Fan in Chicago Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 Just now, 26CornerBlitz said: The point is that drafting Rudolph with a 3rd round pick and the Steelers in postion to contend for a title makes no sense to him. I get that. I dont see how a third round pick conclusively moves Steelers from contender status (even if I choose to disagree that they are contenders just yet). Him specifically talking about a guy who was picked to be his successor points to his comments beyond just a hope for team improvement. Does he agree with each and every pick the Steelers have made in the past ? As they say, the optics (and I hate that word) on this are just not good. And a QB's public face is largely that - image management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 2 minutes ago, Fan in Chicago said: I dont see how a third round pick conclusively moves Steelers from contender status (even if I choose to disagree that they are contenders just yet). Him specifically talking about a guy who was picked to be his successor points to his comments beyond just a hope for team improvement. Does he agree with each and every pick the Steelers have made in the past ? As they say, the optics (and I hate that word) on this are just not good. And a QB's public face is largely that - image management. We simply see it differently and that's okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 14 minutes ago, Fan in Chicago said: Doesn't make it right or classy Right or classy (i.e,. lip service) are not QB requirements. That's what centers are for... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 On 5/7/2018 at 11:07 AM, Mr. WEO said: What 3rd rounder is going to help this team get to the SB? They are loaded on offense, and have been. What D rookie in the 3rd would be surrounding the QB with talent? I mention Wilson as an ironic counterpoint to your claim that picking the backup QB in the 3rd wouldn't help the team go to the SB... because that's pretty much the only time any 3rd rounder did that... Wasn't Nick Foles drafted in the 3rd round? And as a backup QB, helped his team go to the Superbowl and win it? Doubles the odds! My bottom line: Big Ben was salty because the Steelers drafted a QB who had some good pre-draft buzz. By all accounts, Rudolph is a hard worker with a good head for football, attends the Mannings' QB camps, talked through a play easily at Marriaci's QB Whiteboard feature. The Steelers are doing what they ought to be doing, trying to get better at every position, including backup QB, the guy who might keep you in the hunt if your starter goes down. There's nothing to say a 3rd round DL or LB or OG would contribute more. Shut up, Ben. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section122 Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 1 hour ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Once a player is on a team, where he was drafted no longer matters. For example, Kyle Williams was in the same 2006 draft as John McCargo just as Stevie Johnson was in the same draft as James Hardy. I disagree sort of but thank you for clearing up your point. If Stevie or Kyle came in and performed like hardy and mccargo respectively they would have been cut and not thought of again. It was because mccargo was a 1st and hardy a 2nd that they got as many chances as they did. Stevie and Kyle got their chance because they showed something quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthNYfan Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 30 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Wasn't Nick Foles drafted in the 3rd round? And as a backup QB, helped his team go to the Superbowl and win it? Doubles the odds! My bottom line: Big Ben was salty because the Steelers drafted a QB who had some good pre-draft buzz. By all accounts, Rudolph is a hard worker with a good head for football, attends the Mannings' QB camps, talked through a play easily at Marriaci's QB Whiteboard feature. The Steelers are doing what they ought to be doing, trying to get better at every position, including backup QB, the guy who might keep you in the hunt if your starter goes down. There's nothing to say a 3rd round DL or LB or OG would contribute more. Shut up, Ben. Exactly. Ben has a scary injury history that would give and training staff a run for it's money. He has twiddled the thought of retirement like every off-season for the last 3 years. He can talk all he wants about playing 3-5 more years, guaranteed, but the reality is that Brady isn't the rule, he's an exception, same with Brees. Both have been very healthy their entire careers, save for the mega shoulder that Brees had at a young age (which, even by his surgeon's own words, was a miracle he could even throw again), and Brady had the ACL/triad young as well. Ben's got the arthritic body of a 50 year old at this point. He has been beaten to a pulp. He knows it, the Steelers know it. Even if he does play another 3 years, the likelihood that he doesn't miss a couple of games every year is slim to none. He's being his typical diva self. I can't stand him, and haven't for a long time. Shut up Ben. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 2 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Did you google that they just drafted Josh Dobbs last year as Benoit mentioned? Josh Dobbs sucks. Essentially if you think Mason Rudolph is little more than a new Landry Jones or Josh Dobbs you probably think this pick makes no sense. I get that. I absolutely believe Rudolph is better than that and has the potential to be a good starting Quarterback in time - therefore this makes a lot of sense. I loved the fit there before the draft and I still do. