Bob in Mich Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 22 minutes ago, GG said: Facts aren't your strong suit, are they? Why do you ignore that Russians first act was to help Bernie? I am not ignoring that they may have helped Bernie before settling on Trump. What's the point, aside from a 'yeah but whatabout'? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koko78 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 23 minutes ago, GG said: Facts aren't your strong suit, are they? Why do you ignore that Russians first act was to help Bernie? Facts don't matter when they don't fit the narrative or approved talking points. Besides, what difference, at this point, does it make? Anyone who disagrees is a racist/misogynist/Nazi jerk who likes beating kittens to death with puppies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 17 minutes ago, Bob in Mich said: I am not ignoring that they may have helped Bernie before settling on Trump. What's the point, aside from a 'yeah but whatabout'? Because it blows up the entire Trump collusion narrative and raises hell of a lot more questions about why Obama admin sat on the info. Not that hard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 What’s next, Mueller finds the Russians were found to call people up on the phone and ask for credit card info on a scam? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob in Mich Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 7 minutes ago, GG said: Because it blows up the entire Trump collusion narrative and raises hell of a lot more questions about why Obama admin sat on the info. Not that hard Explain to me why it blows up the collusion narrative, if you would. Recall RR said, 'no collusion in THIS INDICTMENT'. The investigation continues with the Don Jr meeting still in play as the facet where collusion still may have taken place, imo. These indictments demonstrate pretty clearly, according to RR that in the period immediately prior to the 2016 election, the Russians attempted to influence in favor of Mr Trump, right? After the election they played both sides against each other but before they sided with Trump over Clinton. So many posters here keep chanting 'no evidence of collusion' but c'mon, that should stop now. Certainly there is insufficient proof shown but there are undeniable indications now that the Russians wanted to aid Mr Trump and indications from Trump Tower, that Trump's people were willing to hear out the Russians offer. That is most definitely not all of the pieces but it is two key pieces Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 39 minutes ago, Bob in Mich said: Explain to me why it blows up the collusion narrative, if you would. Recall RR said, 'no collusion in THIS INDICTMENT'. The investigation continues with the Don Jr meeting still in play as the facet where collusion still may have taken place, imo. These indictments demonstrate pretty clearly, according to RR that in the period immediately prior to the 2016 election, the Russians attempted to influence in favor of Mr Trump, right? After the election they played both sides against each other but before they sided with Trump over Clinton. So many posters here keep chanting 'no evidence of collusion' but c'mon, that should stop now. Certainly there is insufficient proof shown but there are undeniable indications now that the Russians wanted to aid Mr Trump and indications from Trump Tower, that Trump's people were willing to hear out the Russians offer. That is most definitely not all of the pieces but it is two key pieces That Trump Tower meeting was set up by the Russians. They claimed that they had dirt on HRC and of course Don Jr. and others wanted that dirt. Anybody running against her would want it too. The Russians really wanted to talk about the Magnitsky Act and Russian adoptions. The meeting didn't last very long. Don Jr., once he found out what they were really trying to do, ended the meeting. http://www.cnn.com/2017/07/21/politics/russian-adoptions-magnitsky-act/index.html Washington (CNN)President Donald Trump spoke with Russian President Vladimir Putin in an encounter not initially disclosed on the sidelines of an international summit this month. One of the topics, according to Trump? Russian adoptions. Top Trump campaign officials, including Donald Trump Jr., held a meeting in June 2016 with Soviet-born figures at Trump Tower that was kept secret for more than a year. When news first broke, what did Trump Jr. say was the main topic? Russian adoptions. So why are adoptions of Russian children by US parents, which are currently banned, such a hot topic of conversation for Russian officials and representatives? The issue actually gets to the heart of US-Russia relations, and its seemingly straightforward appearance masks a long history of punishing sanctions and retaliation between the two nations. Russia banned adoptions by US parents in 2012, a swift retaliatory action for a US law known as the Magnitsky Act that sanctioned Russian officials and nationals for human rights abuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 This is as sad as when the Leafs GM aggressively went after a dumb rumour about him on a chat board, which nobody believed anyways he held a press conference telling “Poonerman” that he was going to be held to this false post. anyone with Mueller under the age of 60 who can groove with the reality of internet people? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob in Mich Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 3rd, I know that is the administration story but there have been problems with apparent lies and backpedaling, right? At this point I cannot say I can take Don Jr at his word given the way the story has evolved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 You have figured out you shouldn’t trust politicians, Bobby? What’s next week, that a stranger can’t really take your rectal temperature with his finger? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Man Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 THIS HAS BEEN OBVIOUS FOR A WHILE:.................. Mueller Confirms: Russia Used Anti-Trump Resistance To Stoke Division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob in Mich Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 So, what's the story 33, are you one of these agents of Russia sowing discord on this PPP message board? As you know, I have mentioned this before but did not really get your response. I began to wonder because so many of your posts seem very divisive. Not as in holding a strong opinion in a discussion, but sort of drive-by divisive, like to stir up the discussion. You also speak of and defend Russia more than anyone else I have seen here, seem to have a strong European knowledge, and use some less familiar vocabulary. I know some here have claimed you are Canadian and you may live in Canada, but that alone, if true, would not invalidate the question. Did you emigrate to Canada recently? You don't post like most Canadians, not to mention the supposed Russian language posts you exchange with 3rd. Now those seem like BS and 3rd doesn't appear smart enough to be recruited as an agent but you, you.......not so sure about you 33. To other posters, just be aware of the possibilities. Even if I am in left field about 33, there could be divisive forces on here. Lord knows discussions around here devolve quickly into insult contests. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 7 minutes ago, Bob in Mich said: 3rd, I know that is the administration story but there have been problems with apparent lies and backpedaling, right? At this point I cannot say I can take Don Jr at his word given the way the story has evolved. As I recall when Don Jr. was first asked about that meeting he mentioned it was about adoptions. He was derided at the time. Then it came out the pretense for the meeting was the Trump campaign receiving dirt on HRC. You guys with TDS are making much more of this than it needs. Go read the entire CNN story at my link. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 1 minute ago, Bob in Mich said: So, what's the story 33, are you one of these agents of Russia sowing discord on this PPP message board? As you know, I have mentioned this before but did not really get your response. I began to wonder because so many of your posts seem very divisive. Not as in holding a strong opinion in a discussion, but sort of drive-by divisive, like to stir up the discussion. You also speak of and defend Russia more than anyone else I have seen here, seem to have a strong European knowledge, and use some less familiar vocabulary. I know some here have claimed you are Canadian and you may live in Canada, but that alone, if true, would not invalidate the question. Did you emigrate to Canada recently? You don't post like most Canadians, not to mention the supposed Russian language posts you exchange with 3rd. Now those seem like BS and 3rd doesn't appear smart enough to be recruited as an agent but you, you.......not so sure about you 33. To other posters, just be aware of the possibilities. Even if I am in left field about 33, there could be divisive forces on here. Lord knows discussions around here devolve quickly into insult contests. Any thoughts? Yes im sure the FSB is trolling the politics sub board of a privately owned board devoted to a third rate football team lol 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob in Mich Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 1 minute ago, joesixpack said: Yes im sure the FSB is trolling the politics sub board of a privately owned board devoted to a third rate football team lol Seemed pretty crazy that they were making divisive twitter and facebook posts too .... until yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Just now, Bob in Mich said: Seemed pretty crazy that they were making divisive twitter and facebook posts too .... until yesterday. Two key words: Twitter and Facebook 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 1 hour ago, Bob in Mich said: Explain to me why it blows up the collusion narrative, if you would. Recall RR said, 'no collusion in THIS INDICTMENT'. The investigation continues with the Don Jr meeting still in play as the facet where collusion still may have taken place, imo. These indictments demonstrate pretty clearly, according to RR that in the period immediately prior to the 2016 election, the Russians attempted to influence in favor of Mr Trump, right? After the election they played both sides against