McDermott type Quarterbacks

[blacklabel]

For the most part, I like what I've seen from Rudolph. However, he plays in the same system that made Brandon Weeden a first rounder. It's a simplified scheme that often gives QBs wide open targets. So I don't think he's had to make a lot of tight window throws. But if he tests well on the white board and shows how well he takes to coaching, I wouldn't count him out for the Bills. 

[SouthNYfan]

16 minutes ago, blacklabel said:

For the most part, I like what I've seen from Rudolph. However, he plays in the same system that made Brandon Weeden a first rounder. It's a simplified scheme that often gives QBs wide open targets. So I don't think he's had to make a lot of tight window throws. But if he tests well on the white board and shows how well he takes to coaching, I wouldn't count him out for the Bills. 

 

Brandon Weeden is a legend in the making.

He still has a shot to become an all time great!!

??

[FearLess Price]

19 hours ago, PIZ said:

 

I think he's the pick.  There's no way he is worse than Tyrod.

 

Dont jinx it you bastad!

 

I think Mayfields better and worth trading into the top 10 for.

 

I dont like how Rudolphs tape shows him making one read scheme open throws most of the time.

 

Theres a few where you see him go through a few progressions but Mayfield has a lot more tape of going through them.

 

Im cool with picking rudolph if we dont trade up, anyone but josh allen or another mid to late round development QB. It seems like Rudolph would have to ride pine for a few weeks before starting, where with; Rosen, Darnold, and Mayfield, each could probably start week 1 depending who drafts them.

[DrDawkinstein]

6 hours ago, 8-8 Forever? said:

i don't want to move up for a QB anymore.  that ship sailed when both our no 1s fell out of the top 20, IMO.   The price of success.   Grab BPO or BPO-QB at 21 and be done with it.  Trust the process.  Go get a FA QB.   McCarron or someone to compete.   If it isn't for Darnold, who you can't get to anyway why bother trading up?    Get Kyle Williams - type players and go win 10 games next year.   they did it this year with a crappy roster, next year should be at least that roster.

 

According to the point chart #21 and #22 should be able to get us to #7. Into the top 10 at the very least. If there is a player there we think can be THE man, then you definitely move up and get him.

 

The suggestion to keep spinning our wheels at the QB position is extra ironic coming from "8-8 Forever"

[reddogblitz]

Based on what I've seen he likes QBs that protect the football.  Get a lead and sit on it. If he could get an improved run game and a little better D, seems like he'd be set with a QB like that.

 

Based on where he came from He probably also likes guys that can scramble and run ala Donovan McNabb and Cam Newton and Michael Vick.

Edited January 27, 2018 by reddogblitz

[ColoradoBills]

On ‎1‎/‎25‎/‎2018 at 1:52 PM, Tatonka68 said:

All of the Bills mafia have a opinion of who the Bills should draft, but it is McDermott's call. He is looking for no red flags, a senior with "good grades" and a good character guy. So under these conditions these are the players that fit, Mason Rudolph Oklahoma St, Kurt Benkert Virginia, Mike White Western Kentucky and maybe Sam Darnold. He will never draft, in my opinion, Baker Mayfield, Sam Rosen, or Lamar Jackson. Josh Allen does not fit either but might be drafted anyhow. sorry to bust your bubble.

 

 

 

I'm not a big college football fan so I have to rely on TSW posters for QB Draft info.

The one thing I could do was look at McDermott's 1st draft (I think they were all his guys and not Whaley's).

Between what he drafted and how he talks in pressers I came up with what you had plus one more, Availability.

 

1.  Seniors:  Preferably 4 year starters.

2.  Availability:  Not a lot of injuries and played most games.  He has stated this a number of times.

3.  Good Grades:  Especially likes a good major.

4.  No Red Flags:  He wants a "good guy" but will consider some things if they aren't "too bad".

5.  Character:  He does mention "Christian Values" often.

 

I'm just stating the above (not my opinion) just what I think McDermott likes, and I do believe he thinks highly of it.

 

When I looked at the top QB's (1st 2 rounds) on a couple sites like Drafttek I came up with 2 guys that I thought fit his "criteria".

1.  Mason Rudolph - Oklahoma St (like you did).

2.  Luke Falk - Washington State.

 

There has been a lot of talk (pro and con) on Rudolph on TSW already.

I haven't heard too much about Luke Falk.  I do know he is leaving the Senior Bowl to attend a teammates funeral.

Also, I just seen an article on how he has "turned some heads" during his first 2 days of practice at the Senior Bowl.

 

If McDermott is as big on "the process" as we all talk about..............my question would be why would he NOT use the "process"

for the most important position on the team?

