Doug Whaley- Failure to Field a Competitive Roster

[KDIGGZ]

I'm guessing the Peguals are going to try and get their football czar in place and that person will name their own GM. Whaley is toast. He failed to address any of the needs of this team in the offseason which is a big reason why we are in the situation we are

[purple haze]

Still I don't want Whaley picking our future QB.

 

He doesn't seem to get it when it comes to that position.

Get what? Who would you want have wanted him to take that was certain to be good?

[GunnerBill]

It was when Rob was hired. That's what caused the Bills to descend into being a joke.

The coaching staff is entirely the reaponsibility of the Head Coach. They made this very clear at the introductory presser. Rex picks his staff. Rob's arrival wasnt a sign of lost autonomy for Whaley, he never had that in the first place.

 

I think it is one of the things that frustrates Whaley fans. He has never been given the keys to the car. He has been the one at the wheel but with constant back seat driving from ownership and coaches.

Get what? Who would you want have wanted him to take that was certain to be good?

The only year he has "missed" on guys was 2014 when Carr and Bridgewater were options (and without having to trade up before anyone says it). Neither were sure things but he could have picked either... the problem was at the time we only had 10 games of EJ tape to evaluate and they still thought there was some promise there.

[Niagara Dude]

With all due respect, Vince Lombardi could not coach the Bills defensive roster to cover the Jets receivers. It was the most ridiculously lop sided personnel matchup I have ever seen.

I still remember Fitz outrunning our Lorenzo Alexander to get a seven yard gain, this roster is garbage and the Jets showed that. I cannot wait for Whaley to be fired, drafting EJ and trading picks for Sammy have killed this franchise.

I know that people are frustrated....but this is all wrong

 

There is plenty of talent on this team......things that are NOT Whaley's fault

 

- Our blue chip D player is sitting on a 4 game suspension.......we are not getting interior pass rush pressure in the player we have a 100 million dollar contract in...he is also not there in crucial run stop situations which hurt us in this last game.

 

- Sammy Watkins is limited....injuries are not Whaley's fault especially when they did not a injury history in college.

 

- Shaq Lawson DID have an injury in college.....so you could blame him for that situation if you wanted to.....BUT....the jury is still out on this.....if Shaq comes back and that shoulder is fixed and he ends up being a force......then you should NOT blame him for that.

 

- Reggie Ragland was supposed to be a big part of this years defense.....you cant blame Whaley for that injury...and further more Z. Brown seems like he is a adequate replacement.....so he actually deserves credit here.

 

- Kujo......it has sure taken long enough....but Kujo no actually looks like a good swing tackle

 

- Lets not forget that this talent was good enough to go 4-2 in our own division last year

 

Talent is not the problem...how the talent is being used is the problem. Injuries are a problem.......

Really... our WR position after Sammy who he gave a boat load to get is garabge. Robert Woods as # 2 and our LB'S are a bunch of street bums. Very few play makers on defense this season and it showed Thursday.

[todd]

I think the main problem is that there's really one really good WR on the roster - Watkins. There's one good TE - Clay. After that, our receiving capability is really horrible. This is Whaley's biggest mistake, and one so glaring he deserves to be called out for it and maybe fired. There are some significant holes on the roster that have been ignored for years.

[GunnerBill]

Every team has holes on the roster. This year's has more than last year's granted but that is a result of the squeezed middle phenomenen that I have talked about elsewhere.

 

The "horrible" receivers mentioned above have been getting open. Our Quarterback can't see them and find them.

[Philly McButterpants]

sorry the difference between the jets and the Bills was talent. If that wasn't apparent. I don't know what too say. Not simply QB's and coaching. In fact not many here would say even after two crap Bills games anyone would swap Fitz for Tyrod.

We owned the Jets last season. What is the major talent upgrade that they received in the off season??

[Hapless Bills Fan]

I'm guessing the Peguals are going to try and get their football czar in place and that person will name their own GM. Whaley is toast. He failed to address any of the needs of this team in the offseason which is a big reason why we are in the situation we are

 

Oh Brother. Don't you think this is a little bit revisionist? As I recall, we all went into the draft thinking we needed a pass-rushing DE, a high quality LB, and maybe a stout DT. "All" in this case would include Rex.