each other but before they sided with Trump over Clinton. So many posters here keep chanting 'no evidence of collusion' but c'mon, that should stop now. Certainly there is insufficient proof shown but there are undeniable indications now that the Russians wanted to aid Mr Trump and indications from Trump Tower, that Trump's people were willing to hear out the Russians offer. That is most definitely not all of the pieces but it is two key pieces What's the term for a person who keeps clinging to a narrative, despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob in Mich Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 2 minutes ago, GG said: What's the term for a person who keeps clinging to a narrative, despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary? I don't want to take up a lot of your time. The Sabres game starts in 10 minutes after all. Could you just tick off or point me to some of this overwhelming contrary evidence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 10 minutes ago, GG said: What's the term for a person who keeps clinging to a narrative, despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary? Gatoring? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Maiden Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 22 minutes ago, Bob in Mich said: So, what's the story 33, are you one of these agents of Russia sowing discord on this PPP message board? As you know, I have mentioned this before but did not really get your response. I began to wonder because so many of your posts seem very divisive. Not as in holding a strong opinion in a discussion, but sort of drive-by divisive, like to stir up the discussion. You also speak of and defend Russia more than anyone else I have seen here, seem to have a strong European knowledge, and use some less familiar vocabulary. I know some here have claimed you are Canadian and you may live in Canada, but that alone, if true, would not invalidate the question. Did you emigrate to Canada recently? You don't post like most Canadians, not to mention the supposed Russian language posts you exchange with 3rd. Now those seem like BS and 3rd doesn't appear smart enough to be recruited as an agent but you, you.......not so sure about you 33. To other posters, just be aware of the possibilities. Even if I am in left field about 33, there could be divisive forces on here. Lord knows discussions around here devolve quickly into insult contests. Any thoughts? If you really think this message board is anywhere close to be important enough to be manipulated by the " divisive " forces out there, you are definitely in left field.....that notion is beyond ridiculous..... Facebook and twitter reaches millions and millions of individuals.....TBD, not so much.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 (edited) 31 minutes ago, Bob in Mich said: So, what's the story 33, are you one of these agents of Russia sowing discord on this PPP message board? As you know, I have mentioned this before but did not really get your response. I began to wonder because so many of your posts seem very divisive. Not as in holding a strong opinion in a discussion, but sort of drive-by divisive, like to stir up the discussion. You also speak of and defend Russia more than anyone else I have seen here, seem to have a strong European knowledge, and use some less familiar vocabulary. I know some here have claimed you are Canadian and you may live in Canada, but that alone, if true, would not invalidate the question. Did you emigrate to Canada recently? You don't post like most Canadians, not to mention the supposed Russian language posts you exchange with 3rd. Now those seem like BS and 3rd doesn't appear smart enough to be recruited as an agent but you, you.......not so sure about you 33. To other posters, just be aware of the possibilities. Even if I am in left field about 33, there could be divisive forces on here. Lord knows discussions around here devolve quickly into insult contests. Any thoughts? Many Canadians hold to irony like humans hold to oxygen. british culture and expats have been influential in personal and leisure life, I deeply look forward to a book signing and small lecture by Martin Amis in town next week. As well Middle Europe and Russia have provided immense cultural influence through music studies and art appreciation and philosophy and all those great Russian novels of the 19th century More of a Dostoyevsky fan than a Tolstoy, if I may be that bold.... Have cheered mightily for the Bills and Leafs and Jays since the 1970s. Some small pockets of glory but mainly a diet of mediocrity for most of the 120 seasons or so that this has enrailed, helps to be ironic. Just catching up with the end of the postmodern world, so great for my mindset, probably will never get to be post-postmodern though Edited February 17, 2018 by row_33 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob in Mich Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Thanks. Not convinced necessarily but I appreciate a reply Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 5 minutes ago, Bob in Mich said: I don't want to take up a lot of your time. The Sabres game starts in 10 minutes after all. Could you just tick off or point me to some of this overwhelming