Peter King MMQB: 4/2/18.

[MAJBobby]

Just now, 4merper4mer said:

Wahhhhhhhh

 

Yeah it is always good having trash at QB i know. I shouldnt be upset 

[Jamie Nails]

This is the one year that I’m not afraid to trade away next year’s first- we have so much cap space next year, we can paper over it for a season. Just hope we don’t absolutely suck and it’s a top 5 pick 

[clayboy54]

Funny how the argument about "can't miss guys"  always mentions Andrew Luck. Check. He was the #1 can't miss guy. However, he hasn't hit on anything as of yet, and with his shoulder concerns, he's far from what was expected of him. Yet some of the other guys that nobody projected as "can't miss" continue to impress year after year. What this should teach us is that you can't judge future NFL success by past college results alone. So much of the possibilities rest on the personality, drive and dedication of the individual. Those that work the hardest, study the most and are able to overcome the pitfalls of the learning process succeed as NFL QBs, not the ones that "can't miss" coming out of college.

 

If Beane and his team can identify the guy with that motivation, they need to go up, down or sideways to get him, no matter what the cost. There are never many of these kinds of guys. Especially today.

[BadLandsMeanie]

Here is my nightmare.

 

We use the 3 firsts and trade up.  We get our guy. 

 

But them McCarron goes down. And we put our rookie in and then it becomes plain that we may have made a mistake. He isn't ready, might never be ready, we lose a bunch of games.

 

So the next year we finally get our pick at the top of the draft, but the Giants own it.

 

I wouldn't include next year's first in a trade with the Giants because it will be worth a kings ransom right when we need it most, and it won't be ours..

 

[Boatdrinks]

Just now, Jamie Nails said:

This is the one year that I’m not afraid to trade away next year’s first- we have so much cap space next year, we can paper over it for a season. Just hope we don’t absolutely suck and it’s a top 5 pick 

Next years first could land an elite pass rusher if it's a fairly high pick ( a decent probability right now). There is little to look forward to at the QB position in 2019. The cap space is certain to be lower than some of the rosy projections that are out there now. Fortunately, it's doubtful the Bills part ways with that 2019 first for anything less than the #2 pick. I think that's appearing less likely, and the Bills move up will be in pick 5-7 range if it happens. 

[MAJBobby]

1 minute ago, Boatdrinks said:

Next years first could land an elite pass rusher if it's a fairly high pick ( a decent probability right now). There is little to look forward to at the QB position in 2019. The cap space is certain to be lower than some of the rosy projections that are out there now. Fortunately, it's doubtful the Bills part ways with that 2019 first for anything less than the #2 pick. I think that's appearing less likely, and the Bills move up will be in pick 5-7 range if it happens. 

 

Why would it be lower. Who are must re-signs on this team that are UFAs and would take up big space. Maybe Benjamin???

[Boatdrinks]

6 minutes ago, clayboy54 said:

Funny how the argument about "can't miss guys"  always mentions Andrew Luck. Check. He was the #1 can't miss guy. However, he hasn't hit on anything as of yet, and with his shoulder concerns, he's far from what was expected of him. Yet some of the other guys that nobody projected as "can't miss" continue to impress year after year. What this should teach us is that you can't judge future NFL success by past college results alone. So much of the possibilities rest on the personality, drive and dedication of the individual. Those that work the hardest, study the most and are able to overcome the pitfalls of the learning process succeed as NFL QBs, not the ones that "can't miss" coming out of college.

 

If Beane and his team can identify the guy with that motivation, they need to go up, down or sideways to get him, no matter what the cost. There are never many of these kinds of guys. Especially today.

Luck was as " can't miss" as it gets in the NFL draft, and those kinds of prospects don't come along often. Injuries always have the potential to derail any player, Luck isn't immune to this. 

[BillsfanAZ]

7 minutes ago, BadLandsMeanie said:

Here is my nightmare.

 

We use the 3 firsts and trade up.  We get our guy. 

 

But them McCarron goes down. And we put our rookie in and then it becomes plain that we may have made a mistake. He isn't ready, might never be ready, we lose a bunch of games.

