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filthymcnasty08

By filthymcnasty08
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....lybob Veteran

....lybob

Posted
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Running QBs can be very effective the problem is they get hurt a lot - you see this over and over, a team takes an exciting running QB said QB gets hurt and the team tries to protect their investment by making running QB more a pocket passer, QB is ineffective as a pocket passer - the solution for teams that want running QBs is you need 4 or 5 of them - you want RG3? well you better pick up Terrell Pryor and a couple more running QBs too- you probably need three on your starting roster and two on you practice squad to get through the season.

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BarleyNY All Pro

BarleyNY

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View PostFireChan, on 17 November 2014 - 12:24 PM, said:

Mike Shanahan actually ruined this kids career.

 

 

 

 

I would say that RG3 ruined his own career.

 

There is truth to both opinions here. I'd add in Snyder for the trifecta. Running a heavily Baylor influenced offense was bound to put RG3 on the fast track to the broken down QB heap. He was incredibly fast, but not elusive (like Vick). That should have led to a transition to becoming a pocket QB from the beginning, but that never happened as he is still poor as a pocket QB. The only question is: How much blame should be assigned to each party for that:

- Did Snyder insist on immediate success and force Shanny to go with a plan that optimized short term success? His track record and considering the bounty paid for him both indicate this is very likely.

- How much effort did Shanny spend trying to transition RG3 into a pocket QB? One would have to assume that some degree of this was necessary simply due to transitioning to the NFL, but if the coaches put forth the effort it sure didn't take. Or maybe his injuries sidetracked the development plan. It would be interesting to know what the plan was.

- Lastly, how much effort did RG3 put forth to learn the passing game? And if he did put forth the effort, is he capable? He's a smart guy by all accounts, but he also seems a little too wrapped up in the spotlight so I wonder. Ultimately it is on him to develop his pocket passing game or he won't have much of a spotlight to enjoy anymore.

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mannc Hall of Famer

mannc

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Serious question: when did RG III develop all these bad habits? If he did these things in college he would not have been such a highly coveted prospect (nearly the equal of A Luck for many scouts), right? As I recall, he was a ridiculously accurate passer at Bsylor. Were there signs back then that he could have trouble becoming a pocket passer in the NFL? Or did the injuries make him forget how to play QB?

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papazoid All Pro

papazoid

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my hunch is there is a lot more to this story.

 

that the trust between RG III and Gruden is broken.

 

even before gruden, coach shanahan complained about the "direct" relationship between owner Dan Snyder and his face of the franchise QB, RG III.

 

I bet, after his recent benching, RG III complained directly to snyder about gruden. Snyder discussed this with his GM. the GM tipped off gruden.

 

gruden thinks RG III is trying to get him fired,

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Dorkington All Pro

Dorkington

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He just needs to go to a healthy situation. A team that has a decent starting QB that he can develop behind for a couple of years, grow into a single system. Pretty basic stuff, almost any QB needs (unless you're Luck or Wilson). Who that team is, I don't know. He has to re-work his game post injury, that's for sure. It's clear he has physical talent, he'll get another shot.

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Tyrod's Tailor RFA

Tyrod's Tailor

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Serious question: when did RG III develop all these bad habits? If he did these things in college he would not have been such a highly coveted prospect (nearly the equal of A Luck for many scouts), right? As I recall, he was a ridiculously accurate passer at Bsylor. Were there signs back then that he could have trouble becoming a pocket passer in the NFL? Or did the injuries make him forget how to play QB?

 

Injuries mean no respect for his legs, much easier to shut him down in the pocket.

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prissythecat Veteran

prissythecat

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Serious question: when did RG III develop all these bad habits? If he did these things in college he would not have been such a highly coveted prospect (nearly the equal of A Luck for many scouts), right? As I recall, he was a ridiculously accurate passer at Bsylor. Were there signs back then that he could have trouble becoming a pocket passer in the NFL? Or did the injuries make him forget how to play QB?

 

College accuracy does not translate to NFL when you aren't running a pro offense. Tim Tebow averaged over 66% completions during his college career. Thats because he ran a spread and was throwing only to wide open receivers. In the NFL, Tebow averaged an eye poping 47.9% during his 3 year career. So there should not really be a surprise that Griffin is doing poorly when he is being asked to operate in something different from his Baylor kiddie offense.

