Russ Brandon: "Marrone Has Changed the Bills' Culture"

[26CornerBlitz]

Well he did just defeat the team that was declared by many as the best in the NFL. Certainly one of if not the NFC favorite so yes of course I could.

 

You did this last week asking for a signature win. This was his signature win. Last year with a 6-10 team the Bills beat the defending SB champs.

 

Good win. Too bad he'll likely be watching the playoffs at home just like you and I will.

[YoloinOhio]

 

 

And that's the whole Gailey point. We had less talent then ( a bunch of UDFA receivers, Chandler was a nobody) and he produced. It's easy to design gameplans with Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers. Good coaches can make Mark Sanchez look like a starting NFL QB.

 

IMO, too many offensive players have regressed (Glenn, Wood, Pears, Spiller, etc.). good coaches bring the best out of their players. Our defensive coaches have. Our offensive coaches have not.

 

 

 

I could be wrong but I think Schwartz has the coaches he wants in mind and then gets the final say so in hiring from Marrone. I think Marrone has very little input on the defense. For instance, Sean Payton focuses on offense.

a HC typically has a background in offense, defense or ST but that doesn't mean they don't have input on the others or are very involved in the hiring of the assistants.

[section122]

And that's the whole Gailey point. We had less talent then ( a bunch of UDFA receivers, Chandler was a nobody) and he produced. It's easy to design gameplans with Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers. Good coaches can make Mark Sanchez look like a starting NFL QB.

 

IMO, too many offensive players have regressed (Glenn, Wood, Pears, Spiller, etc.). good coaches bring the best out of their players. Our defensive coaches have. Our offensive coaches have not.

 

Sanchez has regressed greatly and they have lost 2 in a row. That said Kelly is the only coach who has his team in the top 6 offensively without an elite level qb. Sure it can be done but it is definitely the exception and not the rule. As for Gailey getting it done, Gailey in 3 years averaged 20.83 points a game. Marrone in 2 years has averaged 21.4 points a game. I also still contend that this is the second best year of Orton's career so maybe the coaching is getting the best out of their players. Their best just isn't good enough.

 

I could be wrong but I think Schwartz has the coaches he wants in mind and then gets the final say so in hiring from Marrone. I think Marrone has very little input on the defense. For instance, Sean Payton focuses on offense.

 

3 of 5 coaches are returning. The only new additions to the staff (from the website so don't quote me) are Pepper and Pagac.

[YoloinOhio]

Serious question for me is can anyone envision Marrone leading the Bills to a Super Bowl win against a high caliber counterpart?

i don't see why not?

[C.Biscuit97]

a HC typically has a background in offense, defense or ST but that doesn't mean they don't have input on the others or are very involved in the hiring of the assistants.

 

IMO, how you get a guy with Schwartz background to come here, is let him have complete control. Do you honestly think Schwartz would be here if had Marrone breathing down his neck? That's why Pettine came here. So he could prove himself away from Rex.

 

Marrone has done a great job at hiring DCs for a very talented defense. He stuck with Crossman and props to him for that. But Hackett was an awful hire and I believe Marrone has a very large hand in the offense, especially the oline. IF we don't make the playoffs, it will be because of the offense solely.

[section122]

Good win. Too bad he'll likely be watching the playoffs at home just like you and I will.

 

Ask and Marrone shall deliver

 

Seriously though how can you ask that question coming off of Sundays win?

 

It really is too bad that someone, that cares about the Bills as much as you obviously do, can't enjoy the best season of Bills football in a decade. This has been fun! For 8 Sundays so far the evening has been a little better, it has been a little easier to get up and go into work on Monday, that is the most in a long time and something I will celebrate.

Edited December 17, 2014 by section122

[Kelly the Dog]

Sorry KtD, but if you think that was terrific coaching, then I think your standards are way too low. Using timeouts there was a no-brainer that I don't think even he could have screwed that up.

 

I'm referring to the times where there's a minute left on the clock at the end of the first half, and the other team is punting deep from their own side of the field and the clock is running down while he stands there looking completely clueless holding onto three timeouts.

 

I'm referring to him gifting the Patriots three points at the end of the first half earlier this year when they had no timeouts and could only throw to the end zone or a quick out to the sidelines.

 

These simple mistakes don't always seem like much but they add up. The worst part is that they are black and white decisions that are just not handled correctly because of nothing other than incompetence.

