What's the price to move up and get our guy?

[dollars 2 donuts]

4 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

IF the sign Cousins, there's no need to spend a 1st round pick on a QB. 

 

 

So much this.

 

IF they are spending 140 million to sign Cousins I'm looking at 21 and 22 to help this team out immediately, not drafting a QB for the future when the future has already been planned out for at least 4 years, given cap ramifications.  

 

This is what people have to realize about Cousins, if he falters he's still going to be our QB for awhile.  Still draft a QB, but it can wait.  

 

If signed hopefully Cousins would be very good.  However, if he isn't you still aren't going to put him on the bench for 25 million per year.

Edited January 15, 2018 by dollars 2 donuts

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, Albillny said:

Sure there is.  We need to hedge our bets.

Don't forget Cousins was drafted in the fourth round the year RG III was drafted in the first.

 

Cousins is your franchise QB at age 29 if signed and there would not be any need to spend a 1st round pick on his potential successor. 

[njbuff]

38 minutes ago, ndirish1978 said:

 

So Cordy, 21, 22 and a 2nd to move up there? That's a lot of value for an injured LT.

 

Im saying..........

 

21, 22, Glenn, 2019 1st and 2019 2nd.

[BillsfanAZ]

I think fans can forget about moving that far up in the draft. The Bills shouldnt give up everything to move up for one player that nobody knows what kind of pro he will be. Even if he is good, the Bills couldnt upgrade anywhere else because they traded away all their picks. I can see the Bills seeing what QB's get past the top ten and if they are going to move up then move up to spots 10-15. It would not cost them a kinds ransom to do so. Also they may only see two QB's worthy of a top 15 pick so they may stay where they are. Between pick 7 of the Bucs and where they Bills pick at 21 there are only two teams that QB would be a need.....Cardinals and Redskins if they lose Cousins. If there was a trade maybe they trade with the Bengals at #12 which could be done for a 1st round pick the following year and a 5th. It all depends on what happens in Free Agency. If the bills sign a Keenum, Bradford, type player then they dont move up at all and see who is there at 21 to groom for a couple years. 

[artmalibu]

Cousins value has yet to be determined.  My guess is it wont be as much and many are predicting.  

[Albillny]

I guess I am just at the point where I think you have to load up.  If someone like Cousins works out, awesome, you can trade the backup for another pick later.  If not, you have another chance at getting the most important position right for a longer time than four years.  I want the team to draft QBs until they get it right.  If they can get the one without using a first round pick, I am fine with that too.  Heck, trade back into the first with our seconds.

Edited January 15, 2018 by Albillny

[davefan66]

Not the year to grab a QB.

 

Need to hit on our first two rounds this year to get immediate offensive and defensive help.  Go all out in FA for a QB, and sit Peterman another year to see what he really has.  

 

Honestly, last year was the year for a QB, but the trade got us another first this year to hopefully fill out this team.

[starrymessenger]

Browns and G-men are not trading out IMO. Darnold & Rosen in that order. Cleveland has screwed up before passing on real deal guys and trying to do things on the cheap (Johnny Football). They have learned their lesson the hard way and won't screw up again. Eli can still play but not for long. Just as we have been talking about a vet to bridge a rook, that's exactly where the Giants are. This is their chance to nab another franchise guy. Who knows when that chance would come along again (look at us). They are not stupid. They will take Rosen. Then you have Jets, Denver, Zona (who are likely to move up IMO) all in the market for a QB - Allen, Mayfield, Rudolph...I think one of Lamar or Rudolph might be there when we pick. If Allen has a bad senior bowl week and game he could drop a fair bit. He has a bad record against power 5 teams and the ability to step up will be important for his draft status. Unfortunately if we want a QB we may be eating the table scraps and leftovers rather than the 32 ounce Kansas City special. Mind you Rudolph or Jackson could very well pan out and one of the top guys fail. All depends how OBD feel about whose left on the board. They may opt for a second tier guy on day two or three in which case they will be bringing in a vet who can start.

