Rex's D

[BADOLBILZ]

GG brings up a good point. Teams realized what the Bills did last year and how well the fearsome foursome rushed the passer and how many sacks we got. In the first game of the year, the Colts played us fairly vanilla and ran their regular offense. We did well and Luck was pretty much a non factor.

 

The second game was the turning point of the season. Belichick and Brady made sure the front four was not going to hurt him. They threw pretty much every pass within two seconds. There was zero chance even Schwqartz's defense was going to get any sacks against that offense. Rex made a monumental strategic error by not pressing and the Pats caught all kinds of short passes, Lewis killed us and we looked back on our heels.

 

The third game the Dolphins, stupidly, just played their regular offense and Tannehill would drop back and look around and again we played pretty well and won the game.

 

The fourth game, against another smart coach and QB, Eli Manning threw virtually every pass quickly. There was no time for a rush and again we were carved up by a short passing game especially because Rex decided to take OBJ out of the game.

 

From then on, pretty much every team threw quick passes against us. The front four got more and more frustrated. Injuries mounted, and we didn't improve until late.

 

But the fact is, Schwartz's defense was not going to be able to get sacks against Brady or Eli any more than Rex's did, and we shut down the two guys that tried to step back and throw. It wasn't until the Bengals game, an undefeated team with a treendous offense and line at that point in the season, who started out throwing very quick, that we couldn't mount any rush.

And Dalton stepped back and had all day to throw

 

 

We will have to disagree about the Giants game.

 

A week later the familiar Eagles totally embarrassed the Giants with a true wide nine, press coverage gameplan.

 

The Pats game was annoying but Rex has perfected losing close games to the Pats so until proven otherwise he appears satisfied with losing by 10 points or less to his master.

 

Losing that Giants game was the first real travesty of "the year that Rex killed".

[YoloinOhio]

It's not like all teams threw it quickly. They didn't. After awhile, when Mario quit and Kyle was out we didn't get any pressure no matter how long they sat back there.

on one of the two plays Dareus dropped back in KC, one of the all 22 guys said it was the right call since 1) he got the ball out in 2 sec on the TD and Dareus was getting double teamed with Mario and Kyle out, he wouldn't have gotten home anyway that quickly had he rushed that time and 2) it's not at all uncommon to drop a Dlineman against a short pass offense like KC. They were trying to trap the routes and shut down the short passing game because typically Alex smith won't or can't throw deep. Rex made him do so and trusted the CBs to make the plays downfield. Smith and his WR executed. Darby and Butler didn't.

 

As I recall there was also some discussion that Dareus dropped in coverage those two snaps instead of rushing out of fatigue because of the lack of DL rotation caused by injuries. I think Thurman denied that, however.

Edited January 26, 2016 by YoloinOhio

[Kelly the Dog]

 

 

We will have to disagree about the Giants game.

 

A week later the familiar Eagles totally embarrassed the Giants with a true wide nine, press coverage gameplan.

 

The Pats game was annoying but Rex has perfected losing close games to the Pats so until proven otherwise he appears satisfied with losing by 10 points or less to his master.

 

Losing that Giants game was the first real travesty of "the year that Rex killed".

I'm not sure what you are disagreeing with in the Giants game. Eli threw almost all quick 2 second passes which were the reason they beat us. He didn't take deep drops a lot. Rex tried to take OBJ out of the game and did. The secondary receivers and backs were killing us when they were gaining yardage. All I was saying was that teams didn't try to beat Schwartz's defense throwing quick passes except the Pats in game one where they killed us.

[BADOLBILZ]

Agree with that. The point is, however, that teams didn't throw 2 second passes against us when Schwartz was here. They did this year because of what Schwartz did last year. There is no defense that can get sacks against 2 second passes.

 

Teams didn't throw 2 second passes against the 2014 D because they didn't want to give the ball away.

 

They threw quickly this year because the throws were there to be made.

[GG]

We will have to disagree about the Giants game.

 

A week later the familiar Eagles totally embarrassed the Giants with a true wide nine, press coverage gameplan.

