TheJauronClap Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 (edited) 53 minutes ago, mannc said: Maybe I'm still salty over that awful performance last night, but I'm not going to give Beane huge props for the Diggs trade. Diggs definitely had a great year, but I would argue that Josh Allen elevated Diggs, just as he elevated Beasley. And you're not even addressing the fact that the Bills could have stayed at 22 and picked Justin Jefferson, who's six years younger than Diggs, is on a much cheaper contract over the next four years, and put up numbers that were every bit as good as Diggs's this year, with Kirk Cousins throwing him the ball. Care to address that? Easy he it the number 2 wideout with arguably the best RB in the NFL. So mainly going to be single coverage with single high safety. Diggs was against bracket coverage and still ate. Need speed I like toney from Florida and etienne if we can snag him Edited January 25, 2021 by TheJauronClap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 Just now, TheJauronClap said: Easy he it the number 2 wideout with arguably the best RB in the NFL. So mainly going to be single coverage with single high safety. Diggs was against bracket coverage and still ate That’s fair, but wasn’t Diggs in that same situation last year with the Vikings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheJauronClap Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 (edited) 3 minutes ago, mannc said: That’s fair, but wasn’t Diggs in that same situation last year with the Vikings? If your QB doesn’t like you he won’t trust you so throws won’t go his way. Diggs was open about it he said he went to Kirk and the OC and they brushed him off that’s when the fallout happened Edited January 25, 2021 by TheJauronClap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Real McClappy Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 2 hours ago, The Frankish Reich said: McD seems so hell-bent on making him the next Luke Kuechly that he doesn't seem to get this. He's a very talented player being forced into a role he's ill-suited for. Luke is the exact kinda player this D truly needs at this phase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 13 minutes ago, mannc said: There’s no reason to think he won’t. Are you confident that in five years Diggs will be outperforming Jefferson? There isn't a reason? So every rookie that plays well will always continue to play well at an elite level? Was Javon Kearse as good as Bruce Smith? Was Anquan Boldin as good as Marvin Harrison? So now we aren't talking about 2020 or 2021...we have to start arguing about 2026. By 2026, Diggs may not even be a Bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 2 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said: There isn't a reason? So every rookie that plays well will always continue to play well at an elite level? Was Javon Kearse as good as Bruce Smith? Was Anquan Boldin as good as Marvin Harrison? So now we aren't talking about 2020 or 2021...we have to start arguing about 2026. By 2026, Diggs may not even be a Bill. You aren’t making much sense here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Frankish Reich Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 1 minute ago, Royale with Cheese said: There isn't a reason? So every rookie that plays well will always continue to play well at an elite level? Was Javon Kearse as good as Bruce Smith? Was Anquan Boldin as good as Marvin Harrison? So now we aren't talking about 2020 or 2021...we have to start arguing about 2026. By 2026, Diggs may not even be a Bill. The aging curve for WRs isn't terribly promising now. I don't see many Jerry Rices or Marvin Harrisons performing at a Pro Bowl level into their mid-30s. Diggs is still young (just turned 27) so the Bills don't have to confront that issue, but it's something to keep in mind. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Frankish Reich Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 8 minutes ago, Real McNasty said: Luke is the exact kinda player this D truly needs at this phase. If only we could create another one. And that's kind of my point: Luke Kuechly wasn't so much created by the Panthers. He arrived fully formed as one of the most skilled, disruptive forces in football. Tremaine has the athletic talent, but simply doesn't have anywhere near the understanding of the game. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 1 minute ago, mannc said: You aren’t making much sense here... You said there isn't any reason to believe Jefferson won't be as good as Diggs. I brought up players who also had record breaking rookie seasons. Kearse had a decent career, Boldin had a good career but never one of the top 3 WR in the game. So then you bring up who will be better 5 years from now in 2026.