Success Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 Honestly, a tip of the cap to the mighty hoodie. That was something else, and as soon as it happened, it was like, how has no one else thought of this? He should have kept it in his back pocket for a bigger game, imo. I can see multiple variations of that kind of disruption. Obviously, teams will prep better for it now. But in some ways, it seems like that move in "Karate Kid" for which there is no real defense. Gotta wonder if we'll try a wrinkle or 2 in that respect, but at minimum, we need to prepare for it. Thoughts? 2 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiotAct Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 care to elaborate? Was it something about the scheme in the way they lined up that’s a huge mismatch or something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 (edited) 3 minutes ago, RiotAct said: care to elaborate? Was it something about the scheme in the way they lined up that’s a huge mismatch or something? dude lined up near the sidelines and then before the kick came screaming in like he was in motion towards the LOS and then hit the LOS perfectly as the ball was snapped and got there so easily it will be almost impossible to make another FG if this becomes standard operating procedure without some major adjustments... It was like the punt block when the guy lines up to cover the gunner then before the snap comes flying in towards the LOS to block the punt leaving the gunner uncovered...except in this case he was out there covering nobody and then did the same thing. Edited September 18, 2023 by Big Turk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 2 minutes ago, RiotAct said: care to elaborate? Was it something about the scheme in the way they lined up that’s a huge mismatch or something? They ran a guy parallel to the line of scrimmage to get him momentum for when the ball was snapped. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fleezoid Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 That was a good design. He was able to watch the snap of the ball and had some speed when he cut up field. It'll be hard to repeat as the end guys will see it coming now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 1 minute ago, Big Turk said: dude lined up near the sidelines and then before the kick came screaming in like he was in motion towards the LOS and then hit the LOS perfectly as the ball was snapped and got there so easily it will be almost impossible to make another FG if this becomes standard operating procedure without some major adjustments I mean, the "major" adjustment is have a guy ready to block him. 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 Just now, MJS said: I mean, the "major" adjustment is have a guy ready to block him. Then that opens up other holes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABILLBACKER Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 Holders will have to delay the snap to cause off sides. It was a brilliant timing play. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Franco_92 Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 First counter is to be unpredictable about the snap to either neutralize the guy completely or cause an offside penalty 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Brown Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 One time thing. Easily defendable with delayed snap and extra blocker. Nice job by BB though for trying to make up for not signing Hopkins to make the offense at least average. 1 2 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 1 minute ago, Big Turk said: Then that opens up other holes. Not really, because if you devote a guy to do the run, you are taking him away from the rush anyway. Plus, all you really need to do is wait to snap it until he runs in and is forced to stop, or snap it before he is close enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoofHearted Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 3 minutes ago, MJS said: I mean, the "major" adjustment is have a guy ready to block him. The major adjustment is to vary the snap like it's coached to be. This is what happens when there's poor coaching of special teams. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QCity Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 It wasn't just a block, the play was designed to score. Check out Miller running down field in case the blocked ball comes to him. Never seen anything like that. 6 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 Just now, Doc Brown said: One time thing. Easily defendable with delayed snap and extra blocker. Nice job by BB though for trying to make up for not signing Hopkins to make the offense at least average. Yeah, it was a nice play, but it isn't going to revolutionize anything. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motorin' Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 1 minute ago, arcane said: First counter is to be unpredictable about the snap to either neutralize the guy completely or cause an offside penalty Which they did a little bit on the next fg. But it seemed to throw the timing off, and you have to think the kicker is a bit distracted by a guy screaming down the line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoofHearted Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 (edited) 7 minutes ago, QCity said: It wasn't just a block, the play was designed to score. Check out Miller running down field in case the blocked ball comes to him. Never seen anything like that. All FG blocks are taught that way. There's always a block guy to one side and a scoop and score guy to the other. This is nothing new. EDIT: @QCity - not sure what you're disagreeing with. Do some research about FG Block Schemes if you don't believe me. The information is out there lol. Edited September 18, 2023 by HoofHearted 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 Just now, Motorin' said: Which they did a little bit on the next fg. But it seemed to throw the timing off, and you have to think the kicker is a bit distracted by a guy screaming down the line. They had a sucky kicker from long range anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 Just now, Motorin' said: Which they did a little bit on the next fg. But it seemed to throw the timing off, and you have to think the kicker is a bit distracted by a guy screaming down the line. yup, he missed quite badly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevewin Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 FWIW it wasn't the fat miserable cheating ball coach who drew it up - it was mastermind Joe Judge Quote "(Special teams coaches Joe) Judge, (Joe) Houston, and Cam (Achord), they dialed up a really good scheme for that block and saw a weak point on their field goal operation," Schooler said after the game. "We worked it during the week and felt pretty confident about it going into the game." 