Losman has the potential to be very good but

[firstngoal]

Losman has the ability to be a decent NFL QB if he can hold onto the football and cut down on his mistakes....but even if he does pan out I'm not sure he will ever be as good as either Matt Leinart or Jay Cutler two QB's that we passed up in the Draft.

[Brandon]

Both may one day become good NFL QBs, but to this point, they've proven even less in the NFL than JP Losman. I'm not too worried that we passed over them.

[34-78-83]

Losman has the ability to be a decent NFL QB if he can hold onto the football and cut down on his mistakes....but even if he does pan out I'm not sure he will ever be as good as either Matt Leinart or Jay Cutler two QB's that we passed up in the Draft.

747198[/snapback]

 

Can we please once and for all take Matt Leinart , with his Hollywood lifestyle, soft arm, and Top 3 contract demands, out of this discussion? Cutler could be another story but ML was just not a fit for Buffalo. Also Cutler has played once, in a preseason game. We may not know much about him til atleast next season.

[Corp000085]

my advice is for you to get over it... Losman's our guy... If he does well, then great... TD actually did something right. If not, release him after this year and roll with another option at QB. But nitpicking over other QBs is fruitless... Had this board been alive in 1983-1986, it would have crashed daily discussing how we picked up some snobby guy who wouldn't play for us and chose the USFL instead of dan marino.

[Bill from NYC]

Can we please once and for all take Matt Leinart , with his Hollywood lifestyle, soft arm, and Top 3 contract demands, out of this discussion? Cutler could be another story but ML was just not a fit for Buffalo. Also Cutler has played once, in a preseason game. We may not know much about him til atleast next season.

747202[/snapback]

 

I couldn't agree more. Could you imagine a qb duel between Leinart and Losman?

[Moose]

When the temperature dips below 50º, Leinart thinks it's cold. B-r-r-r-r-r!

 

While he may turn out to be a decent QB in a warm-climate or dome-playing team, it would have been idiotic for the Bills to draft him.

[DieHardFan]

my advice is for you to get over it...  Losman's our guy...  If he does well, then great...  TD actually did something right.  If not, release him after this year and roll with another option at QB.  But nitpicking over other QBs is fruitless...  Had this board been alive in 1983-1986, it would have crashed daily discussing how we picked up some snobby guy who wouldn't play for us and chose the USFL instead of dan marino.

747203[/snapback]

But if danny had been our QB I GUARANTEE we would have won all 4 SBs

 

Seriously, I was thinking the same thing last night. Kelly made his share of bonehead plays but they were the exception and were quickly overlooked when the next gems were made and because he was family. Losman makes a gaff and the loudmouth drunk starts with Flute and 0-16 chants. If you want instant gratification; masturbate.

[firstngoal]

Can we please once and for all take Matt Leinart , with his Hollywood lifestyle, soft arm, and Top 3 contract demands, out of this discussion? Cutler could be another story but ML was just not a fit for Buffalo. Also Cutler has played once, in a preseason game. We may not know much about him til atleast next season.

747202[/snapback]

 

Leinart wouldn't have been a fit here and I shouldn't have put him in this topic...but I think Cutler is going to be SPECIAL and we passed him up!

[34-78-83]

I couldn't agree more. Could you imagine a qb duel between Leinart and Losman?   

747206[/snapback]

 

I'm getting very, very tired of Qb Duels in this town

 

If only the team had played the kid all season last year we'd be further along in his development and know more of what we have.

[Bill from NYC]

I'm getting very, very tired of Qb Duels in this town   

747217[/snapback]

 

Oh, so am I, but I have a feeling that there is one left.

[34-78-83]

Oh, so am I, but I have a feeling that there is one left.

747219[/snapback]

 

You could be right, and I assume you're speaking of JP vs. Nall.

 

From everything I've seen and heard, Jp is the only one of the three that can really make this offense go. They really do plan on stretching the field alot, it is obvious both in practice and in games. He has shown that ability from the start this year and in the game last night. But the turnovers cannot continue to be a trend with him

 

Nall managed a good game last night, which is important and good for him He doesn't appear to have the same abilites to throw the longer out and in routes, although he seems far superior to KH in that dept. He deserves a chance in this thing still, but only if JP doesn't show progress in the areas of concern above. Before and after the injury, Nall has thrown atleast as many poor passes in camp as Holcomb has.

