Big Turk Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, TakeYouToTasker said: Wrong. You aren't talking about the ability to reason. You're actually eschewing the ability to reason. Reasoning would encompass not seeking to build social institutions that run afoul of normal human behavior; seeking to prop up those institutions which would severely disadvantage half the population to the benefit of the other half is not reasonable. The fact that you're unwilling to have a conversation about what is normal behavior, instead seeking to impose your own viewpoint about appropriateness based on your studies of the pathology or criminals by fiat declaration lends itself towards my argument, not yours. If you aren't a lawyer you should definitely look into becoming one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, TuelTime said: No, appropriate or inappropriate behavior is a matter of perspective. This is why women must sign a non-disclosure agreement before they can party with Shady. A non disclosure agreement wil not absolve anyone of unwanted mis behavior, so he will need to wise up on that one. I have to beleive he has been educated on that sicne that fiasco went public Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Well, just coincidentally, the three current NFLNetwork guys mentioned (Marshall Faulk, Ike Taylor and Heath Evans) are three of the very worst personalities on the network. If they all got canned, it would be addition by subtraction... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 This conversation has gotten pretty weird. This is a thread about obvious and blatant sexual harassment IF the allegations are true. Right? No one here is trying to say that the alleged actions of the NFL Network employees are just normal workplace behavior? There are gray areas but not in this case. Right? Tell me I'm not misunderstanding some of you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, matter2003 said: If you aren't a lawyer you should definitely look into becoming one. I was a lawyer for a period. No crotch grabbing there either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 6 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: I am sorry I totally, totally disagree. I am a professional. When I am at work I act professional. I don't curse, I don't "sexually pursue" (horrible phrase) people, I don't drink alcohol..... I don't do any number of things that are not appropriate in the work place. That's a fiat declaration, which I reject wholesale. People are not paid to stop being people. They are paid for their work. We do not leave our biological imperatives at home. We do not put ourselves in boxes. We are who we are 100% of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan1959 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 1 minute ago, TakeYouToTasker said: Wrong. You aren't talking about the ability to reason. You're actually eschewing the ability to reason. Reasoning would encompass not seeking to build social institutions that run afoul of normal human behavior; seeking to prop up those institutions which would severely disadvantage half the population to the benefit of the other half is not reasonable. The fact that you're unwilling to have a conversation about what is normal behavior, instead seeking to impose your own viewpoint about appropriateness based on your studies of the pathology or criminals by fiat declaration lends itself towards my argument, not yours. Such sweeping generalizations. Please be more specific as to what social institutions run afoul of normal human behavior and in what way? I am certainly willing to have a conversation. I am not trying to impose my viewpoint, merely expressing it - with no more aggressiveness that you show in yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, Buftex said: Well, just coincidentally, the three current NFLNetwork guys mentioned (Marshall Faulk, Ike Taylor and Heath Evans) are three of the very worst personalities on the network. If they all got canned, it would be addition by subtraction... Yea..... Interestingly enough even before I read the allegations whenever Ike's face came onto my TV "penis" was the word that sprung to mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, billsfan1959 said: Such sweeping generalizations. Please be more specific as to what social institutions run afoul of normal human behavior and in what way? I am certainly willing to have a conversation. I am not trying to impose my viewpoint, merely expressing it - with no more aggressiveness that you show in yours. Any convention imposed by third wave feminism or transgender rights movements run counter to nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan1959 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, HappyDays said: This conversation has gotten pretty weird. This is a thread about obvious and blatant sexual harassment IF the allegations are true. Right? No one here is trying to say that the alleged actions of the NFL Network employees are just normal workplace behavior? There are gray areas but not in this case. Right? Tell me I'm not misunderstanding some of you. It certainly seems there are posters that want to confuse the real issues Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 1 minute ago, TakeYouToTasker said: That's a fiat declaration, which I reject wholesale. People are not paid to stop being people. They are paid for their work. We do not leave our biological imperatives at home. We do not put ourselves in boxes. We are who we are 100% of the time. Well I definitely have a