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rock'em Sock'em Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 Another brilliant part of the play for New England is that the off rushing end (#27) did not rush the kicker. He was awaiting to pick up a blocked football for a scoop and score. Yesterday, the ball did not bounce he was, but it would seem likely to do so based on where he was waiting. https://www.patriots.com/video/brenden-schooler-blocks-dolphins-field-goal Having a speedy edge blocker capable of blocking that player, or putting the edge blocker more off the LOS would have its own consequences. The best counter of this will be changing the snap count and perhaps even using well timed offensive motion and hard counts to draw that player offside. And of course doing that could diminish the ability to focus on the kick. I'm curious to see how prevalent this becomes. On a similar note, Kam Chancellor had a few blocked kicks before the NFL put in a rule preventing his technique. https://www.seahawks.com/video/seahawks-safety-kam-chancellor-leaps-to-block-field-goals-184788 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pocoboy Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 It's another flashy thing that will many every pundit fawn over Belicheat's brilliance, while his success without Brady stands on its own legs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warcodered Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 11 minutes ago, Doc Brown said: One time thing. Easily defendable with delayed snap and extra blocker. Nice job by BB though for trying to make up for not signing Hopkins to make the offense at least average. Feels like the kind of thing they were able to do because the Dolphins let themselves become too predictable/complacent on the FG while having a vulnerability. Belichick had it perfectly schemed up but little chance it works again and it didn't though the kicker did miss his next kick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterpan Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 The Cheats obviously saw something on film and were able to time the snap. Like a routine “tell”. Otherwise you could never time it so well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 I mean... doesn't change much if the tackle sees him and blocks him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr.Sack Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 One idea I thought of long ago is to have a female gymnast prepared to go airborne in front of the field goal poles. Have two guys capable of launching a 90 pounder into the air 20-30’ have her attempt to punch the ball out of the air. Not sure if it would be legal but it would do wonders for DEI initiatives. 1 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRebound Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 Apparently the Dolphins holder played for Pats the last 5 years so they knew his tendency. This is a 1 time thing that now every holder will make sure theyre not telling pitches. Seems like Belichik spends 90% of his time trying to find advantages like this. It worked when Brady took care of the offense. Now Belichik looks like a crazy old coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffaloboyinATL Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 43 minutes ago, Success said: Honestly, a tip of the cap to the mighty hoodie. That was something else, and as soon as it happened, it was like, how has no one else thought of this? He should have kept it in his back pocket for a bigger game, imo. I can see multiple variations of that kind of disruption. Obviously, teams will prep better for it now. But in some ways, it seems like that move in "Karate Kid" for which there is no real defense. Gotta wonder if we'll try a wrinkle or 2 in that respect, but at minimum, we need to prepare for it. Thoughts? Yeah, I am guessing it may lead to a rule change. You are allowed a running start as long as you are not heading towards the line of scrimmage, which he wasn’t. I was shocked when I saw it, because I have never seen anyone do that before. I agree, leave it to the evil genius, to come up with something new, in a game that’s been played for over 100 years. (By the way, it is likely not new, but it was new to me.) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaMilBill Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 41 minutes ago, Fleezoid said: That was a good design. He was able to watch the snap of the ball and had some speed when he cut up field. It'll be hard to repeat as the end guys will see it coming now. Feel like just have a hard count. Should be easy to draw them Offside Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 I'm wondering, if you draw this guy Offside, is it a free play like on offense? So Sam Martin can just take the ball and throw it downfield? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Einstein Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 38 minutes ago, QCity said: It wasn't just a block, the play was designed to score. Check out Miller running down field in case the blocked ball comes to him. Never seen anything like that. Gotta give Belichick credit. The stuff he comes up with is incredible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QLBillsFan Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 2 minutes ago, VaMilBill said: Feel like just have a hard count. Should be easy to draw them Offside And or hot read where you throw to the flat for a TD ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiotAct Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 3 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said: I'm wondering, if you draw this guy Offside, is it a free play like on offense? So Sam Martin can just take the ball and throw it downfield? Should be! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Caveman Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 45 minutes ago, Big Turk said: Then that opens up other holes. maybe? It's not like it's a 12th guy on the field. They have always had to block him, they just weren't expecting him to be coming in that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fleezoid Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 4 minutes ago, VaMilBill said: Feel like just have a hard count. Should be easy to draw them Offside Possibly. Not sure how the snap is timed. I'd be worried it would throw the kicker's timing off. Perhaps just delay the snap a bit so the rusher has to stop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 9 minutes ago, Dr.Sack said: One idea I thought of long ago is to have a female gymnast prepared to go airborne in front of the field goal poles. Have two guys capable of launching a 90 pounder into the air 20-30’ have her attempt to punch the ball out of the air. Not sure if it would be legal but it would do wonders for DEI initiatives. The NFL now has a "goaltending" rule where you're no longer allowed to block a kick as it passes over the crossbar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevewin Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 34 minutes ago, pocoboy said: It's another flashy thing that will many every pundit fawn over Belicheat's brilliance, while his success without Brady stands on its own legs. 7 minutes ago, Einstein said: Gotta give Belichick credit. The stuff he comes up with is incredible. Wasn't Bellicheat Quote "(Special teams coaches Joe) Judge, (Joe) Houston, and Cam (Achord), they dialed up a really good scheme for that block and saw a weak point on their field goal operation," Schooler said after the game. "We worked it during the week and felt pretty confident about it going into the game." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoofHearted Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 Just now, Fleezoid said: Possibly. Not sure how the snap is timed. I'd be worried it would throw the kicker's timing off. Perhaps just delay the snap a bit so the rusher has to stop. There are no snap counts on FG. Holders usually flash a hand to signify they are ready to receive the snap, but then the snapper has free reign to snap whenever he wants. This is to ensure no one can time up the snap. This is taught at every level. How Miami got away with having the same operation before someone got them on it is baffling. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beach Posted September 18, 2023 Share Posted September 18, 2023 Pat Mcafee broke it down, the holder had a tell and the holder was in NE for 6years. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ticketssince61 Posted September 19, 2023 Share Posted September 19, 2023 A total aside - but Patriots should go back to these uni's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWeatherMan Posted September 19, 2023 Share Posted September 19, 2023 Yes, just saw the Steelers use this formation against the Browns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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