As I recall we all felt pretty good about the draft and the contracts that were negotiated to keep some quality players. We brought in some lower-tier vet FA on D who are looking pretty good and we rolled the dice with a bunch of OLmen who didn't work out (but at least we didn't overpay as with Williams). Shaq was a deliberate risk/reward move where they lost the toss. Whaley is not responsible for ACL tears nor players who show up fat and stoned.

 

Link to your off-season post showing what you identified (before the draft) as the Bills primary off-season needs that weren't met in the offseason and earn the Golden Pear of Prescience. Otherwise you stand convicted of revisionist history Grade I.

We owned the Jets last season. What is the major talent upgrade that they received in the off season??

 

Someone apparently lit Fitz crotch hairs on fire and it only goes out when he throws long completions.

I think the main problem is that there's really one really good WR on the roster - Watkins. There's one good TE - Clay. After that, our receiving capability is really horrible. This is Whaley's biggest mistake, and one so glaring he deserves to be called out for it and maybe fired. There are some significant holes on the roster that have been ignored for years.

 

I think if you look at the game film, you will see we have guys who run good routes and get open. Sometimes more than one per play. We don't have a QB who is successfully exploiting open receivers.

 

This is far far from the worst problem on the roster.

[thebandit27]

 

Oh Brother. Don't you think this is a little bit revisionist? As I recall, we all went into the draft thinking we needed a pass-rushing DE, a high quality LB, and maybe a stout DT. "All" in this case would include Rex.

As I recall we all felt pretty good about the draft and the contracts that were negotiated to keep some quality players. We brought in some lower-tier vet FA on D who are looking pretty good and we rolled the dice with a bunch of OLmen who didn't work out (but at least we didn't overpay as with Williams). Shaq was a deliberate risk/reward move where they lost the toss. Whaley is not responsible for ACL tears nor players who show up fat and stoned.

 

Link to your off-season post showing what you identified (before the draft) as the Bills primary off-season needs that weren't met in the offseason and earn the Golden Pear of Prescience. Otherwise you stand convicted of revisionist history Grade I.

 

 

Someone apparently lit Fitz crotch hairs on fire and it only goes out when he throws long completions.

 

 

I think if you look at the game film, you will see we have guys who run good routes and get open. Sometimes more than one per play. We don't have a QB who is successfully exploiting open receivers.

 

This is far far from the worst problem on the roster.

Great post.

 

From a guy that was there, I can tell you for sure that there were open targets all game long.

 

Goodwin, specifically, was consistently open.

[jethro_tull]

Whaley is not the problem. You can clearly see the difference in talent on this team over the last 3-4 years. The problem is the utilization of this talent. Schwartz got the most out of the defense. No one has gotten the most out of the offense as of yet. Until we have coaches that do so and a QB who doesn't look like JP Losman reincarnate we will be fair to middlen every year.

He is, specifically for the reason that the Bills corners have been exposed as easily vulnerable to taller, bigger receivers, especially by the best in our division. It happened last season to the better teams- the Bills literally could not stop the bigger TEs on the Redskins, Patriots and Bengals. They were powerless against them.

The Jets happened to pick up on this in a light bulb moment and it worked- big time. The corners were swatted off as if they were gnats. The Bills secondary defense was gutted and exposed for being non-competitive against bigger receivers. Again, they are the wrong guys for the job and the one who hired them failed.

where do we come up with this crap.....how are supposed to respect your opinion on other things when you post this stuff.

 

9-7 is competitive 8-8 is also competitive

 

your laboring under the illusion we are going 1-15 or 2-14

They are not competitive against the best teams- meaning playoff teams. I thought that was the goal- the playoffs. Not competitive against the parity mediocre teams, competitive against playoff teams.

How close do you believe this team is to making the playoffs?

 

*************Go back and look at the Bills record vs. playoff teams under Whaley. It is horrible and indicates failure IMHO.

[Dopey]

1. Dareus. "Character" issues - including taking into account intel on a player's off the field activities - go into deciding whether to draft a player or to sign him to a big contract with guaranteed money. Don't tell me the GM isn't aware of these things. So no, Whaley isn't responsible for Dareus picking up another drug suspension, but it's not like he didn't have reason to believe this could certainly happen.

