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Deshaun Watson admits under oath that Ashley Solis cried at the end of the massage


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1 hour ago, maddenboy said:

i think it depends on their assessment of whether the locker room would prefer Jacoby Brissett or Mayfield.

 

there's probably a lot of players who genuinely would support whichever gives the best chance to win.  Given those 2 choices. 

 

Players know the browns are not winning the superbowl.  but lots probably have contract incentives.  or wanna put out the best tape possible, so they can gtfo as fast as possible.   Or be on a winning team so that being on a winner boosts that player's Brand that he's building.  or whatever.  Even defensive players know that their stats get better as the offense performs better.   etc. etc.

 

If its jacoby, it will probably be a valid read by the players that he really is better as a player for the team.  because faced with a head (mayfield) vs heart (anybody but Mayfield), i think mayfield wins.  in a close one.

The goal of every NFL team should be to be trying to win the Super Bowl every year if you’re doing anything other than that then you’re just existing I’m sure the Browns fans are gonna be OK with that

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I could not imagine what it feels like to be a Browns fan.  The chaos this decision has brought to the organization is really unchartered territory.    I know its easy to sit here as a third party and say, if it was my team I would, ....  Gawd what a fiasco to unleash on your fans.

 

And then for the NFL too...  One guy and his proclivities is just roiling the league.. 

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2 hours ago, wjag said:

I could not imagine what it feels like to be a Browns fan.  The chaos this decision has brought to the organization is really unchartered territory.    I know its easy to sit here as a third party and say, if it was my team I would, ....  Gawd what a fiasco to unleash on your fans.

 

And then for the NFL too...  One guy and his proclivities is just roiling the league.. 

 

 

No worse on the fanbase than hiring Dick Jauron or Chan Gailey was on Bills fans while simultaneously playing QB's like Losman, Edwards and Fitz.    Both situations were basically a 3 year guarantee of failure to anyone who knew how bad those coaches had been at their prior jobs.    I think we have a tendency to downplay the dumpster fires here and exaggerate them elsewhere.   Football will go on in Cleveland.   Maybe being the focal point of the hate of media and opposing fans will galvanize the fanbase like being a laughingstock did for Bills fans.

 

 

Edited by BADOLBILZ
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10 hours ago, maddenboy said:

i actually think the seahawks makes too much sense to not happen.

 

But i'm still stuck at "if the browns trade him at all."

 

And for the record:  i like baker mayfield and think he is underrated, but just a little bit.  And i think Watson is overrated a bit, but i love his game and his ceiling as a player is high. 

 

They should get what they can for him, while they can.  At the end of the year he's an UFA and the best they'll get is a comp late 3rd rounder in 2024.

 

And I think Mayfield is a guy you can win with but he's just a slightly above-average QB.  He's been given a lot to work with with middling results.  As for Watson, it will be interesting to see him away from BoB's offense and outdoors.

 

2 hours ago, wjag said:

I could not imagine what it feels like to be a Browns fan.  The chaos this decision has brought to the organization is really unchartered territory.    I know its easy to sit here as a third party and say, if it was my team I would, ....  Gawd what a fiasco to unleash on your fans.

 

And then for the NFL too...  One guy and his proclivities is just roiling the league.. 

 

I work with a CRNA who is a Browns fan and he's upset they traded for him.  I told him to start rooting for the Bills.  But I'm sure if they start winning with him after his suspension, things will be forgiven in time.

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4 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

The goal of every NFL team should be to be trying to win the Super Bowl every year if you’re doing anything other than that then you’re just existing I’m sure the Browns fans are gonna be OK with that

That is the goal for the team (from an organization stance).  As a fan, having Watson being the face of your franchise is likely going to be a tough pill to swallow for even the most committed fans.

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30 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

No worse on the fanbase than hiring Dick Jauron or Chan Gailey was on Bills fans while simultaneously playing QB's like Losman, Edwards and Fitz.    Both situations were basically a 3 year guarantee of failure to anyone who knew how bad those coaches had been at their prior jobs.    I think we have a tendency to downplay the dumpster fires here and exaggerate them elsewhere.   Football will go on in Cleveland.   Maybe being the focal point of the hate of media and opposing fans will galvanize the fanbase like being a laughingstock did for Bills fans.

 

 

I think that hiring Levy as GM was much worse than the Gailey hiring.

 

I will even go out on a limb and say that Rex was worse than Gailey. 

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Just now, Bill from NYC said:

I think that hiring Levy as GM was much worse than the Gailey hiring.

 

I will even go out on a limb and say that Rex was worse than Gailey. 

 

The drought was absolutely brutal.......people who downplay it are full of sh*t.

