John from Riverside Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 Moulds? Eric Moulds has been one of the best players on our team for a long long time....he is going to count what....TEN MILLION against the cap next year? What are we going to do? If he goes how do we replace him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 Moulds? Eric Moulds has been one of the best players on our team for a long long time....he is going to count what....TEN MILLION against the cap next year? What are we going to do? If he goes how do we replace him? 379823[/snapback] Sign someone else for less money who'll be almost as productive. In case you hadn't noticed, the New England Patriots won the Super Bowl, not the Eagles of Terrell Owens, or the Vikings of Randy Moss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick in* england Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 Moulds? Eric Moulds has been one of the best players on our team for a long long time....he is going to count what....TEN MILLION against the cap next year? What are we going to do? If he goes how do we replace him? 379823[/snapback] Eric would be well advised to take whatever money the Bills are willing to pay him and retire here. I fear for his safety and the mental stability of some fans if he leaves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kota Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 TD has said he wants Moulds to retire a Buffalo Bill. How many receivers at his age actually do anything after leaving their regular team? I think he knows this and will take a pay cut if necessary. He still has Evans, Reed, and Parrish to Mould into a NFL players. Parrish will never be a number 1 or number 2 receiver. He is just to small. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corp000085 Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 Moulds bleeds red white and blue. He'll take a REASONABLE paycut or sign a long term backloaded salary with the intensions of retiring (ala favre, bledsoe [w/NE in theory]) before the contract escalades. Now, if he's offered a 1 year, vet minimum, then of course he'll walk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
udonkey Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 If necessary, can we hope that Lee Evans would be ready to step into the #1 spot with Roscoe Parrish stepping up to #2 or #3? I'm sure that there will be another speedy WR to bring in during next year's draft to return kicks and/or compete for a #3 spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obie_wan Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 Moulds? Eric Moulds has been one of the best players on our team for a long long time....he is going to count what....TEN MILLION against the cap next year? What are we going to do? If he goes how do we replace him? 379823[/snapback] we are doomed!! How can we survive without another overpaid, underproductive, injury prone, big name player??!! oh- the humanity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 we are doomed!! How can we survive without another overpaid, underproductive, injury prone, big name player??!! oh- the humanity 379925[/snapback] injury prone? Are you f-in kidding me? 1996 Buffalo Bills 16 5 20 279 14.0 47 2 4 1 11 1997 Buffalo Bills 16 8 29 294 10.1 32 0 1 0 18 1998 Buffalo Bills 16 15 67 1368 20.4 84 9 22 8 54 1999 Buffalo Bills 14 14 65 994 15.3 54 7 13 6 44 2000 Buffalo Bills 16 16 94 1326 14.1 52 5 23 4 62 2001 Buffalo Bills 16 16 67 904 13.5 80 5 13 5 42 2002 Buffalo Bills 16 15 100 1292 12.9 70 10 14 6 64 2003 Buffalo Bills 13 13 64 780 12.2 49 1 10 1 35 2004 Buffalo Bills 16 16 88 1043 11.9 49 5 12 2 53 '99 - misses 2 games with a hammy injury '03 - bad groin limits him but he still plays... yep, moulds sure sounds injury prone, TD what are you waiting for, cut him! all of those seasons where he played 16 games show that yes, in fact, moulds is injury prone... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 Parrish will never be a number 1 or number 2 receiver. He is just to small. 379842[/snapback] That is what they told about another 5" 10" guy named Steve Tasker....He went on to have a great football career with the bills.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Real Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 we are doomed!! How can we survive without another overpaid, underproductive, injury prone, big name player??!! oh- the humanity 379925[/snapback] In his career he has never missed more than 3 games in any season. In the last 5 years in the league, he's averaged 83 receptions and 1069 yards. That is neither injury prone or underproductive. In fact he has top 5 WR numbers and has been loyal to the Bills over his career and in my opinion isn't overpaid considering everyone knows that he will renegotiate. Eric Moulds is excellent. He's the reason that Peerless and Evans had so much success. Give the guy his props and pay him. He has earned the right to retire a bill if he is willing to be reasonable. t-r Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San-O Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 If necessary, can we hope that Lee Evans would be ready to step into the #1 spot with Roscoe Parrish stepping up to #2 or #3? I'm sure that there will be another speedy WR to bring in during next year's draft to return kicks and/or compete for a #3 spot. 379855[/snapback] Evans is list at 5' 10" and Parrish at 5' 9" 170 lbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 Moulds bleeds red white and blue. He'll take a REASONABLE paycut or sign a long term backloaded salary with the intensions of retiring (ala favre, bledsoe [w/NE in theory]) before the contract escalades. Now, if he's offered a 1 year, vet minimum, then of course he'll walk. 379848[/snapback] The question is how much will the bills be willing to pay him and how much would Eric agree to take a paycut.... If he is going to compliment a Lee Evans next year, then as per the standard for a 2nd WR on the team, he should be getting a 3M+ salaray per year... Will Eric agree to reduce his salaray from 10M to 3M ? And if EM gets cut what is the money he is likely to get in the FA market (For example what did Dyson get this year from baltimore ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