 

Luke Falk article:  https://247sports.com/college/washington-state/Article/Washington-States-Luke-Falk-turns-heads-again-on-second-day-of-Senior-Bowl-week-Coug-OL-Cole-Madison-gaining-notice-114170355

[8-8 Forever?]

12 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

According to the point chart #21 and #22 should be able to get us to #7. Into the top 10 at the very least. If there is a player there we think can be THE man, then you definitely move up and get him.

 

The suggestion to keep spinning our wheels at the QB position is extra ironic coming from "8-8 Forever"

21 and 22 don't get you to 7, at least from the chart I was looking at. Based on what I say, would have to throw in one of the 2nds at least.   I guess there are a quite a few charts.   which one are you looking at?   if 21 and 22 get you to 7, then, maybe yes.  Can't believe they are looking at 6 foot Mayfield.  Yeah, you're probably right, no QB , no success in the NFLand you are 8-8 forever.   we shall see

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

...is Culley the right guy to train whoever the pick is as well as Peterman?..................

[billsfan_34]

On 1/25/2018 at 10:12 PM, SoCal Deek said:

Exactly my point. McD is a defensive coach.  How would anyone know what type of QB he favors?

No one would- I would think Daboll is going to have a large input into the direction we take.

[PolishDave]

On 1/25/2018 at 5:35 PM, PIZ said:

 

I think he's the pick.  There's no way he is worse than Tyrod.

 

That is not the measuring stick the coach and GM are going to use to evaluate QB's.

On 1/25/2018 at 6:03 PM, Lafromboise said:

honestly Peterman is his guy. I'm sure he wants to start him this year and see what he's got with an off season with the ones.

 

 

No.

 

Complete B.S.

[BrooklynBills]

6 hours ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

I'm not a big college football fan so I have to rely on TSW posters for QB Draft info.

The one thing I could do was look at McDermott's 1st draft (I think they were all his guys and not Whaley's).

Between what he drafted and how he talks in pressers I came up with what you had plus one more, Availability.

 

1.  Seniors:  Preferably 4 year starters.

2.  Availability:  Not a lot of injuries and played most games.  He has stated this a number of times.

3.  Good Grades:  Especially likes a good major.

4.  No Red Flags:  He wants a "good guy" but will consider some things if they aren't "too bad".

5.  Character:  He does mention "Christian Values" often.

 

I'm just stating the above (not my opinion) just what I think McDermott likes, and I do believe he thinks highly of it.

 

When I looked at the top QB's (1st 2 rounds) on a couple sites like Drafttek I came up with 2 guys that I thought fit his "criteria".

1.  Mason Rudolph - Oklahoma St (like you did).

2.  Luke Falk - Washington State.

 

There has been a lot of talk (pro and con) on Rudolph on TSW already.

I haven't heard too much about Luke Falk.  I do know he is leaving the Senior Bowl to attend a teammates funeral.

Also, I just seen an article on how he has "turned some heads" during his first 2 days of practice at the Senior Bowl.

 

If McDermott is as big on "the process" as we all talk about..............my question would be why would he NOT use the "process"

for the most important position on the team?

 

Luke Falk article:  https://247sports.com/college/washington-state/Article/Washington-States-Luke-Falk-turns-heads-again-on-second-day-of-Senior-Bowl-week-Coug-OL-Cole-Madison-gaining-notice-114170355

 

Because the draft strategy that applied to their first year is most likely not going to be a hard and fast rule for the draft.

 

I think they choose players that fit those categories because

a. It was year one for him and they had needs at basically any position

b. Our scouts for the whole year had only done work on seniors as was the policy under Doug Whaley/Nix. They didn't start scouting underclassmen until they declare so the majority of the work had been done on seniors.

c. I think McD was looking for high floor players in his first draft to start to build a foundation of guys to build off of. With all the roster turnover that was happening/is still about to happen, I think McD thought it was/is important to get guys in that he can expect a certain amount of production from so that 2-3 years down the road, they have a baseline foundation that will allow them to take a riskier player(character/mental makeup wise) and they will have roster support in place if that pick fails.

 

I think they will mostly take the same approach this draft with possibly a few outliers sprinkled in because of how many picks we have.

 

[PIZ]

52 minutes ago, PolishDave said:

 

That is not the measuring stick the coach and GM are going to use to evaluate QB's.

 

I didn't mean that would be the reason to pick him.  Just an observation.  I think he's much better than Tyrod and has the potential to be a franchise QB.  I don't think he lasts past round 1 and think Arizona at 15 could take him.  Wouldn't be surprised if the Steelers trade up for him, or if New England takes him.  If they target him as their top guy or franchise type potential, move up and get him to make sure you get him.  Don't let the next Roethlisberger or Brady go to someone else. He's my first pick.  I'm sure I will get lots of slack for this.