contrary evidence? Perhaps a 9-month long investigation that hasn't found one shred of collusion? The biggest indictment to date is something that everyone has been speculating about for nearly 2 years, and does not involve any collusion whatsoever. Meanwhile anything that's been disclosed by the various executive & legislative investigations point to many more issues by the previous administration than anything Trump has done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 1 minute ago, Bob in Mich said: Thanks. Not convinced necessarily but I appreciate a reply You took the time, makes me feel at he same time alarmed and flattered. This was like a small cup of coffee chat? And if you come to Toronto maybe a Jays game? i wish nothing but the best for the US, it carries a lot of adult burdens for the whole world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 1 hour ago, Bob in Mich said: So many posters here keep chanting 'no evidence of collusion' but c'mon, that should stop now. Certainly there is insufficient proof shown but there are undeniable indications now that the Russians wanted to aid Mr Trump and indications from Trump Tower, that Trump's people were willing to hear out the Russians offer. That is most definitely not all of the pieces but it is two key pieces Only someone who's stoned could read a 36 page indictment - that doesn't talk about collusion at all - and then say that those saying there's "no evidence of collusion should stop". That's not only disingenuous, it's a reinvention of what is in the document you're citing. You're wrong. Of course you'd realize this if you read the document yourself rather than relying on what RR and "professionals" say about the document. It's called thinking. 45 minutes ago, Bob in Mich said: So, what's the story 33, are you one of these agents of Russia sowing discord on this PPP message board? As you know, I have mentioned this before but did not really get your response. 44 minutes ago, Bob in Mich said: Seemed pretty crazy that they were making divisive twitter and facebook posts too .... until yesterday. It didn't seem crazy to anyone who had been paying attention to this two year plus long story BEFORE yesterday. You just keep admitting that you haven't followed this story closely enough to have a strong opinion, yet you do nothing but spout propaganda and talking points which have long been debunked. It's hilarious to watch. 28 minutes ago, Bob in Mich said: I don't want to take up a lot of your time. The Sabres game starts in 10 minutes after all. Could you just tick off or point me to some of this overwhelming contrary evidence? Why bother? I tried, multiple times with lots of links and sources. You ignored them because you lack intellectual honesty. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 We all have our limits on depth on an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Man Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 This pales in comparison to the enjoyment and amusement of: Kerry clearly using his Nam service as a positive during his campaign. Then the resulting Swift Boat response. then the media and the Dems claiming that Kerry was entitled to use the Nam issue as only he demanded it be defined Wheel turning round and round... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 2 hours ago, Bob in Mich said: 3rd, I know that is the administration story but there have been problems with apparent lies and backpedaling, right? At this point I cannot say I can take Don Jr at his word given the way the story has evolved. So you missed the 23 hours of testimony before Congress about that very meeting that he underwent and the fact that nothing came of that? I would think that the Schifft would have hit the fan with anything he could smear a Trump with if there were anything to Jr.‘s “collusion” with the Rooskies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koko78 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 2 hours ago, row_33 said: You have figured out you shouldn’t trust politicians, Bobby? What’s next week, that a stranger can’t really take your rectal temperature with his finger? That wasn't his finger... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 I didn’t join this board until well after the November 2016 election, a few weeks after BBMB pulled the plug without warning. so my keenly honed subversive tactics were never practised at all for the Trump victory. and again, I wasn’t happy with him getting the nod, and didn’t think he had a ghost of a chance until he won, and I was happy she lost, and I think he’s done a better job than I thought he would to date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koko78 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 2 hours ago, joesixpack said: Yes im sure the FSB is trolling the politics sub board of a privately owned board devoted to a third rate football team lol The Bills are up to being a second-rate football team, mother!@#$er! 