 

And I'm certainly not here to defend DeShaun Watson,  I hope he gets banned for a long time,  but there is hypocrisy from any Bills fan who thinks Browns fans should feel compelled to quit their team while the Bills still honor OJ Simpson with his name on the Wall.    The double standard is strong.

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5 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

And I'm certainly not here to defend DeShaun Watson,  I hope he gets banned for a long time,  but there is hypocrisy from any Bills fan who thinks Browns fans should feel compelled to quit their team while the Bills still honor OJ Simpson with his name on the Wall.    The double standard is strong.

 

I could not agree more.

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40 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

No worse on the fanbase than hiring Dick Jauron or Chan Gailey was on Bills fans while simultaneously playing QB's like Losman, Edwards and Fitz.    Both situations were basically a 3 year guarantee of failure to anyone who knew how bad those coaches had been at their prior jobs.    I think we have a tendency to downplay the dumpster fires here and exaggerate them elsewhere.   Football will go on in Cleveland.   Maybe being the focal point of the hate of media and opposing fans will galvanize the fanbase like being a laughingstock did for Bills fans.

 

 

You really nailed it here.  Struggling to find a franchise QB is something no franchise has ever faced other than the Bills.  It’s so easy for every other team.  Well except maybe the Bears.  Or fish.  Or almost every team in the league at some point in their history.

 

And hiring a coach is usually simple as well.  Most coaches instantly turn into Vince Lombardi.  We should have hired an up and comer like Adam Gase but no blue chip hire like that wanted anything to do with Buffalo.

 

Other than that though you’re right, the Bills handled things exactly like the Browns.  Well, other than knowingly giving an unprecedented  guarantee of a massive contract to a guy with 20+ unresolved and highly publicized allegations of sexual coercion, assault and impropriety.  Oh, and alienating your recent first overall pick so to crush any trade value he may have had.  
 

Other than that and the fact that one is happening now and the other happened 10 years ago the similarities to Trent Edwards are eerie.  Maybe “Erie” given the franchise locations.  I just can’t understand why this topic is being discussed instead of Jauron’s conservative play calling.  It’s like we’re all delusional.

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17 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

The drought was absolutely brutal.......people who downplay it are full of sh*t.

 

And I'm certainly not here to defend DeShaun Watson,  I hope he gets banned for a long time,  but there is hypocrisy from any Bills fan who thinks Browns fans should feel compelled to quit their team while the Bills still honor OJ Simpson with his name on the Wall.    The double standard is strong.

Is anyone actually "honoring" OJ that is a fan?  I couldn't care less if his name is on the wall or not.  That's the organization honoring him.  Same way the Browns organization is paying Watson.

 

It's a bit of a different perspective as a fan from "OJ's name is still on the wall" vs "they paid Watson 230m while Watson was still under investigation and is supposed to be our franchise qb for the next whatever amount of years"

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57 minutes ago, The Wiz said:

Is anyone actually "honoring" OJ that is a fan?  I couldn't care less if his name is on the wall or not.  That's the organization honoring him.  Same way the Browns organization is paying Watson.

 

It's a bit of a different perspective as a fan from "OJ's name is still on the wall" vs "they paid Watson 230m while Watson was still under investigation and is supposed to be our franchise qb for the next whatever amount of years"

 

 

Browns fans can make the same argument about not honoring Watson.    We root for our laundry,  he's just one of a group of around 100 people in the Browns organization after all etc..    And then there is the argument about separating the player from the person.   The money aspect isn't very compelling as long as the player eventually produces.  Lotta' ways to justify a blind eye.   Show me a fan base that doesn't do this and I will show you a group that doesn't care as much about their team as Buffalo and Cleveland do.

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19 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Browns fans can make the same argument about not honoring Watson.    We root for our laundry,  he's just one of a group of around 100 people in the Browns organization after all etc..    And then there is the argument about separating the player from the person.   The money aspect isn't very compelling as long as the player eventually produces.  Lotta' ways to justify a blind eye.   Show me a fan base that doesn't do this and I will show you a group that doesn't care as much about their team as Buffalo and Cleveland do.

Again, how are we rooting for our laundry when his name went on the wall in 1980? Should he be taken out of the hall of fame as well?

 

I don't see too many "Simpson" jerseys when I go to games so not sure we are still rooting for the guy because his name is on the wall. 

 

Also talking about something that took place almost 2 decades after his last game vs an active player makes it very different. 

 

Had it been when OJ was a player still, I'm sure there would be plenty of fans up in arms about him being on the team. 

 

We turn on players for saying ranch is better than blue cheese.   

People got made at lynch for his hit and run on chippewa, Dareus for his drag racing, Henry for his 87 kids, Beasley with his social media, etc.

 

None of the fans turn a blind eye to it because "well, he might help us win so he gets a pass".

