The Next Pandemic: SARS-CoV-2/COVID-19

[Buffalo_Gal]

Just now, Magox said:

 

There is no doubt that there are labs out there that need more supplies to get more testing done.   With that said, the federal testing administered locations seem to be ready to do more immediate testing and from the sounds of it, they weren't being utilized.   But to the article I posted, Quest Diagnostics' issues have nothing to do with lack of supplies or any of that other jazz, their previous issues was that they had too much demand which created backlogs slowing down the time that people could get tests done and receive their results, essentially they lacked capacity early on. 

 

Now, they have increased their capacity and are continuing to increase it and their problem now is that there aren't enough people who need testing being directed their way.  This is something that the states governors will need to coordinate with medical providers, hospitals etc. to get more people using Quest Diagnostics.

I think that may have been why the Coronavirus task team gave out an inches-thick memorandum of 5,000 machines, including the NAZ+phone numbers for those labs, and maps on where the labs are located, to the Governors.

There is far more out there than Quest.

 

[Magox]

Just now, Buffalo_Gal said:

I think that may have been why the Coronavirus task team gave out an inches-thick memorandum of 5,000 machines, including the NAZ+phone numbers for those labs, and maps on where the labs are located, to the Governors.

There is far more out there than Quest.

 

 

So I heard governor Hogan today in an interview and they asked him about how Trump called him out.  Of course he pushed back on that, but when asked about not knowing about the other testing locations, he didn't really seem to answer it head on.  He essentially said, and I'm paraphrasing  "It's good that the Federal Government is making these available to us.".    Not sure if he was implying that they weren't available to earlier or if that was his way of saying that he wasn't aware of them being available to him.   

[North Buffalo]

1 minute ago, Magox said:

 

There is no doubt that there are labs out there that need more supplies to get more testing done.   With that said, the federal testing administered locations seem to be ready to do more immediate testing and from the sounds of it, they weren't being utilized.   But to the article I posted, Quest Diagnostics' issues have nothing to do with lack of supplies or any of that other jazz, their previous issues was that they had too much demand which created backlogs slowing down the time that people could get tests done and receive their results, essentially they lacked capacity early on. 

 

Now, they have increased their capacity and are continuing to increase it and their problem now is that there aren't enough people who need testing being directed their way.  This is something that the states governors will need to coordinate with medical providers, hospitals etc. to get more people using Quest Diagnostics.

One of those supply chain issues... still not sure I fully understand it other than even though available  certain states have already set up testing roots and it may be difficult to bring in another vendor from a purchasing stand point and a facility connection point of contact.  My guess is itll get resolved but may take a couple weeks.

[Buffalo_Gal]

1 minute ago, Magox said:

 

So I heard governor Hogan today in an interview and they asked him about how Trump called him out.  Of course he pushed back on that, but when asked about not knowing about the other testing locations, he didn't really seem to answer it head on.  He essentially said, and I'm paraphrasing  "It's good that the Federal Government is making these available to us.".    Not sure if he was implying that they weren't available to earlier or if that was his way of saying that he wasn't aware of them being available to him.   

Yeah, he got beat up pretty badly yesterday. First Trump, then the Admiral, then Pence steps in being all diplomatic. He must have been something on that call.

 

[njbuff]

Where do these Trump-hating people come from?

 

STOP kicking over these rocks everyone.

 

?

 

[North Buffalo]

1 minute ago, Magox said:

 

So I heard governor Hogan today in an interview and they asked him about how Trump called him out.  Of course he pushed back on that, but when asked about not knowing about the other testing locations, he didn't really seem to answer it head on.  He essentially said, and I'm paraphrasing  "It's good that the Federal Government is making these available to us.".    Not sure if he was implying that they weren't available to earlier or if that was his way of saying that he wasn't aware of them being available to him.   

Probably the former... Governors on both sides of the aisle are still frustrated with slow disjointed fed response.  

[Deranged Rhino]

Just now, North Buffalo said:

Probably the former... Governors on both sides of the aisle are still frustrated with slow disjointed fed response.  

 

Which is only an admission by those governors that they don't understand our system of government and how its supposed to work. Which should be more alarming than anything else. 

[Magox]

Just now, North Buffalo said:

One of those supply chain issues... still not sure I fully understand it other than even though available  certain states have already set up testing roots and it may be difficult to bring in another vendor from a purchasing stand point and a facility connection point of contact.  My guess is itll get resolved but may take a couple weeks.

