Wayne Arnold Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 8 hours ago, NastyNateSoldiers said: I've taken some time recently to think bout what direction the Bills should take with the most important position in sports QB. I think the majority of fans have also we fall into basically 3 categories #1 Team Trade Up #2 Sign a Vet and draft QB to develop. #3 Sign Cousins and use our draft pks. I thought about these 3 plans and read about many opinions on this board . The best one i believe is #3 sign Captain Kirk. Signing Kirk makes sense on so many levels When building a team the most important factor is building threw the draft i can't see the Bills giving up nearly 2yrs of pks to bank on a QB developing or even worse not developing . McBeane want to build this team in there image and there not gonna do it via free agency . These guys want custom made culture guys that fit there systems and the best place to find them are in the draft. Cousins fits the Bill. This is where Cousins comes in . Captain Kirk is a process type guy. If the Bills were drafting a QB i believe Cousins would be the type of guy they draft. He has all the characteristics and intangibles there looking for as far as Durability, Leadership, Work ethic and being a God fearing man . Ntm he's ready made top 12 QB in the NFL averaging 4250 yds, 31 TDs and over 65% completions over his last 4 seasons. The arrow is pointing up with Cousins as he's just entering his prime at 29yrs old. Now i know people will say 27-30 mil per season that's alot of money and i agree it is but the Bills set themselves up for this type of cap hit . Going into 2019 we have nearly 90mil in cap space with no big dollars free agents on the horizon we should be able to absorb that cap hit easily. Ntm we should be able to land cheap talent and starters at the top of the draft. The Plan Well this is where the fun starts not only for McBeane but for us the fans. We get to use all our high pks 5 in top 95 to fill major holes on this team. This gives McBeane great flexibility during the draft to trade down and even collect more assets . Imagine what these 5pks can do for us moving forward these players will get some much needed experience as rookies in 2018 . With these pks and some savvy free agent additions the Bills will be able to again compete for the playoffs in 2018 hopefully get there and win a gm or 2. But the eye of the prize will definitely be on 2019 where we still will have great cap flexibility with a Franchise QB in place and a young nucleus of talent and another draft to really begin to build for the future yrs and make some noise while doing it. This is the Cousins plan and hopefully we get to see it happen. There's no way the Bills can fit that fat contract into their salary cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bray Wyatt Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 1 minute ago, Wayne Arnold said: There's no way the Bills can fit that fat contract into their salary cap. Why not? In terms of actual dollars, KC would get his SB for the first year, so he can have a small actual base for year 1 and then boost it up the next year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26TrapDraw Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 4 minutes ago, John from Hemet said: I am in the team trade up movement.......and I am bracing myself for how much it is actually going to cost us...... The good news.....HUGE amount of cap space next year.... So you'd be opposed to sign Cousins fill the cupboard with this year's draft picks and use next year's cap space to grab any missing pieces? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NastyNateSoldiers Posted January 30, 2018 Author Share Posted January 30, 2018 1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said: Not sure why you are bringing up 2 years ago to talk about the current state of the OL...and I spoke specifically about pass protection and you are talking about run blocking. Everyone here wants to upgrade our pass attack, and thats the point of even this thread. You don't do that behind an OL that isnt good at pass protection and makes no difference how good they are at Run Blocking. Also, in 2016 we were a better rushing team overall in a better system with more depth at RB. That system and OC are gone and the run game wasn't as affective in 2017. 2017 this OL was terrible in pass protection, and it had nothing to do with TT holding the ball longer. This OL was even substantially worse at Pass Protection with Peterman in there trying to stay in the pocket, got killed almost immediately all the time. TT actually makes the pass protection look less terrible by buying times with his legs, but a guy like Cousins or some other pocket passer is going to get killed behind this OL. We already needed to upgrade spots on the OL, now we have Wood gone and Glenn likely gone leaving us with most likely having to fill 3 new starters on the OL. ESPECIALLY if we are drafting a rookie to develop high, they need to keep the kid upright. If you think this OL is pretty good at protecting the QB, then we are clearly on very different pages. And Groy was like a revolving door in pass blocking at times when filling in at Center. In fact, when Wood got hurt and Groy came in, he was a big reason why we lost that game. Peterman vs the Chargers they were smelling blood plus this could of been on Peterman more then anyone else . He probably didn't make the proper adjustments at the los. Plus your talking bout the Chargers here probably the best pass rushing tandem in the league and we were leaving our tackles in one on one situations . Which is a horrible decision to make vs that D especially since u have a rookie 5th rd pk making his debut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 4 minutes ago, BeefCurtns said: So you'd be opposed to sign Cousins fill the cupboard with this year's draft picks and use next year's cap space to grab any missing pieces? Given what it is going to take to sign him.....my preference would be to use draft picks and players and get up to Rosen or Darnold....preferrably Darnold. We have a whopping amount of cap space not this upcoming year but next......and can use that to fill holes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 (edited) 6 minutes ago, NastyNateSoldiers said: Peterman vs the Chargers