11/7/21 Bills @ Jaguars Postgame Thread

[CincyBillsFan]

13 minutes ago, Nitro said:

Offense was brutally bad today.  No one escapes criticism.   Line was.  OTs were slow and acted liked turnstiles.  RBs were MIA.   Allen was rushed and he reverted to hero mode often.  WRs could not get open which is shocking due to the amount of blitzing Jacksonville did.  The Bills, post bye week, has played one good quarter of offense out of eight.  That is a top down problem.  Dabol has to go back to the drawing board.  Allen has to make better choices.  Overall the talent in the O line is not what they thought it was.  The Bills will make the play offs but the weak O line will thwart Super Bowl dreams.

I largely agree with this with the exception that the O-line is way worse then we thought it was.  Its not NFL caliber.  This calls for a complete reworking of the O-line and offensive game plan to include, IF Brown can't go this week, the following:

 

*  Start the other rookie at RT and move Williams to guard. 

 

*  Activate Bridda at RB.  We need the speed.

 

*  Put #41 and #89 (assuming Knox can't go) in the backfield to provide max protection. 

 

 

[CNYfan]

We are sitting three pretty good DLine Players and don't have 5 decent Oline guys.  Figure that

[CincyBillsFan]

4 minutes ago, RichRiderBills said:

With a few sobering hours to reflect....I'm more and more cool on Daboll. He had a pretty crappy gameplan, but worse a bad ability to adapt in game. 

 

Man ...in a tight game there is just no need to structure the offense with high risk stuff with the 2020 defense. If we would have had some juicier QB runs, more heavy looks, toss sweeps, jet sweeps, we would have won. Play calling has to match the tempo of a game, especially adjustments. 

But who do we put in to run a "heavy" look?  A third string practice squad TE and an experimental FB?  And our RB's are not built to execute a heavy run package. They made the assumption that the O-line would at least be competent and that Allen and the WR's would carve people up.  The problem is that at best this year the O-line has been below average and today it was way below the NFL minimum for a functional unit.  It really was that bad.

 

 

 

 

[galept]

26 minutes ago, Nitro said:

The Bills will make the play offs but the weak O line will thwart Super Bowl dreams.

 

That's a little bold at this point. I think we need to show we can still win some games before we start talking about playoffs.

Edited November 8, 2021 by galept

[Livinginthepast]

The one thing I cant understand about Daboll is why he doesnt recognize the obvious reality of having a terrible offensive line and no running attack by using a different focus during the days preceding a game or adjusting with different playcalls in game. This never seems to happen. Daboll had to know that Dawson Knox being out has really hurt the game plan the past couple of games and that his replacements are just not up to it.  Its the same thing with Beane not even trying to fix this on the trade deadline by bringing in somebody else in, either a lineman or a RB. What is with the paralysis in the decision making? If there was nobody out there to bring in then fine, thats the Bills bad luck, but at least tweak the game plan to play to the strengths of your Oline and running game and not to their weaknesses. Running those plays with that line today was just dumb. Especially when it became apparent pretty early on that the Jags were having an easy time pressuring Josh and stopping the run. 

[newcam2012]

4 hours ago, 97bills said:

Win you can rush 4 and get that much pressure and drop everyone it’s not hard. Oh and don’t worry about the running game at all. I think one of the announcers even said it during the game the defense pays no attention to the running backs on the way to hit Allen. 

That's not good when teams don't respect your run game. 

45 minutes ago, Nitro said:

Offense was brutally bad today.  No one escapes criticism.   Line was.  OTs were slow and acted liked turnstiles.  RBs were MIA.   Allen was rushed and he reverted to hero mode often.  WRs could not get open which is shocking due to the amount of blitzing Jacksonville did.  The Bills, post bye week, has played one good quarter of offense out of eight.  That is a top down problem.  Dabol has to go back to the drawing board.  Allen has to make better choices.  Overall the talent in the O line is not what they thought it was.  The Bills will make the play offs but the weak O line will thwart Super Bowl dreams.

Well said.

[ngbills]

7 minutes ago, Livinginthepast said:

The one thing I cant understand about Daboll is why he doesnt recognize the obvious reality of having a terrible offensive line and no running attack by using a different focus during the days preceding a game or adjusting with different playcalls in game. This never seems to happen. Daboll had to know that Dawson Knox being out has really hurt the game plan the past couple of games and that his replacements are just not up to it.  Its the same thing with Beane not even trying to fix this on the trade deadline by bringing in somebody else in, either a lineman or a RB. What is with the paralysis in the decision making? If there was nobody out there to bring in then fine, thats the Bills bad luck, but at least tweak the game plan to play to the strengths of your Oline and running game and not to their weaknesses. Running those plays with that line today was just dumb. Especially when it became apparent pretty early on that the Jags were having an easy time pressuring Josh and stopping the run. 

We need gailey. I am kidding but seriously he found ways to produce with awful OL. 