34-78-83 Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 Guys, are ya really gonna let Obie Wan get you all worked up like that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Real Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 Guys, are ya really gonna let Obie Wan get you all worked up like that? 379945[/snapback] I just hate the fact that E.Moulds doesn't get the credit he deserves. The guy has been money in the league for 5 or 6 years now. When are people going to start giving him his much deserved credit? t-r Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obie_wan Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 In his career he has never missed more than 3 games in any season. In the last 5 years in the league, he's averaged 83 receptions and 1069 yards. That is neither injury prone or underproductive. In fact he has top 5 WR numbers and has been loyal to the Bills over his career and in my opinion isn't overpaid considering everyone knows that he will renegotiate. Eric Moulds is excellent. He's the reason that Peerless and Evans had so much success. Give the guy his props and pay him. He has earned the right to retire a bill if he is willing to be reasonable. t-r 379941[/snapback] Moulds has played through injuries, but those injuries have turned him into an ordinary WR. He has not produced as an elite WR for a number of seasons. He dropped passes last year, disappeared from games and was not a dominant player. His numbers look awesome to you, but Harrison caught 140 passes and Holt consistently puts 1500+ yards. Moulds has not produced at any where near those levels. Look at the TDs. And this was with Drew locking onto Moulds at every opportunity. Hopefully, JP can get him into the end zone. Unless Moulds "cuts" his base salary to $3 mil from $10 mil next year, he will be gone. There will be no JoBu magic to create dead money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerJ Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 I'm assuming the reference to PW relates to the fact that Bills fans have been tough on Pat Williams since he left. I really don't mind Phat Pat leaving for greener pastures. I really think he's on the slippery downslope of his career, but even if he's not and makes the Pro Bowl for the next three years, I won't be bothered by that. What bothers me is his mouthiness. He took the money and ran. So what, but then he turned around and tried to blame the Bills organization for his decision. As far as I'm concerned, he only makes himself look selfish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Real Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 Moulds has played through injuries, but those injuries have turned him into an ordinary WR. He has not produced as an elite WR for a number of seasons. He dropped passes last year, disappeared from games and was not a dominant player. His numbers look awesome to you, but Harrison caught 140 passes and Holt consistently puts 1500+ yards. Moulds has not produced at any where near those levels. Look at the TDs. And this was with Drew locking onto Moulds at every opportunity. Hopefully, JP can get him into the end zone. Unless Moulds "cuts" his base salary to $3 mil from $10 mil next year, he will be gone. There will be no JoBu magic to create dead money. 380112[/snapback] You think he is average? I don't think he is Randy Moss but he is probabily the most physical wide reciever in the game. He's the best in the NFL at beating the 5 yard bump. How many different DB's talk about how strong he is and how hard he is to line up against? On one hand people praise Travis Henry for playing injured, but if Eric Moulds guts it out he's bad for the team. I can't say that right now he would or should have to accept that big of a pay cut. What if he puts up 100, 1500 10? It wouldn't be the first time. He's got a well rounded offense around him with different weapons everywhere. It is possible. Peyton Manning looks for Marvin Harrison just as quickly as Drew looked for Moulds if not more. Not to mention their offense is 70% pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 You think he is average? I don't think he is Randy Moss but he is probabily the most physical wide reciever in the game. He's the best in the NFL at beating the 5 yard bump. How many different DB's talk about how strong he is and how hard he is to line up against? On one hand people praise Travis Henry for playing injured, but if Eric Moulds guts it out he's bad for the team. I can't say that right now he would or should have to accept that big of a pay cut. What if he puts up 100, 1500 10? It wouldn't be the first time. He's got a well rounded offense around him with different weapons everywhere. It is possible. Peyton Manning looks for Marvin Harrison just as quickly as Drew looked for Moulds if not more. Not to mention their offense is 70% pass. 380171[/snapback] I think Mould is above average and I dig having him on our team, but some things don't help his cause. He has a bad habit of looking for flags before a play is really done, and I freakin' hate that. And he probably would look better if we didn't try the garbage can throw from Bledsoe to the corner of the endzone so many freakin' times. "Oh, look, we're second and goal from the five. I have an idea. Let's throw it up for Moulds." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadBuffaloDisease Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 Since he signed his contract extension back in 2001, Eric has been one of the highest-paid WR's in the NFL. But he hasn't produced at that level, even though his presence opens things up for Evans. So I think he'll take a paycut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 "Oh, look, we're second and goal from the five. I have an idea. Let's throw it up for Moulds." 380176[/snapback] Sounds like a GM issue to me. Yeah. Definitely a GM issue. Sorry. I couldn't resist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_wag Posted July 12, 2005 Share Posted July 12, 2005 Moulds bleeds red white and blue. He'll take a REASONABLE paycut or sign a long term backloaded salary with the intensions of retiring (ala favre, bledsoe [w/NE in theory]) before the contract escalades. Now, if he's offered a 1 year, vet minimum, then of course he'll walk. 379848[/snapback] why didn't he sign that type of deal this off-season instead of the simple restructuring he did? it just means the problem has to be dealt with again next off-season.......i think he'll listen again, but with the way the unamortized bonus is piling up the bills can't keep delaying the decision on a one year basis year after year......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_wag Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Will Eric agree to reduce his salaray from 10M to 3M ? 379944[/snapback] his salary isn't 10M next year -- that is his cap hit....... his salary for next year is 6.089M.....the question becomes whether he thinks he can get that much in signing bonus/1st year salary from another club......i think he will be in a position to command more then that, and he has all the leverage given the fact the bills will not carry him at his 10M cap value...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Sounds like a GM issue to me. Yeah. Definitely a GM issue. Sorry. I couldn't resist. 380242[/snapback] Funny stuff, Nanker. Very funny stuff. Donahoe steps up to the line and takes the snap from Donahoe. He sees Donahoe in the corner of the endzone.... Oooooh, and the pass is picked off by everyone not named Donahoe!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 That is what they told about another 5" 10" guy named Steve Tasker....Hewent on to have a great football career with the bills.... 379939[/snapback] Touche. People forget about all those big receiving numbers Tasker put up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadBuffaloDisease Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 his salary isn't 10M next year -- that is his cap hit....... his salary for next year is 6.089M.....the question becomes whether he thinks he can get that much in signing bonus/1st year salary from another club......i think he will be in a position to command more then that, and he has all the leverage given the fact the bills will not carry him at his 10M cap value...... Sorry but Moulds won't get even get close to a $6M signing bonus if he gets cut and signs with another team. He's not the same WR he once was and is on the wrong side of 30. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Evans is list at 5' 10" and Parrish at 5' 9" 170 lbs. 379942[/snapback] Jason Peters is 6'4" and Randy Moss is 6'4". Same guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Jason Peters is 6'4" and Randy Moss is 6'4". Same guy. 380284[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Real Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 his salary isn't 10M next year -- that is his cap hit....... his salary for next year is 6.089M.....the question becomes whether he thinks he can get that much in signing bonus/1st year salary from another club......i think he will be in a position to command more then that, and he has all the leverage given the fact the bills will not carry him at his 10M cap value...... 380268[/snapback] Ok, I have a question. How does a team cut that number? The 10 million I mean. If his salary is 6 and his cap hit is 10, how do you get that lower? Also, Moulds will be 33 next year and I seriously doubt alot of teams would put a ton of cheddar out for him. Decent money, yes, but the difference should be easy to overcome if Moulds wants to stay a bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 What bothers me is his mouthiness. He took the money and ran. So what, but then he turned around and tried to blame the Bills organization for his decision. As far as I'm concerned, he only makes himself look selfish. 