Shaq Lawson and Jordan Matthews to IR

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, BobBelcher said:

 

Havent all of the former receivers we let go of before this season already proven that you don’t just get rid of talented players because they had one year of bad luck with injuries? I would be pissed off if we did the same thing with Glenn only to see him dominate for 16 games next season somewhere else . All we are ever doing is creating more team needs and setting us back more and more. 

 

Hopefully mcbeane realized availability is unpredictable after their trade for Matthews, a guy that was praised for his overall availability and couldn’t be available half the season for us

 

or hopefully they realized that maybe it wasn’t the receivers from last year, but a quarterback that never throws to receivers in space  where they don’t have to get hit hard after every catch 

 

Who exactly has dominated that's been let go?

 

Post numbers to back your assertion.

 

[C.Biscuit97]

8 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

Sammy and Dareus DON'T make this a playoff team. They didn't make this a playoff team for the half-decade they were here. Instead, they committed fraud and grand larceny. Glad they're gone.

 

Seems like a Bunch of Whaley's failures will be in the playoffs this year. I wonder why that is?

 

but I know no matter how bad "your" side looks, you'll never admit defeat. You are clearly right Joe.

5 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

 

Who exactly has dominated that's been let go?

 

Post numbers to back your assertion.

 

Julio Jones has 2 catches for 24 yards last game. Clearly, he had no impact on the game.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, C.Biscuit97 said:

Seems like a Bunch of Whaley's failures will be in the playoffs this year. I wonder why that is?

 

but I know no matter how bad "your" side looks, you'll never admit defeat. You are clearly right Joe.

 

And how many of those teams are going to the playoffs BECAUSE of Whaley's failures, hm?

 

Bob Woods. Maybe.

 

But ok, you SURE got me.

 

[ShakAttack]

Just now, joesixpack said:

 

Who exactly has dominated that's been let go?

 

Post numbers to back your assertion.

 

 

Aside from Robert woods having a couple dominating performances this season maybe I exaggerated with choice of words but the point is still valid. Watkins looked healthy before this season and still is. He makes plays when thrown to in LA and has been scoring almost every week as of late. A healthy Sammy is better than any receiver we have right now hands down and I highly doubt whoever we draft in the late 2nd round with the rams pick will give us better value (just the odds). Dareus has been playing well since he showed up in Jacksonville. As for Darby and Gilmore they both start on excellent defenses. And before anyone tells me the patriots’ team defense ranking look at how they’ve been playing LATELY and points allowed.  Not coincidentally, they’re all starting for teams that are better than ours and are about to do something we haven’t done in 17 years... make the playoffs. 

 

Guess they were good enough for playoff caliber teams but not the mighty bills! 

[Bangarang]

1 hour ago, SoTier said:

 

What has Matthews done to merit even being brought back?  Find somebody better.

 

That was my point to begin with..

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, BobBelcher said:

 

Aside from Robert woods having a couple dominating performances this season maybe I exaggerated with choice of words but the point is still valid. Watkins looked healthy before this season and still is. He makes plays when thrown to in LA and has been scoring almost every week as of late. A healthy Sammy is better than any receiver we have right now hands down and I highly doubt whoever we draft in the late 2nd round with the rams pick will give us better value (just the odds). Dareus has been playing well since he showed up in Jacksonville. As for Darby and Gilmore they both start on excellent defenses. And before anyone tells me the patriots’ team defense ranking look at how they’ve been playing LATELY and points allowed.  Not coincidentally, they’re all starting for teams that are better than ours and are about to do something we haven’t done in 17 years... make the playoffs. 

 

Guess they were good enough for playoff caliber teams but not the mighty bills! 

 

I notice you're conveniently forgetting who we got in return. EJ gaines has been a VERY important piece of our defense.

 

And you're doubting their ability to draft when THREE of their first four picks this past year are solid contributors or better?

 

Come on man, try intellectual honesty.

 

6 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Seems like a Bunch of Whaley's failures will be in the playoffs this year. I wonder why that is?

 

but I know no matter how bad "your" side looks, you'll never admit defeat. You are clearly right Joe.

