Leslie Frazier, Alex Smith, and the Golden Handcuffs

[Behindenemylines]

11 hours ago, benderbender said:

Frazier deserved the Chicago Bears HC job. He was exactly what they needed. It is a crime against the football gods that he didn't. Bears ownership is reaping what they have sewn and it doesn't even make me happy. 

Frazier is a wimp and can’t handle a HC job.  Why are we even discussing this.  

[benderbender]

11 hours ago, Behindenemylines said:

Frazier is a wimp and can’t handle a HC job.  Why are we even discussing this.  

We're discussing it because there were no real answers given so it's open to endless speculation. 

[PBF81]

On 10/4/2023 at 10:39 AM, Doc said:

Limiting points is the most important thing.  Most of those extra yards were probably surrendered during garbage time.

 

So in the comparison, you're saying that was the case this season, but not last season then?  

 

That make sense to your?  

 

 

Edited October 5, 2023 by PBF81

[Chicken Boo]

Alex Smith's 104 rating is akin to Singletary's 4.5 ypc. 

 

Some folks struggled to grasp that.

Edited October 5, 2023 by Chicken Boo

[eball]

The fans who still believe 13 seconds was McD’s fault are the delusional ones.

 

[Doc]

3 hours ago, PBF81 said:

So in the comparison, you're saying that was the case this season, but not last season then?  

 

That make sense to your? 

 

Fewer points allowed but more yards?  Why yes, yes it does.  And you win the game based on points allowed, not yards.

 

Does this have something to do with the "the Bills didn't address MLB and Nakobe Dean would have been the best move"?

Edited October 5, 2023 by Doc

[NoHuddleKelly12]

On 10/4/2023 at 10:35 AM, MJS said:

Overruled the squib kick? Everything I have seen and heard is that everyone, including McDermott, was expecting the squib kick, but Bass did not get the word from the coaches.

 

And we don't know for sure that McDermott called the D. That's a logical assumption, but he could have also trusted Frazier to do it and got seriously burned by that decision. We don't know because they've been tight lipped about it.

It will be quite a day around here once the retired coach/player memoir comes out revealing what exactly went down at that moment! 

[Behindenemylines]

10 hours ago, benderbender said:

We're discussing it because there were no real answers given so it's open to endless speculation. 

Frasier played a soft assed weak D that gave up play after play. Maybe the stats looked good-but so did Tyrods as a reference.
 

our D after 4 games is so superior.   Just look at the outcomes!   Frasier cost this organization in many ways.  His coaching style was the equivalent of all the junk in our garages.  So much of it is too good throw away but not good enough to keep.  He should have been gone several years ago as we had out grown him as a coach. If not for McBeanes loyalty he would have been. I know 💯 I would have canned him two years ago.  

 

Probably a good guy(I’ve never met him and never heard otherwise) and probably good enough to coach for 16-20 teams, but not for real contenders.  
 

prove me wrong please. 
 

 

[PBF81]

3 hours ago, Doc said:

Fewer points allowed but more yards?  Why yes, yes it does.  And you win the game based on points allowed, not yards.

 

Does this have something to do with the "the Bills didn't address MLB and Nakobe Dean would have been the best move"?

 

55 v. 58?  Really?  

 

To put it in the same context, that's 3/4 point per game, or 13 points per season.  The difference between the first ranked scoring D and the last ranked scoring D last season was 186 points, or about 11 PPG.  

 

Somehow I'd take a stab that if by season's end we'll have allowed 13 more points but 1,800 more yards than last season, that there won't be a whole lot of people talking about how much better McD's D is.  

 

Anyway, way to leapfrog the point entirely.  

 

But you can be right.  I'm fine with it.  LOL 

 

 

Edited October 6, 2023 by PBF81

[DuckyBoys]

Frazier had a system and did not change up game plan week to week  We'll see on McDermott but I think he may tailor each week more to the opponent

[Doc]

1 hour ago, PBF81 said:

55 v. 58?  Really?  

 

To put it in the same context, that's 3/4 point per game, or 13 points per season.  The difference between the first ranked scoring D and the last ranked scoring D last season was 186 points, or about 11 PPG.  

 

Somehow I'd take a stab that if by season's end we'll have allowed 13 more points but 1,800 more yards than last season, that there won't be a whole lot of people talking about how much better McD's D is.  

 

Anyway, way to leapfrog the point entirely.  

 

But you can be right.  I'm fine with it.  LOL

 

The point is points allowed.  Yards don't mean anything as long as they don't lead to points.  I'm not sure why this even needs to be said.  Now if you're talking fantasy football...