380127[/snapback] I think a lot of people are misinterpreting Pat Williams' "mouthiness". To me, he sounds like someone who loved playing in Buffalo, for the Bills, and is bitterly disappointed that he isn't a Bill any more. Maybe fans, and GM's can tell when a guy is approaching the top of the hill, so to speak, but the athletes themselves are normally the last to know. I suspect in 2 or 3 years, Williams will look back on his days with the Bills very fondly. Remember how pissed off Thurman was to be released by the Bills? It didn't last long. Football players are very emotional people, normally. Their emotions can contribute greatly to their play, but they can also lead them to short circut at times. Think of this as nothing more than a jilted lovers' quarrel. I, for one, wish Pat Williams the best of luck in Minnesota. We got a lot out of that guy, for a number of years, at a bargain price. Now, Minnesota is overpaying him, at the downside of his career. We got his best years. TD is a tough-guy. He is shrewd. IMO, his one distasteful quality, is that he tends to throw ex-Bills under the bus. He says an offer was rejected by Williams. Williamsagent claims no offer was made. It's not the first time this kind of thing has happened during TD's tenure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinky finger Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 You think he is average? I don't think he is Randy Moss but he is probabily the most physical wide reciever in the game. He's the best in the NFL at beating the 5 yard bump. How many different DB's talk about how strong he is and how hard he is to line up against? On one hand people praise Travis Henry for playing injured, but if Eric Moulds guts it out he's bad for the team. I can't say that right now he would or should have to accept that big of a pay cut. What if he puts up 100, 1500 10? It wouldn't be the first time. He's got a well rounded offense around him with different weapons everywhere. It is possible. Peyton Manning looks for Marvin Harrison just as quickly as Drew looked for Moulds if not more. Not to mention their offense is 70% pass. 380171[/snapback] No way does EM sniff 100, 1500, 10. Not with all the touches WM will get. I suppose 10 TDs is possible, but 100 & 1500 are numbers for the high powered passing offenses. I don't think the Bills are designed, this year, for a WR to tally those numbers. Besides, I'm not convinced EMs numbers will be that much better than LE numbers, if at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 IMO, his one distasteful quality, is that he tends to throw ex-Bills under the bus. He says an offer was rejected by Williams. Williamsagentclaims no offer was made. It's not the first time this kind of thing has happened during TD's tenure. 380406[/snapback] Who would you rather believe...The GM of your beloved Team, who has the team in his mind or an agent whose only prerogative is to get a big contract for his client ? Go Figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_wag Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Sorry but Moulds won't get even get close to a $6M signing bonus if he gets cut and signs with another team. He's not the same WR he once was and is on the wrong side of 30. 380282[/snapback] joe horn (who is 33) recently inked an extension that gave him 7 million up front (+ salary of 665K in the first year of the deal).........i certainly think the two are comparable......... either way, i think we'll have the chance to see how much he will command on the open market........i don't see moulds as a bill in '06......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astrobot Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Would you want Moulds to be the eventual receivers coach? I see Moulds playing at $4M next year, with an offer that includes moving into coaching with the Bills when he's ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 No way does EM sniff 100, 1500, 10. Not with all the touches WM will get. I suppose 10 TDs is possible, but 100 & 1500 are numbers for the high powered passing offenses. I don't think the Bills are designed, this year, for a WR to tally those numbers. Besides, I'm not convinced EMs numbers will be that much better than LE numbers, if at all. 380415[/snapback] JP notwithstanding, it's possible. Cincy's Rudi Johnson set a team record for carries - 361, and WR's Chad Johnson and T.J. Houshmanzedeh caught 95 and 73 respectively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_wag Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Ok, I have a question. How does a team cut that number? The 10 million I mean. If his salary is 6 and his cap hit is 10, how do you get that lower? Also, Moulds will be 33 next year and I seriously doubt alot of teams would put a ton of cheddar out for him. Decent money, yes, but the difference should be easy to overcome if Moulds wants to stay a bill. 380295[/snapback] one way to get it lower is to do a "simple restructuring.........this involves converting salary into signing bonus (reason being signing bonus can be amortized over the life of the deal whereas salary counts on the current year's cap)........the player gets paid the same, but cap dollars get pushed from the current year into future years.........the problem with this strategy is that those unamortized bonus dollars never go away until they hit the cap, whether the player is on the roster or not......... another option is to do an "extension".........in this case the salary is again reduced, but to make up for that a new signing bonus is issued........this is added to the old "unamortized" signing bonus and is then amortized over the new life of the deal.........this is what the saints did with joe horn.......this makes more sense cap wise because you can set up 2 or 3 manageable years where you don't have to deal with the issue every season, but the catch is you are giving more cash to them so you want to make sure they will be around and not ready to take a slide in performance because the cap hit is nasty to dump them......... because mould's cap number