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Top 20 AFC training camp battles to watch (Bills listed 3 times)

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14 hours ago, MJS said:

AFC training camp battles to watch: Patriots QB, Bills RB, more

 

Gregg Rosenthal - AROUND THE NFL EDITOR

 

https://www.nfl.com/news/afc-training-camp-battles-to-watch-patriots-qb-bills-rb-more

 

6 - Buffalo Bills
CB · Josh Norman vs. Levi Wallace
 
Norman is the heavy favorite here because of his relationship with coach Sean McDermott and his $6 million contract. But he's now 32 years old, deep into his decline phase. McDermott's magic touch with the secondary will be tested.
 
12 - Buffalo Bills
DE · Trent Murphy vs. Mario Addison vs. A.J. Epenesa
 
Buffalo's pass rush was a quiet weakness last season, so general manager Brandon Beane added an old friend from Carolina (Addison) and a high pick (second-rounder Epenesa) to compete for the spot opposite Jerry Hughes. Murphy, an expensive free agent signing in 2018, could wind up anywhere from the starting lineup to off the roster.
 
13 - Buffalo Bills
RB · Devin Singletary vs. Zack Moss
 
Singletary has already proven himself, ranking among the 10 most elusive backs last season (minimum 100 carries), according to PFF. Moss is a similarly slashing runner who, like Singletary, was a third-round pick brought in to share to load and possibly steal goal-line work. Moss will have to prove himself quickly because Singletary is too legit to sit for long.
 
...
 
I'm not sure I agree on the Normon vs Wallace take. I think Wallace is the heavy favorite, especially given that Norman is not going to have the normal preseason to establish himself. The other two I agree with, although I think the plan all along is to have heavy doses of BOTH Singletary and Moss (although Moss will get phased in much like Singletary was behind Gore). I'm more excited about AJ Epenesa than most. I really liked what I saw from the highlights and videos I went back and watched after we drafted him. I hope he gets a lot of playing time.


Moss is a compliment to Motor, not competition.  Addison had 46 sacks in the last 5 years and 9.5 last year so he’s not declining.  Epenesa May start by mid season, but probably not with this year early.  Still not sure on Murphy.  He played well at the end of the year, it’s just a matter of does Beane feel he has enough room to keep him as he’s expensive and we just don’t know how much he wants to save vs. keeping the asset.  Who knows on Norman.  Not having an off-season shouldn’t matter as he knows McD’s defense cold, so if he goes back to the way he performed in Carolina, he’ll win it.  If he continues like in Washington who played him in the wrong scheme, then he won’t make the team.  I know Wallace tried hard last year, but he was the weakness of the secondary.

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22 hours ago, MJS said:

AFC training camp battles to watch: Patriots QB, Bills RB, more

 

Gregg Rosenthal - AROUND THE NFL EDITOR

 

https://www.nfl.com/news/afc-training-camp-battles-to-watch-patriots-qb-bills-rb-more

 

6 - Buffalo Bills
CB · Josh Norman vs. Levi Wallace
 
Norman is the heavy favorite here because of his relationship with coach Sean McDermott and his $6 million contract. But he's now 32 years old, deep into his decline phase. McDermott's magic touch with the secondary will be tested.
 
12 - Buffalo Bills
DE · Trent Murphy vs. Mario Addison vs. A.J. Epenesa
 
Buffalo's pass rush was a quiet weakness last season, so general manager Brandon Beane added an old friend from Carolina (Addison) and a high pick (second-rounder Epenesa) to compete for the spot opposite Jerry Hughes. Murphy, an expensive free agent signing in 2018, could wind up anywhere from the starting lineup to off the roster.
 
13 - Buffalo Bills
RB · Devin Singletary vs. Zack Moss
 
Singletary has already proven himself, ranking among the 10 most elusive backs last season (minimum 100 carries), according to PFF. Moss is a similarly slashing runner who, like Singletary, was a third-round pick brought in to share to load and possibly steal goal-line work. Moss will have to prove himself quickly because Singletary is too legit to sit for long.
 
...
 