[DrDawkinstein]

10 hours ago, 8-8 Forever? said:

21 and 22 don't get you to 7, at least from the chart I was looking at. Based on what I say, would have to throw in one of the 2nds at least.   I guess there are a quite a few charts.   which one are you looking at?   if 21 and 22 get you to 7, then, maybe yes.  Can't believe they are looking at 6 foot Mayfield.  Yeah, you're probably right, no QB , no success in the NFLand you are 8-8 forever.   we shall see

 

I searched around a few weeks ago and found the same chart consistently across websites:

 

http://walterfootball.com/draftchart.php

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/draft/draft-trade-chart/

https://www.drafttek.com/NFL-Trade-Value-Chart.asp

 

In that chart, #21 and #22 together total 1580pts, and #7 is worth 1500pts.

Throw in a 2nd and we can get all the way up to #4.

Again, assuming teams are willing to go strictly off the chart, which I'm sure wont be the case. With all the teams jockeying for position, we my have to include more picks to get up that far.

The good news is, we're the ONLY team that can offer 2 1sts in this years draft, and that automatically makes them much more valuable.

 

What chart are you using?

Edited January 27, 2018 by DrDawkinstein

[Formerly Allan in MD]

Liking what I'm seeing of Mike White in the Senior Bowl.  Get's the ball out quickly and finds open receivers, with accuracy.

[NewEraBills]

12 hours ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

I'm not a big college football fan so I have to rely on TSW posters for QB Draft info.

The one thing I could do was look at McDermott's 1st draft (I think they were all his guys and not Whaley's).

Between what he drafted and how he talks in pressers I came up with what you had plus one more, Availability.

 

1.  Seniors:  Preferably 4 year starters.

2.  Availability:  Not a lot of injuries and played most games.  He has stated this a number of times.

3.  Good Grades:  Especially likes a good major.

4.  No Red Flags:  He wants a "good guy" but will consider some things if they aren't "too bad".

5.  Character:  He does mention "Christian Values" often.

 

I'm just stating the above (not my opinion) just what I think McDermott likes, and I do believe he thinks highly of it.

 

When I looked at the top QB's (1st 2 rounds) on a couple sites like Drafttek I came up with 2 guys that I thought fit his "criteria".

1.  Mason Rudolph - Oklahoma St (like you did).

2.  Luke Falk - Washington State.

 

There has been a lot of talk (pro and con) on Rudolph on TSW already.

I haven't heard too much about Luke Falk.  I do know he is leaving the Senior Bowl to attend a teammates funeral.

Also, I just seen an article on how he has "turned some heads" during his first 2 days of practice at the Senior Bowl.

 

If McDermott is as big on "the process" as we all talk about..............my question would be why would he NOT use the "process"

for the most important position on the team?

 

Luke Falk article:  https://247sports.com/college/washington-state/Article/Washington-States-Luke-Falk-turns-heads-again-on-second-day-of-Senior-Bowl-week-Coug-OL-Cole-Madison-gaining-notice-114170355

 

I've been talking about Falk for a while now.  Simmered down some of the talk because not many people around him seem to like him, but I like his game and when I think about a QB profile that fits McD, he's the guy that comes to mind.

1)  Small town kid; Farm guy

2)  Walk on; 3 year starter; has played a lot of football

3)  Humble; has no problem with hard coaching

4)  Has actually had full command of an offense.  Was trusted with checks; getting in and out of run plays. Was not required to look to the sideline for play checks it was all his call.

 

He fits directly into the culture that McD is trying to build.  As for his game, he has a lot of strengths.  His arm strength is questionable at times; his patience in letting things develop gets tested at times as he likes to get the football out quickly.  I like Falk.  Like his footwork in the pocket; I like how he climbs the pocket.

 

I do not like his frame LOL.  From what I can gather, his benching was due to him not waiting for things to develop.  Leach's comments were that he wanted Falk to see the field.  So to me that was Leach being frustrated with Faulk pulling the trigger too early on some plays.  I like Falk more than Rudolph and Jackson honestly.  He's not going to give you much mobility but he can scoot when he needs too.  It's not a strength. 

 

My favorite QB prospect though is Mayfield.  It didn't start off that way but after watching the decisions he makes he won me.  I'm not saying he's a better decision maker than other guys, but what I like is that the decisions that Mayfield likes to make are the ones that kill defenses.  That might get him in trouble at the next level, I don't know, but that's the type of killer instinct you don't see in a lot of QBs and I like that.  When you look at some of the plays where he has two options, most guys will take the safer underneath one but Mayfield likes that intermediate and deep dagger that hurts defenses.