Julio Jones has 2 catches for 24 yards last game. Clearly, he had no impact on the game.

 

Oh we're back to the sammy watkins DECOY argument?

 

Original thought is original.

 

 

[Punching Bag]

3 hours ago, Dablitzkrieg said:

Word on the street it is a vaginal injury, unsure how extensive, but apparently he will be out a while with the beating it has taken.  He also will not be on the team next year

Did you recommend your gynecologist to him?

[Chris66]

Whaley was a very good talent evaluator. Not his fault hevwas given not hired 2 head coaches. Hard to buy the groceries when you you dont know what your making

[C.Biscuit97]

14 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

 

I notice you're conveniently forgetting who we got in return. EJ gaines has been a VERY important piece of our defense.

 

And you're doubting their ability to draft when THREE of their first four picks this past year are solid contributors or better?

 

Come on man, try intellectual honesty.

 

 

Oh we're back to the sammy watkins DECOY argument?

 

Original thought is original.

 

 

Who did Patrick Peterson cover last game? Cooper Kupp or Tavon Austin?

 

 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, Chris66 said:

Whaley was a very good talent evaluator. Not his fault hevwas given not hired 2 head coaches. Hard to buy the groceries when you you dont know what your making

 

let's start from his most recent draft and work back. You tell me who's talented:

 

Shaq Lawson

Reggie Ragland

Adolphus Washington

Cardale Jones

Jonathan williams

Kolby listenbee

Kevon Seymour

 

Ronald Darby

John Miller

Karlos Williams

Tony Steward

Nick o leary

Dezmin lewis

 

Sammy watkins

Cyrus Kouandijo

Preston Brown

Ross Cockrell

Cyril richardson

Randell Johnson

Seantrel Henderson

 

 

[Doc Brown]

2 hours ago, SoTier said:

 

Well, that's only if you ignore facts, sweetie ... Sammy Watkins has 184 receptions, 2984 yards, and 29 TDs in 4 seasons, 3 with the Bills ... but carry on pretending the geniuses at OBD know how to build a winning team -- or are even interested in doing so.

Jordan Matthews has 250 receptions, 2,995 yards, and 20 TD's in 4 seasons.  He was a 2nd round draft pick.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Who did Patrick Peterson cover last game? Cooper Kupp or Tavon Austin?

 

 

 

wanna know how much time I spend watching Rams games? Zero.

 

wanna know how much I care about Rams players? Even less.

 

wanna know how much I cry about Sammy Watkins being on the Rams? I don't. Why? I'm a Bills fan.

 

[BigDingus]

23 minutes ago, BobBelcher said:

 

Aside from Robert woods having a couple dominating performances this season maybe I exaggerated with choice of words but the point is still valid. Watkins looked healthy before this season and still is. He makes plays when thrown to in LA and has been scoring almost every week as of late. A healthy Sammy is better than any receiver we have right now hands down and I highly doubt whoever we draft in the late 2nd round with the rams pick will give us better value (just the odds). Dareus has been playing well since he showed up in Jacksonville. As for Darby and Gilmore they both start on excellent defenses. And before anyone tells me the patriots’ team defense ranking look at how they’ve been playing LATELY and points allowed.  Not coincidentally, they’re all starting for teams that are better than ours and are about to do something we haven’t done in 17 years... make the playoffs. 

 

Guess they were good enough for playoff caliber teams but not the mighty bills! 

 

Neither Sammy, nor Woods (and definitely not Goodwin) have been dominant. Here's the problem with your assertion as well, Watkins was gone in a year, and Woods was already a FA. We were in cap hell due to Whaley, so throwing the kind of money Woods got at him would've been ASININE. Cordy Glenn is rated #44 best tackle in the league by PFF, which is NOT deserving of such a massive contract. Being above-average-good does not mean pay at an elite level! 