 

This kind of stuff happens way too often. This is what I mean when I say they are winning in spite of him.

I agree with a lot of that. Which is why I said he often doesnt do well.

 

But totally disagree with no brainer comment you made. I have been screaming at the TV for decades over that concept. Hardly any coach does it; call timeouts with 5-6 minutes left. They wait til 3-4 or even 2.

[26CornerBlitz]

Ask and Marrone shall deliver

 

It really is too bad that someone, that cares about the Bills as much as you obviously do, can't enjoy the best season of Bills football in a decade. This has been fun! For 8 Sundays so far the evening has been a little better, it has been a little easier to get up and go into work on Monday, that is the most in a long time and something I will celebrate.

 

You want to celebrate the arrival of mediocrity in what will likely culminate in another non-playoff season, you are certainly entitled. I'll wait to celebrate after a more praise worthy accomplishment, particularly when I believe them team is playoff caliber. Enjoy!

Edited December 17, 2014 by 26CornerBlitz

[FireChan]

So if Whaley doesn't fire Marrone and/or Hackett, that kinda invalidates everybody wanting either of those guys gone, right? I mean, if Whaley obtaining talent (which of course has nothing to do with the HC, lol) is the sole reason we are where we are, and Whaley is great, then not firing either of those guys is the right move, right? Or will we see a 180, call it Whaley's biggest mistake, and want him fired too?

[TheBillsWillRiseAgain]

Whaley has made far too many amazing moves to ever consider firing him.

[C.Biscuit97]

Ask and Marrone shall deliver

 

Seriously though how can you ask that question coming off of Sundays win?

 

It really is too bad that someone, that cares about the Bills as much as you obviously do, can't enjoy the best season of Bills football in a decade. This has been fun! For 8 Sundays so far the evening has been a little better, it has been a little easier to get up and go into work on Monday, that is the most in a long time and something I will celebrate.

 

I'm strruggling with this year but I just think it could be so much more. I hate that we are playing Orton because it accomplishes nothing long term. I hate the way we misused Spiller and failed to find a way to use Mike Williams. I hate that good linemen like Wood and Glenn have regressed.

 

That said, I love everything about the defense. IT's probably one of my favorite groups of all time. I feel they are owed so much more than this crappy Kyle Orton/ Nate Hackett led offense. This might be the homer coming out, but with a half decent offense, I think we could make a SB run. I just want more and this should be a playoff year.

 

And if we trick ourselves into believing guys liek Hackett/ Orton are good enough, we aren't going away in the future.

[The Big Cat]

So if Whaley doesn't fire Marrone and/or Hackett, that kinda invalidates everybody wanting either of those guys gone, right? I mean, if Whaley obtaining talent (which of course has nothing to do with the HC, lol) is the sole reason we are where we are, and Whaley is great, then not firing either of those guys is the right move, right? Or will we see a 180, call it Whaley's biggest mistake, and want him fired too?

 

Honestly, if I'm Whaley, and I want Hackett gone, I find him a HC gig at a second tier D1 school first. I think that's way more likely than just cutting the guys loose.

[Haven Moses]

The only way Pegulas make changes is if Terry is connected somehow to a big time football name like Polian, Cowher, etc. He won't change and bring in any coordinator types.

[Kelly the Dog]

Ask and Marrone shall deliver

 

Seriously though how can you ask that question coming off of Sundays win?

 

It really is too bad that someone, that cares about the Bills as much as you obviously do, can't enjoy the best season of Bills football in a decade. This has been fun! For 8 Sundays so far the evening has been a little better, it has been a little easier to get up and go into work on Monday, that is the most in a long time and something I will celebrate.

I think that Bills Fandom is basically into three camps, almost evenly divided:

 

1] Like you, Marrone is the best we have had in awhile. He's saddled with bad QBing. But he stays for sure.

2] Like me, Marrone is a question mark. There is good and bad. 9-7 he deserves another shot but the season isn't over yet.

3] Like some, Marrone and Hackett suck. We win in spite of them because of our defense.

 

Many of the #2's were swayed significantly by last week's win. A lot of the #2's were closer to #3 last week but the huge win swayed them. That proves Marrone can win a big game. But if they lose to the Raiders, we're 8-8 and he under-achieved and those fans are back to the #3's again.

[Cleveland Rocks?]