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 Just now, Koko78 said: That wasn't his finger... So so it was even more deceptive? curiouser and curiouser.... Next you’ll tell me there is no such thing as a leprechaun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Where Is the Democratic Outrage Over Spying on Americans? https://townhall.com/columnists/thomasjfarnan/2018/02/17/where-is-the-democratic-outrage-over-spying-on-americans-n2450480 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebug Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 6 hours ago, GG said: What's the term for a person who keeps clinging to a narrative, despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary? Trump? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Just now, thebug said: Trump? Hey, look at that. Sure does seem like these tweets - which he was mocked for endlessly - are actually true. We know they tried to get a warrant on Trump associates several times and it was rejected. We know they had Trump team and his associates (inside Trump Tower even) under surveillance from October 21, 2016 through October of 2017. Trump has said, several times, that Russia meddled. That's not in debate. What is in debate is if Russia colluded with Trump or his team to fix the election. That's what he has called a hoax. Not the meddling. Those who are trying to argue otherwise are either deceiving you or don't realize there is a difference between those two accusations. A subtle, but important difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebug Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said: Hey, look at that. Sure does seem like these tweets - which he was mocked for endlessly - are actually true. We know they tried to get a warrant on Trump associates several times and it was rejected. We know they had Trump team and his associates (inside Trump Tower even) under surveillance from October 21, 2016 through October of 2017. Trump has said, several times, that Russia meddled. That's not in debate. What is in debate is if Russia colluded with Trump or his team to fix the election. That's what he has called a hoax. Not the meddling. Those who are trying to argue otherwise are either deceiving you or don't realize there is a difference between those two accusations. A subtle, but important difference. No he said the whole thing was a hoax. Made up, never happened. And that’s just one example. The guy is a pathological liar. He’s mocked for most of his tweets because he’s an imbecile. Edited February 18, 2018 by thebug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Just now, thebug said: No he said the whole thing was a hoax. Made up, never happened. This is not true. See this, from July: A day before his first face-to-face meeting with Russian leader Vladimir Putin, President Trump agreed that Moscow meddled in the 2016 election but also claimed “other people” could have interfered – “nobody really knows for sure.” “I think it was Russia and I think it could have been other people in other countries,” Trump said during a joint press conference with Polish President Andrzej Duda, before throwing doubt on his own comments. “It could have been a lot of people interfered.” https://nypost.com/2017/07/06/trump-says-russia-and-maybe-other-countries-meddled-in-us-election/ No one denies Russia meddled in the election. The charge that Trump has fought is that he colluded actively with them to fix the election. There is a difference between the two. Surely you can see that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 11 minutes ago, thebug said: Trump? I implore you to, with a completely open mind, and no preconceived notions, to read through all of the evidence Deranged Rhino has been presenting for over a year now. If you ask him, I'm sure he can provide for you a detailed and well sourced timeline, either by links to an existing one, or otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebug Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said: This is not true. See this, from July: A day before his first face-to-face meeting with Russian leader Vladimir Putin, President Trump agreed that Moscow meddled in the 2016 election but also claimed “other people” could have interfered – “nobody really knows for sure.” “I think it was Russia and I think it could have been other people in other countries,” Trump said during a joint press conference with Polish President Andrzej Duda, before throwing doubt on his own comments. “It could have been a lot of people interfered.” https://nypost.com/2017/07/06/trump-says-russia-and-maybe-other-countries-meddled-in-us-election/ No one denies Russia meddled in the election. The charge that Trump has fought is that he colluded actively with them to fix the election. There is a difference between the two. Surely you can see that? Hard to believe a word he says. http://projects.thestar.com/donald-trump-fact-check/ they call them false things because he’s just too stupid to know what he’s talking about most of the time. Edited February 18, 2018 by thebug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaoulDuke79 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 4 minutes ago, thebug said: No he said the whole thing was a hoax. Made up, never happened. And that’s just one example. The guy is a pathological liar. He’s mocked for most of his tweets because he’s an imbecile. Just like you're mocked for most of your posts. You're in good company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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