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 4 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Wasn't Nick Foles drafted in the 3rd round? And as a backup QB, helped his team go to the Superbowl and win it? Doubles the odds! My bottom line: Big Ben was salty because the Steelers drafted a QB who had some good pre-draft buzz. By all accounts, Rudolph is a hard worker with a good head for football, attends the Mannings' QB camps, talked through a play easily at Marriaci's QB Whiteboard feature. The Steelers are doing what they ought to be doing , trying to get better at every position, including backup QB, the guy who might keep you in the hunt if your starter goes down. There's nothing to say a 3rd round DL or LB or OG would contribute more. Shut up, Ben. There's no other player in the 3rd round they could have picked that would have gotten them closer to the SB. This is another blow to the tired old argument that "rookie QBs should be drafted to be groomed under the current franchise QB". Favre had no interest in Rodgers, Brady no interest in Garapolo and Ben for Lamar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthNYfan Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 49 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: There's no other player in the 3rd round they could have picked that would have gotten them closer to the SB. This is another blow to the tired old argument that "rookie QBs should be drafted to be groomed under the current franchise QB". Favre had no interest in Rodgers, Brady no interest in Garapolo and Ben for Lamar. Ben for Mason I believe you mean, Flacco for Lamar. I get your drift though. The incumbent guy at ANY job never wants to see his potential replacement hired, even if it's not intended to happen for 3 years by management, it still puts a definitive "end date" to your tenure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing Bong Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 (edited) 8 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Wasn't Nick Foles drafted in the 3rd round? And as a backup QB, helped his team go to the Superbowl and win it? Doubles the odds! Nick foles' competition wasn't roethlisber. And Matt Flynn's competition WAS RUSSEL WILSON. Ben can be upset because he's not Foles or Flynn Edited May 12, 2018 by PetermanThrew5Picks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing Bong Posted May 12, 2018 Share Posted May 12, 2018 4 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: There's no other player in the 3rd round they could have picked that would have gotten them closer to the SB. This is another blow to the tired old argument that "rookie QBs should be drafted to be groomed under the current franchise QB". Favre had no interest in Rodgers, Brady no interest in Garapolo and Ben for Lamar. It's totally fabricated I won't research but rando 3+ rounds picks don't exactly overshadows a talented encumbent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 16 minutes ago, PetermanThrew5Picks said: Nick foles' competition wasn't roethlisber. And Matt Flynn's competition WAS RUSSEL WILSON. Ben can be upset because he's not Foles or Flynn The point wasn't who the competition was, but that in fact, if the backup QB can come in and play well, he's as or more likely to save the season than a 3rd round LB or whoever it is Big Ben thinks he should have picked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 15 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: There's no other player in the 3rd round they could have picked that would have gotten them closer to the SB. This is another blow to the tired old argument that "rookie QBs should be drafted to be groomed under the current franchise QB". Favre had no interest in Rodgers, Brady no interest in Garapolo and Ben for Lamar. Alvin Kamara and Kareem Hunt both say Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 5 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Alvin Kamara and Kareem Hunt both say The league's reaction to those two players was the now traditional 3rd round run on running backs started in the 2nd instead. If you wanted this year's Kareem Hunt or Alvin Kamara or David Johnson you had to go a round earlier. 3 running backs in the 1st; 4 in the 2nd..... compared to 2017 when 2 went in the first 8 picks and 2 in the 2ns round before the run started in round 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: The league's reaction to those two players was the now traditional 3rd round run on running backs started in the 2nd instead. If you wanted this year's Kareem Hunt or Alvin Kamara or David Johnson you had to go a round earlier. 3 running backs in the 1st; 4 in the 2nd..... compared to 2017 when 2 went in the first 8 picks and 2 in the 2ns round before the run started in round 3. The point is that 3rd round picks can be valuable additions toward immediate team success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEraBills Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 (edited) Yeah but Ben to me is being a troll on this. They took James Washington in the 2nd round, who will more than likely see reps as a WR. Certainly Washington will help them in winning now if he has anywhere close to the season Ju Jus had last year. They took a versatile Safety/Hybrid linebacker in Edmunds in the 1st to help the defense. So taking a QB in the 3rd is a luxury pick IMO, of course he doesn't see it that way but you can't expect a front office to look at the Browns take a QB at #1 overall, then the Ravens take one at #32 and then all of his offseason antics about thinking about retirement the last two years, you can't expect them to just wait around until they actually need a QB to go get one. I'm sure they remember the Charlie Batch years. No team that has had the taste of not having a franchise QB, then having one, wants to revisit NOT having one. Edited May 13, 2018 by NewEraBills 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 1 hour ago, 26CornerBlitz said: The point is that 3rd round picks can be valuable additions toward immediate team success. And of course it is true that they can. But equally with a QB who hasn't exactly been injury free in recent years you have to weigh that against what a talented young Quarterback like Rudolph can do for you now and down the line. As I said earlier if you don't think Rudolph has the potential