 

The Pats game was annoying but Rex has perfected losing close games to the Pats so until proven otherwise he appears satisfied with losing by 10 points or less to his master.

 

Losing that Giants game was the first real travesty of "the year that Rex killed".

I'll have to watch the Giants Eagles game, but did MacAdoo call the same offense in both games?

 

I'm not excusing Rex for not having his players ready and being confused with the offense. Just that the Schwartz ball washing needs to stop. I have a hunch that Schwartz's D would have gotten killed much worse than Rex this year, especially if you factor the injuries.

[Kelly the Dog]

 

Teams didn't throw 2 second passes against the 2014 D because they didn't want to give the ball away.

 

They threw quickly this year because the throws were there to be made.

I don't know if i agree with the first statement at all. It's not like we were picking off a lot of short quick passes.

[GG]

The second game was the turning point of the season. Belichick and Brady made sure the front four was not going to hurt him. They threw pretty much every pass within two seconds. There was zero chance even Schwqartz's defense was going to get any sacks against that offense. Rex made a monumental strategic error by not pressing and the Pats caught all kinds of short passes, Lewis killed us and we looked back on our heels.

 

 

 

All you have to do is watch the 2nd half of the first Pats* game in 2014.

[fansince88]

I've heard, of course, that Rex tried - and failed - to merge systems.

 

But I hadn't seen this article before. Thanks for posting. Unlike much of the schlop in the media these days, this was pretty well-reasoned and informative.

 

I still think it's interesting that Schwartz could get good productivity from these players and Rex couldn't. No matter how you slice and dice it, this year's disappointment is all on Rex.

 

While the article does make me a bit more optimistic about 2016, I'm a long time snake-bitten Bills fan and perpetually in the I'LL BELIEVE IT WHEN I SEE IT mode these days.

Rex did not have the same LB's as Schwartz. That was huge.

It's not like all teams threw it quickly. They didn't. After awhile, when Mario quit and Kyle was out we didn't get any pressure no matter how long they sat back there.

Mario Quitting was just as huge as Kyle's injury.

[The Big Cat]

Lol evidence?

 

Our defense went from great to below average under Ryan without losing much of anything from the personnel.

 

So I should just believe Rex and this article in that he tried to run Schwartz's scheme but it just wasn't working.

 

Got it.

 

Hell what's the point of this thread? To defend Rex?

 

The guy sucked this year. Plain and simple. Why is this so hard to admit for some? He most likely has one more year to get it fixed. If not I'll go out on a limb and predict him and his brother will be out of the league in 2017.

 

http://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/184706-rexs-d/?do=findComment&comment=3856556

[jr1]

multiple pro bowlers on offense. Rex's d was the weak link

[John from Riverside]

Count me as one of the fans not happy with what Rex did with this defense.....but I will give him the year to get it straightened out

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Wasn't the NY Jets defense top 10 in total defense every year but 1 from 2011-2014? And the one year it wasn't was 2013, when they were a dreadful 11th.

 

It depends on the metric. I'm not sure what "total defense" means. If you mean YPG (rush + pass) yes. If you mean PPG, no.

[Reed83HOF]

Count me as one of the fans not happy with what Rex did with this defense.....but I will give him the year to get it straightened out

 

I don't think you will find any fans happy with what happened to the D. That is what kept us out of the playoffs. Regardless who the coach is it has to get better next year. In some regards I really like Rex (most players love the guy and play well for him; he is always all in and wants to win) as a coach, in other regards I can't stand him (he's stubborn and a poor game day head coach). I can guarantee that he is embarrassed with the D this year and is all-in regarding fixing it. Both Ryan's have huge egos and I would suspect that they are going to work this offseason prove the world wrong next year in regards to the criticism's being hurled at them...

 

At least that is what I'm telling myself. I'm trying to drink some kool-aid and enjoy it before it gets pissed in again

[BADOLBILZ]

I'll have to watch the Giants Eagles game, but did MacAdoo call the same offense in both games?

 

I'm not excusing Rex for not having his players ready and being confused with the offense. Just that the Schwartz ball washing needs to stop. I have a hunch that Schwartz's D would have gotten killed much worse than Rex this year, especially if you factor the injuries.