is 10 and his salary is 6 he has 4M in unamortized bonus for the '06 season.........he is also signed through '07, so double that to 8M.........THAT IS 8M THAT HAS TO HIT THE CAP AT SOME POINT........not a great situation to be in, but one that was created by extending his deal last year by only 1 year instead of a few.........to get it lower they could drop his salary and add more signing bonus to be amortized (not a great option because at that point there is only one year left on the contract -- you are just moving dollars into the 2007, creating a huge cap hit)........the other option is to drop his salary to the 1.5M level again, give him the difference in signing bonus again, but EXTEND THE DEAL BY A FEW SEASONS.......at that point the signing bonus can then be amortized further.........but it's a bad situation overall because eventually those signing bonus dollars are going to have to hit the cap......... this is all the result of the bills backloading the deal and taking VERY SMALL CAP HITS the first few seasons of it.........for example, the bills only gave him 500K in salary in '01 and 1.55 in '02........those numbers should have been higher which would have helped balance out the backend of the contract........i think the bills will approach him again with another 1 year extension next off-season, but this just means that unamortized bonus number keeps growing and growing year after year........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_wag Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 IMO, his one distasteful quality, is that he tends to throw ex-Bills under the bus. He says an offer was rejected by Williams. Williamsagentclaims no offer was made. It's not the first time this kind of thing has happened during TD's tenure. 380406[/snapback] williams' agent does not deny that their was an offer made in the early summer........the problem was that was TD's "take it or leave it offer"........williams' agents complaint (and williams as well) is that the bills didn't even contact them from that point further.......not before the season, not during the season, and not after the season........williams had no choice but to look elsewhere because the bills wouldn't even give him the courtesy of a call to attempt to work something out after all those years of service........that is what pissed him off, and i don't blame him........not being able to work out a deal is one thing........not even attempting it is another all together........ TD has stated publically they made him an offer in the summer and that was their last contract talks with pat williams.........he did the exact same thing with JJ...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick in* england Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 williams' agent does not deny that their was an offer made in the early summer........the problem was that was TD's "take it or leave it offer"........williams' agents complaint (and williams as well) is that the bills didn't even contact them from that point further.......not before the season, not during the season, and not after the season........williams had no choice but to look elsewhere because the bills wouldn't even give him the courtesy of a call to attempt to work something out after all those years of service........that is what pissed him off, and i don't blame him........not being able to work out a deal is one thing........not even attempting it is another all together........ TD has stated publically they made him an offer in the summer and that was their last contract talks with pat williams.........he did the exact same thing with JJ...... 380477[/snapback] A take it or leave it offer seems fair. He's saying to JJ and PW that we want you - but only on our terms. If they REALLY wanted to stay they would have. Instead both chose to chase the money... And now they are bitching about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fake-Fat Sunny Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 There are a number of factors here which folks do not seem to be factoring in entirely in their offerings of what is fair and what is not: 1. The salary cap is really going to surge with the new TV contracts and the amount of money available to players by rule under the CBA (they are guaranteed a certain % of the designated gross which includes TV receipts). I believe (correct me if I am wrong because there are many factors here such as when the TV checks are in, the renegotiation of a new CBA once all the owners get on thesame page) that when the next FA period comes around their will be a lot of cap room to increase contracts like Clements and valued vets will be rewarded with new deals or old deals which were too big under the old cap will be honored as teams move to deliver roughly 70% of the designated gross to players salaries. 2. Reality matters. For example, if Moulds suffers an injury to the one Andre Reed suffered in his contract year, then the market for him will likely be soft and the Bills will be able to sign him to a coditional deal which rewards him only if he performs. Gameplanning what ifs at this point is a pretty foolish game with an older player. Likewise too, if Moulds puts up a year like his average over the last 5 (80+ catches and over a 1000 yards) then the market for him will be stronger and if/when his new contract forces a cut then he will play that market (where a 6 million signing bonus might be relative chump change under a new cap). 