 

It's complicated.   There are a number of different entities that are conducting these tests.  Each entity has their own challenges.  Many people like @shoshin get confused and seem to believe that all these locations are facing the same issues.  It's a lot more complex than that and some entities are able to meet demand better than other entities for a variety of reasons.  It could be due to lack of chemicals, swabs, lack of coordination to direct people to the appropriate locations or in Quest Diagnostics' situation too much demand which created backlogs.  

 

It's a huge undertaking and there are a lot of moving parts and the local, state and federal government or for that matter all the medical, hospital and labs never had to deal with something as massive as this and try to have it resolved in such a short time period.  But they do seem to be making marked progress on a daily basis.   And for me that's encouraging.

[Buffalo_Gal]

1 minute ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

Which is only an admission by those governors that they don't understand our system of government and how its supposed to work. Which should be more alarming than anything else. 

I would not discount this.  I cannot imagine what this task force has had to deal with on the state level.

They have been trying very hard to not embarrass any of the Governors, unless they have REALLY been stupid. Besides Hogan, I have only heard Pritzker being dumped on. Trump-Cuomo have been doing the love-hate thing since this started. Pretty much everyone else... even Jay Inslee,  for goodness sake! Trump has praised/had nice words for. 

People really should listen to these pressers instead of getting their news through the filter of the "msm."

 

[North Buffalo]

Just now, Deranged Rhino said:

 

Which is only an admission by those governors that they don't understand our system of government and how its supposed to work. Which should be more alarming than anything else. 

That makes no sense to me... FEMA and FDA have always had their issues, but have functioned much better in previous emergencies after rough starts.  The disjointed slow response from Fed leadership made the issue so much worse for the States.  I still think States like Florida and Georgia opening up too soon are in for a rude awakening in a couple weeks.

[Magox]

4 minutes ago, North Buffalo said:

Probably the former... Governors on both sides of the aisle are still frustrated with slow disjointed fed response.  

 

Let's be clear, Hogan was considering running against Trump for 2020 and he does reside in a blue state.  He's not a fan of Trump and of course the Democratic governors have their own motives.   They aren't being reasonable North Buffalo, for the reasons I responded earlier to expect that the Federal Government was going to have this in a manner that they were requesting was completely unrealistic.    Let's call this for what it is, they are now making this the big issue and the reason being is that they are using it as a pretext to open up the economy.   So the argument and blame game is already being paved, "We can't open up the economy without more testing, and if we do and you don't give us the testing we say we need, then it's your fault".

 

 

[North Buffalo]

1 minute ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

I would not discount this.  I cannot imagine what this task force has had to deal with on the state level.

They have been trying very hard to not embarrass any of the Governors, unless they have REALLY been stupid. Besides Hogan, I have only heard Pritzker being dumped on. Trump-Cuomo have been doing the love-hate thing since this started. Pretty much everyone else... even Jay Inslee,  for goodness sake! Trump has praised/had nice words for. 

People really should listen to these pressers instead of getting their news through the filter of the "msm."

 

I get the sense that Trump Cuomo relationship is lot like Gingrich Clinton.., they take shots at each other in public when they have different priorities but actually work together well to get ***** done.

[Magox]

Just now, North Buffalo said:

I get the sense that Trump Cuomo relationship is lot like Gingrich Clinton.., they take shots at each other in public when they have different priorities but actually work together well to get ***** done.

 

 

I actually agree with this.  There is enormous pressure on Cuomo to trash Trump, and Cuomo most likely eventually will on a sustained basis here in the coming months leading up to the elections.  But, Cuomo does have his own big personality and he's not going to get easily bullied by the pressure to Trash Trump, he will do it on his own terms.

[North Buffalo]

2 minutes ago, Magox said:

 

Let's be clear, Hogan was considering running against Trump for 2020 and he does reside in a blue state.  He's not a fan of Trump and of course the Democratic governors have their own motives.   They aren't being reasonable North Buffalo, for the reasons I responded earlier to expect that the Federal Government was going to have this in a manner that they were requesting was completely unrealistic.    Let's call this for what it is, they are now making this the big issue and the reason being is that they are using it as a pretext to open up the economy.   So the argument and blame game is already being paved, "We can't open up the economy without more testing, and if we do and you don't give us the testing we say we need, then it's your fault".