professional persona that is not the same as I am in the pub, even if that is with work colleagues, or when I am at home or with my friends. So I must be a freak of nature or your theory fails. It is just having the ability to control and moderate one's behaviour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, HappyDays said: This conversation has gotten pretty weird. This is a thread about obvious and blatant sexual harassment IF the allegations are true. Right? No one here is trying to say that the alleged actions of the NFL Network employees are just normal workplace behavior? There are gray areas but not in this case. Right? Tell me I'm not misunderstanding some of you. Not at all... the problem is that "allegations" too often are being treated as fact by companies without sufficiently investigating the truth of them with real consequences to people. And if you don't think women will make stuff up for no reason...well, just think how often a woman will make up a reason to not go out with a guy that is a complete lie...now imagine if a bunch of money was involved.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bomb Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 5 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: I was a lawyer for a period. No crotch grabbing there either. Most ppl don't have white collar careers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, GunnerBill said: Well I definitely have a professional persona that is not the same as I am in the pub, even if that is with work colleagues, or when I am at home or with my friends. So I must be a freak of nature or your theory fails. It is just having the ability to control and moderate one's behaviour. No, you're simply making a personal choice to moderate your own behavior based on your own preferences. That's your choice. However, that doesn't mean individuals making a different choice, and acting on normal human biological impulses which don't violate someone's rights are wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 5 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: I was a lawyer for a period. No crotch grabbing there either. Yeah, I don't doubt that...lawyers are definitely pretty tightly wound...although I can't count the number of ones I've seen snorting coke at an after party tho... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan1959 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 4 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said: That's a fiat declaration, which I reject wholesale. People are not paid to stop being people. They are paid for their work. We do not leave our biological imperatives at home. We do not put ourselves in boxes. We are who we are 100% of the time. You are correct, we are who we are 100% of the time. What we do not do is manifest, behaviorally, 100% of who we are 100% of the time. Which is not really a nuanced distinction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaviorPeterman Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 For those that aren't sheep and are paying close attention, I hope you understand what the elites and liberals are doing here pushing this BS 'Sexual Harassment' narrative to the forefront in recent weeks. Obviously the Russia collusion story is going nowhere despite the recent arrests and charges against Trump campaign members (the charges have nothing to do with Trump or his campaign BTW) so this was 'Plan B' all along. And liberals have no problem sacrificing their own (i.e. Weinstein, Al Franken, etc) to set the stage for 2020 when they run another female candidate against Trump and push the gender card to the forefront again even though they failed miserably with Crooked Hillary. Same reason all the BS sexual accusations against Trump are magically in the news again and you see his 'victims' sob stories as if they are 'new' allegations. It's pretty sad the lengths Democrats (and some Republicans) are going to go to try and stop this guy because he's not one of them and never will be. And even when Trump wins by a larger margin in 2020 they'll still find new ways to waste taxpayer money and continue their futile efforts. These are truly sick people folks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bomb Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: Well I definitely have a professional persona that is not the same as I am in the pub, even if that is with work colleagues, or when I am at home or with my friends. So I must be a freak of nature or your theory fails. It is just having the ability to control and moderate one's behaviour. Not everyone is a Puritan either... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 1 minute ago, TakeYouToTasker said: However, that doesn't mean individuals making a different choice, and acting on normal human biological impulses which don't violate someone's rights are wrong. But we are talking about when they do violate someone's rights..... like sticking a hand down their trousers to check if they are wearing underwear..... 1 minute ago, T-Bomb said: Not everyone is a Puritan either... I don't want them to be. Just professional. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, T-Bomb said: Not everyone is a Puritan either... Don't tell that to all the people doing the Salem Witch Hunt on sexual harrssment these days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, matter2003 said: just think how often a woman will make up a reason to not go out with a guy that is a complete lie I'm guessing in your experience this happens all the time. Maybe reflect on that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, SaviorPeterman said: For those that aren't sheep and are paying close attention, I hope you understand what the elites and liberals are doing here pushing this BS 'Sexual Harassment' narrative to the forefront in recent weeks. Obviously the Russia collusion story is going nowhere despite the recent arrests and charges against Trump campaign members (the charges have nothing to do with Trump or his campaign BTW) so this was 'Plan B' all along. And liberals have no problem sacrificing their own (i.e. Weinstein, Al Franken, etc) to set the stage for 2020 when they run another female candidate against Trump and push the gender card to the forefront again even though they failed miserably with Crooked Hillary. Same reason all the BS sexual accusations against Trump are magically in the news again and you see his 'victims' sob stories as if they are 'new' allegations. It's pretty sad the lengths Democrats (and some Republicans) are going to go to try and stop this guy because he's not one of them and never will be. And even when Trump wins by a larger margin in 2020 they'll still find new ways to waste taxpayer money and continue their futile efforts. These are truly sick people folks. Cool conspiracy theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 (edited) 1 minute ago, HappyDays said: I'm guessing in your experience this happens all the time. Maybe reflect on that. Anyone who has been on enough dates with women has it happen. The more successful you are with women, the more it will happen. It's like a guy who gets one sale after talking to 5 people versus a guy who gets 10 sales after talking to 100...the guy with the most sales gets the most rejections...dating no different than sales, its a numbers game. Anyone who is claiming to have never gotten rejected by a woman hasn't done much of anything worth noting with women in their life. Edited December 12, 2017 by matter2003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, matter2003 said: Yeah, I don't doubt that...lawyers are definitely pretty tightly wound...although I can't count the number of ones I've seen snorting coke at an after party tho... So we get another of your generalisations about a whole profession..... teachers are freaky and lawyers are tightly wound. Got you. As for snorting at an after party. I would never have done it myself..... but I again differentiate between what is appropriate behaviour in the office and appropriate behaviour outside work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bomb Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 (edited) 4 minutes ago, jrober38 said: Cool conspiracy theory. Actually, there is merritt to that. The liberal media is exhausting all options possible, it's quite transparent. Don't be sheeple for either side. Edited December 12, 2017 by T-Bomb Spelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 7 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said: Such sweeping generalizations. Please be more specific as to what social institutions run afoul of normal human behavior and in what way? I am certainly willing to have a conversation. I am not trying to impose my viewpoint, merely expressing it - with no more aggressiveness that you show in yours. This is certainly a drastic shift from page seven of the discussion where you declared "if we really have to define what is appropriate or inappropriate, then I don't know what else to say.... ", and more recently informed me that "the discussion isn't about what constitutes normal human behavior, that's what you want it to be about", where you sought to impose your own views by fiat rather than discuss them. If you want to start over, I'm fine with that. Let's start with a list of behaviors, obviously not comprehensive, and where they fall on the scale of acceptability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, GunnerBill said: So we get another of your generalisations about a whole profession..... teachers are freaky and lawyers are tightly wound. Got you. As for snorting at an after party. I would never have done it myself..... but I again differentiate between what is appropriate behaviour in the office and appropriate behaviour outside work. How many people does it have to be before its not considered a generalization? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 1 minute ago, matter2003 said: Anyone who has been on enough dates with women has it happen. The more successful you are with women, the more it will happen. It's like a guy who gets one sale after talking to 5 people versus a guy who gets 10 sales after talking to 100...the guy with the most sales gets the most rejections...dating no different than sales is a numbers game Making up an excuse to not go on a date with a guy means a woman is willing to lie about sexual harassment for money. I think I've had enough internet for one day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 (edited) 1 minute ago, HappyDays said: Making up an excuse to not go on a date with a guy means a woman is willing to lie about sexual harassment for money. I think I've had enough internet for one day. Not only willing, I'd say it is far more likely. Or don't you believe that money is something women are attracted to? Must be love these 25 year old models are dating these 80 year old guys...they love the wrinkles... Edited December 12, 2017 by matter2003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, matter2003 said: How many people does it have to be before its not considered a generalization? Haha. Are