3. Intangibles matter. They matter less if the intangible is a relative one like a judgment that Moulds is a vet who had made recurring deals to the Bills satisfaction, but they matter more when they are rooted in reality. the intangibles which matters most with Moulds are: A. He has the flexibility to play the slot or the wing. He does not fear going over the middle and he has some speed and even better athleticism to allo w for some highlight reel circus catches which allows him to be a threat in multiple slots. B. His flexibilbity as a WR forces opponents to cover based on not only what he is doing (some folks are correct in saying he is not Marvin Harrison but so what on a given play you have to double him or put your best cover guy on him (and thus not on Evans, Price, Reed. etc) but what he might do if you do not dt him or cover him tight. C. He has ad a couple of injuries which hurt us (more testimony to how good of a player he is) but like it or not he generally has started 13-16 games a season in his career and he is durable in that regard. Will Mou;ds be worth a salary of $10 million next year? Probably not. Will Moulds agree to a salary which allows the Bills to compete and acquire other players? probably yes as this is what he has done in the real-world historically. I see know problem here that is not easily solved depending upon how he does this year and how he survives that cannot be easily done. Cut him if he sucks and sign him if he does not suck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 williams' agent does not deny that their was an offer made in the early summer........the problem was that was TD's "take it or leave it offer"........williams' agents complaint (and williams as well) is that the bills didn't even contact them from that point further.......not before the season, not during the season, and not after the season........williams had no choice but to look elsewhere because the bills wouldn't even give him the courtesy of a call to attempt to work something out after all those years of service........that is what pissed him off, and i don't blame him........not being able to work out a deal is one thing........not even attempting it is another all together........ TD has stated publically they made him an offer in the summer and that was their last contract talks with pat williams.........he did the exact same thing with JJ...... 380477[/snapback] That doesn't mean it was a take-it-or leave-it offer whatsoever. He gave three offers to the three UFA. One of them, Schobel, decided to negotiate and got the early deal done. The one thing you always complain we don't do. OOOPS, I forgot. It had to be the early summer weeks instead of the late summer weeks. So I guess it doesn't count. No negotiations went on during the season for JJ and PW, which they normally don't. Both parties, meaning JJ and PW, had already long known they would test free agency to get their offers up. That is what happens 99% of the time. TD didn't come back to PW during the first week of FA because as far as he was concerned, he had made the last offer. Why was it incumbent upon him in your mind that he should up his offer before PW makes a counter offer? They never came back to the table either. And took the first big offer without giving the Bills a chance to match it either. That negotiation went both ways. Neither side "negotiated" to keep PW in Buffalo. In fact, it was PW who didn't negotiate. I highly doubt, and would bet anything, that TD would not have matched the Vikings offer. He didn't think PW was worth that much money. It's arguable whether he was. The Vikes obviously thought so. But PW didn't negotiate any more or less than TD did. In fact, less. Because TD made a (admittedly) low offer and PW didn't make a counter offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_wag Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 That doesn't mean it was a take-it-or leave-it offer whatsoever. He gave three offers to the three UFA. One of them, Schobel, decided to negotiate and got the early deal done. The one thing you always complain we don't do. OOOPS, I forgot. It had to be the early summer weeks instead of the late summer weeks. So I guess it doesn't count. No negotiations went on during the season for JJ and PW, which they normally don't. Both parties, meaning JJ and PW, had already long known they would test free agency to get their offers up. That is what happens 99% of the time. TD didn't come back to PW during the first week of FA because as far as he was concerned, he had made the last offer. Why was it incumbent upon him in your mind that he should up his offer before PW makes a counter offer? PW's agent did counter the summer offer shortly after receiving at which that point TD shut down discussions due to their distance apart....... They never came back to the table either. And took the first big offer without giving the Bills a chance to match it either. again, incorrect..........PW's agent did give the bills the chance to match, despite the fact he hadn't heard a word from TD since early summer....... That negotiation went both ways. Neither side "negotiated" to keep PW in Buffalo. In fact, it was PW who didn't negotiate. incorrect.......he countered, and never heard a response to his counter.......TD decided to not even attempt to work out a deal after that initial "take it or leave it" offer......... But PW didn't negotiate any more or less than TD did. In fact, less. Because TD made a (admittedly) low offer and PW didn't make a counter offer. your facts are wrong....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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