 

So the next year we finally get our pick at the top of the draft, but the Giants own it.

 

I wouldn't include next year's first in a trade with the Giants because it will be worth a kings ransom right when we need it most, and it won't be ours..

 

I get what you are saying but you are dealing in "what ifs". Next years draft for QB's doesnt look promising. If the QB is still there after the Browns first pick and Beane wants to trade away next years first to get his guy, then I say just rip the band aid off and do it. I would want to keep as many of the other draft picks we have this year as possible. If the Bills pick at QB pans out, then nobody will care about next years first round pick being gone. If he doesnt pan out, at least Beane took a chance to finally get the Bills a franchise guy. 

[Boatdrinks]

13 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Why would it be lower. Who are must re-signs on this team that are UFAs and would take up big space. Maybe Benjamin???

Ive already seen projections that are substantially lower than the 100 mill or so that's been thrown around out there. I don't think there are many must re-signs . Some of that available space will be due to expiring contracts , leaving few players under contract at the time. How many players do the Bills actually have under contract now? The space will get eaten up, it's not like they'll be able to go on a spending spree because they've got everyone signed to cheap deals with a ton of available space. I'd just expect that it will be a lower amount of available space than many of the early projections. 

Edited April 2, 2018 by Boatdrinks

[clayboy54]

8 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

Luck was as " can't miss" as it gets in the NFL draft, and those kinds of prospects don't come along often. Injuries always have the potential to derail any player, Luck isn't immune to this. 

Yes, but for whatever the reason, Luck has not become the savior that people projected him to be. Because of the variables, injuries included, it's a crap-shoot. I'd rather take my chances on personality, work-ethic and drive to motivate the guy I pick.

 

[Chuck Wagon]

25 minutes ago, BadLandsMeanie said:

Here is my nightmare.

 

We use the 3 firsts and trade up.  We get our guy. 

 

But them McCarron goes down. And we put our rookie in and then it becomes plain that we may have made a mistake. He isn't ready, might never be ready, we lose a bunch of games.

 

So the next year we finally get our pick at the top of the draft, but the Giants own it.

 

I wouldn't include next year's first in a trade with the Giants because it will be worth a kings ransom right when we need it most, and it won't be ours..

 

 

 

Sure.

 

And what if McCarron is great for the first ~10 games, gets hurt, the rookie comes in and he's great for the remaining 6 games, take us into the playoffs and wins a game.

 

Next offseason teams are banging down our door for McCarron, easily recouping part of the package we give to trade up for QB this year and the drafted QB runs with the job for the next 15 years.

 

 

[Reed83HOF]

1 minute ago, clayboy54 said:

Yes, but for whatever the reason,

*See Grigson; Ryan Grigson

[Mat68]

So does NYG and Buffalo both want Darnold?  Is Gettleman just playing the game to get Beane to pay a lot for him.  If Darnold is on the board at 2 I could see Buffalo making an offer Gettleman could not refuse.  Darnold would come in and most likely beat out Mcarron and I think he will do great things for the franchise.  

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

2 minutes ago, clayboy54 said:

Yes, but for whatever the reason, Luck has not become the savior that people projected him to be. Because of the variables, injuries included, it's a crap-shoot. I'd rather take my chances on personality, work-ethic and drive to motivate the guy I pick.

 

If talent is equal or close this may make a difference. However, you can have the hardest working, most motivated, best person in the world and if they don't have the talent....they won't play.

[John from Riverside]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Trade the 3 #1 picks and get your guy.

 

So what if the Giants draft well with those picks?..........the Chargers got Shawne Merriman who became arguably the best defensive player in the NFL for 3 years and a starting LT in Roman Oben in addition to Philip Rivers in the Eli Manning deal.    Looked initially like a total fail for the Giants as Eli struggled.      But Merriman and Oben flamed out and even if they had not the Giants still found the strength to somehow recover as a roster and win 2 SB's.

 

Trade up.......get your guy........and in 4 years the Giants will start losing those draft picks to attrition and FA and you will either be laughing all the way to the playoffs or you will have had a chance at another QB.

 

Ultimately you are about your QB decisions in the NFL........get busy living or get busy getting fired McBeane.