they were smelling blood plus this could of been on Peterman more then anyone else . He probably didn't make the proper adjustments at the los. Plus your talking bout the Chargers here probably the best pass rushing tandem in the league and we were leaving our tackles in one on one situations . Which is a horrible decision to make vs that D especially since u have a rookie 5th rd pk making his debut. What about the Jets game where TT was getting crushed the moment he snapped the ball? What about the other 15 games where the pass protection was not good. Sorry, but you are categorically wrong if you think the pass protection by this OL was good in 2017. Every time Peterman was in there...preseason, the 4 games he played in during the regular and playoff season they got to Peterman easily and quickly. Smell blood? What does that have to do with anything? So because Chargers smell blood thats an excuse for how miserable the OL provided pass protection? Doesn't matter if the D smells Blood or what the Rock is Cooking, the OL job is to provide pass protection and they were terrible all year at doing it. The only caveat about TT, is because he is a threat to run and the D needs to account for that, they cant consistently bring pressure because he can burn them for big gains or buy time with his legs. But without that threat, the OL cant stop anyone and they showed it over and over again. In the Jets game, they decided to bring the pressure all game and ate the OL and TT for lunch. This OL is a joke at pass protection, even in the preseason it was embarrassingly bad no matter who was behind center. Again, I cant fathom how anyone can make excuses for the OL Pass Protection or think its not bad. Our DL and OL need major improvements this offseason, we SUCK in the trenches. Edited January 30, 2018 by Alphadawg7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 6 minutes ago, Bray Wyatt said: Why not? In terms of actual dollars, KC would get his SB for the first year, so he can have a small actual base for year 1 and then boost it up the next year Maybe, but this is a spicy meatball... Especially spicy considering... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Wrong answer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBonhamRocks Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 1 minute ago, Wayne Arnold said: Maybe, but this is a spicy meatball... Especially spicy considering... Not that I'm championing it, but I think the answer to that is the projected cap room next year. Draft a contract that is easier on this year's cap and not so much next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Noggin Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: If there's someone there they feel "Oh yeah. He's the one. He's an 80% guy" they may try. But it's far from a sure thing that they'll be able to, if so. Almost all of the top players this year have, as far as I can see, some question mark to their games. Of all the guys, the one that I feel best about (assuming in interviews, he comes across as loving the game and really having the "want to" factor) is Rosen, and a nice smart chap here just scared us about his "bust" potential based upon rush yards from scrimmage for college QB. The cap space issue, IMO, is overblown. I think the issue to ponder is that trading up has a large (but less obvious) salary cap impact. Let's say for the sake of argument, trading up costs us 3 first round picks and 2 seconds. That's 5 quality players expected to be contributors that we can't draft and reimburse at a low rate while we evaluate them. Let's say 3 become high-quality starters, 1 becomes a contributer, and 1 busts. Since you didn't draft them, you need to pay 3 quality free agents and 1 second-tier guy to replace them. Look for 2 quality DLmen - not the top guys, go back about 10 on the salary lists - and the very best ILB you can grab. Heyward, Jordan types and someone as close to Luke Kuechly as you can sign, and a quality WR. Don't you think you've spent $36M in salary cap or more with those 4 acquisitions? Now, assuming we pick in a similar or lower place next year, the CBA would put the cap hit at about $2M each for each 1st round rookie and $1M for each 2nd round rookie. Total cap for draftees at the position of $8M The difference is $27M - exactly the cap hit of a top QB such as Stafford. And that's not taking into account the higher salary you pay Mr Top of the 1st Round rookie. Back of the envelope bottom line: full court press for Cousins vs trade up for Mr Right is probably closer to a salary cap wash than you think for a team with lots of holes that wants to compete. And we've seen for years the effect of paying top salaries to DL, DB, OL - "everyone but QB" as well as the effect of what I'll call "serial QB monogamy" (pick a guy who might have potential to develop into Mr Right, focus on him for 3 years, divorce him, pick again). This is effing solid. Carry on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NastyNateSoldiers Posted January 30, 2018 Author Share Posted January 30, 2018 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said: What about the Jets game where TT was getting crushed the moment he snapped the ball? What about the other 15 games where the pass protection was not good. Sorry, but you are categorically wrong if you think the pass protection by this OL was good in 2017. Every time Peterman was in there...preseason, the 4 games he played in during the regular and playoff season they got to Peterman easily and quickly. Smell blood? What does that have to do with anything? So because Chargers spell blood thats an excuse for how miserable the OL provided pass protection? Doesn't if the smell what the Rock is Cooking, the OL job is provide pass protection and they were terrible all year at doing it. The only caveat about TT, is because he is a threat to run and the D needs to account for that, they cant consistently bring pressure because he can burn them for big gains or buy time with his legs. But without that threat, the OL cant stop anyone and they showed over and over again. In the Jets game, they decided to bring the pressure all game and ate the OL for lunch. This OL is a joke at pass protection, even in the preseason it was embarrassingly bad no matter who was behind center. Again, I cant fathom how anyone can make