C.Biscuit97

What???? He routinely got voted dirtiest player in the nfl. Ive never seen a player get as many passes and excuses for his behavior than RI. I guess it’s good that he has football because he would be in prison otherwise. I will say that I would testify on his part after he does something really bad after he retires. This dude has some serious mental issues but let’s let him keep ramming his head. I just hope I’m not around him when he really blows. But in a way, this is what the Raiders should be. The greatest hard knocks team ever.

You’re acting like he didn’t have a college coach with a recent history of developing a top 5 nfl qb. I would be fine with Allen doing this after his MVP season.

If Allen turns out better than a heisman trophy and national champ; rookie passing record having; MVP, and SB runner up , he will be a borderline HOFer. No pressure Josh! cam newton average at best says Billybob ?

You don’t either. Jim Kelly was on one of most talented teams in nfl history. He had worse regular season and post season stats than McNabb. McNabb played with one HOF caliber player. Yet, he played in a SB and 4 championship games. And my point remains consistent. Kelly is a HOF while McNabb is on the outside looking in. But if you completely dismiss McNabb’s career, you are kinda foolish. He was at worst a slight step down from Kelly.

Same thing with Aaron Rodgers. I think the people who don’t like the Allen pick are the people who go with what history tells us. Allen got drafted because of physical tools rather than what he actually did. Those guys terrify me. Back to guys like Hackenburg. And can we stop acting like his college coach wasn’t Carson Wentz’? Sorry, I’m going to have high expectations for the highest drafted qb in Bills history.

Comparison are crazy but how can anyone say Allen will be better or worse than Bortles at this point? In fact, I can see Allen having a very similar 2nd season as Bortles did, which we would all take right now. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BortBl00.htm

You are 100% right. Eli kinda sucked for a long time. But those 2 wins get you in. If McNabb got 1, he would be in. Gotcha. I was young for the Aikman years and thought he was much better than he ended up being. His numbers kinda sucked. But he played on one of the most loaded teams of all time.

History of the nfl says it’s hard to remain a top 3 defense in consecutive years. Also, optimist view, we will be blown out less and have leads that makes other teams getting yards in garbage time. As I said, I still think our defense will be good. A defense that is 8th or so with an offense that is 15 is much better than a D ranked 2 and an offense ranked 31.

Well said. I guess as fans we treat our players as family and get mad if someone says anything bad about them. Personally, I couldn’t care and I hope Allen doesn’t either. It’s not going to make him throw the ball farther. The best part of sports is he has the power to determine his career.

I mean these are a lot of IFs at this point. I’m very critical of our offensive moves but I’m completely sold on our defense. However, there were some incidents of bend but don’t break moments. Also, teams did take the foot of the gas petal in some games when we got blown out. Still, I think we have at worst a top 10 defense and maybe higher if Oliver can be as good as he has the talent to be.

My only counter to this is Newton was dominant in the best conference in college, won a heisman and title, and set rookie passing records. If I had to make a comparison for Allen, it might be Vince Young Rookie year. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/Y/YounVi00.htm

Good points. I also think the general thought is he will improve, which is completely reasonable. However, and I call it the Mike Vick Effect, very athletic qbs who are better runners than passers (which Allen is right now) can come out and do damage to defenses. However when DCs get more tape and develop schemes to keep them in the pocket, they struggle. Besides being a dog murdering scumbag, that’s the main reason why Vick was never a consistent franchise qb. im fairly confident Allen won’t run a dog fighting ring (maybe ?) but he will be in for an adjustment this year as opposed to last year when there wasn’t a ton of tape. The great ones adjust so hopefully he does.

Good points. I think McNabb is better than Dalton (went to a Sb and like 4 title games) but also feel Dalton gets slighted. If Allen had Dalton’s career stat wise, I think we would take it.

5 out of 4 philly people are morons. ? I’m not sure what this means. Do you think Joe Flacco and Eli Manning are better than Jim Kelly and Dan Marino?

Agreed but it gives context. Those Bills teams were absolutely loaded. Kelly was kinda terrible in the playoffs. It wasnt to put down Kelly but McNabb is much closer to Kelly than some folks will admit here. He had a very good career. Not HOF but very good. To completely dismiss him is wrong. Fair points. I also remember besides that year with TO he had some garbage receivers - James Thrash, Freddie Mitchell. Absolute trash for a while.

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No but he had a better career (better number than Jim Kelly) than most people realize. Always seemed to come up short in big spots thought. And if TO was such a selfish prick, they could have be a special combo. Also, he stole pizza from me at Syracuse football camp. That alone disqualifies him. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/McNaDo00.htm https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/K/KellJi00.htm

My only concern is his size. He has to be one of the smallest LBs in the nfl. It’s a different league but getting hit by guys charging ahead 100 lbs bigger than you has to wear on you. But guy is a playmaker so I hope he can stay healthy.

With all due respect, besides playing, have those former QBs shown ability to scout qbs? John Elway, up there for best qb ever IMo, has been awful at evaluating qbs. Jim Kelly wanted Tebow. Michael Jordan has one of the worst franchises in the nba. Probably the best qb evaluator in the nfl is a former college linemen and Kool Aid man lookalike Andy Reid. Honestly, sometimes former players opinions are worse than nerds who get hurt playing flag football.

I freely admit I wanted Rosen and didn’t want Allen. I think both guys played on bad offenses and I do think Rosen has it worse. They had very similar passing stats with Allen being a far superior runner. but it is beyond stupid to make any concrete judgments about either guy’s future after one season on a losing team. I also would struggle to respect an “analyst” who change their opinion based on a season. Either way, it’s pretty awesome that the division is Brady vs. the 3 1st rounders (and Fitz). Maybe the division can be interesting for the first time in forever.

I know right. If Allen was on the Fins, what would Bills fans’ opinions be after being a 56% passer in a lower D1 conference where he wasn’t on any of the All MWC teams; completed 52% of his passers his rookie year with 10 tds and 12 ints? I’m sure we would talking about how the Fins have a stud franchise qb. ? right or wrong, I try to be consistent. I didn’t want the Bills to draft Allen. I hate that I’m not blindly behind because I have serious doubts. I know he is a hard work and seems to have a good head on his shoulders. I know people who have meant him and said he’s a good dude. But I need to see him win with arm. I think the Bills could have gotten him a better OC (I’m amazed how sold everyone is on Daboll) and a legit 1 type receiver. I do like the improved oline and he plays with a good defense to keep him in games. but to sum it up, if Allen wasn’t a Bill, fans wont be sold either (also silly to be sold on a qb after one year). I hate that I still have the doubts and there aren’t many things that I would love to be wrong on than Allen. But sorry. After years of defending every Bills qb (compare Losman and Favre’s 1st 2 years), I need to see it. So do non Bills fans. And hopefully, we do.

You mean UCLA where had a different OC every season? Or UCLA where he played with a defense that gave up 36.8 points/ game?

Rosen has the worst oline in the nfl, Fitz (love him but he runs a 5.3 now), Johnson coming off a major injury, a head coach who got fired after a year, an OC who got fired after 4 games then Byron Leftwich in his first coaching gig. Rosen May suck but it is insane to make any concrete conclusion on a rookie qb in that circumstance.

Agreed but you see a noticeable improvement in year 2. I think it’s insane how quickly we give up on young QBs but it is the reality. As Sal C said, if Allen doesn’t have a Mitch Tribusky type year, it might be tome to get a little worried.

Name calling? When did you become such a Richard (see it’s easy)?