 

2. Sammy. Not his fault at all.

 

3. Lawson. Definitely on Whaley. He may turn out to be a great pick. But to the extent that he was a "we need to fill a defensive hole immediately because we're in a win-now philosophy", he was a really ill-advised pick.

 

4. Ragland. Not his fault at all. And I do think Whaley did a decent job in finding some decent players on the waiver wire to fill the gap, but this one really hurt.

 

5. Kujo. I disagree on this one. I haven't watched the All 22, and I don't pretend to be an expert here. But Kujo was certainly expected to seize a starting OT job by now, and it's telling that he's behind Jordan Mills on the depth chart.

 

And the idea that "talent is not the problem" remains the problem. I think we have middle of the road talent, right there with the Jets and Dolphins, but I consider that to be a problem -- for the last few years, the theory has been we can get a few lucky breaks and sneak into the playoffs. That's not a recipe for sustained success.

 

You left out the pats. Other than Brady and gronk, that is as middle of the road talent as you can get. Wanna guess the big difference? Hint: it's not talent or cheating. Another hint : his initials are BB.

[jethro_tull]

****Under Doug Whaley's watch

 

The Bills are 4 and 12 vs. playoff teams. One of those games was against the Patriots at the end of the season when they had already clinched.

 

Basically 3 and 13 against playoff teams.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

He is, specifically for the reason that the Bills corners have been exposed as easily vulnerable to taller, bigger receivers, especially by the best in our division. It happened last season to the better teams- the Bills literally could not stop the bigger TEs on the Redskins, Patriots and Bengals. They were powerless against them.

The Jets happened to pick up on this in a light bulb moment and it worked- big time. The corners were swatted off as if they were gnats. The Bills secondary defense was gutted and exposed for being non-competitive against bigger receivers. Again, they are the wrong guys for the job and the one who hired them failed.

 

The Bills were not getting pressure. Fitz wasn't beating them by getting it out quickly under duress - if he had been, they would have had a shot at mistakes. The CB repeatedly face taller WR and they don't look as bad - when they're supported by QB pressure. When you face a team with 4 legit receiving options and you let the QB be "comfortable" in the pocket, I don't care if you've got Godzilla and TRex at CB they're going to get torched.

 

Everyone would like to have Kam Chancellor and Richard Sherman out there. But big, tall, fast, agile DB who can cover superbly are not that common. There's a reason 3 of the 4 Denver CB are 5'10", 5'11" and Talib is only 6'1". Carolina Panthers, 6'0" and 6'1", just to look at a few teams noted for stout defense.

 

Gilmore is 6'1" and Darby 5'11". You write as though Whaley drafted Smurfs who are way out of line for good DB in the league physically, but that's not it.

[Best Player Available]

We owned the Jets last season. What is the major talent upgrade that they received in the off season??

Talent upgrade or better all around coaching in 2016? The Jets are in year 2 like the Bills. And like the Bills it's more than just the HC.

here's a few names of players that seemed to know their jobs Thursday. Not a lot of new faces. But the Bills and these receivers would benefit from being on the Bills roster. Brandon Marshall, Eric Decker, Quincy Enunwa,

Nick mangold the old center. Leonard williams, Sheldon Richardson. Really the whole front 7 looked kind of look nasty. Matt Forte played like a player younger than he is. Was it him or thier O-line. so off season acquisitions and players that have been there. a solid game plan which Rex had no idea on how to adjust.(full disclosure he never does) Especially the passing game. good thing Revis lost a step.

Rex's ability to win his little revenge games against a former employer seems to have evaporated. The pats*** game once circled as a win. is now anything but a sure thng.

[PolishDave]

****Under Doug Whaley's watch

 

The Bills are 4 and 12 vs. playoff teams. One of those games was against the Patriots at the end of the season when they had already clinched.

 

Basically 3 and 13 against playoff teams.

 

This is an example of how fans grasp for straws when the team is playing lousy. Fire everyone. It's everyone's fault. Everybody sucks. And now its Whaley's fault the Bills have a bad record against playoff teams.. Too funny dude...