[newcam2012]

29 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

I largely agree with this with the exception that the O-line is way worse then we thought it was.  Its not NFL caliber.  This calls for a complete reworking of the O-line and offensive game plan to include, IF Brown can't go this week, the following:

 

*  Start the other rookie at RT and move Williams to guard. 

 

*  Activate Bridda at RB.  We need the speed.

 

*  Put #41 and #89 (assuming Knox can't go) in the backfield to provide max protection. 

 

 

Changes need to be made. I'm not sure this whole sale changes in mid season are the answer. Your season has some validity but it doesn't seem to be the Bills offenaive strengths or identity.

[Bangarang]

I’m going to get criticized for this but I don’t care.

 

Our d-line sucks at collapsing the pocket and getting pressure. Groot is decent against the run but he’s invisible at actually getting pressure off the edge. He gets coverage sacks and that’s really it.

 

Epenesa had a great preseason and was unblockable. Well, that’s because he was going against our o-line. He’s another guy who is largely invisible every week. 
 

We used a 2nd round pick on Boogie just for him to be a healthy scratch almost every week. Not that I think he’s going to be a great lad rusher either but it just goes to the point that it’s a poor use of resources. 
 

Our offense needs a complete makeover. Our RBs are just guys. The interior of offensive line needs a complete overhaul. Two of our top 3 WRs are on the wrong side of 30 with one of them only here on a 1 year deal. 
 

It’s a copy cat league and teams are seeing that all it takes is to just send 4 rushers and play 2 high safeties to essentially eliminate every big and explosive play. 

Edited November 8, 2021 by Bangarang

[RyanC883]

Bean sucks.   Running game sucked last year, still sucks.  OL sucks last year, no material changes made. 

 

JA can’t throw and our backup RB’s can run behind this awful OL 

 

We have not beat a team with a winning record (unless KC now has one?). 

52 minutes ago, RichRiderBills said:

With a few sobering hours to reflect....I'm more and more cool on Daboll. He had a pretty crappy gameplan, but worse a bad ability to adapt in game. 

 

Man ...in a tight game there is just no need to structure the offense with high risk stuff with the 2020 defense. If we would have had some juicier QB runs, more heavy looks, toss sweeps, jet sweeps, we would have won. Play calling has to match the tempo of a game, especially adjustments. 

 

MCD also sucks in game 

[CincyBillsFan]

5 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

I’m going to get criticized for this but I don’t care.

 

Our d-line sucks at collapsing the pocket and getting pressure. Groot is decent against the run but he’s invisible at actually getting pressure off the edge. He gets coverage sacks and that’s really it.

 

Epenesa had a great preseason and was unblockable. Well, that’s because he was going against our o-line. He’s another guy who is largely invisible every week. 
 

We used a 2nd round pick on Boogie just for him to be a healthy scratch almost every week. Not that I think he’s going to be a great lad rusher either but it just goes to the point that it’s a poor use of resources. 
 

Our offense needs a complete makeover. Our RBs are just guys. The interior of offensive line needs a complete overhaul. Two of our top 3 WRs are on the wrong side of 30 with one of them only here on a 1 year deal. 
 

It’s a copy cat league and teams are seeing that all it takes is to just send 4 rushers and play 2 high safeties to essentially eliminate every big and explosive play. 

I don't agree with everything you posted but it is a fair take.  Another poster noted that we're sitting three D-linemen who would likely make the D-line rotation on a lot of NFL teams every week while putting O-linemen on the field who wouldn't play for most teams.  That is a waste of resources. 

 

 

[RyanC883]

8 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

I’m going to get criticized for this but I don’t care.

 

Our d-line sucks at collapsing the pocket and getting pressure. Groot is decent against the run but he’s invisible at actually getting pressure off the edge. He gets coverage sacks and that’s really it.

 

Epenesa had a great preseason and was unblockable. Well, that’s because he was going against our o-line. He’s another guy who is largely invisible every week. 
 

We used a 2nd round pick on Boogie just for him to be a healthy scratch almost every week. Not that I think he’s going to be a great lad rusher either but it just goes to the point that it’s a poor use of resources. 
 

Our offense needs a complete makeover. Our RBs are just guys. The interior of offensive line needs a complete overhaul. Two of our top 3 WRs are on the wrong side of 30 with one of them only here on a 1 year deal. 
 

It’s a copy cat league and teams are seeing that all it takes is to just send 4 rushers and play 2 high safeties to essentially eliminate every big and explosive play. 

 

Bean is overrated.  Basham is inactive while OL Humphrey is an all pro per PFF.  Groot is just as you said.  He is Lawson 2.0.   W have zero elite talent on the OL or DL.  I cant think of a SB caliber team without an elite player at either spot.  

[Bruffalo]

8 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

I’m going to get criticized for this but I don’t care.