Yes, getting rid of all talented players is a bad idea. But we took in a lot of good players too. Our secondary is actually improved over last year even without a single returning starter. Micah Hyde and Jordan Poyer are both consistently ranked highly as well as EJ Gaines & Tre'Davious White. Kelvin Benjamin hasn't had much time here, but he's also a great player. Whaley trading away a 1st to get Watkins in a draft loaded with WRs, many better than him, was idiotic. And people acting like you need a specific type of receiver to work with Tyrod are just ridiculous. A good receiver is a good receiver! If you think Tyrod needs WRs tailored to him, that shows how bad he is! Can they run routes? Can they catch? How's their size & catch radius? Are they good on those fronts? Then Tyrod SHOULD be able to get them the ball! 

And with Gilmore - again, do you realize the cap position we were in? How could we pay for a contract like the Patriots did with our situation? He didn't want to be here anyway, what were we supposed to do? Dareus was getting paid higher than most QB's and was one of the highest paid defensive players in the entire league, and had missed multiple games each year! It's like you think every player just wanted to be here, would take far less to stay here, and that the salary cap didn't apply to us...

Edited December 6, 2017 by BigDingus

[Chris66]

2 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

 

wanna know how much time I spend watching Rams games? Zero.

 

wanna know how much I care about Rams players? Even less.

 

wanna know how much I cry about Sammy Watkins being on the Rams? I don't. Why? I'm a Bills fan.

 

Your missing out. Theyre a fun to watch

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, Chris66 said:

Your missing out. Theyre a fun to watch

 

I'll watch them this week, since they'll be on local TV.

 

 

[C.Biscuit97]

6 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

 

wanna know how much time I spend watching Rams games? Zero.

 

wanna know how much I care about Rams players? Even less.

 

wanna know how much I cry about Sammy Watkins being on the Rams? I don't. Why? I'm a Bills fan.

 

Because you hate to see how wrong you are?  It was Sammy who draws the number 1 cb every week and frees up Gurley and the other receivers.  Believe it or not, it's not just about numbers.

 

honest question, did you give Whaley of a chance as you did to these guys? And why do you believe so much in them?  This is a very boring team right now.

Edited December 6, 2017 by C.Biscuit97

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Because you hate to see how wrong you are?

 

honest question, did you give Whaley of a chance as you did to these guys? And why do you believe so much in them?  This is a very boring team right now.

 

Because unlike Dollar Doug's "patch-a-leak" method, these guys seem to have a plan. And yes, until his third abysmal draft in a row, I gave him a chance. These guys found more starters in one draft than Doogie did in three years.

 

 

[vincec]

2 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

 

let's start from his most recent draft and work back. You tell me who's talented:

 

Shaq Lawson starter

Reggie Ragland starter

Adolphus Washington starter

Cardale Jones backup

Jonathan williams practice squad

Kolby listenbee practice squad

Kevon Seymour backup

 

Ronald Darby starter

John Miller backup

Karlos Williams

Tony Steward

Nick o leary backup

Dezmin lewis

 

Sammy watkins starter

Cyrus Kouandijo backup

Preston Brown starter

Ross Cockrell starter

Cyril richardson

Randell Johnson

Seantrel Henderson backup

 

 

So out of the 20 players you listed, there are 7 starters, 6 backups and 2 practice squad players. So 15 out of 20 made an NFL roster and half are heavy contributors. Yeah, that really stinks.

[Chris66]

3 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Because you hate to see how wrong you are?

 

honest question, did you give Whaley of a chance as you did to these guys? And why do you believe so much in them?  This is a very boring team right now.

Not for nothing ,but the 2000 patriots were pretty boring to watch.

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, vincec said:

So out of the 20 players you listed, there are 7 starters, 6 backups and 2 practice squad players. So 15 out of 20 made an NFL roster and half are heavy contributors. Yeah, that really stinks.

 

JWill is actually on the Saints' 53 after spending time on the Broncos' practice squad. 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

8 minutes ago, vincec said:

So out of the 20 players you listed, there are 7 starters, 6 backups and 2 practice squad players. So 15 out of 20 made an NFL roster and half are heavy contributors. Yeah, that really stinks.

 

 

You're a twat.

 

How many of those are quality contributors?

 

Shaq Lawson, BUST.

Ragland, who knows what he'll be

Uncle Adolphus, tell me you're on board with his body of work?