I'm not sure I agree on the Normon vs Wallace take. I think Wallace is the heavy favorite, especially given that Norman is not going to have the normal preseason to establish himself. The other two I agree with, although I think the plan all along is to have heavy doses of BOTH Singletary and Moss (although Moss will get phased in much like Singletary was behind Gore). I'm more excited about AJ Epenesa than most. I really liked what I saw from the highlights and videos I went back and watched after we drafted him. I hope he gets a lot of playing time.


I can also see Epenesa being kicked inside on passing downs.  Then you have Addison, Hughes, and Epensa on the D-line with Harrison or whomever else the Bills put there.  

21 hours ago, beavis said:

32 is deep decline?

 

yeah, that didn't make any sense.  Players play well into their 30's.  The fact that Norman may be declining has little to do with being 32. 

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On 7/29/2020 at 4:22 PM, ColeB said:


Yeah, the pass rush was such a quiet weakness that they finished 12th with 44 sacks.

For such an elite D , 3rd yards , 2and in ppg , maybe ?

At any rate , even with Star out , I see the DL as very improved. Addison is as good as Hughes. Oliver should have a great Sophomore year and establish himself as a premiere DT. QJeff can play in or outside and was widely regarded as Sea most consistent DLinemen. Butler and Epenesa should be great depth and Dirty Harry returns. 

 

Expecting the DL as a whole to really ball out

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9 minutes ago, JerseyBills said:

For such an elite D , 3rd yards , 2and in ppg , maybe ?

At any rate , even with Star out , I see the DL as very improved. Addison is as good as Hughes. Oliver should have a great Sophomore year and establish himself as a premiere DT. QJeff can play in or outside and was widely regarded as Sea most consistent DLinemen. Butler and Epenesa should be great depth and Dirty Harry returns. 

 

Expecting the DL as a whole to really ball out

 

Jefferson is an excellent player. He will put perform Addison. Book it. 

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Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Jefferson is an excellent player. He will put perform Addison. Book it. 

I agree QJeff is excellent but I am very high on Addison,  I think he'll be neck and neck with Hughes off the edge. Hopefully both of them have amazing years, I think they will. I'm just a big Addison fan. He's so consistent and little more explosive than QJeff imo.

Can I ask why you feel that way? 

Edited by JerseyBills

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Posted (edited)

Was I the only person who read the following, and nearly barfed at another NFL pundit who knows literally the inverse of anything substantial on the Buffalo Bills?

 

"Moss is a similarly slashing runner"

 

Moss is Thunder. Singletary us lightning. It's not like that's a novel concept, among catch-phrases for NFL RB's... lazy journalism at it's finest.

 

I guess I'll take lazy journalism, though, if it at least highlights the Bills. Can't win them all, right 🙄

Edited by ROCBillsBeliever
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25 minutes ago, JerseyBills said:

I agree QJeff is excellent but I am very high on Addison,  I think he'll be neck and neck with Hughes off the edge. Hopefully both of them have amazing years, I think they will. I'm just a big Addison fan. He's so consistent and little more explosive than QJeff imo.

Can I ask why you feel that way? 

 

Because Addison noticeably declined last year. His sack numbers are a bit of a mirage. His pass rush win rate was way down and his tackles for loss were way down. He got the QB at an almost unprecedented rate compared to his pass rush win percentage and I just don't think that is sustainable. When you really watch the tape you see a guy who is slower and less powerful than at his peak. The chances of him getting home so often when winning so few of his rush attempts in 2020 as he did in 2019 are slim. If you just look at headline numbers Addison's 2019 makes him look as good as ever. The advanced numbers and the tape tell a slightly different story. I think AJ will supplant him by week 8. 

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1 hour ago, ROCBillsBeliever said:

Was I the only person who read the following, and nearly barfed at another NFL pundit who knows literally the inverse of anything substantial on the Buffalo Bills?

 

"Moss is a similarly slashing runner"

 

Moss is Thunder. Singletary us lightning. It's not like that's a novel concept, among catch-phrases for NFL RB's... lazy journalism at it's finest.

