MJS Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 2 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said: No this is exactly what I wrote, "Can you cite ONE NFL game that an over the top Field goal was so close that it might have decided the game? " You supplied one, the Belichek one, the other you posted was a game by 4 and a game by 14, one wasnt even the NFL but neither was material to the outcome of the game. Just like the Bills=-Jets game...meaningless. But why does that matter? Getting plays right is important, whether it is a blowout or not. They need to be more accurate and less arbitrary in most aspects of the game, and technology is available and ready to be implemented but they choose not too, instead opting for a bunch of old guys making judgement calls. Just now, NewEra said: Yeah.... this is terrible and would love to hear what the man in charge of all-22 has to say about this. But we know there’s no chance of that happening Haha, and we aren't supposed to notice that the score doesn't change even thought you watch the ball go through the uprights? It's pretty crazy and needs some explanation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 People really over here arguing it doesn't matter if points are taken off the board because of referee error because "It doesn't happen often" or "It usually doesn't matter." What the heck. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyBatty is alive Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Just now, MJS said: But why does that matter? Getting plays right is important, whether it is a blowout or not. They need to be more accurate and less arbitrary in most aspects of the game, and technology is available and ready to be implemented but they choose not too, instead opting for a bunch of old guys making judgement calls. You want the NFL or football go go "all technology", good for you, I dont. I have already cited the fiasco the NFL has made about what a catch is. And what happens if technology malfunctions and gets the call wrong? Yeah good luck trying to solve that. My money is the Pats will learn a creative way to trick the fool proof technology. give them time and study. Football is a game of judgement officiated and run by people, seeking perfections if not attainable IMO. Would i like perfection, sure if the cost/time/hassle are not excessive. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherlock Holmes Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 38 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said: Our Super Bowl wide right had zero to do with the goal; post. Can you cite ONE NFL game that an over the top Field goal was so close that it might have decided the game? I will wait. Obviously not, but you can't deny what happened in our game and say "well when was a game decided by an over the top FG"... What if we were losing by 3 or less points, would you not lose your ****ing mind?!?!?!?! Like law, it sets a precedent and I don't like the ****ing precedent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 7 minutes ago, MJS said: But why does that matter? Getting plays right is important, whether it is a blowout or not. They need to be more accurate and less arbitrary in most aspects of the game, and technology is available and ready to be implemented but they choose not too, instead opting for a bunch of old guys making judgement calls. Haha, and we aren't supposed to notice that the score doesn't change even thought you watch the ball go through the uprights? It's pretty crazy and needs some explanation. And really frustrating that we know there’s zero chance that we ever hear an explanation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 6 minutes ago, NewEra said: Yeah.... this is terrible and would love to hear what the man in charge of all-22 has to say about this. But we know there’s no chance of that happening It probably would be "it's above my pay grade." As I said earlier, they wouldn't want to admit the refs screwed-up. That's one way to do it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyBatty is alive Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Just now, Sherlock Holmes said: Obviously not, but you can't deny what happened in our game and say "well when was a game decided by an over the top FG"... What if we were losing by 3 or less points, would you not lose your ****ing mind?!?!?!?! Like law, it sets a precedent and I don't like the ****ing precedent Actually i can deny it and if we lost be 3 points I wouldn't debate it ad nauseam as we are here with this otherwise meaningless points, i would have moved on, its a judgement call, sometimes they go against you, deal with it. Only "precedent" it could possibly set is if the official made a demonstrably wrong call which, imo, i stil havent seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 (edited) 11 minutes ago, whatdrought said: People really over here arguing it doesn't matter if points are taken off the board because of referee error because "It doesn't happen often" or "It usually doesn't matter." What the heck. In which one of these instances were points taken off the board due to referee errors? People are actually arguing that because some fans were disappointed at the outcome of close calls that the referees must have been in error. Edited September 17, 2020 by Jauronimo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 3 minutes ago, Jauronimo said: In which one of these instances were points taken off the board due to referee errors? People are actually arguing that because some fans were disappointed at the outcome of close calls that the referees must have been in error. Do you not think the Bills kick was good? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 I sent an email. Complete waste of time I’m sure, but it could be comedy gold 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Just now, whatdrought said: Do you not think the Bills kick was good? No. The guys with the best view ruled it no good and there is no video evidence available to definitively prove otherwise. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Just now, Jauronimo said: No. The guys with the best view ruled it no good and there is no video evidence available to definitively prove otherwise. Mmkay. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecmic82 Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Just now, Jauronimo said: No. The guys with the best view ruled it no good and there is no video evidence available to definitively prove otherwise. What if there were definitive video evidence to prove otherwise? Would you want the refs to look at it? Would you find a passing interest in viewing it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Just now, whatdrought said: Mmkay. Prove it was good, mmmkay. Just now, Ecmic82 said: What if there were definitive video evidence to prove otherwise? Would you want the refs to look at it? Would you find a passing interest in viewing it? Sure, please share it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Joshin' Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 3 minutes ago, Jauronimo said: No. The guys with the best view ruled it no good and there is no video evidence available to definitively prove otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 5 minutes ago, whatdrought said: Do you not think the Bills kick was good? No need to ask. The NFL just admitted it was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 1 minute ago, Just Joshin' said: What does that prove? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecmic82 Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Jauronimo said: Prove it was good, mmmkay. Sure, please share it. That’s the point here I think. A lot of people would like a simple tech fix to confirm these close calls. They’d be interested in such video, they’d be interested in refs having access to it, and they’d be interested in viewing it themselves, as you are. Edited September 17, 2020 by Ecmic82 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Joshin' Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 1 minute ago, Jauronimo said: What does that prove? Watch it.....seemed like good to me. Of course, you will see it otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YattaOkasan Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 20 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said: You want the NFL or football go go "all technology", good for you, I dont. I have already cited the fiasco the NFL has made about what a catch is. And what happens if technology malfunctions and gets the call wrong? Yeah good luck trying to solve that. My money is the Pats will learn a creative way to trick the fool proof technology. give them time and study. Football is a game of judgement officiated and run by people, seeking perfections if not attainable IMO. Would i like perfection, sure if the cost/time/hassle are not excessive. The catch rule was not introducing more technology. You bring up a great point about technology failing, but you could review or be left with the current crappy system. I think trying to hack the technology would be super tough and also leave trail so I dont think they would be as successful as you think. They got the call on the field wrong and they could get it right. They should do better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyBatty is alive Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Just now, Jauronimo said: What does that prove? It proves nothing except that someone else thought it was good off the same view everyone has seen...except for the officials perfectly positioned under the goal posts. Thank God we won our the non-stop conspiracy theories would be running rampant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 29 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said: No this is exactly what I wrote, "Can you cite ONE NFL game that an over the top Field goal was so close that it might have decided the game? " You supplied one, the Belichek one, the other you posted was a game by 4 and a game by 14, one wasnt even the NFL but neither was material to the outcome of the game. Just like the Bills=-Jets game...meaningless. My buddy bet $200 on the Over 46. It was +210. It’s meaningless to some, sure. It’s not meaningless to others. When there is betting involved.....which there is....every single game......the league should make more of an effort to get EVERY call correct. There’s no reason not to except if they’re: A: being cheap or B: they just don’t care and they’re lazy. Neither are reasonable answers. Considering the money that the NFL generates they should be able to figure this out. 19 minutes ago, Doc said: It probably would be "it's above my pay grade." As I said earlier, they wouldn't want to admit the refs screwed-up. That's one way to do it. Yup. Only took 2 minutes and I’ve got some free time 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Just now, Ecmic82 said: That’s the point here I think. A lot of people would like a simple tech fix to confirm these close calls. They’d be interested in such video, as you are. The point of this thread is that there is a major problem with field goal officiating in the NFL specifically with good field goals being ruled as misses. The proof is 2 close calls and some crap that happened in the NCAA, 4 or 5 instances in televised football over the past decade none of which is proven to have been an example of a missed call. No one has successfully established there is a real problem with field goal officiating. If you want to talk about using tech to address non-issues in the game, be my guest but that isn't the premise of this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rochesterfan Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 3 minutes ago, Just Joshin' said: Watch it.....seemed like good to me. Of course, you will see it otherwise. you really can’t tell at what point it gets to the upright. It looks like it sails right over the upright to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 10 minutes ago, Doc said: No need to ask. The NFL just admitted it was. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 3 minutes ago, Just Joshin' said: Watch it.....seemed like good to me. Of course, you will see it otherwise. I've watched it many times. Looks like a close call and one that was left up to referee judgement due to an errant kick. I do not see proof of a grievous mistake or anything necessitating a call to arms like the OP demands. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecmic82 Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 1 minute ago, Jauronimo said: The point of this thread is that there is a major problem with field goal officiating in the NFL specifically with good field goals being ruled as misses. The proof is 2 close calls and some crap that happened in the NCAA, 4 or 5 instances in televised football over the past decade none of which is proven to have been an example of a missed call. No one has successfully established there is a real problem with field goal officiating. If you want to talk about using tech to address non-issues in the game, be my guest but that isn't the premise of this thread. Nope. I see very little argument here that the NFL has a “major” problem with calling field goals. I’m calling bull**** on that strawman framing. What I see are people calling for an easy fix to what could potentially be an issue in the future, and what has undoubtedly been an issue in the past. That’s it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyBatty is alive Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 1 minute ago, YattaOkasan said: The catch rule was not introducing more technology. You bring up a great point about technology failing, but you could review or be left with the current crappy system. I think trying to hack the technology would be super tough and also leave trail so I dont think they would be as successful as you think. They got the call on the field wrong and they could get it right. They should do better. The catch rule absolutely introduced/involves technology..... multiple slow motion high fidelity cameras and replays emerged. Hack technology on the NFL, sure it already hasn't happened? I do think the probably pats screwed around for years with the QB-HC communication as well as the other teams telecom. No you THINK or want the call on the field to be the wrong call, you don't know for a fact...if you think you do there is no point in further debate. 7 minutes ago, NewEra said: My buddy bet $200 on the Over 46. It was +210. It’s meaningless to some, sure. It’s not meaningless to others. When there is betting involved.....which there is....every single game......the league should make more of an effort to get EVERY call correct. There’s no reason not to except if they’re: A: being cheap or B: they just don’t care and they’re lazy. Neither are reasonable answers. Considering the money that the NFL generates they should be able to figure this out. Yup. Only took 2 minutes and I’ve got some free time Ah hah, maybe the ref under the field goal; post bet the under! Start a thread on that see what kind of traction it gets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Just now, whatdrought said: ? They essentially admitted that Bass made the FG by screwing with the all-22 footage. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YattaOkasan Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 1 minute ago, RoyBatty is alive said: The catch rule absolutely introduced/involves technology..... multiple slow motion high fidelity cameras and replays emerged. Hack technology on the NFL, sure it already hasn't happened? I do think the probably pats screwed around for years with the QB-HC communication as well as the other teams telecom. No you THINK or want the call on the field to be the wrong call, you don't know for a fact...if you think you do there is no point in further debate. At the end of the day it was still a judgement call. Ball position relative to time is not a judgement call. I think the onus is on you to show that hacking has happened. Fine I don't know that Bass's kick was good. This same tech could easily be applied to spotting the ball which we all agree is a problem. There is no reason to not know where the ball is exactly at any specific time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Just now, Doc said: They essentially admitted that Bass made the FG by screwing with the all-22 footage. Ah, I thought you meant they publicly admitted it... The all 22 thing is weird, but not specifically proof. The proof is in the view that everyone (minus two posters) here and the announcers and the in house ref for CBS can see. But alas, some people get something in their brain and don't have the intellectual elasticity to change their opinions with the introduction of facts and evidence. In their defense - NFL referees have been so notoriously reliable that they really are above reproach and shouldn't ever be questioned.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 On 9/15/2020 at 3:54 PM, Da webster guy said: I've watched this kick in slow motion and regular speed a dozen times. Two things are clear, the first is that the ball was not above the uprights at all. It was close, but certainly the ref standing UNDER the upright has no clue. Second, this kick was good by several feet, not just a few inches. The NFL using the excuse that balls kicked above the upright are not reviewable is ridiculous, how do you know it was above the upright? There is only one way, from a side view camera even with the top of the goal posts which means either attached to the posts themselves or 40 rows up on the sidelines. The ones in the upper end zones have no angle on this critical piece of information. So many games come down to kicks, I'm shocked that this is just getting brushed under the table. NFL needs to wise up and use the simple technology available to be able to get these calls right. They finally added pylon cams, and even this year they are actually placing cameras on the first down markers (duh). Imagine a superbowl decided by a kick and we aren't even sure if you can challenge it or not? McD should have thrown the challenge flag "coach you can't challenge a ball above the uprights" McD "i'm challenging that it wasn't above the uprights, lets see your replay" uh....um....we just have a camera on the ends of the field and one under the goals posts in the middle so.....you know these cameras are expensive coach. 