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Buffalo Sabres and NHL: 2019/20: Sabres season officially over. Draft lottery June 26th


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1 hour ago, shrader said:

 

Each of these guys would be replaced by someone making similar money.  Your list combined is going to be right around the average NHL salary.  Those are not the kind of deals that cause cap issues.  The highest on your list is Scandella at $4 million and quite honestly I don't see him as a part of the issue right now.

 

Oh, and I missed Bogosian earlier on the list of bigger contracts at $5.1 million.  That's one that is part of the problem and again, is a Murray contract.

This is where we will disagree. Problem is he has kept same people for all 3 years, has gone backwards..and those are the guys who are holding this team back. Not the Jacks and Skinners of the world, its the "middle class" the Sabres have whiffed on...

1 hour ago, JohnC said:
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The GM has little cap flexibility to make major changes to the roster. He put himself in this position

Agreed?

 

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Last year when you and others were blaming Housley for everything including globing warming

thats kinda funny!!!!

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primary issue with this lackluster team was a lack of talent

and who is responsible for that?

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was to clear cap space in the near future and then bolster the roster

how do you know this? Why not clear the decks this year then? Bills traded guys they did not want here, no matter the impact to record and cap situation , Botteril has kept seemingly every player since he has been here sans ROR and Beuilieu..both doing swimmingly since he has traded them.

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Even those who are in a state of hysteria have to acknowledge that the Sabres will be in much better cap situation to make meaningful deals next year.

Maybe I be missing something, but we will have no ammo for trades correct? So we talking FA? I have not done enough work, maybe some players that will need to offloaded from other teams cause they have bad contracts and cant fit anymore, but those are usually just that, guys on bad contracts. 

 

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For all those in the clamoring chorus screaming for a GM change let me ask you how do you not know that the owner agreed to this rebuilding strategy with the GM he selected? Just as the owner agreed with the rebuilding strategy when he selected McDermott for the Bills.  

So you really think Bots sold the Pegulas he needed to waste 3 years of prime Eichel years to field a competitive team..not championship mind you, just competitive.

 

Be like a new coach coming into the Bills last year and saying i know you spent all this draft capital to draft Allen,and threw 2 years away to make sure you got him(sabres tank), and you have him on a  market inefficient deal, but i need 3 years to put enough people around him to make the playoffs. I know that adds up to 6 wasted years, and no other team needs to do that, but in Buffalo thats whats needed!!

 

No freaking way. Ain't buyin it

 

I agree 100% that maybe this was all not on Housley( dont get me started on Ralph making some of the same mistakes), but then that means the GM stinks too.

 

 

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24 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

 

So you really think Bots sold the Pegulas he needed to waste 3 years of prime Eichel years to field a competitive team..not championship mind you, just competitive.

 

Be like a new coach coming into the Bills last year and saying i know you spent all this draft capital to draft Allen,and threw 2 years away to make sure you got him(sabres tank), and you have him on a  market inefficient deal, but i need 3 years to put enough people around him to make the playoffs. I know that adds up to 6 wasted years, and no other team needs to do that, but in Buffalo thats whats needed!!

 

No freaking way. Ain't buyin it

 

I agree 100% that maybe this was all not on Housley( dont get me started on Ralph making some of the same mistakes), but then that means the GM stinks too.

 

 

I respectfully but strenuously disagree with the gist of what you stated. I believe with a lot of confidence that the owner knew exactly the course that Botts was going to take when he was hired. Just as Pegs knew exactly what the plan was going to be when he hired McDermott to be his HC. McDermott has publicly stated that in his interview for the job he talked mostly about his approach to building a franchise and how he was going to go about doing that. It was as much a conceptual presentation as it was a detailed presentation. You don't think that when the owner was interviewing the candidates for the hockey GM position he asked what the candidates' strategy was to make this competitive team? 

 

I'm confident that the GM is going to make some deals this season using his surplus in defensemen as chips. Will these deals be consequential? Probably not unless a major Risto deal is made that includes additional assets. Next year this team is going to have plenty of cap space to make more substantive deals that will upgrade the roster. Rebuilding the team was never going to be a quick or easy process. I have repeatedly stated this point of view and you have repeatedly dismissed it. If you can't handle this harsh reality then I suggest a Sabre hiatus in order to free yourself from your self-induced state of agitation. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, plenzmd1 said:

This is where we will disagree. Problem is he has kept same people for all 3 years, has gone backwards..and those are the guys who are holding this team back. Not the Jacks and Skinners of the world, its the "middle class" the Sabres have whiffed on...