I can't believe there are Bills fans who want to fire the coach. Then again, there are lot of Browns fans who want Pettine fired too. But our team has fallen apart. Yours seems to getting better each week. I think a lot of offenses are struggling at this point of the season because the DCs have so much film built up.

[26CornerBlitz]

I can't believe there are Bills fans who want to fire the coach. Then again, there are lot of Browns fans who want Pettine fired too. But our team has fallen apart. Yours seems to getting better each week. I think a lot of offenses are struggling at this point of the season because the DCs have so much film built up.

 

The Browns just fired Chud after one season. I can't see another change on the horizon so soon.

[34-78-83]

I can't believe there are Bills fans who want to fire the coach. Then again, there are lot of Browns fans who want Pettine fired too. But our team has fallen apart. Yours seems to getting better each week. I think a lot of offenses are struggling at this point of the season because the DCs have so much film built up.

It's an internet message board. I often forget this too myself and get really frustrated for no reason

[zow2]

So much about nothing. Does a culture of winning (i.e. New Eng, Balt) exist? yes, absolutely. It exists because they have solid QB, coaches and front office talent that makes good player personnel decisions. A culture of losing can also exist when teams lack the above.

 

So has Marrone helped change the culture in the short term? sure. The team is 8-6 and looks pretty good. If they really want to change though, they need to maintain this and even get better in coming seasons. It's easy for teams like Buffalo to slide backwards.. They can't let that happen and should definitely not fire Marrone or the GM at this time. Gimme a break...we're on the ascent, not decline.

[#34fan]

*(sigh)* You do not fire an HC after a 8 or 9 win season. Period. -It's a horrifically gut-wrenching truth that I struggle with every day.

 

Back to back eight-win seasons after multiple 12 or 13 win years could be a problem. However, it's not one we have.

 

So..... The Maroon stays.

 

I disagree with him changing the culture though.... CLEARLY the Schwartz's leadership is behind the defensive swagger, which is the ONLY reason why we're winning games. Shwartz has Dareus and K-dub playing out of their minds. Bradham and Brown are also flourishing and (IMO) overachieving in his system.

 

Jim Schwartz's D is a HUGE part of our O.

 

By contrast, Nate Hackett's contributions to our success have been negligible. He can leave town TONIGHT for all I care.

HACKETT SUCKS. We'll be in better shape once we get an OC who believes in scoring in the red zone, and getting first downs.

[Campy]

*(sigh)* You do not fire an HC after a 8 or 9 win season. Period. -It's a horrifically gut-wrenching truth that I struggle with every day.

 

Back to back eight-win seasons after multiple 12 or 13 win years could be a problem. However, it's not one we have.

 

So..... The Maroon stays.

 

I disagree with him changing the culture though.... CLEARLY the Schwartz's leadership is behind the defensive swagger, which is the ONLY reason why we're winning games. Shwartz has Dareus and K-dub playing out of their minds. Bradham and Brown are also flourishing and (IMO) overachieving in his system.

 

Jim Schwartz's D is a HUGE part of our O.

 

By contrast, Nate Hackett's contributions to our success have been negligible. He can leave town TONIGHT for all I care.

HACKETT SUCKS. We'll be in better shape once we get an OC who believes in scoring in the red zone, and getting first downs.

 

I generally love hyperbole but the bolded part is ridiculous.

 

Hackett doesn't whiff on blocks, reads, or throws.

 

If the OL can find a way to elevate their play and if we get more production out of the QB position, Hackett will look a lot smarter. I know that's nuanced and the "Fire the coach!" crowd won't like reading it, but it's true.

[Kelly the Dog]

I disagree with him changing the culture though.... CLEARLY the Schwartz's leadership is behind the defensive swagger, which is the ONLY reason why we're winning games. Shwartz has Dareus and K-dub playing out of their minds. Bradham and Brown are also flourishing and (IMO) overachieving in his system.

I think that Marrone deserves a lot of credit for the resurgence of Dareus and to a lesser extent, Bradham. He sat both of them down a few times, had a lot of man to man talks with them, really stuck up for Dareus. The two players deserve the most credit for turning their lives and careers around, but Marrone played a major part in it. I do think the team really likes him and plays hard for him. That doesn't mean they wouldn't play hard for another good motivator, but a lot of good coaches are cerebral and not good motivators. You have to be both.

 

Marrone could use a little more help in the cerebral department though.

[26CornerBlitz]

Football Outsiders Ranks the Bills as Follows: Offense: #26 Defense: #1 Special Teams: #3 Aaron Schatz calls the Bills an imbalanced team which comes as no surprise to any of us.