 

Holcomb is a shell of his former self, which was no great shakes to begin with. He has gone from a backup that I feel very comfortable with to a guy that looks out of his element in this new offense.

[N.Y. Orangeman]

Can we please once and for all take Matt Leinart , with his Hollywood lifestyle, soft arm, and Top 3 contract demands, out of this discussion? Cutler could be another story but ML was just not a fit for Buffalo. Also Cutler has played once, in a preseason game. We may not know much about him til atleast next season.

747202[/snapback]

 

Absolutely not. This kid is a winner (see last year's ND game) who managed a complex offense for three incredibly productive years. Until JP proves he is a legitimate starting QB or Leinhart falls flat on his face, the comparisons and "what-ifs" are valid IMO.

[Rico]

I couldn't agree more. Could you imagine a qb duel between Leinart and Losman?   

747206[/snapback]

[Alaska Darin]

Absolutely not.  This kid is a winner (see last year's ND game) who managed a complex offense for three incredibly productive years.  Until JP proves he is a legitimate starting QB or Leinhart falls flat on his face, the comparisons and "what-ifs" are valid IMO.

747229[/snapback]

You mean because college success for quarterbacks is a good measure of success in the NFL?

 

Leinhart would have been a disaster in Buffalo, regardless of what he accomplishes elsewhere.

[Rico]

You could be right, and I assume you're speaking of JP vs. Nall.

 

From everything I've seen and heard, Jp is the only one of the three that can really make this offense go. They really do plan on stretching the field alot, it is obvious both in practice and in games. He has shown that ability from the start this year and in the game last night. But the turnovers cannot continue to be a trend with him

 

Nall managed a good game last night, which is important and good for him He doesn't appear to have the same abilites to throw the longer out and in routes, although he seems far superior to KH in that dept. He deserves a chance in this thing still, but only if JP doesn't show progress in the areas of concern above.

747221[/snapback]

With 2 pre-season games to go before Week 1, that is still a very big IF that is yet to be resolved.

[34-78-83]

With 2 pre-season games to go before Week 1, that is still a very big IF that is yet to be resolved.

747237[/snapback]

 

I refer you to the thread started by KTFABD earlier.

[Rico]

I refer you to the thread started by KTFABD earlier. 

747240[/snapback]

I saw it ... pretty desperate.

[inkman]

You mean because college success for quarterbacks is a good measure of success in the NFL? 

 

Leinhart would have been a disaster in Buffalo, regardless of what he accomplishes elsewhere.

747232[/snapback]

 

Why can't you be smart like this over in the baseball forum?

[34-78-83]

I saw it ... pretty desperate.

747243[/snapback]

 

Desperate how? By bringing up facts from a body of work over the course of a guy's playing career?

[Rico]

Desperate how? By bringing up facts from a body of work over the course of a guy's playing career?

747254[/snapback]

Desperate times call for desperate spinning.

 

Here's to JP finally stepping up and distancing himself from the crowd next game.

[34-78-83]

Desperate times call for desperate spinning.

747268[/snapback]

 

Hey, I'll take Big plays mixed with turnovers over three and outs all day, but that's just me. If Nall shows he can make plays down the field, then he deserves his shot. He has not shown this yet (remember the coaches see a lot more than we do) No spinning required.

[BADOLBILZ]

Can we please once and for all take Matt Leinart , with his Hollywood lifestyle, soft arm, and Top 3 contract demands, out of this discussion? Cutler could be another story but ML was just not a fit for Buffalo. Also Cutler has played once, in a preseason game. We may not know much about him til atleast next season.

747202[/snapback]

 

There is NO WAY a high profile Heisman trophy winning USC player with a Hollywood lifestyle and movie star aspirations could ever pan out and be accepted in Buffalo.

[34-78-83]

There is NO WAY a high profile Heisman trophy winning USC player with a Hollywood lifestyle and movie star aspirations could ever pan out and be accepted in Buffalo. 