 

 

If what you say is true and sure some is the political blame game, but from what I saw Feds got caught with their pants down.  States once they realized this reacted fast to catch up.  Feds are finally figuring out what they can do well.  Feds couldve been so much better helping with logistics and in some things they did well and other things like mask supplies they FUBARed it. IMO is was more parochial politics like who gets credit and pays for building and paving a bridge on an interstate.

[Deranged Rhino]

2 minutes ago, North Buffalo said:

If what you say is true and sure some is the political blame game, but from what I saw Feds got caught with their pants down.  States once they realized this reacted fast to catch up.  Feds are finally figuring out what they can do well.  Feds couldve been so much better helping with logistics and in some things they did well and other things like mask supplies they FUBARed it. IMO is was more parochial politics like who gets credit and pays for building and paving a bridge on an interstate.

 

Your leaving out the China of it all in your analysis. 

 

The fact China was lying to the world about the virus while hording PPE surely slowed the response time and ***** up the logistical supply chains more than anything else. 

[North Buffalo]

Problem is COVID doesnt care and will expose any cracks... political and or logistics in the system... much like 911.... once all sides get a better sense of their roles the response to new outbreaks will be dealt with much more efficiently.

[Magox]

4 minutes ago, North Buffalo said:

If what you say is true and sure some is the political blame game, but from what I saw Feds got caught with their pants down.  States once they realized this reacted fast to catch up.  Feds are finally figuring out what they can do well.  Feds couldve been so much better helping with logistics and in some things they did well and other things like mask supplies they FUBARed it. IMO is was more parochial politics like who gets credit and pays for building and paving a bridge on an interstate.

 

It could have been handled better on all levels. Without doubt

[North Buffalo]

7 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

Your leaving out the China of it all in your analysis. 

 

The fact China was lying to the world about the virus while hording PPE surely slowed the response time and ***** up the logistical supply chains more than anything else. 

In December sure but not by January when even the independent and networked hospital I work at was scrambling because it realized it were about to get overwhelmed...

And ps I dont trust China or businesses that use Chinese labor further than I can throw them.

Edited April 21, 2020 by North Buffalo

[Deranged Rhino]

3 minutes ago, North Buffalo said:

In December sure but not by January when even the independent and networked hospital I work at was scrambling because it realized it was about to get overwhelmed...

And ps I dont trust China or businesses that use Chinese labor further than I can throw them.

 

In mid January the WHO was still telling the world that the virus wasn't transmissible from human to human. 

[Buffalo_Gal]

11 minutes ago, North Buffalo said:

If what you say is true and sure some is the political blame game, but from what I saw Feds got caught with their pants down.  States once they realized this reacted fast to catch up.  Feds are finally figuring out what they can do well.  Feds couldve been so much better helping with logistics and in some things they did well and other things like mask supplies they FUBARed it. IMO is was more parochial politics like who gets credit and pays for building and paving a bridge on an interstate.

Why should the feds have had 500M masks on hand? Especially since the elastic can dry rot (and that was the initial problem with some of the stockpile).  The ventilators, they all (state and feds) should have replaced when the old ones became obsolete (Obamacare made them so expensive, they were only produced here by two businesses prior to COVID-19).

I am in awe of what has been done by the Feds to assist the states. From building a hospital in under a week, to retrofitting buildings for patients, to forcing supply chains that has been outsourced to other countries into the US.

Nothing has been perfect. And, it is distressing that China did not inform the world about this virus.

One thing is for certain... the United States cannot depend upon other countries for needed medical goods. I sincerely hope these are brought back to the US, even if the government needs to subsidize the business to make it happen.


 

Edited April 21, 2020 by Buffalo_Gal

[North Buffalo]

1 minute ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

In mid January the WHO was still telling the world that the virus wasn't transmissible from human to human. 

Medical professionals knew this was unlikely and we were being warned... 

[Deranged Rhino]

1 minute ago, North Buffalo said:

Medical professionals knew this was unlikely and we were being warned... 

 

So the world's leading health organization saying in mid January that the disease wasn't transmissible human to human (even though they knew that was false) wasn't a problem... 

 

Got it.

[North Buffalo]

3 minutes ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

Why should the feds have had 500M masks on hand? Especially since the elastic can dry rot (and that was the initial problem with some of the stockpile).  The ventilators, they all (state and feds) should have replaced when the old ones became obsolete (Obamacare made them so expensive, they were only produced here by two businesses prior to COVID-19).