excuses for the OL Pass Protection or think its not bad. Our DL and OL need major improvements this offseason, we SUCK in the trenches. I don't agree nearly every line gets beat from time to time. We add a good QB that can actually get rid of the ball on time like Cousins and were bringing bk the power run scheme that this line thrived in that's gonna open up more play action passes. Our oline is far from horrible. Last yr i seen plenty of plays where Tyrod just sat bk there and didn't deliever the ball. I believe as is this line is adequate enough to get the job done. LT Cordy LG Incog C Groy RG Miller / Dukaka RT Dawkins Edited January 30, 2018 by NastyNateSoldiers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billykay Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 8 hours ago, GunnerBill said: I am firmly in Team Trade Up and I actually believe the Bills will. EDIT: I don't hate the Cousins plan and I do see the advantages but I just feel like he is going to get an astronomical sum for a QB of his standard and he pretty much fixes you into building through the draft around him. The Bills may have cap space going into 2019 but they will hopefully also be starting to think at that stage about signing a young shutdown corner long term (Tre) and a young franchise left tackle long term (Dion). So while you have some cap space for short term FA deals in 2019 and 2020 you don't have room to tie yourself into big FAs on 4 or 5 year deals. I think if you find your Quarterback in the draft you have a little more flexibility as to how you build the team around him. With Cousins you know what you are getting. With drafting a QB, you just never know. Either way, there are pluses & minuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NastyNateSoldiers Posted January 30, 2018 Author Share Posted January 30, 2018 If this regime decides to just cut Cordy Glenn then he better be seriously damaged goods . Because he has 3yrs and 23mil remaining on his deal . That's definitely cap friendly in this era even if your a RT that's solid . He can get healthy he's one of the better tackles in this league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 3 minutes ago, NastyNateSoldiers said: If this regime decides to just cut Cordy Glenn then he better be seriously damaged goods . Because he has 3yrs and 23mil remaining on his deal . That's definitely cap friendly in this era even if your a RT that's solid . He can get healthy he's one of the better tackles in this league. This is how I feel as well....if Cordy Glenn has a chance of returning to form we really need to keep him. I think he (or Dawkins) would make a outstanding RT.... and they fit the power scheme that is coming....just like John Miller....just like Ryan Groy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 (edited) 9 minutes ago, NastyNateSoldiers said: If this regime decides to just cut Cordy Glenn then he better be seriously damaged goods . Because he has 3yrs and 23mil remaining on his deal . That's definitely cap friendly in this era even if your a RT that's solid . He can get healthy he's one of the better tackles in this league. If they can trade Glenn after 6/1 then they could add $11.25 million to the 2018 salary cap. Even releasing him would add $9.75 million. Might be worth it. Edited January 30, 2018 by Wayne Arnold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I think you might be overlooking something, dd. The Redskins can franchise Cousins for $34.5 M, sure. But unless I'm missing something, he doesn't have to sign the tag until the 2nd week of July. And if I'm Cousins, and faced with the possibility that I sign the tag and get traded somewhere I don't want to go, I sit on my hands and whistle "Day by Day" while the Redskins squirm. No one is going to trade for an unsigned player. And day by day, potentially interested trade partners who need a QB are going to make other plans and fill in their cap space. Remember, even if they have a handshake deal to renegotiate, the receiving team has to have the cap space open at the time of the trade for it to go through. Meanwhile, Washington has to stay under the cap as they try to sign all their free agents and make their contingency plans at QB in case Cousins uses the ultimate leverage, which is to sit on the sofa and play Madden next year. I don't think the Redskins franchise Cousins unless they are seriously willing to sign a deal with him. I think to sign him expecting to trade, is too risky for them. It puts the leverage on Cousins side of the fence. Not out of the realm of possibility considering the leverage point of view.. It will be interesting.. I still think Washington is willing to franchise and keep him if they can't get something in return for him. Even if they are able to land Josh Allen or another QB at 13 they would still most likely want a vet for at least another to groom a drafted QB If they let cousins go then they are scrambling around for a vet IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 1 minute ago, ddaryl said: Not out of the realm of possibility considering the leverage point of view.. It will be interesting.. I still think Washington is willing to franchise and keep him if they can't get something in return for him. Even if they are able to land Josh Allen or another QB at 13 they would still most likely want a vet for at least another to groom a drafted QB If they let cousins go then they are scrambling around for a vet IMO If they keep him and draft someone you're using 30+ million of cap space on a placeholder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kota Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 No more bandaids. Find your guy, draft your guy, and don't miss. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NastyNateSoldiers Posted January 30, 2018 Author Share Posted January 30, 2018 8 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said: If they can trade Glenn after 6/1 then they could add $11.25 million to the 2018 salary cap. Even releasing him would add $9.75 million. Might be worth it. I thought its 4.9 mil. Savings if released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 1 minute ago, NastyNateSoldiers said: I thought its 4.9 mil. Savings if released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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