747273[/snapback]

 

You stop that right now Mr.! And OJ didn't have a weak set of legs (you conveniently skipped over the weak arm comment)

[nodnarb]

Prediction: Matt leinart will not be special in the nfl.

cutler hasn't proven anything yet.

what are you whining about?

 

You're trying to make an argument that two unproven qbs are better than a third unproven qb? do you really think leinart is a fit in buffalo? Do you really think he'd want to re-sign after his 5 years is up? Do you really want as your bills qb a guy who's dating paris hilton and who wants to be in hollywood?

 

Fug Leinart.

[Rico]

Hey, I'll take Big plays mixed with turnovers over three and outs all day, but that's just me. If Nall shows he can make plays down the field, then he deserves his shot. He has not shown this yet (remember the coaches see a lot more than we do) No spinning required.

747272[/snapback]

Another big IF that is yet to be answered. Too many ifs.

 

Like I said in another post yesterday, Friggin' Meathead, this mess is all his fault... questions should've been answered last year.

[34-78-83]

Another big IF that is yet to be answered. Too many ifs.

 

Like I said in another post yesterday, Friggin' Meathead, this mess is all his fault... questions should've been answered last year.

747284[/snapback]

 

agreed!

[jjsiepierski34]

Leinert's arm strength isn't there for games in Ralph with swirling winds in Nov, and Dec. Cutler's mechanics are worse than Losman's.

 

Losman is our guy.

 

To quote Bill Polian, "and if you don't like it....get outta town!"

[N.Y. Orangeman]

You mean because college success for quarterbacks is a good measure of success in the NFL? 

 

Leinhart would have been a disaster in Buffalo, regardless of what he accomplishes elsewhere.

747232[/snapback]

 

 

Based on what? Your opinion.

Until either of them get the opportunity to play, the question is still very much hanging out there.

[Pyrite Gal]

Leinart wouldn't have been a fit here and I shouldn't have put him in this topic...but I think Cutler is going to be SPECIAL and we passed him up!

747214[/snapback]

But I think that the facts around a choice of Cutler would jave been (rather than simply just the unsupported speculation that he is special):

 

1. By choosing Cutler, the Bills would have allocated yet another 1st round choice to a QB rather than spending it on our hole at starting SS, If we had chosen Cutler at #8, as Bullocks (a good potential player but not projected as an immediate starter and merely having hope and speculation that he will be a 1st year starter) would have been the likely SS pick. Maybe you trade up, but we did this to fill our DT gap. What remains unexplored as a clear implication of taking Cutler would have beem its effect on the other needs we tried to fulfill.

 

The big consideration is that if we simply went after Cutler to fill our QB hole, it essentially would have demanded a very different approach to building a team. Unless the poster has some certainty that making another QB choice would have meant anything other than virtually guranteeing 06 as being another yeat of experiment, rebuilding and losing and that the Golden Buys would be comfortable having no shot whatsoever at their age and given our 6 years of non-playoffs, the thought of picking Cutler makes no sense.

 

The bottomline: For those who think we should have taken Cutler what is your rebuilding strategy and timeline because without one the pick simply ,akes no sense.

 

2. I assume that it is based on an assessment that he is gonna be so good he turns this team around quickly. Is their any experience of any 1st round QB chosen ever turning a team around on a relevant (or even short) timeline?

 

Immediate 1 year- No

2 years- One can argue that Michael Vick did this for AT, but why is Cutler gonna have the impact of Michael Vick on this team and even if you want to claim he will (all I am asking for is specifically why folks think he is special and then why no other teams saw it so they made him a top 5 pick. So, I think the answer is NO here as well. Particularly with the team writing off 06 as Vick essentially did his rookie, year 2 year timeline even begins to get too long to be realistic for the Bills.

 

Perhaps someone holding the draft Vick contention wants to cite Ben RoboQB and his rookie impact on the Steelers as the example they are following. Yet, if they are going to make this claim they also need to answer then why they feel the Bills are introducing Cutler into the same situation as RoboQB joined in Pitts which was having the #1 statistically ranked D in the NFL (in case you have not noticed the Bills were not a good D last year) and the Bills have th equivalent of the Hionses Ward/Jerome Bettis/Alan Faneca led O in having Cutler join Evans/WM/Chris Villarial on our team.