Edited January 15, 2018 by starrymessenger

[Dr. Who]

Just now, davefan66 said:

Not the year to grab a QB.

 

Need to hit on our first two rounds this year to get immediate offensive and defensive help.  Go all out in FA for a QB, and sit Peterman another year to see what he really has.  

 

Honestly, last year was the year for a QB, but the trade got us another first this year to hopefully fill out this team.

Funny, 'cause last year lots of folks were telling those of us pushing to take Watson or Mahomes that this was the year to take a qb.  Somehow, it is never the right year.

[Mat68]

32 minutes ago, ndirish1978 said:

 

And it's in Cleveland's best interest to blow up their cap space on a 30 year old QB rather than taking the best QB in a draft that has good ones and having him on a rookie contract? I doubt it.

Its in Hue Jackson's and the owner to actually have a team that is not terrible.  Hue Jackson doesnt have the time to develop a Qb.  i think he deserves a chance to win.  They draft a guy they win maybe 5 games and he is fired.

[MAJBobby]

20 minutes ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

sign Kirk Cousins stay put at 21/22 and draft Mason Rudolph 

 

I actually like this idea as well. Turns a horrible talented meeting room into one that is really strong. The more i think of Cousins and still a early QB the more i think this becomes my preferred idea 

Edited January 15, 2018 by MAJBobby

[yungmack]

Outside of Darnold, I don't think any of the other QBs are worth the draft capital being kicked around here. Rudolph's game is not at all NFL ready and will need a ton of work. Could easily wind up an EJ/Geno type. Mayfield is short, with smallish hands, and a questionable "head. Slot him as a Flutie. Rosen has a ton of talent but his teams have done nothing. I don't mind his supposed character flaws; I think he's a good kid. My concern with him is his fragility. Draft him and you might have the next RG3. Which leaves Sam Darnold as worthy of a major trade and I can't imagine any of the teams needing a QB letting him get past them. I'd also feel a whole lot better about a major commitment to him if he spent another year at SC. 

Edited January 15, 2018 by yungmack

[/dev/null]

16 minutes ago, artmalibu said:

• Cleveland (0-16) .520
• New York Giants (3-13) .531
• Indianapolis (4-12) .480
• Cleveland - from Houston (4-12) .516
• Denver (5-11) .492
• New York Jets (5-11) .520
• Tampa Bay (5-11) .555
• Chicago (5-11) .559
• San Francisco (6-10)# .512
• Oakland (6-10)# .512
• Miami (6-10) .543
• Cincinnati (7-9) .465
• Washington (7-9) .539
• Green Bay (7-9) .539
• Arizona (8-8) .488
• Baltimore (9-7) .441
• Los Angeles Chargers (9-7) .457
• Seattle (9-7) .492
• Dallas (9-7) .496
• Detroit (9-7) .496
• Buffalo* (9-7) .492
• Buffalo -

The question is how far up can the bills get and who will be left.  I see picks 1 and 2 being QBs so how much do you give up to take the 3rd best prospect?   Plus with denver and the jets being right up there I see it being a tough deal to make.  

 

Do you even trade up for the 3rd best prospect?  Over the last 35 years the only time the "3rd best QB" wasn't a bust were Jim Kelly and Ben Roethlesberger

[MAJBobby]

6 minutes ago, davefan66 said:

Not the year to grab a QB.

 

Need to hit on our first two rounds this year to get immediate offensive and defensive help.  Go all out in FA for a QB, and sit Peterman another year to see what he really has.  

 

Honestly, last year was the year for a QB, but the trade got us another first this year to hopefully fill out this team.

 

Its always better next year. Until next year comes and then it becomes the next year and the previus years were better 

[artmalibu]

1 minute ago, /dev/null said:

 

Do you even trade up for the 3rd best prospect?  Over the last 35 years the only time the "3rd best QB" wasn't a bust were Jim Kelly and Ben Roethlesberger

 

 

Thats my point.  I dont see giving up a lot of draft capital to take the left overs.  The team has too many needs.  I would like to see the Bills as an attractive place that a proven QB wants to come too.  