 

I guess I'll take lazy journalism, though, if it at least highlights the Bills. Can't win them all, right 🙄

Was going to post this basically, but saying Moss is a hammer not a slasher. 

 

As someone else posted above their styles complement each other. 

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, ROCBillsBeliever said:

Was I the only person who read the following, and nearly barfed at another NFL pundit who knows literally the inverse of anything substantial on the Buffalo Bills?

 

"Moss is a similarly slashing runner"

 

Moss is Thunder. Singletary us lightning. It's not like that's a novel concept, among catch-phrases for NFL RB's... lazy journalism at it's finest.

 

I guess I'll take lazy journalism, though, if it at least highlights the Bills. Can't win them all, right 🙄

I read that too and was a little confused. I thought he was just trying to say that both running backs are capable of "slashing" the defense, that is, to pick up chunks of yards. Even if they go about it in different ways.

 

Or he really doesn't know the difference between the two. But he likely does. The only national people saying good things about Singletary are the ones who actually watched him.

Edited by MJS
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11 hours ago, MJS said:

I read that too and was a little confused. I thought he was just trying to say that both running backs are capable of "slashing" the defense, that is, to pick up chunks of yards. Even if they go about it in different ways.

 

Or he really doesn't know the difference between the two. But he likely does. The only national people saying good things about Singletary are the ones who actually watched him.

 

I guess I could see the former, but I suspect the latter, as it's all too common 🤷‍♂️

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"Addison rushed more than 95% from the right side from 2016 to ’18. Last year, Addison rushed 18% from the left and the rest from the right."

 

 

Highly likely that Addison will be splitting time with Hughes at RE and only rotating in at LE in passing situations.

 

Given the DT depth I've gotta think they saw Jefferson as a LE at the time of his signing (maybe that's changed somewhat with Star opting out).

 

Epenesa/Jefferson at LE

Hughes/Addison at RE

 

Murphy is trade bait.

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On 7/29/2020 at 4:08 PM, MJS said:

AFC training camp battles to watch: Patriots QB, Bills RB, more

 

Gregg Rosenthal - AROUND THE NFL EDITOR

 

https://www.nfl.com/news/afc-training-camp-battles-to-watch-patriots-qb-bills-rb-more

 

6 - Buffalo Bills
CB · Josh Norman vs. Levi Wallace
 
Norman is the heavy favorite here because of his relationship with coach Sean McDermott and his $6 million contract. But he's now 32 years old, deep into his decline phase. McDermott's magic touch with the secondary will be tested.
 
12 - Buffalo Bills
DE · Trent Murphy vs. Mario Addison vs. A.J. Epenesa
 
Buffalo's pass rush was a quiet weakness last season, so general manager Brandon Beane added an old friend from Carolina (Addison) and a high pick (second-rounder Epenesa) to compete for the spot opposite Jerry Hughes. Murphy, an expensive free agent signing in 2018, could wind up anywhere from the starting lineup to off the roster.
 
13 - Buffalo Bills
RB · Devin Singletary vs. Zack Moss
 
Singletary has already proven himself, ranking among the 10 most elusive backs last season (minimum 100 carries), according to PFF. Moss is a similarly slashing runner who, like Singletary, was a third-round pick brought in to share to load and possibly steal goal-line work. Moss will have to prove himself quickly because Singletary is too legit to sit for long.
 
...
 
I'm not sure I agree on the Normon vs Wallace take. I think Wallace is the heavy favorite, especially given that Norman is not going to have the normal preseason to establish himself. The other two I agree with, although I think the plan all along is to have heavy doses of BOTH Singletary and Moss (although Moss will get phased in much like Singletary was behind Gore). I'm more excited about AJ Epenesa than most. I really liked what I saw from the highlights and videos I went back and watched after we drafted him. I hope he gets a lot of playing time.

 

I think the opposite, if Norman is close to the level he was in Carolina, he'll win the job.  I don't view Singletary and Moss as a competition at all, more that they will just compliment eachother.  Could see by late in the year Singletary id nicked up, so start using Moss much more.