 

Face it. Whaley is not the problem on this team. These coaches aren't getting the production out of the talent that is already there. There is plenty of talent on this roster.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

****Under Doug Whaley's watch

 

The Bills are 4 and 12 vs. playoff teams. One of those games was against the Patriots at the end of the season when they had already clinched.

 

Basically 3 and 13 against playoff teams.

 

Look, this is ridiculous. No one is going to say that the Bills have shown up as legit against the best under Marrone and Ryan. The point about the record 4-12 vs teams that eventually made the playoffs is legit and well-taken.

 

But you don't take away wins because you come up with extenuating circumstances, the record is the record. What's next, wins against NE the first 4 games don't count because, Gronk? and Brady?

 

This is just as silly as the people who want to excise long throws from Tyrod's stats. They are part of his skill set and part of his stats. One can legitimately point out problems - failure to convert 3rd downs, failure to hit open WR over the middle - but the positives are just as legitimate.

[CountryCletus]

 

The Bills were not getting pressure. Fitz wasn't beating them by getting it out quickly under duress - if he had been, they would have had a shot at mistakes. The CB repeatedly face taller WR and they don't look as bad - when they're supported by QB pressure. When you face a team with 4 legit receiving options and you let the QB be "comfortable" in the pocket, I don't care if you've got Godzilla and TRex at CB they're going to get torched.

 

Everyone would like to have Kam Chancellor and Richard Sherman out there. But big, tall, fast, agile DB who can cover superbly are not that common. There's a reason 3 of the 4 Denver CB are 5'10", 5'11" and Talib is only 6'1". Carolina Panthers, 6'0" and 6'1", just to look at a few teams noted for stout defense.

 

Gilmore is 6'1" and Darby 5'11". You write as though Whaley drafted Smurfs who are way out of line for good DB in the league physically, but that's not it.

Smurfs.... LMFAO

 

Well- they are blue at home games...

[May Day 10]

Whaley seems very good at identifying defensive prospects. I would give him an A or a B in that realm. There are a lot of Ds and Fs such as identifying offensive talent, team makeup, coaching staff/scheme matching his personnel, cap allocation/management, and ultimately team performance.

[H2o]

He is, specifically for the reason that the Bills corners have been exposed as easily vulnerable to taller, bigger receivers, especially by the best in our division. It happened last season to the better teams- the Bills literally could not stop the bigger TEs on the Redskins, Patriots and Bengals. They were powerless against them.

The Jets happened to pick up on this in a light bulb moment and it worked- big time. The corners were swatted off as if they were gnats. The Bills secondary defense was gutted and exposed for being non-competitive against bigger receivers. Again, they are the wrong guys for the job and the one who hired them failed.

We beat the Jets twice last year. It was a bad game all around. It was also a typical performance of a Rob Ryan coached defense. Look at Dallas and NO when he was there and the passing statistics of opposing teams. You'll see exactly what I'm talking about. I guess you expect Whaley to find some freakish 6'4" guys to play CB. Darby and Gilmore were top 15 in the league last year. What has really changed from last year to this? You guessed it, or maybe you didn't, but the answer is Rob Ryan. Whaley has fielded the best roster, from top to bottom, we have had since the 9-7 year with Bledsoe at the helm. Not saying we have the greatest roster in the NFL, but our best in quite some time. If you want to talk about $ and contracts be my guest, but talent wise we should have enough to compete for a WC spot. We are missing some key guys right now as well. Coaching, coaching, coaching is the problem right now and that is something that the Pegula's have never let Whaley in on. Edited September 18, 2016 by H2o

[dave mcbride]

For the record, Gilmore (6'1") and Darby (5'11") aren't short for nfl corners. Anyway, when measuring you have to focus on height plus wingspan (players defend with their arms and hands, not heads) and - crucially - their vertical. Darby had an OUTSTANDING vertical at the combine: 41.5".

 

Thesea are the sorts of factors that make the 6'3" Michael Crabtree play like a 6'7" guy -- he has freakishly long arms. Same for the 6'10" Olajuwon, whose wingspan made him "taller" than a lot of 7 footers.

Edited September 18, 2016 by dave mcbride