 

Again why is picking Cutler work for the Bils at all in building a quality team this year when Ralph/Mrv need to at least project some possibility of winning or in the short team after that. How you are even going to turn our D into something a Culter can win with in his second year when he MAY start (paticularly since by drafting Cutler we have spent the first rounder on him rather than the D) simply does not scan.

 

3. Maybe you want to rebuild by not leaving the holes at SS or DT by not making cuts since we have cap room. If so then it needs to be explained why Sam Adams and Lawyer Milloy on the backsides of their career make this team work with Cutler.

 

4. The thought you take Cutler is simply unsupported beyond people having some semse Cutler is special. Is this merely due to some tremor in the force or are their tangible reasons? Do these tangible reasons end up overallocating cap and spirtual resources to the QB position simply unheard of since the Bills allocated a ton of cap room to both RJ and Flutie.

 

Picking Cutler is an opinion anyone is entitle to, but it just flat out makes no sense if your goal is to win anytime before 2008 or 2009. Even then it is simply an unsupported speculative leap.

[firstngoal]

Prediction: Matt leinart will not be special in the nfl.

cutler hasn't proven anything yet.

what are you whining about?

 

You're trying to make an argument that two unproven qbs are better than a third unproven qb? do you really think leinart is a fit in buffalo? Do you really think he'd want to re-sign after his 5 years is up? Do you really want as your bills qb a guy who's dating paris hilton and who wants to be in hollywood?

 

Fug Leinart.

747281[/snapback]

 

Maybe so on Leinart but I think Cutler will be SPECIAL...I've watched alot of football over the years and even though it was only one game and preseason Cutler was outstanding last week on the road against the Lions...nice setup...outstanding arm and mobility and no problems turning the ball over or making bad decisions.

[firstngoal]

Maybe so on Leinart but I think Cutler will be SPECIAL...I've watched alot of football over the years and even though it was only one game and preseason Cutler was outstanding last week on the road against the Lions...nice setup...outstanding arm and mobility and no problems turning the ball over or making bad decisions.

747336[/snapback]

 

And I almost forgot...all that was with 2 years LESS experience than what J.P. has.

[Adam]

Losman has the ability to be a decent NFL QB if he can hold onto the football and cut down on his mistakes....but even if he does pan out I'm not sure he will ever be as good as either Matt Leinart or Jay Cutler two QB's that we passed up in the Draft.

747198[/snapback]

Cant draft a 1st round QB every few years..... we have other needs

[HereComesTheReignAgain]

Losman has the ability to be a decent NFL QB if he can hold onto the football and cut down on his mistakes....but even if he does pan out I'm not sure he will ever be as good as either Matt Leinart or Jay Cutler two QB's that we passed up in the Draft.

747198[/snapback]

 

 

Can we at least wait until these guys take a real snap in the NFL before you drool all over them? I swear the Leinart fanatics are more annoying than the Flutie flakes!

[Pyrite Gal]

Maybe so on Leinart but I think Cutler will be SPECIAL...I've watched alot of football over the years and even though it was only one game and preseason Cutler was outstanding last week on the road against the Lions...nice setup...outstanding arm and mobility and no problems turning the ball over or making bad decisions.

747336[/snapback]

 

 

OK. But what did you see that you think it would have been worthwhile not filling a major hole on our D to get this QB who if he became a productive starter next year would be developing much faster than we've seen a human being be able to develop.

 

He might achieve a RoboQB level of development as a rookie, but given that the 06 and likely 07 Bills are not only far worse than the team RoboQB joined, but would even be worse than we are because of the hole left by devoting the 1st rpund chocie to Cutler rather than the D.

 

If we are gonna discuss the hypotethetical of we should have picked Cutler, then this discussion deserves some at least nod to the hypotherical implications of such a choice. Picking Cutler seems to make little sense if your goal is to have your team get Ws, even if you are willing to put off being competitive this year (and probably next).

 

I simply doubt this this timeline is remotely possible given Ralph's age and the extended playoff drought experienced by the Bills as a business.

 

We are already in bad shape because it appears we may not even be competitive this year with our draft devoted to the D and the hope existing resources at QB will prove adequate.