 

1) Don't trust your hunch.....this years D was the less than mediocre. A violent pass rush with an improved offense/running game would have been a better formula than what worked on D in 2014. Speculating that the D would have been worse is nothing more than the fox that couldn't reach the grapes rationalizing that they were probably sour anyway.

 

2) Injuries aren't all random. They are often a byproduct of unusual action and fatigue. Both of which were in much greater supply courtesy of Rex hodge-podge 2015 D.

 

3) I don't ballwash Schwartz so enough of that nonsense. He is a one trick DC whose D only works with great talent on the DL. That being the case, the fact that he couldn't do as well or better reflected very poorly on the renowned defensive genius Rex Ryan.

[BADOLBILZ]

I don't know if i agree with the first statement at all. It's not like we were picking off a lot of short quick passes.

 

I didn't say they did. But if you throw a contested pass into the teeth of a press covering, ballhawking defense you run the risk of a tipped pass and a turnover.

 

Case in point, the Packers game. People always point out that play where Rodgers missed Nelson on the double move that could have been a TD later in that game..... but prior to that he threw what should have been a pick six to Gilmore on a throw what was basically at the LOS.......the kind of short pass the Bills were assaulted with early in 2015. If the receiver isn't open, you don't throw the pass.

 

That's the way Schwartz D worked, pass rush from sprinter stance at hard wide angles to spread the OL apart and press receivers to disrupt timing and cause the QB to hold the ball long enough to get to the QB. It's a package and it worked as well as it did because it was executed like it was drawn up.

 

Just because you line up 4 DL does not make it the same wide 9 look. Much of the time the Bills had rushers STANDING UP at the pass rush, which hinders explosiveness and decreases leverage and ability to get under OL pads. They also had different gap responsibilities.......where they basically had 1 gap to rush in Schwartz D. Rex can BS all he wants but the devil is in the details. He wasn't comfortable running Schwartz D and he obviously wasn't comfortable running his own with the personnel he had so it's on him. He was epically bad in 2015.

[FireChan]

I'd love to see some examples of this "blend" where Mario and the gang had one gap responsibility and they failed with the DB's in press. I don't consider making our expensive defensive line play two gap and "read and react" blending when the CB's are 10 yards off the WR's. That's more like trying to lose.

Edited January 26, 2016 by FireChan

[GunnerBill]

I think that explains what Rex referred to in his further explanation, that he couldn't continue to run the Schwartz scheme because they were getting killed. But when the injury bug hit and Mario quit, he couldn't do much more.

You are arguing against arguments I am not making. I have never said I wanted Rex to run the Schwartz defense and I have never said Schwartz's defense worked against Tom Brady.

 

In fact whethere people are "ball washing" Schwartz or not is irrelevant to what happened to the 2015 defense. I don't know why you keep bringing him up. The 2015 defense is the responsibility of Rex Ryan and Dennis Thurman.

Edited January 26, 2016 by GunnerBill

[YoloinOhio]

 

It depends on the metric. I'm not sure what "total defense" means. If you mean YPG (rush + pass) yes. If you mean PPG, no.

nfl.com uses the Total Defense metric. It is a combination of various stats that they use to rank.

 

.

Edited January 26, 2016 by YoloinOhio

[ALF]

My problem with the Rex D

 

Plays getting called in late

 

Last second substitutions

 

Leaving the players confused and poor discipline for penalties

 

The Bills do not have the cap space to rebuild the defense to fit Rex's system let alone re-sign key players

 

The last game against the Jets who needed that win , the D looked good despite injuries, so I give Rex credit there

[Coach Tuesday]

Admittedly I don't understand X's and O's as much as some of you.

 

But from my standpoint, the problem with the first Patriots game wasn't so much the pass rush strategy as it was the coverage strategy. The CBs were playing 10 yards off. It was pitch-and-catch for Tommy Boy and his receivers.

 

Isn't Rex's defense about coverages more than the pass rush? Shouldn't this article be analyzing coverages in the backend? Again, I admit I'm no expert here. Just floating out the idea.