you really asking that? Given that teachers and lawyers probably number the hundreds of thousands just in America I would suggest it needs to be more than the less than 1% I think you have personal experience of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 3 hours ago, BuffaloBill said: I wonder how long it is before the parade of high profile guys accused of sexual harassment finally grinds to a halt. It seems like now there are two or three every week. You are seriously off here if the allegations against the men are proven true. Innocent until proven guilty. Until then, I'll reserve judgement. And after that point I'll continue my life like I am now. Has no bearing on me whatsoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuelTime Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Gone are the days of hitting them over the head with your club and dragging them back to your cave to live happily ever after.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan1959 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, GunnerBill said: So we get another of your generalisations about a whole profession..... teachers are freaky and lawyers are tightly wound. Got you. As for snorting at an after party. I would never have done it myself..... but I again differentiate between what is appropriate behaviour in the office and appropriate behaviour outside work. So far from matter2003's posts, I've gathered that teachers are freaks who want to have sex with anyone in a public restroom at Bills' games, lawyers are wound tight and like to snort cocaine, he's looking for that woman who will be on her knees in a bathroom stall (he seems to have a thing for public restrooms) within five minutes of hitting on her, and, here's the real shocker: women lie in order to not go out with him. Did I miss anything? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 5 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: But we are talking about when they do violate someone's rights..... like sticking a hand down their trousers to check if they are wearing underwear..... In a vacuum, of course that wouldn't be acceptable behavior. But we aren't in a vacuum. There are many contexts in which the historical interactions of the people involved could make that exact same interaction completely reasonable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Like A Mofo Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 3 hours ago, T-Bomb said: That's what 3rd wave feminists want, and there are plenty of feminist men who agree. Again, 3rd wave feminism... Agree. the movement is a slow and understated one, but very very real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bomb Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 (edited) 3 minutes ago, matter2003 said: Not only willing, I'd say it is far more likely. Women lie just as much or more than men... Edited December 12, 2017 by T-Bomb Spelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 (edited) Just now, billsfan1959 said: So far from matter2003's posts, I've gathered that teachers are freaks who want to have sex with anyone in a public restroom at Bills' games, lawyers are wound tight and like to snort cocaine, he's looking for that woman who will be on her knees in a bathroom stall (he seems to have a thing for public restrooms) within five minutes of hitting on her, and, here's the real shocker: women lie in order to not go out with him. Did I miss anything? They've lied to you to, you just probably believed them in your naivety. Edited December 12, 2017 by matter2003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, billsfan1959 said: So far from matter2003's posts, I've gathered that teachers are freaks who want to have sex with anyone in a public restroom at Bills' games, lawyers are wound tight and like to snort cocaine, he's looking for that woman who will be on her knees in a bathroom stall (he seems to have a thing for public restrooms) within five minutes of hitting on her, and, here's the real shocker: women lie in order to not go out with him. Did I miss anything? I think that is a reasonable synopsis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 A lot of cute comments about not being "able to look at girls" and "what's next.." BS here. It's really simple, don't hump if not asked. Don't show your dong if not asked. Don't try and solicit sex with a co-worker if she's not interested. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan1959 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 4 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said: This is certainly a drastic shift from page seven of the discussion where you declared "if we really have to define what is appropriate or inappropriate, then I don't know what else to say.... ", and more recently informed me that "the discussion isn't about what constitutes normal human behavior, that's what you want it to be about", where you sought to impose your own views by fiat rather than discuss them. If you want to start over, I'm fine with that. Let's start with a list of behaviors, obviously not comprehensive, and where they fall on the scale of acceptability. Not really a shift at all. I happen to believe that what constitutes acceptable or appropriate behavior in any given situation should come pretty easily to you - and we shouldn't have to have a comprehensive list to go by. If you need a list, then, by all means, develop one and pin it to your shirt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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