SCBills Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 If given the choice: Let Poyer and Edmunds walk. Trade Ed Oliver. All three Day 1/Day 2 picks used to replace DT, LB and S. Then, after likely restructures, the Bills become MAJOR players in Free Agency. We're talking about the ability to sign 2 premier OL Free Agents, along with a WR like OBJ or Meyers. OR We likely let Poyer walk regardless, but keep Oliver and re-sign Edmunds. Maybe have enough money to sign an IOL. Draft WR/OL/S on Day 1 and Day 2. ------ I'd be fine with heavy defensive draft investment if it means getting Allen proven protection and another proven weapon. We can always draft a WR early next year with Davis in a contract year. Hypothetically (or something similar) Allen Dawkins - Bates - Morse - Seumalo - McGlinchey (Brown OL6) Cook - Day 3 Pick - Hines Knox - Morris Diggs - OBJ - Davis - Shakir - Beasley Von - Jones - RD1 Pick - Rousseau RD2 Pick - Milano White - Elam - Taron RD3 Pick/Benford - Hyde Enough money to bring back depth guys like Boettger, Jackson, Marlowe, Phillips, Lawson etc., ----- I doubt we do this, but I think it's time to pour money into the Offense. By doing that, I'd be ok with another defense heavy draft. Allen needs PROVEN protection, and a guy like OBJ on a 2-3 year deal (tied to Von's time here) makes all the sense in the world for us. Or do we want status quo on Defense and an Offense-heavy draft? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 They don't NEED to keep spending day 1 picks on defense. We don't NEED a top 5 defense every year. Just going to have to live with an average D and invest the resources to offense. The rules favor the offense, we have a superhuman at QB, invest in it instead of forcing him to do superhuman things too often. OLine and WR. The D is going to get scored on in the playoffs against good offensive teams, we have seen that throughout the playoffs. and from experience. It doesn't matter...rules are titled too heavily to the offense now, stop trying be great at both and focus on being great at the side of the ball where we can benefit the most. If McD is such a great defensive coach he should be able to do more with less. 6 2 2 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCBills Posted February 21, 2023 Author Share Posted February 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, Big Turk said: They don't NEED to keep spending day 1 picks on defense. We don't NEED a top 5 defense every year. Just going to have to live with an average D and invest the resources to offense. The rules favor the offense, we have a superhuman at QB, invest in it instead of forcing him to do superhuman things too often. OLine and WR. The D is going to get scored on in the playoffs against good offensive teams, we have seen that throughout the playoffs. and from experience. It doesn't matter...rules are titled too heavily to the offense now, stop trying be great at both and focus on being great at the side of the ball where we can benefit the most. If McD is such a great defensive coach he should be able to do more with less. I completely agree, but would be fine taking a stud DT if we get Oliver off the books to sign a premier OL. DL is where I don't hate the investment, BUT Beane has to do better... and I'm to the point where I'd rather spend/trade for a Von Miller merc every few years while drafting monster DT's. As far as LB goes, if we let Edmunds walk, given we only play 2 LB's primarily, they are going to draft one early and/or sign a capable mid-tier vet. I'm fine with that too... IF the Edmunds money goes to Offense. Safety is where I start getting beyond frustrated, because we shouldn't need to use a Day 2 pick at Safety... there are going to be places where we aren't top notch on Defense, and I'm completely fine letting Benford and Marlowe go at it for who starts next to Hyde over the summer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 26 minutes ago, SCBills said: If given the choice: Let Poyer and Edmunds walk. Trade Ed Oliver. All three Day 1/Day 2 picks used to replace DT, LB and S. Then, after likely restructures, the Bills become MAJOR players in Free Agency. We're talking about the ability to sign 2 premier OL Free Agents, along with a WR like OBJ or Meyers. OR We likely let Poyer walk regardless, but keep Oliver and re-sign Edmunds. Maybe have enough money to sign an IOL. Draft WR/OL/S on Day 1 and Day 2. ------ I'd be fine with heavy defensive draft investment if it means getting Allen proven protection and another proven weapon. We can always draft a WR early next year with Davis in a contract year. Hypothetically (or something similar) Allen Dawkins - Bates - Morse - Seumalo - McGlinchey (Brown OL6) Cook - Day 3 Pick - Hines Knox - Morris Diggs - OBJ - Davis - Shakir - Beasley Von - Jones - RD1 Pick - Rousseau RD2 Pick - Milano White - Elam - Taron RD3 Pick/Benford - Hyde Enough money to bring back depth guys like Boettger, Jackson, Marlowe, Phillips, Lawson etc., ----- I doubt we do this, but I think it's time to pour money into the Offense. By doing that, I'd be ok with another defense heavy draft. Allen needs PROVEN protection, and a guy like OBJ on a 2-3 year deal (tied to Von's time here) makes all the sense in the world for us. Or do we want status quo on Defense and an Offense-heavy draft? I think aiming for an above average offensive line is the sweet spot. There’s very little difference between the impact of the 4th and 16th best OLs, but the cost is very different. So I’d like to see the Bills aim to field the 10th-12th best OL while finding a C of the future and maintaining good depth. That should leave enough resources to find another playmaker at WR and still have some leftover for a little defensive help. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCBills Posted February 21, 2023 Author Share Posted February 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, BarleyNY said: I think aiming for an above average offensive line is the sweet spot. There’s very little difference between the impact of the 4th and 16th best OLs, but the cost is very different. So I’d like to see the Bills aim to field the 10th-12th best OL while finding a C of the future and maintaining good depth. That should leave enough resources to find another playmaker at WR and still have some leftover for a little defensive help. Potentially true, but it isn't lost on me that the #1 OL and #2 OL played each other in the Super Bowl. Also isn't lost on me that the "elite" defense didn't look any different from the average defense in that game. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCbillsfan Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 Bills will keep Oliver because there are higher priorities to address imo. Poyer is likely gone so that's likely at least a draft pick needed. Also, even though they like Edmunds I think he's gonna get a huge offer somewhere else. So losing Edmunds is a huge hole to fill. Probably sign a veteran LB as a bridge and draft a LB early (first 3 rounds.) The remaining picks hopefully are used on OL, WR, and a late pick on RB. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimer1960 Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 29 minutes ago, Big Turk said: They don't NEED to keep spending day 1 picks on defense. We don't NEED a top 5 defense every year. Just going to have to live with an average D and invest the resources to offense. The rules favor the offense, we have a superhuman at QB, invest in it instead of forcing him to do superhuman things too often. OLine and WR. The D is going to get scored on in the playoffs against good offensive teams, we have seen that throughout the playoffs. and from experience. It doesn't matter...rules are titled too heavily to the offense now, stop trying be great at both and focus on being great at the side of the ball where we can benefit the most. If McD is such a great defensive coach he should be able to do more with less. Your points are true, but I think it would be foolish to just flat not consider half of the players in the draft because they play defense. That, I think, would be a recipe for reaches and disappointment. I understand and agree that if there are relatively equal options available at any given pick on offense and defense that we'd prefer they lean offense, but I think it looks likely that at some of their picks that there could be better options on defense available than on offense. For instance, I think that there could be a better pass rusher available at pick 27 than the options remaining at OL and WR. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 4 minutes ago, SCBills said: Potentially true, but it isn't lost on me that the #1 OL and #2 OL played each other in the Super Bowl. Also isn't lost on me that the "elite" defense didn't look any different from the average defense in that game. Point taken, although I don’t think I’d have KC’s quite that high. Philly probably had the best in the NFL tho. Maybe Cleveland was with them or better when healthy. And good point on the “elite” defenses. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 36 minutes ago, SCBills said: Then, after likely restructures, the Bills become MAJOR players in Free Agency. We're talking about the ability to sign 2 premier OL Free Agents, along with a WR like OBJ or Meyers. Bills are -$20M without signing Poyer or Edmunds and once you move Saffold and Phillips void year money and replace them on the Top 51. How much cap in restructuring do you think Beane is going to free up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCBills Posted February 21, 2023 Author Share Posted February 21, 2023 (edited) 3 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: Bills are -$20M without signing Poyer or Edmunds and once you move Saffold and Phillips void year money and replace them on the Top 51. How much cap in restructuring do you think Beane is going to free up? The Allen restructure brings us to where we are out of the red. Bills are likely willing to restructure other guys that have been mentioned in order to free up, say, 12M for Year 1 of an Edmunds deal. Trade Ed Oliver. Gives us around 11M. Operating on that premise alone, simply letting Edmunds walk and trading Oliver, frees up - at minimum - 23M that the Bills likely had earmarked for those two. Edited February 21, 2023 by SCBills Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 25 minutes ago, SCBills said: The Allen restructure brings us to where we are out of the red. Bills are likely willing to restructure other guys that have been mentioned in order to free up, say, 12M for Year 1 of an Edmunds deal. Trade Ed Oliver. Gives us around 11M. Operating on that premise alone, simply letting Edmunds walk and trading Oliver, frees up - at minimum - 23M that the Bills likely had earmarked for those two. I guess we'll find out about an Oliver trade soon enough. I just don't see that happening. You give a lot of options, but money will be tight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Says Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 You're cutting McKenzie to keep Beasley? Don't assume Bills won't consider bringing Crowder back. Dane Jackson is RFA and they could keep him. Spencer Brown was banged up early and I wonder of he takes a step this year. A second TE might help this offense. And no thanks to OBJ. I'd rather add a young,healthy WR in the draft or free agency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCBills Posted February 21, 2023 Author Share Posted February 21, 2023 8 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: I guess we'll find out about an Oliver trade soon enough. I just don't see that happening. You give a lot of options, but money will be tight. Honestly, I don't either. I absolutely loathe the fact Oliver is eating 11M next year. We have zero DT's locked up beyond next year, but that's a story for another time. I think it's such a gross mismanagement of cap to pay him that money while we're all pontificating on how the Bills can scrape together scraps to sign a mid-tier IOL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 4 minutes ago, SCBills said: Honestly, I don't either. I absolutely loathe the fact Oliver is eating 11M next year. We have zero DT's locked up beyond next year, but that's a story for another time. I think it's such a gross mismanagement of cap to pay him that money while we're all pontificating on how the Bills can scrape together scraps to sign a mid-tier IOL. It will no doubt be an interesting year no matter which way Beane turns the team or not. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 1 hour ago, SCBills said: If given the choice: Let Poyer and Edmunds walk. Trade Ed Oliver. All three Day 1/Day 2 picks used to replace DT, LB and S. Then, after likely restructures, the Bills become MAJOR players in Free Agency. We're talking about the ability to sign 2 premier OL Free Agents, along with a WR like OBJ or Meyers. OR We likely let Poyer walk regardless, but keep Oliver and re-sign Edmunds. Maybe have enough money to sign an IOL. Draft WR/OL/S on Day 1 and Day 2. ------ I'd be fine with heavy defensive draft investment if it means getting Allen proven protection and another proven weapon. We can always draft a WR early next year with Davis in a contract year. Hypothetically (or something similar) Allen Dawkins - Bates - Morse - Seumalo - McGlinchey (Brown OL6) Cook - Day 3 Pick - Hines Knox - Morris Diggs - OBJ - Davis - Shakir - Beasley Von - Jones - RD1 Pick - Rousseau RD2 Pick - Milano White - Elam - Taron RD3 Pick/Benford - Hyde Enough money to bring back depth guys like Boettger, Jackson, Marlowe, Phillips, Lawson etc., ----- I doubt we do this, but I think it's time to pour money into the Offense. By doing that, I'd be ok with another defense heavy draft. Allen needs PROVEN protection, and a guy like OBJ on a 2-3 year deal (tied to Von's time here) makes all the sense in the world for us. Or do we want status quo on Defense and an Offense-heavy draft? As far as I am concerned, as long as Frazier is here, it almost doesn't matter if we let Edmunds and Poyer walk because the scheme we play is atrocious in the post season against teams like Chiefs and Bengals, who the AFC will be going through for the foreseeable future. Not to mention other teams are on the rise like Jets, Miami, and Jags. So while in the past, I have been keen about keeping both sides of the ball up, this offseason I have flipped to focusing mostly on the offense and start cutting salaries on defense because I have absolutely no faith in Frazier come post season time to be any better or worse despite it. There are guys in FA like Al-Shaair from SF who can be had cheaper that can do a lot of the things Edmunds does and there are some options at Safety too. If I had to pick one to keep though, it would be Poyer for 2 years because he will be a much smaller cap hit than Edmunds. I would also trade Oliver just because I have a hard time seeing them shell out big money to keep a guy who has been so inconsistent and dependent on the guys around him to succeed. I think an interior DL core that is made up of Jones, Phillips and Settle is strong enough that we can afford to trade Oliver and then add another DT in FA or Draft. Now spend a lot of that saved money this year and next year (not having to pay Oliver) and our draft picks on revamping the OL and getting another legit receiving weapon and an upgrade at RB. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBeaneBandit Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 I would be okay with that if they signed a wide receiver and a premier guard in free agency. But they would also have to keep their eye out for a bigger size running back to pair with Cook in the middle rounds as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freddie's Dead Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 Yes, please. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AuntieEm Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, SCBills said: Honestly, I don't either. I absolutely loathe the fact Oliver is eating 11M next year. We have zero DT's locked up beyond next year, but that's a story for another time. I think it's such a gross mismanagement of cap to pay him that money while we're all pontificating on how the Bills can scrape together scraps to sign a mid-tier IOL. I never liked the Oliver pick. The whole thing in college with the jacket on the sidelines didn't leave a positive impression to begin with, but when his name got called just something about how he rubbed his hands together just screamed to me he was only thinking about the money he make and not that he realized a lifelong dream of getting drafted into the NFL. Nothing he shows playing or in interviews tells me he loves playing. Let him cash his checks from another team. Edited February 21, 2023 by AuntieEm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherlock Holmes Posted February 21, 2023 Share Posted February 21, 2023 Trades then FA then Draft... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProcessTruster Posted February 22, 2023 Share Posted February 22, 2023 hard to imagine OBJ has much left. why keep gambling on huge contract shiny objects, failed this year with Von Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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