 

 

So now you've moved the goal posts on me.  First it was those guys causing cap issues, now it's that they are under-performing.

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34 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

So Babcock, who spurned the Sabres for the Leafs just got canned

 

 


Holy crap! Never saw that coming. Players must have revolted. And if that’s the case, the Leafs may have bigger issues than head coach. But, like the old saying goes, you can’t fire the players. 

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2 hours ago, JohnC said:

Paul Hamilton was on WGR's Instigator Show. I thought he gave some good insights about this team's construction and a fair representation of this team. This is a 12 minute segment. 

 

https://wgr550.radio.com/media/audio-channel/11-20-paul-hamilton-instigators

 

So we have the same bums as last year, explains the collapse.

 

What i don't understand as how we have a collection of gutless slugs who have no heart and aren't embarrassed about their effort and wont come out and scratch and claw on every possession!! :angry:

 

 

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43 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

So we have the same bums as last year, explains the collapse.

 

What i don't understand as how we have a collection of gutless slugs who have no heart and aren't embarrassed about their effort and wont come out and scratch and claw on every possession!! :angry:

 

 

Paul Hamilton has often made the point that one of the main deficiencies of this team beyond the lack of talent (obviously) is the manner it is constructed. There are too many perimeter players who refuse or are incapable of going to the net on offense. Two many players couldn't or wouldn't do what was necessary to be infront of the net when shots were taken. The player mix needs to change with more physical players added and less finesse players subtracted. 

 

The issue isn't so much size as it is style of play. Sam Reinhart isn't so much a big guy as he is a tough player who is willing to do what is necessary to position himself around the net and be in a good position to put the rebound in. We need more players who are willing to do what is necessary to score/win. 

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1 minute ago, JohnC said:

Paul Hamilton has often made the point that one of the main deficiencies of this team beyond the lack of talent (obviously) is the manner it is constructed. There are too many perimeter players who refuse or are incapable of going to the net on offense. Two many players couldn't or wouldn't do what was necessary to be infront of the net when shots were taken. The player mix needs to change with more physical players added and less finesse players subtracted. 

 

The issue isn't so much size as it is style of play. Sam Reinhart isn't so much a big guy as he is a tough player who is willing to do what is necessary to position himself around the net and be in a good position to put the rebound in. We need more players who are willing to do what is necessary to score/win. 

 

Anyone not willing to go to the net shdnt be in the league. Just head scratching to me, getting to the net is how you win. Reminds me of basketball were no one is in the paint, kids are getting soft.

 

 

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47 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

Curious  as to how the Sabres would have turned out if he became the Sabres coach instead of going to Toronto?

 

 

If he had to work with the same level of talent that the Sabres had during the past few years he would have not been very successful. Talent prevails. 

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6 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Paul Hamilton has often made the point that one of the main deficiencies of this team beyond the lack of talent (obviously) is the manner it is constructed. There are too many perimeter players who refuse or are incapable of going to the net on offense. Two many players couldn't or wouldn't do what was necessary to be infront of the net when shots were taken. The player mix needs to change with more physical players added and less finesse players subtracted. 

 

The issue isn't so much size as it is style of play. Sam Reinhart isn't so much a big guy as he is a tough player who is willing to do what is necessary to position himself around the net and be in a good position to put the rebound in. We need more players who are willing to do what is necessary to score/win. 

How many of those perimeter players are GMTM holdovers?

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1 minute ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

Anyone not willing to go to the net shdnt be in the league. Just head scratching to me, getting to the net is how you win. Reminds me of basketball were no one is in the paint, kids are getting soft.

 

 

You don't need every player to be able to play in the dirty areas around the net but you do need enough of them on your roster to be effective on offense. There are more dirty goals than pretty goals. Especially from an offensive standpoint this is a poorly constructed roster. 

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Just now, JohnC said:

You don't need every player to be able to play in the dirty areas around the net but you do need enough of them on your roster to be effective on offense. There are more dirty goals than pretty goals. Especially from an offensive standpoint this is a poorly constructed roster. 

 

all the dirty !! :devil:

 

 

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5 minutes ago, GG said:

How many of those perimeter players are GMTM holdovers?