[starrymessenger]

1 minute ago, yungmack said:

Outside of Darnold, I don't think any of the other QBs are worth the draft capital being kicked around here. Rudolph's game is not at all NFL ready and will need a ton of work. Could easily wind up an EJ/Geno type. Mayfield is short, with smallish hands, and a questionable "head. Slot him as a Flutie. Rosen has a ton of talent but his teams have done nothing. I don't mind his supposed character flaws; I think he's a good kid. My concern with him is his fragility. Draft him and you might have the next RG3. Which leaves Sam Darnold as worthy of a major trade and I can't imagine any of the teams needing a QB letting him get past them. I'd also feel a whole lot better about a major commitment to him if spent another year at SC. 

 

Rosen projects as the best pure passer in this group right now and it's not even close IMO. He's an elitist tennis playing kind of guy. Not blue collar. I agree he's not a bad guy. I think the big apple is the perfect landing spot for him - I think he will be good and the Giants know it. I also agree that he needs to pack on another 15 lbs and a S&C program. If he's anything like me those needed pounds should not be a problem.

[MAJBobby]

26 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Cousins is your franchise QB at age 29 if signed and there would not be any need to spend a 1st round pick on his potential successor. 

 

Why. 3 or 4 years of grooming of Rookie and move on. However if Cousins becomes your longer term Answer to play to 37-39 then your are in the business of flipping QBs for picks. 

 

There is no downside to this idea well unless Both Cousins and your Rookie Flop. 

Edited January 15, 2018 by MAJBobby

[26CornerBlitz]

10 minutes ago, /dev/null said:

 

Do you even trade up for the 3rd best prospect?  Over the last 35 years the only time the "3rd best QB" wasn't a bust were Jim Kelly and Ben Roethlesberger

 

This has zero relevance with respect to QB prospects in the 2018 draft. 

1 minute ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Why. 3 or 4 years of grooming of Rookie and move on. However if Cousins becomes your longer term Answer to play to 37-39 then your are in the business of flipping QBs for picks. 

 

There is no downside to this idea well unless Both Cousins and your Rookie Flop. 

 

The downside is you spend a premium pick on a player who will not conribute for a few years. It makes no sense with so many other priority needs.

[SoTier]

2 hours ago, ProcessTheTrust said:

I get that, 100%. I wish I could remember how far way both the Eagle and Rams seemed from being complete teams as well. I mean, I know how the Rams filled their WR holes, haha! Seriously though, I'm just curious what we think our price would be....in this bizzaro world where we would make this move.

True, I don't personally put that much stock in the combine, but I've given in to the fact that it plays a role in the overall evaluation. Agreed, the real story is already on tape.

 

Ummm ... given that the Eagles have still been winning without Wentz and that the Rams changed coaching staffs and added significantly to their offense (2 WRs compliments of the Bills plus signing a FA OT), you can't just pretend it's all on the QB, dude.  Wentz looked decent in 2016 as a rookie, but Goff was already being labeled a bust because of how clueless he looked ... and Minnesota, Philadelphia, and Jacksonville are the current poster kids for building a strong team and then making do with a competent QB.

 

I don't think that trading up for a QB pays off unless he's the very best QB prospect in the draft, which means he'll likely be the consensus #1 pick, and even then, it's chancy.  The Bills don't have enough picks to do that ... if there even is a QB in the draft who's that good, which I'm not convinced there is.  I have no problem taking a QB in the 2nd round; some decent ones have come out of the 2nd round in recent years.  If Baker Mayfield was available late in the first or in the second, I might take a shot on him.  I think we've seen in recent years that it's not how short ( Brees, Wilson) or tall (Osweiller, Glennon) you are but how you play the game.  I wouldn't trade up for him, though.

[JaCrispy]

25 minutes ago, /dev/null said:

 

Do you even trade up for the 3rd best prospect?  Over the last 35 years the only time the "3rd best QB" wasn't a bust were Jim Kelly and Ben Roethlesberger

Watson?