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOUSE Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 I thought this was some 1970s thread about Keith Richards 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 Just now, Royale with Cheese said: You said there isn't any reason to believe Jefferson won't be as good as Diggs. I brought up players who also had record breaking rookie seasons. Kearse had a decent career, Boldin had a good career but never one of the top 3 WR in the game. So then you bring up who will be better 5 years from now in 2026.... The typical trajectory is that players get better after their rookie seasons, not worse. The fact that you can name a few guys who got worse after their rookie seasons is not evidence that Jefferson will. FFS, he's 21-years old. Why would he regress? It's far more likely that Diggs, who will be 28 before next season, will never have another season like this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Real McClappy Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 1 minute ago, The Frankish Reich said: If only we could create another one. And that's kind of my point: Luke Kuechly wasn't so much created by the Panthers. He arrived fully formed as one of the most skilled, disruptive forces in football. Tremaine has the athletic talent, but simply doesn't have anywhere near the understanding of the game. That the biggest ? Can it be developed or coached in Edmunds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Frankish Reich Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 Just now, Real McNasty said: That the biggest ? Can it be developed or coached in Edmunds? I think we've seen that it can't. I was willing to give him a long leash - 19 years old when drafted and all that. And he's still young. But I don't see the growth happening. If we were talking about a guy with, say, a defensive tackle's body (Ed Oliver?) that would signal that maybe he's as good as he'll get. But Edmunds is a freak. There's a position for him on the football field where he'll excel, and if that position isn't one that exists in any standard approach, well, maybe you ought to think about creating one for him. I hate to see that kind of talent squandered. But as I've said, I think someone will find the right position/role for him. I just don't think it'll be McDermott and the Bills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Frankish Reich Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 9 minutes ago, HOUSE said: I thought this was some 1970s thread about Keith Richards Nicely done. But I think we have to go with Lemmy since Keith's drug of choice was somewhat different in the 1970s: https://www.nme.com/blogs/lemmy-biopic-motorhead-hawkwind-2690187 I only know this because I was able to binge some of the recent wave of rock star bios during the months of COVID shutdowns. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 1 hour ago, Sharky7337 said: The problem is hes almost done with his rookie deal and we didn't get the benefit of that enough Who are you referring to as being almost done with his rookie deal? Tre was extended before the season and Oliver isn’t even halfway through his rookie deal. Are you and Kwai San referring to someone else? Because I can’t ascertain that from your reply to his post about Tre and Oliver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maryland-bills-fan Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 (edited) One player AFTER Espessa, the Ravens took Dobbins. Fist team all american. 4.44 sec dash time. Singletary did 4.66 and Moss did 4.65 later improved to 4.52. The first couple of 2020 WR (walter football) clocked at 4.5 4.45 4.27 4.55 4.43 4.42. ... Dobbins looks more like wide receiver than a running back. Everybody missed the preseason, Dobbins missed most of the 1st six games with minor injuries nd more with Covid. What I saw in the Ravens game is that he could beat our people to the outside and had a couple of nice runs around the corner. We don't have that in our playbook. We don't have the screen pass as a danger for a chunk yardage pickup. It might be 10-15 yards. It is never going to be 45 to 60 yards. We don't have somebody like T.Thomas who can sneak out just beyond the LOS, take a short flip and go for 15 yards almost routinely. ..... ........ In addition, to the yardage, it changes the defences. DB are NOT going to be able to play 6 DB on 3 WR and keep their eyes on the WR the whole time. Why? https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/jk-dobbins-ravens-ohio-state-running-backs/50vkayzy7ese1vum9gq9vtx6a Edited January 25, 2021 by maryland-bills-fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djp14150 Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 3 hours ago, mannc said: Continue hitting on 1st and 2d round picks? When did they start to hit on 1st and 2nd round picks, other than Josh Allen? Or 3rd round picks, for that matter... WTF.....they have bern fine drafting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 2 minutes ago, djp14150 said: WTF.....they have bern fine drafting. Other than Josh Allen, Tyler Bass might be Beane’s best pick... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 7 minutes ago, mannc said: The typical trajectory is that players get better after their rookie seasons, not worse. The fact that you can name a few guys who got worse after their rookie seasons is not evidence that Jefferson will. FFS, he's 21-years old. Why would he regress? It's far more likely that Diggs, who will be 28 before next season, will never have another season like this one. Are you seriously saying that only a few guys got worse after their rookie seasons? I just pointed out guys who has record breaking seasons as rookies. Players have sophomore slumps or never live up to their first year all the time. Sam Bradford, Reggie Bush, Steve Slaton, Mike Williams, RGIII, Rashaan Salam etc.... . Since you don't think he will regress and he keeps up this pace.....he will have the greatest 4-5 year stretch of any WR in NFL history. If there's no reason to think he will regress, his 88 catches, 1,400 yards and 7 TD's will be his floor. What are you expecting next year with his trajectory? 