[The Big Cat]

Football Outsiders Ranks the Bills as Follows: Offense: #26 Defense: #1 Special Teams: #3 Aaron Schatz calls the Bills an imbalanced team which comes as no surprise to any of us.

 

Well, the organization had the will to fix the special teams last offseason...

[Kirby Jackson]

Football Outsiders Ranks the Bills as Follows: Offense: #26 Defense: #1 Special Teams: #3 Aaron Schatz calls the Bills an imbalanced team which comes as no surprise to any of us.

How could anyone not think that coaching is a part of that? I am not saying ALL of it but there are a segment here that believe that the coaching is blameless on the offense. It sure sounds like RB is in agreement. Edited December 17, 2014 by Kirby Jackson

[section122]

How could anyone not think that coaching is a part of that? I am not saying ALL of it but there are a segment here that believe that the coaching is blameless on the offense. It sure sounds like RB is in agreement.

as big cat pointed out how many of us thought coaching was the reason for the poor st unit last year? This year they made a commitment to improve it and did so with the same coach.

[Kirby Jackson]

 

as big cat pointed out how many of us thought coaching was the reason for the poor st unit last year? This year they made a commitment to improve it and did so with the same coach.

Some would argue that they used resources that could have been spent elsewhere to protect Crossman. The Bills dress at least 7 guys (Gay, Carpenter, Sanborn, Schmidt, Easley, Dean and Thigpen) that play nothing but ST. I will promise that is the highest number in the league. The ST has been improved but at the expense of other areas. Edited December 17, 2014 by Kirby Jackson

[thewildrabbit]

The problem with this whole thread is that Russ Brandon defending Marrone by saying he "changed the culture" is a straw man argument. And how convenient that, win or lose, Russ now cites a "changed culture" and a need for "continuity" since his football ops ass is on the line with Marrone. When the season started it was "playoffs or bust." Now it's "culture and continuity." DOES ANYONE ELSE SMELL THE BULLSCHIDT?

 

You know he does not just want to be a marketer for the Bills. He wants more chest bumps with Sammy on game day and more fist pumping in the war room on draft day. That's his real agenda.

 

The real question is, has Marrone done enough to be retained? Most of us think we know, but I'd say pretty much everyone wants to see the last 2 games before deciding. In the meantime, I've seen plenty of decisions from the dark ages, and barring a stirring win in New England, I'd say the Bills can and should try to do better.

 

The problem is, we've seen so much garbage in the last 15 years that 8-6 makes it look like St. Doug really is roaming the sidelines.

 

And Russ, whose culture did he change, exactly? I remember when you were the GM...that was some culture we had then, wasn't it?

 

Brandon the football guy is the problem and a snake in the grass. When he talks "culture" he's politicking for his own ass. Is that not obvious?

 

Just stick to selling tickets Russ. You did a great job finding 30000 Green Bay fans to sell the game out last weekend.

Good stuff!

 

I don't dislike Russ Brandon, although I do want him as far away from the football operations side of things, as he can get. Of course he is going to endorse his alum, and preach continuity, as he has his fingerprints all over the current team.

 

 

What a lot of Bills fans are overlooking is the fact that this Bills HC has yet to field a team that can actually compete with the New England Patriots, and if he can't beat NE, Bill Belichick, Tom Brady then WTF good is he?

 

This upcoming game at NE is looming larger, and larger to me!

[The Big Cat]

Some would argue that they used resources that could have been spent elsewhere to protect Crossman. The Bills dress at least 7 guys (Gay, Carpenter, Sanborn, Schmidt, Easley, Dean and Thigpen) that play nothing but ST. I will promise that is the highest number in the league. The ST has been improved but at the expense of other areas.

 

And yet others will tell you it's because we play a disproportionate number of our starters on ST.

[Kirby Jackson]

 

 

And yet others will tell you it's because we play a disproportionate number of our starters on ST.

That's kind of my point. ST aren't necessarily better because Crossman is good and we just didn't know it. ST are good because we have thrown a disproportionate amount of resources towards it compared to other teams.

[TheBillsWillRiseAgain]

Special Teams has contributed more to our wins than the offense has this season. Anyone complaining about the personnel decisions on ST is crazy.

