UKBillFan Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 8 minutes ago, mannc said: Maybe, but if he had articulated a compelling defense he could at least have bought more time…he didn’t give the Bills anything to work with. It's possible the Bills told him not too. Or his attorney (who isn't much better than the alleged victim's attorney) did. For his job, it might have been better to speak out. For his chances in court, it may be better to keep quiet for now other than the controlled statements. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanSD Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 40 minutes ago, BarleyNY said: Lol. Yeah, no college aged guy could ever see that one coming. Some HS kid lying about her age. Also even if she did tell him she was 18 (crazy how some fellow SDSU football players remember that little detail) and he got her a beer (that wasn’t laced with anything), then that’s still a crime. Best case scenario for Araiza is that he’s guilty of some very bad things. Worst case, he’s guilty of some truly horrifying crimes. I’m happy he’s gone from Buffalo. Giving an underage kid a beer isn't a very bad thing. It's like the least bad illegal thing that a college student might do. I'm happy that Araiza is gone because I'd prefer not to have a rapist on the team. I would be happy with him being a Bill if all he did was give out beer to high schoolers. Come on now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullBuchanan Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 3 minutes ago, Yobogoya! said: I think the most he’s won with Araiza’s release is a Pyrrhic victory. Granted the spotlight is now hot on this case, but anyone representing Araiza in court is going to use the journal entries he published online to demonstrate how the accuser herself admits she was not cognizant at the time of the attack and had no idea who was involved. Seems like they just wanted to get Araiza cut, and they did. But if both the criminal and civil trials turn out to be duds, he’ll be punting again for someone in no time. That’s far from a resounding success if you ask me. That was stated right in the lawsuit - i don't see how there's any contradiction or how her admission of being unaware of all the parties involved is highly relevant. That's what the police are supposed to be for. She claimed that she knows she had sex with Araiza (which is a crime on his part) and that he led her back to a room where she was raped (which would also be a crime(s) even if he did not take part). I agree that I don't think there's been any success here - beyond getting attention and public pressure on a story that a university tried to bury (yet again). However, that in itself is meaningful given what we've seen over the years as related to incidents of sexual assault. Had he made the team, he'd at least have a couple million dollars to go after. Now he'll be broke. Not sure why they'd want to get him released if their goal was financial restitution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motorin' Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 14 minutes ago, Yobogoya! said: I think the most he’s won with Araiza’s release is a Pyrrhic victory. Granted the spotlight is now hot on this case, but anyone representing Araiza in court is going to use the journal entries he published online to demonstrate how the accuser herself admits she was not cognizant at the time of the attack and had no idea who was involved. Seems like they just wanted to get Araiza cut, and they did. But if both the criminal and civil trials turn out to be duds, he’ll be punting again for someone in no time. That’s far from a resounding success if you ask me. As soon as the Civil Suit begins, they can subpoena the evidence obtained in the criminal investigation. They are after the results of the rape kit test, which may or may not have even been processed yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 9 minutes ago, BillsFanSD said: Giving an underage kid a beer isn't a very bad thing. It's like the least bad illegal thing that a college student might do. I'm happy that Araiza is gone because I'd prefer not to have a rapist on the team. I would be happy with him being a Bill if all he did was give out beer to high schoolers. Come on now. Tip of the iceberg and all. Also depends on context. A 21 year old guy handing a beer to a 17 or 18 year old girl who’s already drunk might just have some ulterior motives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanSD Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 Just now, BarleyNY said: Tip of the iceberg and all. Also depends on context. A 21 year old guy handing a beer to a 17 or 18 year old girl who’s already drunk might just have some ulterior motives. Maybe, but if it were me, I would focus on the "gang rape" thing, not the "underage consumption" thing. I mean, really now. Underage consumption? We're throwing that particular stone? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 1 hour ago, mannc said: Someone WAY down thread produced a link that appears reliable, stating that the prosecutor has to prove there was no reasonable mistake about the victim’s age. Actually, it’s the defendant that has to prove there was a reasonable and actual expectation to believe the victim was 18 or older. Evidence could include attire, appearance, venue, testimony, etc. The prosecutor merely has to establish the victim was under 18 at the time. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 6 minutes ago, K-9 said: Actually, it’s the defendant that has to prove there was a reasonable and actual expectation to believe the victim was 18 or older. Evidence could include attire, appearance, venue, testimony, etc. The prosecutor merely has to establish the victim was under 18 at the time. Not under California law, apparently. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 6 minutes ago, BillsFanSD said: Maybe, but if it were me, I would focus on the "gang rape" thing, not the "underage consumption" thing. I mean, really now. Underage consumption? We're throwing that particular stone? Sure. That’s obviously the worst of it. There’s plenty of other bad stuff too. Might want to take off the royal blue colored glasses for a sec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanSD Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 2 minutes ago, BarleyNY said: Sure. That’s obviously the worst of it. There’s plenty of other bad stuff too. Might want to take off the royal blue colored glasses for a sec. I'm not being a homer here. No team would cut a player because they once provided beer to a minor. I certainly would not want the Bills to do so, but I wouldn't want any employer to do that either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 7 minutes ago, BillsFanSD said: I'm not being a homer here. No team would cut a player because they once provided beer to a minor. I certainly would not want the Bills to do so, but I wouldn't want any employer to do that either. No kidding. It is more that he gave an already drunk 17 year old more beer and then had sex with her. That’s not just statuary rape, that’s rape. Oh and he did so knowing that he had chlamydia. That’s all before he - or possibly someone else - took her inside and upstairs to a bedroom to be gang raped. Weird that someone else could’ve taken her to the room though. what would’ve had to happen was that Araiza met this girls, had sex with her and then just walked away as soon as he was done. Just went to hang out with some other people or something. That’d be very odd. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKBillFan Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 Just now, BarleyNY said: No kidding. It is more that he gave an already drunk 17 year old more beer and then had sex with her. That’s not just statuary rape, that’s rape. Oh and he did so knowing that he had chlamydia. That’s all before he - or possibly someone else - took her inside and upstairs to a bedroom to be gang raped. Weird that someone else could’ve taken her to the room though. what would’ve had to happen was that Araiza met this girls, had sex with her and then just walked away as soon as he was done. Just went to hang out with some other people or something. That’d be very odd. Any proof of any of this or are we jumping to conclusions... again? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc11 Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 3 minutes ago, BarleyNY said: No kidding. It is more that he gave an already drunk 17 year old more beer and then had sex with her. That’s not just statuary rape, that’s rape. Oh and he did so knowing that he had chlamydia. That’s all before he - or possibly someone else - took her inside and upstairs to a bedroom to be gang raped. Weird that someone else could’ve taken her to the room though. what would’ve had to happen was that Araiza met this girls, had sex with her and then just walked away as soon as he was done. Just went to hang out with some other people or something. That’d be very odd. You're speaking on her accusations like they have already been proven to be fact. 1 hour ago, Doc said: How? How do you prove he wasn't in the room gang-raping her other than denying it, which many people won't believe? And all people want to know when they hear "statutory rape" is "lock him up" without hearing context. Again there was no time for resolution so the Bills had no choice but to move on so it wouldn't be a distraction going forward. Witnesses. Thats how you build a case, witnesses. 1 hour ago, mannc said: Araiza had at least a month to come up with a response, even though the complaint wasn’t filed until Thursday. They could have hired investigators, found witnesses who could back up his story. He should have anticipated a public furor. And Araiza could have issued a comprehensive denial, which he never did. His official statement was pathetic and weak. His lawyer did get an investigator that has interviewed witnesses. He's already stated this. You don't lay out your entire defense outside of court. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 5 minutes ago, Herc11 said: His lawyer did get an investigator that has interviewed witnesses. He's already stated this. You don't lay out your entire defense outside of court. Usually that’s true, but not in this case. Araiza was fighting for his reputation and his career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motorin' Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 2 minutes ago, Herc11 said: You're speaking on her accusations like they have already been proven to be fact. Araiza's attorney disputes many aspects. He claims she was not intoxicated when she arrived and that Matt never gave her a drink. What he has not disputed was that Matt had sex with her outside of the house shortly after meeting her, and that she was later sexually assaulted by other members of the team. In fact, Araiza's attorney stated that one of the other teammates may be charged with rape based on the evidence he has obtained. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herc11 Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 1 minute ago, mannc said: Usually that’s true, but not in this case. Araiza was fighting for his reputation and his career. His lawyer is a criminal defense lawyer. His goal is to keep Matt out of jail, not on the team. 1 minute ago, Motorin' said: Araiza's attorney disputes many aspects. He claims she was not intoxicated when she arrived and that Matt never gave her a drink. What he has not disputed was that Matt had sex with her outside of the house shortly after meeting her, and that she was later sexually assaulted by other members of the team. In fact, Araiza's attorney stated that one of the other teammates may be charged with rape based on the evidence he has obtained. Correct. Like always, there are three sides to every story. In this case: Hers, His, and the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 1 minute ago, Herc11 said: His lawyer is a criminal defense lawyer. His goal is to keep Matt out of jail, not on the team. I actually find it interesting he hired a criminal defense attorney. He was hired 6 weeks ago which lines up with when the police 1st spoke with him. I have to imagine someone is going to be charged with rape for the police to start asking Araiza questions 9 months after the alleged rape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 6 minutes ago, Herc11 said: His lawyer is a criminal defense lawyer. His goal is to keep Matt out of jail, not on the team. No, his goal is whatever his client tells him his goal is. If he wasn’t willing to fight for Araiza’s job, then Araiza had the right to replace him with someone who would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKBillFan Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 1 minute ago, mannc said: No, his goal is whatever his client tells him his goal is. If he wasn’t willing to fight for Araiza’s job, then Araiza had the right to replace him with someone who would. But attorneys, with experience of the law, tend to guide clients what the goal should be. In this case, the advice probably is staying out of prison/being found not guilty is more important than staying on the Bills roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted August 28, 2022 Share Posted August 28, 2022 19 minutes ago, UKBillFan said: Any proof of any of this or are we jumping to conclusions... again? They are only allegations at this point, which is what has made this whole thing so hard 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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