9 minutes ago, Jauronimo said: The point of this thread is that there is a major problem with field goal officiating in the NFL specifically with good field goals being ruled as misses. The proof is 2 close calls and some crap that happened in the NCAA, 4 or 5 instances in televised football over the past decade none of which is proven to have been an example of a missed call. No one has successfully established there is a real problem with field goal officiating. If you want to talk about using tech to address non-issues in the game, be my guest but that isn't the premise of this thread. It’s clearly mentioned in the OP. It is definitely discussqble. You act like it’s a completely different subject. It is not 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Just now, Ecmic82 said: Nope. I see very little argument here that the NFL has a “major” problem with calling field goals. I’m calling bull**** on that strawman framing. What I see are people calling for an easy fix to what could potentially be an issue in the future, and what has undoubtedly been an issue in the past. That’s it. Did you read the OP? The original title contained the words "Immediate Action". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecmic82 Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Just now, YattaOkasan said: At the end of the day it was still a judgement call. Ball position relative to time is not a judgement call. I think the onus is on you to show that hacking has happened. Fine I don't know that Bass's kick was good. This same tech could easily be applied to spotting the ball which we all agree is a problem. There is no reason to not know where the ball is exactly at any specific time. Yeah, a field goal attempt is MUCH closer to a binary event than are judgement calls that require rules interpretation, like pass interference. Field goals are purely judgement calls because only because we choose them to be. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 2 minutes ago, whatdrought said: Ah, I thought you meant they publicly admitted it... The all 22 thing is weird, but not specifically proof. The proof is in the view that everyone (minus two posters) here and the announcers and the in house ref for CBS can see. But alas, some people get something in their brain and don't have the intellectual elasticity to change their opinions with the introduction of facts and evidence. In their defense - NFL referees have been so notoriously reliable that they really are above reproach and shouldn't ever be questioned.... When you alter footage that should just be left alone, there's a reason behind it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyBatty is alive Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 1 minute ago, YattaOkasan said: At the end of the day it was still a judgement call. Ball position relative to time is not a judgement call. I think the onus is on you to show that hacking has happened. Fine I don't know that Bass's kick was good. This same tech could easily be applied to spotting the ball which we all agree is a problem. There is no reason to not know where the ball is exactly at any specific time. The onus is on me to prove? Read what I wrote, "I do think the probably screwed", note the key words "think' and "probably". If you dont think a multibillion organization with a penchant for cheating in the past is capable of hacking technology, well that is your opinion i wont bother to respond to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecmic82 Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Jauronimo said: Did you read the OP? The original title contained the words "Immediate Action". There’s a ton of things In sport and life that, in some estimation, may call for “immediate action” that aren’t “major” problems 😂. and as a poster above observed, the OP wrote about the need for a tech fix in his post, so unsure why the premise of this thread DOESN’T at least partially involve using tech to solve a problem. Edited September 17, 2020 by Ecmic82 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBilz2500 Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 He still looked shaky on all 4 of his FG attempts and just snuck the 2 he made right inside the upright. He has a strange kicking motion almost like he doesn’t start back far enough. Not impressed at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyBatty is alive Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 8 minutes ago, Doc said: They essentially admitted that Bass made the FG by screwing with the all-22 footage. Did they? The NFL is so freaking stupid that they would doctor highlight reels of a missed field goal so Bills fanatics could cite that as the NFL essentially admitting Bass made the field goal. There is one thing to be a fan, a homer,......another to be, imo, irrational. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YattaOkasan Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 (edited) 4 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said: The onus is on me to prove? Read what I wrote, "I do think the probably screwed", note the key words "think' and "probably". If you dont think a multibillion organization with a penchant for cheating in the past is capable of hacking technology, well that is your opinion i wont bother to respond to. Was gonna reply above, but this is just as good. You said I dont know if the kick is good or not but then casually throw this out there. At least with the kick I have some pretty strong evidence. You have literally nothing to support them hacking the technology. More than happy to not discuss conspiracies. Edited September 17, 2020 by YattaOkasan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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