 

Our d-line sucks at collapsing the pocket and getting pressure. Groot is decent against the run but he’s invisible at actually getting pressure off the edge. He gets coverage sacks and that’s really it.

 

Epenesa had a great preseason and was unblockable. Well, that’s because he was going against our o-line. He’s another guy who is largely invisible every week. 
 

We used a 2nd round pick on Boogie just for him to be a healthy scratch almost every week. Not that I think he’s going to be a great lad rusher either but it just goes to the point that it’s a poor use of resources. 
 

Our offense needs a complete makeover. Our RBs are just guys. The interior of offensive line needs a complete overhaul. Two of our top 3 WRs are on the wrong side of 30 with one of them only here on a 1 year deal. 
 

It’s a copy cat league and teams are seeing that all it takes is to just send 4 rushers and play 2 high safeties to essentially eliminate every big and explosive play. 

I don't understand the lack of D-Line pressure no matter who we play.  It's almost like it's a scheme or coaching issue, we have this huge rotation of players but Addison still plays 60% of snaps.  

[newcam2012]

11 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

I’m going to get criticized for this but I don’t care.

 

Our d-line sucks at collapsing the pocket and getting pressure. Groot is decent against the run but he’s invisible at actually getting pressure off the edge. He gets coverage sacks and that’s really it.

 

Epenesa had a great preseason and was unblockable. Well, that’s because he was going against our o-line. He’s another guy who is largely invisible every week. 
 

We used a 2nd round pick on Boogie just for him to be a healthy scratch almost every week. Not that I think he’s going to be a great lad rusher either but it just goes to the point that it’s a poor use of resources. 
 

Our offense needs a complete makeover. Our RBs are just guys. The interior of offensive line needs a complete overhaul. Two of our top 3 WRs are on the wrong side of 30 with one of them only here on a 1 year deal. 
 

It’s a copy cat league and teams are seeing that all it takes is to just send 4 rushers and play 2 high safeties to essentially eliminate every big and explosive play. 

No criticism here. Your points are valid. The Bills weaknesses are being exposed. The game is mostly won on both side of the lines. Currently, the Bills Oline is clearly not a strong suit. Can they improve? Will they have enough to contribute to a super bowl run? It's a week to week game. After this week, it's hard to feel confident about the Bills chances to hoist the Lombardi trophy. Fortunately, the Bills have time to make adjustments and improvements. The coaches and players will be tested and challenged. Go Bills!

[CincyBillsFan]

1 minute ago, RyanC883 said:

 

Bean is overrated.  Basham is inactive while OL Humphrey is an all pro per PFF.  Groot is just as you said.  He is Lawson 2.0.   W have zero elite talent on the OL or DL.  I cant think of a SB caliber team without an elite player at either spot.  

I have hope that Groote can develop into an elite D lineman and if Oliver keeps getting better he can become an elite defensive tackle.  But your observation is spot on - there is not currently an elite lineman on either side of the ball playing for the Bills.  And while the D-line has a lot of solid talent you could argue that the best Bill's O-lineman is only average - and maybe not even that.  This is why it's critical that Brown develop into a top flight tackle.

 

 

 

 

[RyanC883]

Just now, CincyBillsFan said:

I have hope that Groote can develop into an elite D lineman and if Oliver keeps getting better he can become an elite defensive tackle.  But your observation is spot on - there is not currently an elite lineman on either side of the ball playing for the Bills.  And while the D-line has a lot of solid talent you could argue that the best Bill's O-lineman is only average - and maybe not even that.  This is why it's critical that Brown develop into a top flight tackle.

 

 

 

 

 

great reply.  totally agree. 

[newcam2012]

4 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

I don't understand the lack of D-Line pressure no matter who we play.  It's almost like it's a scheme or coaching issue, we have this huge rotation of players but Addison still plays 60% of snaps.  

The defense gave up 9 points today. Come on this loss was on the offense. 

[Nelius]

Not a lot more to say about this mess, but will add that Dawkins noticeably stuck out to me today as being horrendous. It felt like there were multiple plays in a row where he got completely embarrassed. Something seemed off with him, I've never seen him play that consistently awful. He looked gassed.

[Blank Stare]

If Moss is ok, I’d like to see Motor sit next week. Despite all the off season talk, he’s still the same guy he was last year. Go with Brieda and Moss. Get more speed on the field. Praying Brown and Knox are back next week. I’d cut Ford and either raid a PS olineman from another team or activate Stevenson. Ford is done here. 

Edited November 8, 2021 by TheProcess

[Bruffalo]

Just now, newcam2012 said:

The defense gave up 9 points today. Come on this loss was on the offense. 

I'm not implying it isn't, but the fact that our D-Line doesn't really get sacks is kind of a head scratcher.

 

The O-Line is obviously the biggest issue moving forward, as it's limiting the whole offense.  I just want to see a more dominating front from the D-Line, they definitely move people off their mark but they need to get home more.