 

It seems more likely that even if Cutler did prove to be a special player even beyind Manning who need the Edggering.Harrison acquistion to develop into a competive team that the 06 definite losing season and likey 07 definite losing season, that if we picked Cutler the chances of this team being abandoned by many fans annd out of WNY would be on the table.

[N.Y. Orangeman]

Can we at least wait until these guys take a real snap in the NFL before you drool all over them?  I swear the Leinart fanatics are more annoying than the Flutie flakes!

747348[/snapback]

 

 

Blind faith in Leinart, Cutler OR Losman is foolish at this stage.

[Tasker]

Yeah, I don't think that Leinart or Cutler should be ranked ahead of JP yet, or ahead of Tim Couch or Ryan Leaf or Akili Smith. Being a successful NFL quarterback is not cut and dry.

 

I like JP's talent, and if I had to personally pick it I think it will be Cutler, than JP right behind him, then Leinart well behind. But an important difference is that we already have JP.

 

So do you think that Cutler (or Leinart) is better for a team than JP + Whitner? I don't think either Cutler or Leinart is clearly enough better than JP to warrant giving up a Whitner like player. Things may be proven different in hindsight, but I think at the time of the pick, JP + Whitner is better for the future of the team than JP + Cutler or Leinart (with JP benched or cut).

 

If JP does not progress into a solid young QB this season then we might need to consider other options next off season. But right now the jury is out (thanks to Mularkey), and I think JP could easily end up better than Cutler or Leinart.

[generaLee83]

Losman has the ability to be a decent NFL QB if he can hold onto the football and cut down on his mistakes....but even if he does pan out I'm not sure he will ever be as good as either Matt Leinart or Jay Cutler two QB's that we passed up in the Draft.

747198[/snapback]

 

 

Yeah yeah yeah, should have, could have, would have. Just put it to rest already. This stupid topic has been done 100 times over.

[Risin]

my advice is for you to get over it...  Losman's our guy...  If he does well, then great...  TD actually did something right.  If not, release him after this year and roll with another option at QB.  But nitpicking over other QBs is fruitless...  Had this board been alive in 1983-1986, it would have crashed daily discussing how we picked up some snobby guy who wouldn't play for us and chose the USFL instead of dan marino.

747203[/snapback]

 

 

Quoted for truth.

 

Great post man.

 

[PatPatPatSack]

But if danny had been our QB I GUARANTEE we would have won all 4 SBs 

 

Seriously, I was thinking the same thing last night.  Kelly made his share of bonehead plays but they were the exception and were quickly overlooked when the next gems were made and because he was family.  Losman makes a gaff and the loudmouth drunk starts with Flute and 0-16 chants.  If you want instant gratification; masturbate.

747212[/snapback]

 

 

Instant?

[Kelly the Dog]

Normally, one would never think one half of one pre-season game was 1/50th enough time to determine if a player is going to be good or not, especially after only a few practices. But I will anyway, because it simply reinforced what I already thought/knew. Leinart is going to be at very best a Chad Pennington in this league and will forever frustrate his team's coaches and fans and will end up hurt and out of the league in 6-7 years.

 

Sure, I could be dead wrong and he could turn out to be a great player but I truly doubt it. Last night was a microcosm of his abilities, IMO. He started out great. he looked in control. he made a couple very nice plays, and made you go, wow, this guy is a good quarterback. And then he tried to do the couple things that he can't do, the couple things that will forever keep him from being a great quarterback, and it was exactly what you would expect. He couldn't put enough muster into his passes 15-20 yards downfield when he had to and the speed of the DBs in the NFL overcame his accuracy. And that is something you can say after one game, because it's a physical thing not a mental thing.

 

He is not going to get a stronger arm. His mechanics are not going to get faster. He already has a good throwing motion but he is not going to get faster at it. He can walk pretty fast when no one is near him but he is just big and slow overall. He will get killed by the blitz, he will make a lot of nice short plays. But he will not be able to make the throws a top NFL QB needs to make. And he will get his WRs killed like Chad does.

 

I am very glad we didn't grab Leinart. He's smart, and tough, and accurate, and pretty poised, and can do a lot of things very well. But he can't do what he will need to do and the NFL will eat him up. Just an opinion.