I am in awe of what has been done by the Feds to assist the states. From building a hospital in under a week, to retrofitting buildings for patients, to forcing supply chains that has been outsourced to other countries into the US.

Nothing has been perfect. And, it is distressing that China did not inform the world about this virus.

One thing is for certain... the United States cannot depend upon other countries for needed medical goods. I sincerely hope these are brought back to the US, even if the government needs to subsidize the business to make it happen.


 

The last two paragraphs I agree with and the hospital tents built by that national guards were and a god send.  The mask issue and stock pile issues caught everyone... The need for ventilators and medical supplies was not an Obama care deal... It goes much further back to Clinton and Bush and the way our healthcare is distributed and regulated.  Streamlining and cutting costs have been disjointed at best while healthcare become big business and serving best only those areas with money.

7 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

So the world's leading health organization saying in mid January that the disease wasn't transmissible human to human (even though they knew that was false) wasn't a problem... 

 

Got it.

Sure it was but laying blame on WHO when our medical professional knew better and were telling Trump otherwise and yet he wasnt publically reacting was a bigger problem.

[Deranged Rhino]

2 minutes ago, North Buffalo said:

Sure it was but laying blame on WHO when our medical professional knew better and were telling Trump otherwise and yet he wasnt publically reacting was a bigger problem.

 

He was taking action though. That's where you're wrong. 

 

Don't conflate tapping down panic through public statements with being the same as the actions taken by him and the task force throughout Jan-March prior to the lock down.

 

You said it best earlier -- there's blame enough to go around. But leaving China out of that discussion is disingenuous at best.

[Buffalo_Gal]

9 minutes ago, North Buffalo said:

The last two paragraphs I agree with and the hospital tents built by that national guards were and a god send.  The mask issue and stock pile issues caught everyone... The need for ventilators and medical supplies was not an Obama care deal... It goes much further back to Clinton and Bush and the way our healthcare is distributed and regulated.  Streamlining and cutting costs have been disjointed at best while healthcare become big business and serving best only those areas with money.

Buried in this thread is a tweet from one of the ventilator manufacturers (back in February or early March). He laid out exactly why everyone who manufactured ventilators in the US closed up shop except for his family-owned company, and one other company. He stated the taxes on Obamacare made it very difficult for ventilators to be made in the United States. He may have been lying (not sure why he would be), but as the guy whose factory was one of two building them... tough to disregard what he said.

 

Edited April 21, 2020 by Buffalo_Gal

[North Buffalo]

Just now, Deranged Rhino said:

 

He was taking action though. That's where you're wrong. 

 

Don't conflate tapping down panic through public statements with being the same as the actions taken by him and the task force throughout Jan-March prior to the lock down.

LMAO... His task force was a joke.

[Deranged Rhino]

1 minute ago, North Buffalo said:

LMAO... His task force was a joke.

 

Got it. 

[Doc]

3 minutes ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

Buried in this thread is a tweet from one of the ventilator manufacturers (back in February or early March). He laid out exactly why everyone who manufactured ventilators in the US closed up shop except for his family-owned company, and one other company. He stated the taxes on Obamacare made it very difficult for ventilators to be made in the United States. He may have been lying (not sure why he would be), but as the guy who factory was one of two building them... tough to disregard what he said.

 

He's not lying.  Medical manufacturing mostly moved to China after Obamacare.

[Deranged Rhino]

 

Good! 

[Buffalo_Gal]

Trump up

Praising medical professionals.
Pointing out the per capita death rate is lower than most countries.
20 states (40% of our country) is opening up (safely).
Senate passed paycheck protection program (and something else) act.

$382B small business money
$75B hospitals
$25B for coronavirus testing

Urging House to pass the bill.

[Boatdrinks]

7 hours ago, Justice said:

Maybe the mortality rate varies depending on how each healthcare system handles it more than anything else. 

I’d expect that our health care professionals have given their best whichever area of the country they are in. I think the mortality rate is far more likely to be influenced by the general health of the patient and by individual genetic factors that we may not even know about yet. Many deaths were patients with underlying health issues but some were not. Some have even referenced on this board young and athletic individuals with extreme symptoms. So it seems likely that even with good overall health, some could have an unknown genetic vulnerability to Coronavirus. Just as it appears a significant percentage of the population will have no symptoms at all. 