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BarleyNY All Pro

BarleyNY

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Serious question: when did RG III develop all these bad habits? If he did these things in college he would not have been such a highly coveted prospect (nearly the equal of A Luck for many scouts), right? As I recall, he was a ridiculously accurate passer at Bsylor. Were there signs back then that he could have trouble becoming a pocket passer in the NFL? Or did the injuries make him forget how to play QB?

Just to add on to what has been said, Baylor's offensive system is pretty basic even compared to typical college systems. It's a big transition even for a QB coming out of a system with pro elements, but RG3 had a much bigger jump to make. Luck, in contrast, played for Stanford which is about a close to a pro system as you're going to get in college and he had a lot of learning to do as evidenced by his early struggles.

I think RG3's main issue as a pocket passer has to do with reading the field properly and quickly. This is where many QBs fail. Kapernick can't do it and it's sidelining his career. Teams are making him stay in the pocket and beat them that way and that's what teams are making RG3 do. His injuries are making it easier because he can't run like he once did.

Lastly, determining what will happen once players like him get into the NFL limelight and are handed the kind of money he's seen is always a projection. Sometimes they don't put in the time they need to and sometimes they work, but can't do it. Rumor has it that the reason Manziel isn't starting for Cleveland is because he hasn't put in enough time and he doesn't understand the offense well enough. RG3 came from a military family and looked like he would be the kind of guy who had a tremendous work ethic, but rumors in Washington are that he sees himself above the others on his team and it has really cause locker room problems.

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26CornerBlitz Hall of Famer

26CornerBlitz

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Can RGIII be fixed? Inside the quarterback's struggles

Washington gave up a lot to get Robert Griffin III, and now they're dealing with a sunk cost issue that outstrips all the contracts they inked in the first decade of the new millennium, when owner Dan Snyder and a cadre of underqualified front office people conspired to overpay player after player. The Griffin draft in 2012 was supposed to be the reversal of that mindset, when Washington D.C.'s team would build and sustain through the draft, but if Griffin fell from grace, the two first-round picks given up in order to move up to the second overall selection would throw the franchise into a serious reversal of fortune.

 

Of course, that's exactly what has happened. Griffin has suffered injuries and regressed mightily since his Rookie of the Year season, and first-year head coach Jay Gruden's decision to bench him on what appears to be a permanent basis makes all the sense in the world, based on the tape.

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thebandit27 Hall of Famer

thebandit27

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Just to add on to what has been said, Baylor's offensive system is pretty basic even compared to typical college systems. It's a big transition even for a QB coming out of a system with pro elements, but RG3 had a much bigger jump to make. Luck, in contrast, played for Stanford which is about a close to a pro system as you're going to get in college and he had a lot of learning to do as evidenced by his early struggles.

I think RG3's main issue as a pocket passer has to do with reading the field properly and quickly. This is where many QBs fail. Kapernick can't do it and it's sidelining his career. Teams are making him stay in the pocket and beat them that way and that's what teams are making RG3 do. His injuries are making it easier because he can't run like he once did.

Lastly, determining what will happen once players like him get into the NFL limelight and are handed the kind of money he's seen is always a projection. Sometimes they don't put in the time they need to and sometimes they work, but can't do it. Rumor has it that the reason Manziel isn't starting for Cleveland is because he hasn't put in enough time and he doesn't understand the offense well enough. RG3 came from a military family and looked like he would be the kind of guy who had a tremendous work ethic, but rumors in Washington are that he sees himself above the others on his team and it has really cause locker room problems.

 

Can't say I agree with that...

 

http://www.footballstudyhall.com/2013/5/22/4351446/Baylor-bears-football-art-briles-lache-seastrunk-spread-offense

 

http://www.sbnation.com/college-football/2013/11/7/5073520/baylor-football-offense-art-briles-2013

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BarleyNY All Pro

BarleyNY

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We will have to agree to disagree about this. It's a good system, but it isn't one that is complicated for a QB to run. Difficult, yes. Complicated, not really.

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