I don't want to only blame TM about the roster composition. Our current GM definitely deserves blame. The Sheary acquisition is the poster child for players whose style of play aren't conducive to playing around the net. When you combine this deficiency with the lack of goal scoring talent who can't convert when opportunities exist then you have an offense that is impotent. 

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Just now, JohnC said:

I don't want to only blame TM about the roster composition. Our current GM definitely deserves blame. The Sheary acquisition is the poster child for players whose style of play aren't conducive to playing around the net. When you combine this deficiency with the lack of goal scoring talent who can't convert when opportunities exist then you have an offense that is impotent. 

He apparently liked Sheary so much, he traded for his clone this season 

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1 hour ago, K-9 said:


Holy crap! Never saw that coming. Players must have revolted. And if that’s the case, the Leafs may have bigger issues than head coach. But, like the old saying goes, you can’t fire the players. 

I think there was an internal power struggle for the past year or so between Dubas and Babcock.  A buddy of mine is a huge Leafs fan thought he wouldn't make it to Xmas.

 

I imagine Shanahan thought moving forward with Dubas was more conducive to longterm success than keeping Babcock aboard. 

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1 hour ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

Lots of botterill hate going on. I dont keep up with hockey but how come we constantly dont have talent after all these years?

 

 

There is plenty of blame to go along with the current and prior regimes. But when you make an accumulation of personnel mistakes in a cap system you weigh the franchise down for an extended period of time. Mistakes made regarding talent, contracts and term reverberate for years. The Okposo contract is very damaging to the franchise not so much because of its cost as it is for its length. 

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1 minute ago, JohnC said:

There is plenty of blame to go along with the current and prior regimes. But when you make an accumulation of personnel mistakes in a cap system you weigh the franchise down for an extended period of time. Mistakes made regarding talent, contracts and term reverberate for years. The Okposo contract is very damaging to the franchise not so much because of its cost as it is for its length. 

 

i hope what you said n your other comments is true in that they have a plan to make this roster right, sick of all this losing !!!

 

 

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44 minutes ago, GG said:

He apparently liked Sheary so much, he traded for his clone this season 

It's all part of the 23.5 year plan.

37 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

i hope what you said n your other comments is true in that they have a plan to make this roster right, sick of all this losing !!!

 

 

Lol he has a plan and the centerpiece is Eichel's future grandson.  Be patient.

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4 hours ago, shrader said:

 

So now you've moved the goal posts on me.  First it was those guys causing cap issues, now it's that they are under-performing.

I don’t think I did.. my point is the cap issues on this team on caused by the guys in the middle not producing, not the guys making 6+. And any cap issue is always caused by people underperforming no?

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59 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

I don’t think I did.. my point is the cap issues on this team on caused by the guys in the middle not producing, not the guys making 6+. And any cap issue is always caused by people underperforming no?


Cap issues are defined completely by dollars. A winning team can have cap issues too. A perfect example is Boston who has no cap space either but is in first place. 

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12 hours ago, stony said:

I think there was an internal power struggle for the past year or so between Dubas and Babcock.  A buddy of mine is a huge Leafs fan thought he wouldn't make it to Xmas.

 

I imagine Shanahan thought moving forward with Dubas was more conducive to longterm success than keeping Babcock aboard. 

Maybe its as simple as the Leafs management has expectations of winning, they weren't wining, so the coach goes.

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2 hours ago, plenzmd1 said:

Maybe its as simple as the Leafs management has expectations of winning, they weren't wining, so the coach goes.

Yeah they weren't winning but the players had tuned out the coach. They stopped playing for him. I have my doubts a new coach will change anything. The Leafs have too many guys with character flaws. 

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14 hours ago, stony said:

I think there was an internal power struggle for the past year or so between Dubas and Babcock.  A buddy of mine is a huge Leafs fan thought he wouldn't make it to Xmas.

 

I imagine Shanahan thought moving forward with Dubas was more conducive to longterm success than keeping Babcock aboard. 

That sounds like what happened from what I’ve read. 

 

I can’t find the article right now (I’ll post it if I do), but I read somewhere that Dubas wanted to fire Babcock last season and Shanahan stepped in to protect him. 

 

It makes sense that Dubas would want a different coach. He’s what, 33 years old?

And he’s as new-school as it gets. Where as Babcock is as old school as it gets, and he’s not exactly known for being super positive (like Dubas). He’s more of a hard ass, grind the players down type of coach. 