to be a successful NFL starter then you say - take the 3rd round guy who might contribute. If you do think Rudolph has that potential then you take the Quarterback, every time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 17 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: There's no other player in the 3rd round they could have picked that would have gotten them closer to the SB. This is another blow to the tired old argument that "rookie QBs should be drafted to be groomed under the current franchise QB". Favre had no interest in Rodgers, Brady no interest in Garapolo and Ben for Lamar. Next up: our own Mr WEO on ESPN (sorry not sorry) I think they arguably could have drafted a guy in the 3rd who would maybe work into the lineup, be depth, and help them on ST at least. But if they're not happy with the backup QB situation, I think both the Eagles and the Vikings of recent years demonstrate how important the backup QB is. Taking a QB in the 3rd whom some saw as a late 1st or 2nd round guy is plausibly the best value they saw there towards wins. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DriveFor1Outta5 Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 (edited) On 5/12/2018 at 11:10 AM, section122 said: I disagree sort of but thank you for clearing up your point. If Stevie or Kyle came in and performed like hardy and mccargo respectively they would have been cut and not thought of again. It was because mccargo was a 1st and hardy a 2nd that they got as many chances as they did. Stevie and Kyle got their chance because they showed something quickly. Exactly. Being drafted highly establishes a player’s reputation. Those with soild reputations will be given more chances to succeed. Life generally works this way, even outside of football. Every player does not enter the league on equal ground. Teams want every player to be successful, and everyone is given that chance. However, not everyone is allowed the same amount of time to prove themselves. Sam Bradford certainly wouldn’t continue to be signed as a starting QB, if he weren’t a first overall draft pick. Edited May 13, 2018 by DriveFor1Outta5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 11 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Alvin Kamara and Kareem Hunt both say I said hello to both of them as they sat next to me at the bar watching the SB. I told Hunt that as long as he was coached by Andy Reid, he had zero chance of PLAYING in a SB. zero point zero... Kamara I consoled with the fact that his second contract will make him rich...he then bought me another draft. 9 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Next up: our own Mr WEO on ESPN (sorry not sorry) I think they arguably could have drafted a guy in the 3rd who would maybe work into the lineup, be depth, and help them on ST at least. But if they're not happy with the backup QB situation, I think both the Eagles and the Vikings of recent years demonstrate how important the backup QB is. Taking a QB in the 3rd whom some saw as a late 1st or 2nd round guy is plausibly the best value they saw there towards wins. I agree. This was the year that they should have taken a cheap Ben replacement rather than some depth guy. The Giants will with they had done the same... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said: I said hello to both of them as they sat next to me at the bar watching the SB. I told Hunt that as long as he was coached by Andy Reid, he had zero chance of PLAYING in a SB. zero point zero... Kamara I consoled with the fact that his second contract will make him rich...he then bought me another draft. A rather weak retort from you that doesn't refute the point of how big of an immediate contribution a 3rd round pick can make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 2 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: ...he then bought me another draft. You forgot to mention it was Blatz, and it was a small glass... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said: A rather weak retort from you that doesn't refute the point of how big of an immediate contribution a 3rd round pick can make. Which pick was this year's Hunt or Kamara for Pitts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 Just now, Mr. WEO said: Which pick was this year's Hunt or Kamara for Pitts? Even worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teddy KGB Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 26 is a Josh Dobbs fanboy ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Even worse. Come on! Who in the the 3rd is even close to those two RBs? There wan't a RB taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said: Come on! Who in the the 3rd is even close to those two RBs? There wan't a RB taken. I brought up those two as examples. Often there are good players available in the 3rd round who can make an impact on a particular team. That was the point I was making in response to your comment that no player in the draft could help them to make a Super Bowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 5 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: I brought up those two as examples. Often there are good players available in the 3rd round who can make an impact on a particular team. That was the point I was making in response to your comment that no player in the draft could help them to make a Super Bowl. Exceptions do not make the rule. Pittsburgh was a SB team last season, they just need a new coach. The Steelers are palming for the future without Big Ben.. Rudolph is a bargain in tha regard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 Just now, Mr. WEO said: Exceptions do not make the rule. Pittsburgh was a SB team last season, they just need a new coach. The Steelers are palming for the future without Big Ben.. Rudolph is a bargain in tha regard. They'll be face palming if they think Rudolph is the future. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 Just now, 26CornerBlitz said: They'll be face palming if they think Rudolph is the future. In the 3rd round, it's a risk free pick. Ben needs to look inward before he bitches about a 3rd round pick. True for any one else who questions this pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 5 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: In the 3rd round, it's a risk free pick. Ben needs to look inward before he bitches about a 3rd round pick. True for any one else who questions this pick. ? Not true at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 Just now, 26CornerBlitz said: ? Not true at all. How so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 Just now, Mr. WEO said: How so? Anyone who questions the pick of Rudolph should look inward? What the heck does that even mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 Just now, 26CornerBlitz said: Anyone who questions the pick of Rudolph should look inward? What the heck does that even mean? Not like Big Mouth Ben...that was for him. The point is that the Steelers were stacked this year. They weren't a 3d round, non-QB pick away form the SB. Rudolph is a zero risk/positive reward proposition for that team. And that;s exactly why they picked him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 8 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: Not like Big Mouth Ben...that was for him. The point is that the Steelers were stacked this year. They weren't a 3d round, non-QB pick away form the SB. Rudolph is a zero risk/positive reward proposition for that team. And that;s exactly why they picked him. Stacked? Not on defense after they lost Shazier. In any event, Rudolph won't be helping their cause any time soon if ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 3 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Stacked? Not on defense after they lost Shazier. In any event, Rudolph won't be helping their cause any time soon if ever. Shakier isn't why they weren't in the SB. Ben talks about retiring annually now. Maybe Rudolph won't help, but the point of this discussions that here is/was no other 3rd round pick that would... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 14, 2018 Share Posted May 14, 2018 11 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: Shakier isn't why they weren't in the SB. Ben talks about retiring annually now. Maybe Rudolph won't help, but the point of this discussions that here is/was no other 3rd round pick that would... That you do not know because it happens on a regular basis with 3rd round picks making contributions to teams in rookie campaigns. Which brings us right back where we started. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section122 Posted May 14, 2018 Share Posted May 14, 2018 20 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: That you do not know because it happens on a regular basis with 3rd round picks making contributions to teams in rookie campaigns. Which brings us right back where we started. We get it 26. You don't like rudolph. We got it predraft. It is because you don't think Rudolph is any good that the pick wasn't worthwhile to you. The Steelers had him as a first round pick and took him in the third. Therefore in their mind they got great value and can possibly transition from big Ben to their next franchise qb. It is simply because you refuse to accept that Rudolph COULD be good that you can't accept that the pick may have been wise on the Steelers part. Kamara and Hunt are nice pieces and on their way to being superstars. Are they more important to their teams than Russel Wilson? Obviously the answer is no. If Rudolph hits the Steelers have the most difficult spot to fill done very cheap. If he washes out then it was a missed pick which happens all the time in the NFL. Are we also going to pretend like the Steelers didn't have an extra 3rd from trading Bryant away? They got okorafor to help their o-line. So they did add a 3rd round pick to help the team as well as grabbing their potential franchise qb. 3 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted May 14, 2018 Share Posted May 14, 2018 Let me put it this way: Jim Kelly was effusive in his praise about Reich and AVP. If Kelly was really worried about either of them taking his job, he wouldn’t have been so effusive in his praise about Reich and AVP. He was never in danger of it despite some fan’s calls for Reich later in his career. Montana didn’t help Young at all. Farve, Marino, Elway... none of them were known for being teachers to guys that could take their jobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 14, 2018 Share Posted May 14, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, section122 said: We get it 26. You don't like rudolph. We got it predraft. It is because you don't think Rudolph is any good that the pick wasn't worthwhile to you. The Steelers had him as a first round pick and took him in the third. Therefore in their mind they got great value and can possibly transition from big Ben to their next franchise qb. It is simply because you refuse to accept that Rudolph COULD be good that you can't accept that the pick may have been wise on the Steelers part. Kamara and Hunt are nice pieces and on their way to being superstars. Are they more important to their teams than Russel Wilson? Obviously the answer is no. If Rudolph hits the Steelers have the most difficult spot to fill done very cheap. If he washes out then it was a missed pick which happens all the time in the NFL. Are we also going to pretend like the Steelers didn't have an extra 3rd from trading Bryant away? They got okorafor to help their o-line. So they did add a 3rd round pick to help the team as well as grabbing their potential franchise qb. Not buying what you're selling. If the Steelers really thought that highly of Rudolph, they wouldn't have taken Edmunds and Washington in the 1st two rounds with so many teams having veretan QBs nearing the end of their careers. I understand Big Ben's POV even if you don't. Edited May 14, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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