Cardale Jones THIRD STRINGER

Ronald Darby, this guy I actually liked

John miller, an enigma

Sammy watkins, overpaid, overdrafted and overrated

Kouandijo, AWFUL

Preston Brown, buttery soft and gutless

Again, people need to be honest with themselves.

 

I will, however concede this point to the Whaley lovers: he was a much better evaluator of pro talent than college talent, and did manage some decent FA signings.

 

 

Edited December 6, 2017 by joesixpack

[Rico]

40 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

 

let's start from his most recent draft and work back. You tell me who's talented:

 

Shaq Lawson

Reggie Ragland

Adolphus Washington

Cardale Jones

Jonathan williams

Kolby listenbee

Kevon Seymour

 

Ronald Darby

John Miller

Karlos Williams

Tony Steward

Nick o leary

Dezmin lewis

 

Sammy watkins

Cyrus Kouandijo

Preston Brown

Ross Cockrell

Cyril richardson

Randell Johnson

Seantrel Henderson

 

 

I've said it before & I'll say it again, Nick O'Leary is a decent back-up TE.

[BringBackOrton]

39 minutes ago, vincec said:

So out of the 20 players you listed, there are 7 starters, 6 backups and 2 practice squad players. So 15 out of 20 made an NFL roster and half are heavy contributors. Yeah, that really stinks.

This number dwindles every year....because the players suck.

 

Goodwin is a starter on a horrible team.  He couldn't even start here.  

 

They will die out, like every draft class has before them.  2014 was all "We got 2 good starters in Watkins and Brown, and great backups in Kujo, Cockrell, Cyril Richardson, and Randall Johnson!  We hit on every pick!" Then the attrition happens.  Brown plays like ****.  Cockrell, Kujo, Richardson and Johnson get cut and bounced around over the next two years. Suddenly it's just Sammy, and he's traded away for relative peanuts.

 

Doug Whaley has never drafted a player who has made a Pro Bowl.  Absolutely damning stat, with the Pro Bowl being the sign of "had a pretty good season" these days.  

Edited December 6, 2017 by jmc12290

[BigDingus]

12 minutes ago, jmc12290 said:

This number dwindles every year....because the players suck.

 

Goodwin is a starter on a horrible team.  He couldn't even start here.  

 

They will die out, like every draft class has before them.  2014 was all "We got 2 good starters in Watkins and Brown, and great backups in Kujo, Cockrell, Cyril Richardson, and Randall Johnson!  We hit on every pick!" Then the attrition happens.  Brown plays like ****.  Cockrell, Kujo, Richardson and Johnson get cut and bounced around over the next two years. Suddenly it's just Sammy, and he's traded away for relative peanuts.

 

Doug Whaley has never drafted a player who has made a Pro Bowl.  Absolutely damning stat, with the Pro Bowl being the sign of "had a pretty good season" these days.  

^This 100%

 

Every year that goes by, the drafts look worse & worse as more players wash out of the league or end up further down the depth chart. The team is already souring on Washington, so look for him to begin that slide soon. Cyrus Kouandijo won't be in the league in another year or so either. Kevon Seymour has 16 tackles & 3 defended passes on the year, with goose eggs across the board elsewhere. Expect him to be training camp depth next year, then cut. Crockell is not a starter, he's a 2nd string CB & 3rd on the depth chart for the Giants (behind Brandon Dixon & Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie). 

So yes, for starters we have some players from last year's draft as starters, a few backups, and 3rd stringers or practice squad players. By next year there will be even less. These drafts have been total busts.

[simool]

Watkins elite talent, game changer.... FFS

 

 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

2 minutes ago, simool said:

Watkins elite talent, game changer.... FFS

 

 

 

Lol right? People need cranio-rectal extractions.

[BigDingus]

4 minutes ago, simool said:

Watkins elite talent, game changer.... FFS

 

 

 

"Dominant" is a word being thrown around easily these days... I guess Tyrod Taylor is "dominant" too... I mean Sammy has games where he goes for 67 yards, just like Tyrod does!

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

4 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

 

Lol right? People need cranio-rectal extractions.

 

....would that be dentistry?............

[3rdand12]

preston brown has 3 years running with 100 tackles plus. if this was a safety i would be unhappy. But from him?