This scenario could happen no matter what.

 

My feeling on it is this.....if they do decide that Rosen (or Mayfield) this the guy they can biuld around for the next decade then losing the number 1 in next years draft is not gonna make that much of a difference in the long concept.....AJM should start regardless of who we draft......unless the rookie comes in and totally blows him away...competition is a good thing....some of these QBs woudl really benefit of holding a clipboard for a while...its a pick not for the now but for the future of the team....

 

And if a rookie QB comes in and sucks?   Well that is what rookies do for the most part so you have to live with that too......which is why its best to have a veteran out in front of them to start.

 

Im good with an option a and a option b in this draft as long as we get A qb that the bills believe can be the guy even if it takes some grooming.

 

I dont worry about next years number 1 that much....if we suck we will have a high number in every round and we will have a ton of free agent spending money.

 

 

John H.

[clayboy54]

2 minutes ago, horned dogs said:

If talent is equal or close this may make a difference. However, you can have the hardest working, most motivated, best person in the world and if they don't have the talent....they won't play.

 Agreed, but of the top probably 8-9 QBs in the draft this year, they are all pretty talented. Even Lauletta, Falk and White are talented guys that need time to grow their game. A few of them are uber-talented. This is why so many "experts" love Allen. Now, which ones will put in the work to really get better and excel at their craft? That is the one I want.

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

7 minutes ago, clayboy54 said:

 Agreed, but of the top probably 8-9 QBs in the draft this year, they are all pretty talented. Even Lauletta, Falk and White are talented guys that need time to grow their game. A few of them are uber-talented. This is why so many "experts" love Allen. Now, which ones will put in the work to really get better and excel at their craft? That is the one I want.

I hear you. You sound like you cheer for the underdog and that's fine. My point is all the hard work in the world isn't going to turn EJ Manuel into Cam Newton. I don't think it is an either or though. You can be talented and work hard as well. These dudes all work hard or they wouldn't be where they are.

Edited April 2, 2018 by horned dogs

[Boatdrinks]

6 minutes ago, Mat68 said:

So does NYG and Buffalo both want Darnold?  Is Gettleman just playing the game to get Beane to pay a lot for him.  If Darnold is on the board at 2 I could see Buffalo making an offer Gettleman could not refuse.  Darnold would come in and most likely beat out Mcarron and I think he will do great things for the franchise.  

This is the biggest mystery of the draft right now. Just what is Gettleman and the NYG's MO. Are they all in on Eli for a couple years? If so , they'd do well with the talent infusion that a bunch of picks would allow. Or adding a dynamic RB like Barkley. Conversely , why would they consider trading Eli's best target at WR? Mannings stats with and without Beckham are eye opening. The drop off is precipitous. Why would they smooth over their relationship with Manning post -McAdoo , then draft his replacement at 2 ? The minute Manning has a bad quarter, the fans will be on them to play the rookie. Not a great situation for a new HC to have a ready- made QB controversy set up for him. Hard to read the tea leaves where the Gmen are concerned; Gettleman has certainly kept his poker face on. 

[PIZ]

I wonder if these teams (like the Giants) that we are talking to, are not just requesting draft picks.  Could they ask for a player(s) to be added as well?  Guys like Hyde, Poyer, Tre White, Benjamin, McCoy, Lawson, etc. may be used in addition to the #12 pick.  I would imagine they don't want to give their 2019 1st, when it is an unknown position.

[4merper4mer]

1 hour ago, BillsfanAZ said:

I get what you are saying but you are dealing in "what ifs". Next years draft for QB's doesnt look promising. If the QB is still there after the Browns first pick and Beane wants to trade away next years first to get his guy, then I say just rip the band aid off and do it. I would want to keep as many of the other draft picks we have this year as possible. If the Bills pick at QB pans out, then nobody will care about next years first round pick being gone. If he doesnt pan out, at least Beane took a chance to finally get the Bills a franchise guy. 

But your whining about not getting Wentz or trading up this year with teams that clearly need a QB as much as us is as what if as it gets.  These were/are mission impossible.  Mahoney last year is the only plausible scenario you present and it remains to be seen what he offers.