 

Lou Lamoriello and Babcock were a perfect match. Dubas and Babcock, not so much. 

 

 

 

 

 

Brenden Shanahan is now all-in with a Dubas. It’ll be interesting to see how it works out. Like him or not, Babcock is known as one of the best coaches in the NHL. I have a lot of respect for how well prepared he (usually) has his teams, and there’s no denying that he came in and changed that culture in Toronto, pretty much day 1. 

 

Babcock also took most of the heat from the media. He said he viewed it as part of his job, and wanted that heat in order to take it off the players. And he Was taking a Lot of heat. Now, that will all fall on the players and a rookie 30-something year old coach and his 30-something year old GM in the biggest, most rabid hockey market in the world. 

 

Theres a lot of hype around Keefe. So maybe be he ends up better than Babcock? 

But I'm not sold yet. 

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20 hours ago, stony said:

I think there was an internal power struggle for the past year or so between Dubas and Babcock.  A buddy of mine is a huge Leafs fan thought he wouldn't make it to Xmas.

 

I imagine Shanahan thought moving forward with Dubas was more conducive to longterm success than keeping Babcock aboard. 

I think it might have been the media threatening the Leafs’ organization after having had to listen to ‘Mumbles’ these past few years.

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Sportsnet's Elliotte Friedman was on WGR's Instigator Show. This is a 20 min. segment. Part of the discussion dealt with the firing of Babcock and the Toronto situation. There was another segment that dealt with potential trade scenarios for Buffalo. The point was made that making a deal is very difficult to do for Botts because he is not in a position of strength and the potential trade partners are aware of that.

  

https://wgr550.radio.com/media/audio-channel/11-21-sportsnets-elliotte-friedman-with-the-instigators

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Hmm, they gotta win one their not supposed right? Little baby bet on em +230, little parley bet them and the Colts 14-1 odds. Both team have to win outright

 

btw, combines bet about 1/3 of a unit for me, so ain’t got a lot of confidence but keeps out the OTB and losing triple that!. 

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I’m actually enjoying the Boston game so far. 

 

Everyone actually looks like they give a crap tonight. Everyone giving an effort again, trying to win their puck battles and they’re back to Playing the style Ralph wants them to play. 

 

I cant take the losses where 2/3rds of the team looks like they don’t care. But if I see an honest effort and they lose because the other team’s more skilled, then fine. I an live with that and continue to root these guys on. But if/when they don’t care, why should I?

 

 

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https://theathletic.com/1398426/2019/11/21/sabres-assistant-don-granato-on-near-death-experience-youve-got-about-5-minutes-and-you-will-not-be-here/?source=shared-article

 

Sabres assistant Don Granato on near-death experience: ‘You’ve got about 5 minutes and you will not be here

 

 

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t was a strep bacteria, not like strep throat, but streptococcus bacteria that they believed was at the heart of Granato’s illness. They ran some blood work and did advanced tests to try and determine the rate of growth of the bacteria.

 

“But there was more going on,” Granato said.

A lot more as it turned out.

 

But at 5 a.m., the team doctor called Granato to ask if he could get back to the hospital. So at 6 a.m., Granato is back at the hospital and now is being admitted as an in-patient. Later that morning things took a dramatic turn for the worse when seemingly out of nowhere Granato began coughing up phlegm and blood.

 

“From there it just accelerated,” Granato said.

 

The bacteria had made its way into Granato’s bloodstream, “and the pneumonia took over my lungs and I basically had respiratory failure later that day,” the 52-year-old said.

 

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They basically had to knock me out and I had no idea this was coming,” he said.

 

“They just kind of came in the room, a whole group of them, and literally the doctor said to me, ‘listen, you’ve got about 5 minutes and you will not be here anymore. We need to do this to you right now.’ I had no time to think about it. Which is a really good thing. I’m sure they did that intentionally.”

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The one thing that Granato insisted on and Krueger agreed was that he wouldn’t rush it and that he would only come back when he was 100 percent ready so there wouldn’t be any distractions. Doctors were aware of this and confirmed that Granato was not in any danger of relapsing and that this appeared to be a one-off, random medical issue.

 

And so it was on Wednesday as the struggling Sabres hit the ice in advance of a trip to Boston that Granato returned to work.

 

Wow! I figured it had to be pretty bad for him to be out this long, but I didn’t know the extent. Sounds like he came very close to dying. 

 

Glad he’s back and feeling better! 

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