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I think the OP missed the first competition.  The CB competition is  between Josh Norman and Gaines.

 

The weak link of the 2019 defense of Wallace/Johnson has been gutted.  The Norman/Gaines winner not only will be better but brings the entire defense to a significantly higher level by making the weakest component a strength.  Both Norman and Gaines have shown they can be excellent in the past, odds are one of the two still has  it.

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I don't see there there is going to be a huge battle between Singletary and Moss.  I think McDermott wants to have a relatively equal split in carries between the two of them.  Yes, the Bills will list one of them as a starter at the beginning of the season, but if they have an equal number of carries, so what?  It will take time during the season to determine if either of them can be relied on to have a greater impact long term, but that is something that will sort itself out when the time comes, and not before.

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22 hours ago, Einstein's Dog said:

I think the OP missed the first competition.  The CB competition is  between Josh Norman and Gaines.

 

The weak link of the 2019 defense of Wallace/Johnson has been gutted.  The Norman/Gaines winner not only will be better but brings the entire defense to a significantly higher level by making the weakest component a strength.  Both Norman and Gaines have shown they can be excellent in the past, odds are one of the two still has  it.

Well I disagree. Wallace is totally in the mix.

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On 7/29/2020 at 4:08 PM, MJS said:

AFC training camp battles to watch: Patriots QB, Bills RB, more

 

Gregg Rosenthal - AROUND THE NFL EDITOR

 

https://www.nfl.com/news/afc-training-camp-battles-to-watch-patriots-qb-bills-rb-more

 

6 - Buffalo Bills
CB · Josh Norman vs. Levi Wallace
 
Norman is the heavy favorite here because of his relationship with coach Sean McDermott and his $6 million contract. But he's now 32 years old, deep into his decline phase. McDermott's magic touch with the secondary will be tested.
 
12 - Buffalo Bills
DE · Trent Murphy vs. Mario Addison vs. A.J. Epenesa
 
Buffalo's pass rush was a quiet weakness last season, so general manager Brandon Beane added an old friend from Carolina (Addison) and a high pick (second-rounder Epenesa) to compete for the spot opposite Jerry Hughes. Murphy, an expensive free agent signing in 2018, could wind up anywhere from the starting lineup to off the roster.
 
13 - Buffalo Bills
RB · Devin Singletary vs. Zack Moss
 
Singletary has already proven himself, ranking among the 10 most elusive backs last season (minimum 100 carries), according to PFF. Moss is a similarly slashing runner who, like Singletary, was a third-round pick brought in to share to load and possibly steal goal-line work. Moss will have to prove himself quickly because Singletary is too legit to sit for long.
 
...
 
I'm not sure I agree on the Normon vs Wallace take. I think Wallace is the heavy favorite, especially given that Norman is not going to have the normal preseason to establish himself. The other two I agree with, although I think the plan all along is to have heavy doses of BOTH Singletary and Moss (although Moss will get phased in much like Singletary was behind Gore). I'm more excited about AJ Epenesa than most. I really liked what I saw from the highlights and videos I went back and watched after we drafted him. I hope he gets a lot of playing time.

 

 

2 of the 3 are not battles....

 

you have RB rotations and you regularly play 3CBs.

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On 7/31/2020 at 5:39 PM, Einstein's Dog said:

I think the OP missed the first competition.  The CB competition is  between Josh Norman and Gaines.

 

The weak link of the 2019 defense of Wallace/Johnson has been gutted.  The Norman/Gaines winner not only will be better but brings the entire defense to a significantly higher level by making the weakest component a strength.  Both Norman and Gaines have shown they can be excellent in the past, odds are one of the two still has  it.

 

Gaines won.  He got to opt out list first.

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5 hours ago, Limeaid said:

 

Gaines won.  He got to opt out list first.

Gaines chickened out.  IMO, there is no competition at this point Norman, starts alongside Tre.  

 

Wallace is a clear drop down in level of depth.  As a  matter of fact, I hope the real competition is for the backup CB spot between Wallace and the newcomer from Seattle.

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