse & repeat every year.

[Ramza86]

I think we are 3 really good offensive lineman and one great slot WR away from really contending next season.

[US Egg]

Took Elway awhile to show he could win it all.

 

This hurrying Josh nonsense is just silliness.

[Dr. Who]

Just now, LABILLBACKER said:

McDermott runs the whole show. He selected Beane, Frazier and Dorsey. The defensive scheme that has failed this team in 4 straight playoffs is his. Yes he's a man of high character,  culture and process. But beyond that his actual coaching skills leave alot to be desired. I realize why a small percentage of fans are terrified to return to a drought scenario if he is replaced.  But I'm 100x more terrified we'll waste the talents of the greatest qb Buffalo will ever see by keeping him and his failed associates around. But if your happy and content with winning regular season games then he's your Schottenheimer type leader. What's the point of competing if you don't strive for a championship. 

I share the concern. Because I admire McDermott as a person and he is currently the coach of the Buffalo Bills, I hope he exceeds what appear to be his limits. All that said, Terry Pegula should have Ben Johnson on speed dial, because I suspect he is the next hot OC to get a shot at HC.

Just now, Ramza86 said:

I think we are 3 really good offensive lineman and one great slot WR away from really contending next season.

How confident are you Beane can pull off that requirement? That's the correct Rx, I agree.

[Chaos]

Just now, I am the egg man said:

Took Elway awhile to show he could win it all.

 

This hurrying Josh nonsense is just silliness.

You do understand Elway needed a HC change before he won it all? Or don't you know things?