 

 

Back to Falk for a second.  He's viewed negatively because of the offense he played in.  But the thing I think that makes him different is that he's adaptable and a quick learner.  Falk knows football, not just Mike Leach's offense.  He can translate principles from Leach's offense to other systems and identify systems that run a lot of what Leach is running (Patriots run some of those principles).  In any case we'll see how our QB search ends soon.

[ColoradoBills]

8 minutes ago, NewEraBills said:

 

I've been talking about Falk for a while now.  Simmered down some of the talk because not many people around him seem to like him, but I like his game and when I think about a QB profile that fits McD, he's the guy that comes to mind.

1)  Small town kid; Farm guy

2)  Walk on; 3 year starter; has played a lot of football

3)  Humble; has no problem with hard coaching

4)  Has actually had full command of an offense.  Was trusted with checks; getting in and out of run plays. Was not required to look to the sideline for play checks it was all his call.

 

He fits directly into the culture that McD is trying to build.  As for his game, he has a lot of strengths.  His arm strength is questionable at times; his patience in letting things develop gets tested at times as he likes to get the football out quickly.  I like Falk.  Like his footwork in the pocket; I like how he climbs the pocket.

 

I do not like his frame LOL.  From what I can gather, his benching was due to him not waiting for things to develop.  Leach's comments were that he wanted Falk to see the field.  So to me that was Leach being frustrated with Faulk pulling the trigger too early on some plays.  I like Falk more than Rudolph and Jackson honestly.  He's not going to give you much mobility but he can scoot when he needs too.  It's not a strength. 

 

My favorite QB prospect though is Mayfield.  It didn't start off that way but after watching the decisions he makes he won me.  I'm not saying he's a better decision maker than other guys, but what I like is that the decisions that Mayfield likes to make are the ones that kill defenses.  That might get him in trouble at the next level, I don't know, but that's the type of killer instinct you don't see in a lot of QBs and I like that.  When you look at some of the plays where he has two options, most guys will take the safer underneath one but Mayfield likes that intermediate and deep dagger that hurts defenses.

 

 

Back to Falk for a second.  He's viewed negatively because of the offense he played in.  But the thing I think that makes him different is that he's adaptable and a quick learner.  Falk knows football, not just Mike Leach's offense.  He can translate principles from Leach's offense to other systems and identify systems that run a lot of what Leach is running (Patriots run some of those principles).  In any case we'll see how our QB search ends soon.

 

Thanks for your post.  Like I said, I'm not a big college football fan.

 

Your input on Mayfield is appreciated.

 

I guess the thing about Falk is................if the Bills can't get 1-2 of the top guys they like then Falk may come into play.

Funny you mentioned the Patriots................I read a few articles that had the Pat's interested in Falk, no doubt because of the position they could

draft him in. 

[reddogblitz]

5 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

I searched around a few weeks ago and found the same chart consistently across websites:

 

http://walterfootball.com/draftchart.php

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/draft/draft-trade-chart/

https://www.drafttek.com/NFL-Trade-Value-Chart.asp

 

In that chart, #21 and #22 together total 1580pts, and #7 is worth 1500pts.

Throw in a 2nd and we can get all the way up to #4.

Again, assuming teams are willing to go strictly off the chart, which I'm sure wont be the case. With all the teams jockeying for position, we my have to include more picks to get up that far.

The good news is, we're the ONLY team that can offer 2 1sts in this years draft, and that automatically makes them much more valuable.

 

What chart are you using?

 

Really it doesn't matter what chart you use, it's if the team with the higher pick you're trying to trade up for says you're offering enough or not.

[ColoradoBills]

2 hours ago, reddogblitz said:

 

Really it doesn't matter what chart you use, it's if the team with the higher pick you're trying to trade up for says you're offering enough or not.

 

Add, the more teams wanting that draft pick the higher the cost.

Bills gave 2-1st's and a 4th to move up only 5 spots for Watkins!

[Paulus]

Cousins would be a miracle.

[DrDawkinstein]

17 hours ago, reddogblitz said:

 

Really it doesn't matter what chart you use, it's if the team with the higher pick you're trying to trade up for says you're offering enough or not.

 

Of course. But the chart is a good starting point, and all we have to go off of for this discussion.

 

14 hours ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

Add, the more teams wanting that draft pick the higher the cost.

Bills gave 2-1st's and a 4th to move up only 5 spots for Watkins!

 

Yep, competition will be tough. However, that other 1st you're referring to was a future-1st. Generally speaking, picks available for trade in the current year's draft are considered to be worth a whole round more than picks from next year's draft. For example, offering a 2018 3rd is equivalent to offering a 2019 2nd. We're pretty stacked with early 2018 picks, so have that going for us. We're the only team that will be trying to trade up which can offer 2 immediate 1sts. It's going to be tough, should be interesting!