 

As for the points, they've actually allowed just 49 points, not 55, since the Jets scored a TD on a punt return in OT.  So that's 9 fewer points than last year.  I checked the first 4 games last year and there were no STs points scored by the opponents so last year's team did give up 58 points.

 

But since you did the math and to remove another argument, let's say we use 55 points.  The Bills were 2nd in points allowed last year, just 9 points behind SF.  You think anyone will care that they surrendered almost 1,800 more yards if they end up with the #1 scoring defense?  LOL

[PBF81]

27 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

The point is points allowed.  Yards don't mean anything as long as they don't lead to points.  I'm not sure why this even needs to be said.  Now if you're talking fantasy football...

 

As for the points, they've actually allowed just 49 points, not 55, since the Jets scored a TD on a punt return in OT.  So that's 9 fewer points than last year.  I checked the first 4 games last year and there were no STs points scored by the opponents so last year's team did give up 58 points.

 

But since you did the math and to remove another argument, let's say we use 55 points.  The Bills were 2nd in points allowed last year, just 9 points behind SF.  You think anyone will care that they surrendered almost 1,800 more yards if they end up with the #1 scoring defense?  LOL

 

You're reading waaaaay too much into this.  

 

Who knows, maybe we'll average 150 yards against the rest of the season, I have no idea.  

 

All I was saying that it's not as obvious to me yet that this D is better yet.  Particularly since we haven't even really played a good offensive team besides Miami, and becuase of a few errors on their part they only put up 20 on nearly 400 yards of offense.  

 

Relax a little.  It was just a reason for caution, that's all.  I mean seriously, as if what, this would be the first season that we've started hot like this but then cooled off or something, in point or yardage?   I mean it's only been the pattern now for two seasons and possibly this one.  

 

If you don't want to be cautious, great, don't.  I don't care.  LOL   I really don't.  

 

At least allow me to be if you dont' mind.  

 

🙄

 

... BTW, I just looked, in '21 we gave up only 44 in our first four games, 64 in our first five, which gives us a buffer of only 9 points for this next game in comparison.  So using that we're 11 back, AND over 300 yards compared to '21.  

 

Both seasons combined, the early games anyway, I'm personally far from convinced that the D is better yet after having played Garropalo, Wilson, and Howell.  

 

 

Edited October 6, 2023 by PBF81

[Just in Atlanta]

I’m not sure golden handcuffs means what you think it means. 

Edited October 7, 2023 by Just in Atlanta

[Doc]

11 minutes ago, Just in Atlanta said:

I’m not sure golden handcuffs means what you think it means. 

 

Inconceivable!

[Scott7975]

Frazier was a damn good coach.  However, this D so far is playing with an edge that I haven't seen before.  They are playing fast, physical, and disciplined football.  I hope that continues through the season and into the playoffs.  If it does, this team is going to the show.

[Man with No Name]

On 10/5/2023 at 3:03 PM, eball said:

The fans who still believe 13 seconds was McD’s fault are the delusional ones.

 

well, he's the head coach. so yes it is his fault. if he wasn't a part of the discussion, he gave frazier too much autonomy. 

[Real McClappy]

Leslie was a good dude for Buffalo overall.  I"m happy for the switch and wish him nothing but the best.

 

Here is a video of him on numerous Bills topics. This is a solid interview worth a listen on our Bills.

 

Edited October 7, 2023 by Real McNasty

[SloanBillsFan]

On 10/4/2023 at 10:37 AM, FrenchConnection said:

It's interesting that you bring up Alex Smith. People forget how good of a year he had statistically in 2017. It was a really bold move to trade a guy that just threw for over 4,000 yards and 26 TDs with only 5 INTs to start an unproven Mahomes who was for all intents and purposes a rookie. It has obviously worked out, but it took stones at the time.

The fact that Mahomes sat behind a really good QB is in my opinion the basic difference between Patrick and Josh. What did Josh have his first season? Mr. INT, Nathan Peterman. Then Josh was just thrown into a baptism by fire. 

 

That's not to say Mahomes isn't one of the best QBs in the league. He is. He just had a better mentor to help him on his path to the field. 

 

On Frazier I guess "I'm taking a year off" was another smokescreen since he's with the NFL Network now. I know optics favor flash over substance but geez just be honest. Did he and McD afraid the fans would riot? 

 

I'll be quiet now 

[Matt_In_NH]

On 10/4/2023 at 9:15 AM, WhoTom said:

 

Well, the OP isn't using the Golden Handcuffs metaphor correctly.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_handcuffs

 

 

 

Yeah, this would be a more a golden parachute deal....he is still getting paid.  Then again, handcuffs just does not fit, it is not clear he did not mean shower

Edited October 19, 2023 by Matt_In_NH