[Deranged Rhino]

 

 

[Buffalo_Gal]

Mnuchin up:
Thanking Mitch and Chuckie. Also thanking Kevin McCarthy and Nancy (makes me think the House will pass it).
He said, "We look forward to the House passing this tomorrow."

Have over 1M companies with less than 10 workers have received the money. He said that some big businesses have taken the loans (and given back). New, FAQ coming out.

Press: will you request the big companies return the money
Mnuchin: yup

Trump: Harvard will be paying back the money.
Mnuchin:  attest to certification. (went into the bigger businesses returning the money at no liability)

Press: Who long will the new money last?
Mnuchin: Put out more money on this than the last 10 years.  Didn't answer. ?

Press: Criminal question
Mnuchin: they had done 5 years, it was shorter than before, and they will not be changing that

Press: How many more phases?
Mnuchin: Pass 4 (with infrastructure), broadband to rural area, sports, entertainment, payroll tax cut, states. Sounds like he is hopeful phase 4 is it. 
Press: Last payroll money?
Mnuchin: We expect so.

Press: What will phase 4 cost?
Mnuchin: No comment

Press: Oversight?
Mnuchin: We have independent oversight, and are looking forward to Congress confirming that person.
No one lender sent out more than 4%.





 

Mnuchin - big team effort. And he is praising everyone for unanimous consent.

 

Mnuchin: airlines shut down, and he's talking about the oil (less use, more supply), looking for all options on energy independence.

 

[Buffalo_Gal]

 

Press: how many jobs have been saved so far?
Mnunchin: 30M
And he's talking about more distribution on the checks.

Trump back:

Immigration suspension. Unemployed Americans are first in line for jobs when America re-opens. We will first take care of the American worker. 60 days, will evaluate at that time based on economics.
Sounds like no new green cards.

Pence visited a GE plant that is making ventilators. 50K produced in a few weeks.

Trump/Cuomo meeting. Goal of doubling testing. NYS will continue to control the testing in  their states. Have a ton of labs in NYS.
Saying very nice things about NYS and NYC.

Edited April 21, 2020 by Buffalo_Gal

[Buffalo_Gal]

Bringing back the USS Comfort to VA.  NY does not need it any longer.

FDA authorized 50 diagnostic tests, including the first one approved yesterday that the patient can do at home (doctor's order).

[Deranged Rhino]

 

[snafu]

4 hours ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

Nice sentiment, but the first thing you are going to do is to pack people in close together?
 

 

 

I’ve said a few times that I’m not going to criticize decisions...

This guy makes it difficult.

 

 

 

 

Edited April 21, 2020 by snafu

[Buffalo_Gal]

Dr Birx:
Improvement across all large metros.
Still seeing outbreaks in care facilities (elderly) in rural areas. She's talking about  distancing, hygiene, etc.
We will continue to see more deaths as they will lag, especially in cities.

 

[Deranged Rhino]

Brett Braier is in the press room for Fox today instead of Roberts. Expect a terrible question to follow from him. 

[Buffalo_Gal]

Dr Hahn (FDA) up:
FDA was asked to remove all unnecessary barriers by Trump, the FDA did that. (So, if they are unnecessary, why have them?)
Two types of antibody tests. They are beginning to understand them for detection at different points of the infection.
Discussing the test validation for the new tests that have been coming out since March.
The FDA still expects the developers to validate their tests.
Working with CDC to validate the 90 manufacturers (independent validation). They are not playing... they are going after anyone saying a test has been approved when it has not.

Press: How many of these tests actually work?
Hahn: Self validation and they must label that. Expect to have more results on the FDA validation.

Press: Wanting to beat up on hydroxychloroquine again.
Hahn: Doctor needs to consider the prescription. The one study the press mentioned was small. And, the preliminary date says hydroxychloroquine has been helpful.
All trials are in progress. It will be early summer before those trials are finished.

Press: Va study, that more people died on hydroxychloroquine than off it.
Trump: We will take a look at it.

 

6 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said:

Brett Braier is in the press room for Fox today instead of Roberts. Expect a terrible question to follow from him. 

Asked a buncha stuff, including about NK.
Trump: I wish him well.

LMAO
It was CNN that came out with the report, and when CNN comes out with it, I don't put too much credence in it.

 

Edited April 21, 2020 by Buffalo_Gal