 Not bad.

 and yes i watch the games and seen the bad ones. underrated 

Just now, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

....would that be dentistry?............

no. more like an extrusion.

[26CornerBlitz]

15 minutes ago, simool said:

Watkins elite talent, game changer.... FFS

 

 

 

 

Leads the teams with 17 YPC and 6 TD Receptions (4 TDs in the last 5 games). Has generated 27 first downs on his 31 receptions in only 51 targets all while drawing the opponents' best cover corner game every game often with Safety help over the top.  Meanwhile, let's take a comparative look at the Bills' Receiving Corps AKA Corpse.   

 

 

 

[BringBackOrton]

2 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

 

Leads the teams with 17 YPC and 6 TD Receptions (4 TDs in the last 5 games). Has generated 27 first downs on his 31 receptions in only 51 targets all while drawing the opponents' best cover corner game every game often with Safety help over the top.  Meanwhile, let's take a comparative look at the Bills' Receiving Corps AKA Corpse.   

 

 

 

We don't have Goff.

 

Ask Kelvin if that's made a difference in his numbers.

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, jmc12290 said:

We don't have Goff.

 

Ask Kelvin if that's made a difference in his numbers.

 

Watkins numbers were fine in 2015 in Buffalo.  We can ask Kelvin something when he's healthy and playing. 

[BringBackOrton]

4 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Watkins numbers were fine in 2015 in Buffalo.  We can ask Kelvin something when he's healthy and playing. 

What were Matthews' numbers in 2016?  What changed?

[CommonCents]

1 hour ago, joesixpack said:

 

 

You're a twat.

 

How many of those are quality contributors?

 

Shaq Lawson, BUST.

Ragland, who knows what he'll be

Uncle Adolphus, tell me you're on board with his body of work?

Cardale Jones THIRD STRINGER

Ronald Darby, this guy I actually liked

John miller, an enigma

Sammy watkins, overpaid, overdrafted and overrated

Kouandijo, AWFUL

Preston Brown, buttery soft and gutless

Again, people need to be honest with themselves.

 

I will, however concede this point to the Whaley lovers: he was a much better evaluator of pro talent than college talent, and did manage some decent FA signings.

 

 

Take it easy on Preston Brown, he is having a rough week in those panties.

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, jmc12290 said:

What were Matthews' numbers in 2016?  What changed?

 

No better players around him to draw coverage and the inability to stay healthy.  He's the personification of JAG which is exactly why the Eagles acquired Jeffery and Smith who replaced him as upgrades. BTW, here are the Bills' receiving numbers from 2015 with a mostly healthy Watkins and Taylor:

 

[BringBackOrton]

1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

No better players around him to draw coverage and the inability to stay healthy.  He's the personification of JAG which is exactly why the Eagles acquired Jeffery and Smith who replaced him as upgrades. BTW, here are the Bills' receiving numbers from 2015 with a mostly healthy Watkins and Taylor:

 

Look at how much better Woods is doing in LA this year compared to 2015.  What happened?

 

What better players drew coverage from Matthews in 2016?

Edited December 6, 2017 by jmc12290

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, jmc12290 said:

Look at how much better Woods is doing in LA this year compared to 2015.  What happened?

 

Sean McVay happened.  

[BringBackOrton]

Just now, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Sean McVay happened.  

And Sammy didn't see that benefit because?

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, jmc12290 said:

And Sammy didn't see that benefit because?

 

Stop asking questions and provide some answers man.  BTW, Trevor Siemian. 

[BringBackOrton]

1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Stop asking questions and provide some answers man.  BTW, Trevor Siemian. 

 

Just now, ScottLaw said:

?

 

Matthews isn't in the same ballpark as Sammy. It's not even close.

It's weird.

 

Jordan Matthews was better before he became a Bills WR.

 

Marquise Goodwin was better after he left the Bills.

 

Robert Woods was better after he left the Bills.

 

Chris Hogan was better after he left the Bills.

 

Kelvin Benjamin was better before he became a Bills WR.

 

Anyone know if that has to do with the QB's these guys were playing with on different teams?  Is there a common thread anyone can see here?  Bueller?  Bueller?