[thewildrabbit]

Some would argue that they used resources that could have been spent elsewhere to protect Crossman. The Bills dress at least 7 guys (Gay, Carpenter, Sanborn, Schmidt, Easley, Dean and Thigpen) that play nothing but ST. I will promise that is the highest number in the league. The ST has been improved but at the expense of other areas.

This is very disconcerting considering how bad the offense has been all season, and most particular in the red zone. I'll be very disappointed should the team retain the same OC & O line coach.

[FireChan]

Good stuff!

 

I don't dislike Russ Brandon, although I do want him as far away from the football operations side of things, as he can get. Of course he is going to endorse his alum, and preach continuity, as he has his fingerprints all over the current team.

 

 

What a lot of Bills fans are overlooking is the fact that this Bills HC has yet to field a team that can actually compete with the New England Patriots, and if he can't beat NE, Bill Belichick, Tom Brady then WTF good is he?

 

This upcoming game at NE is looming larger, and larger to me!

 

Oh yeah, let's just grab one of those coaches who can consistently duel the best HoF HC and QB combo in history. They're around.

[Kirby Jackson]

 

 

I don't dislike Russ Brandon, although I do want him as far away from the football operations side of things, as he can get. Of course he is going to endorse his alum, and preach continuity, as he has his fingerprints all over the current team.

That's kind of the irony of it. He has always deferred the football decisions. With that being said he clearly has had his hands on this team over the last almost 2 full years more than any team ever (and it's not even close). I think that we are all in agreement that we are in the best place that we have been in since the '90's. Is it a coincidence that his hand picked coach and his hand picked GM have been successful?

 

This is very disconcerting considering how bad the offense has been all season, and most particular in the red zone. I'll be very disappointed should the team retain the same OC & O line coach.

Agree, I'd like to include the TE coach as well. They perenially stink.

[papazoid]

Football Outsiders Ranks the Bills as Follows: Offense: #26 Defense: #1 Special Teams: #3 Aaron Schatz calls the Bills an imbalanced team which comes as no surprise to any of us.

 

very fair ratings

[Coach Tuesday]

very fair ratings

 

Those aren't just "ratings" - they're statistically-modeled rankings based on a whole host of criteria, including strength of opponent, situational effectiveness, etc.

[Kelly the Dog]

as big cat pointed out how many of us thought coaching was the reason for the poor st unit last year? This year they made a commitment to improve it and did so with the same coach.

A huge part is Marrone deciding to play starters on it this year when he didnt last year. That wasnt a Crossman decision. It's true you need players, but Whaley brought in two Pro Bowl ST players as well as Spikes who plays them. They have a star studded ST now counting starters. That isn't great coaching. Crossman got too much credit this year and too much blame last year.

 

If you gave Marrone two pro bowl offensive players and six other solid new starters on offense he better win the SB, but that is asking way too much.

[FireChan]

 

A huge part is Marrone deciding to play starters on it this year when he didnt last year. That wasnt a Crossman decision. It's true you need players, but Whaley brought in two Pro Bowl ST players as well as Spikes who plays them. They have a star studded ST now counting starters. That isn't great coaching. Crossman got too much credit this year and too much blame last year.

 

If you gave Marrone two pro bowl offensive players and six other solid new starters on offense he better win the SB, but that is asking way too much.

 

Just like if you gave Schwartz 3 Pro Bowl defensive players and 8 above average starters, we'd have a great defense?

[Kelly the Dog]

Just like if you gave Schwartz 3 Pro Bowl defensive players and 8 above average starters, we'd have a great defense?

That is what was different from the previous year. Schwartz lost two pro bowlers, talent wise. Gained Spikes and Graham and a good rookie 3rd rounder. That's basically a wash. And yet he did significantly better.

[34-78-83]

That's kind of my point. ST aren't necessarily better because Crossman is good and we just didn't know it. ST are good because we have thrown a disproportionate amount of resources towards it compared to other teams.

which just adds to the age old and TRUE point that it's a players league.

[FireChan]

 

That is what was different from the previous year. Schwartz lost two pro bowlers, talent wise. Gained Spikes and Graham and a good rookie 3rd rounder. That's basically a wash. And yet he did significantly better.

 

Lost two?

 

I'm not disagreeing that Schwartz is better than Pettine. But you look at what we have on defense, talent-wise, and it isn't even close to the O. Would we be top 3 if our offense had that kind of talent? Maybe, maybe not. But we wouldn't be 26th. That's for certain.