110 catches, 1,700 yards and 12 TD's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 Just now, Royale with Cheese said: Are you seriously saying that only a few guys got worse after their rookie seasons? I just pointed out guys who has record breaking seasons as rookies. Players have sophomore slumps or never live up to their first year all the time. Sam Bradford, Reggie Bush, Steve Slaton, Mike Williams, RGIII, Rashaan Salam etc.... . Since you don't think he will regress and he keeps up this pace.....he will have the greatest 4-5 year stretch of any WR in NFL history. If there's no reason to think he will regress, his 88 catches, 1,400 yards and 7 TD's will be his floor. What are you expecting next year with his trajectory? 110 catches, 1,700 yards and 12 TD's? Good grief. Jefferson just had a great rookie season. I have no idea what kind of stats he's going to put up for the next four years, much less over his entire career. It's possible that this year was a fluke, but it's much more likely that he'll still be a really good NFL receiver when Diggs is in decline or OOF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 2 minutes ago, mannc said: Good grief. Jefferson just had a great rookie season. I have no idea what kind of stats he's going to put up for the next four years, much less over his entire career. It's possible that this year was a fluke, but it's much more likely that he'll still be a really good NFL receiver when Diggs is in decline or OOF. Yes you do have an idea, you specifically stated "why would he regress?". What's the opposite of regression? So when Diggs starts to decline, like every player in the NFL, you try to replace him. So when Jefferson starts to decline, whatever team he's on will replace him. That's how it works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsherd Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 Hill had 172 yards, there is a need for speed but you also need to be able to utilize it. We have Mackenzie but he is not part of the game plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Frankish Reich Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 (edited) 28 minutes ago, billsherd said: Hill had 172 yards, there is a need for speed but you also need to be able to utilize it. We have Mackenzie but he is not part of the game plan. McKenzie is more of our Mecole Hardman. Punt returner, end around, bubble screen, etc., etc. Actually preceded Hardman at Georgia. Not as flat-out fast as Hardman, but very slippery. He just needs to catch those punts cleanly and it's goodbye Andre Roberts. I'd love to see him re-signed and given more touches per game. Edited January 25, 2021 by The Frankish Reich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABILLBACKER Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 5 hours ago, MasterStrategist said: Agree, as the saying goes "speed kills", "can't coach speed". That said, can't fill every single need but its a solid list to work from. Beane needs to be very honest this offseason and make some tough decisions, ie: roster cuts. Perhaps creating enough cap to sign Milano back, or look for an upgrade at other positions. Then absolutely need to continue hitting on the 1st, 2nd round picks. Oliver and Epenesa need to stand out next season I can see Ed's game improve this fall with Star back but I'm not holding my breathe for Epenesa. We need to get a better group of pass rushers than Hughes, Murphy or Addison. And we're going to have to cut some name players to free up $ for this pass rusher. I don't see one in the late 1st? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterStrategist Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 4 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said: I can see Ed's game improve this fall with Star back but I'm not holding my breathe for Epenesa. We need to get a better group of pass rushers than Hughes, Murphy or Addison. And we're going to have to cut some name players to free up $ for this pass rusher. I don't see one in the late 1st? Agree about needing more talent up front. Jerry has sentimental.value, but its a business and it would be smart to start from scratch at the def end spots (cut Jefferson and butler too for.cap money). The Penn St defensive end would be a dream come true if we could get him (likely a trade into teens or early 20s), Georgia defensive end 2nd on my list. Think we need a speed rusher, Epenesa fill out his frame on the other side. Then due some diligence and find a solid pass rush fit in free agency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 3 hours ago, Sharky7337 said: The problem is hes almost done with his rookie deal and we didn't get the benefit of that enough Ed Oliver's almost done with his rookie deal? He can get 5 years with the first round option. He just finished the second season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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