 

And the people that give them a pass because of that need to reevaluate their lives if winning a championship is more important than being a decent human being. 

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5 minutes ago, The Wiz said:

Again, how are we rooting for our laundry when his name went on the wall in 1980? Should he be taken out of the hall of fame as well?

 

I don't see too many "Simpson" jerseys when I go to games so not sure we are still rooting for the guy because his name is on the wall. 

 

Also talking about something that took place almost 2 decades after his last game vs an active player makes it very different. 

 

Had it been when OJ was a player still, I'm sure there would be plenty of fans up in arms about him being on the team. 

 

We turn on players for saying ranch is better than blue cheese.   

People got made at lynch for his hit and run on chippewa, Dareus for his drag racing, Henry for his 87 kids, Beasley with his social media, etc.

 

None of the fans turn a blind eye to it because "well, he might help us win so he gets a pass".

 

And the people that give them a pass because of that need to reevaluate their lives if winning a championship is more important than being a decent human being. 

 

Oh so you think that if OJ were accused of murdering two people WHILE HE WAS STILL PLAYING  "plenty of fans would have been up in arms about him being on the team"?

 

Thanks for giving me the benefit of the doubt on that. :rolleyes:

 

It's really hard to have a discussion when you don't see the vast distinction between slaughtering a couple human beings and paying women to get them into compromising circumstances and hopefully perform certain sexual acts with you.     Even if the creep did it 50 times.   Using premeditated tactics to get women to have sex with them when they might otherwise have not planned to is probably how half of the people on TSW were conceived.    Some of you I'm absolutely CERTAIN that was the case.  

 

It's creepy and increasingly punishable behavior but whether people want to admit it or not the bridge between there and what Watson did is much closer than the one between Watson and a double murderer.   Which is ultimately why Watson's deal went right to civil.     

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3 hours ago, The Wiz said:

Is anyone actually "honoring" OJ that is a fan?  I couldn't care less if his name is on the wall or not.  That's the organization honoring him.  Same way the Browns organization is paying Watson.

 

It's a bit of a different perspective as a fan from "OJ's name is still on the wall" vs "they paid Watson 230m while Watson was still under investigation and is supposed to be our franchise qb for the next whatever amount of years"

 

No, no one is "honoring" OJ or even rooting for him.  And he hasn't played in decades now.

 

The Browns OTOH gave up significant assets to get Watson, and compounded it by giving him a fully guaranteed contract so that he would choose them when it was reported that they were out of the running.  Meaning they can't cut him no matter how poorly he plays and are tied to him until the end of the 2026 season.  Then on top of that, he won't be playing this year and maybe longer.

 

What is there possibly to be upset over...

Edited by Doc
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1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Oh so you think that if OJ were accused of murdering two people WHILE HE WAS STILL PLAYING  "plenty of fans would have been up in arms about him being on the team"?

 

Thanks for giving me the benefit of the doubt on that. :rolleyes:

 

It's really hard to have a discussion when you don't see the vast distinction between slaughtering a couple human beings and paying women to get them into compromising circumstances and hopefully perform certain sexual acts with you.     Even if the creep did it 50 times.   Using premeditated tactics to get women to have sex with them when they might otherwise have not planned to is probably how half of the people on TSW were conceived.    Some of you I'm absolutely CERTAIN that was the case.  

 

It's creepy and increasingly punishable behavior but whether people want to admit it or not the bridge between there and what Watson did is much closer than the one between Watson and a double murderer.   Which is ultimately why Watson's deal went right to civil.     

I see the distinction very well. And OJ was tried for it and found innocent.  Does that change how myself or anyone else feel about it or think what happened, no.

 

But somehow that is your point of what he did,  he should be shunned by Bills fans?

 

Guess what, he is. No one is saying he's a great guy. No one is defending him. After all that came to light most Bills fans wrote him off.   I know I did. 

 

Where is ray lewis or Aaron hernandez in this conversation about players killing people?

 

 

And your description of Watson sounds like a guy in a white tinted van with "free candy" spray painted on the side of it.   So I should look at him like a pedophile then?

Edited by The Wiz
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1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

Using premeditated tactics to get women to have sex with them when they might otherwise have not planned to is probably how half of the people on TSW were conceived.

I feel like this kind of lumps what he did in with things that are far less problematic, that or you seem to think some pretty ***** up things are normal behavior.

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6 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

I feel like this kind of lumps what he did in with things that are far less problematic, that or you seem to think some pretty ***** up things are normal behavior.

 

It's him trolling.  Like usual.

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14 minutes ago, The Wiz said:

And your description of Watson sounds like a guy in a white tinted van with "free candy" spray painted on the side of it.   So I should look at him like a pedophile then?

 

What kinda candy we talkin', here?  If you got Mallo Cups, I'm getting in the van.

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