Schopp: Taylor is better than you think.

[section122]

You raise a fair point. Tyrod is good enough to get into the playoffs I think, but he isn't good enough to take a team to the superbowl.

 

In saying that I hope they keep him next year but still draft a QB in the first round

 

I'm really sick of this narrative. We've been through it a million times but Colin Kaepernick, Joe Flacco, the corpse of Peyton Manning, and Russel Wilson have all been to and some even won super bowls in just the last 5 years. Eli Manning has 2 Super Bowls and people don't know if he is a HOFer. How in the world can anyone say he can't take a team to the super bowl definitively. IT IS A TEAM GAME. Getting hot at the right time is often the key to making and or winning a super bowl. The Brady/Manning/Roethlisberger trio have just jaded everyone. If you look at the NFC side going back to 2007 there have been 9 teams represented with only the Giants and Seahawks getting there multiple times.

 

By the definition of not being good enough to take a team to the super bowl being the measuring stick, 23 teams should be looking into moving on from their QB. Here is the list of Super Bowl starting qbs in the league right now: Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Ben Roethlisberger, Aaron Rodgers, Matt Ryan - that's a good list but it is only 5 of the names. Eli Manning, Russel Wilson, Joe Flacco, and Cam Newton have all taken teams to the super bowl recently. None of them are playing as good as Tyrod is this year although Wilson has heated up lately. In their Super Bowl years they played well but have also proven that they can play at a level lower than Tyrod. Why can't he elevate like these guys did?

 

So please can we stop with the "can't take us to the Super Bowl" nonsense? The Bills as a franchise haven't even made the playoffs in 17 years. 15 years before TT got here. He shouldn't be responsible for solely pulling this team out of the doldrums, it needs to be on all sides of the ball. QB isn't end all be all even the mighty Brady needs a team around him. Drew Brees has won 7 games a year the last 3 years if even he, as great of a qb as he is, can't do it without a team around him why in the world would that be an expectation of Tyrod.

 

I don't mean this post directed to you other than the Super Bowl narrative but it was as good a place as any to put this rant

Edited October 27, 2017 by section122

[Wayne Arnold]

You mean you want him to be bad. Should clarify.

 

Why would I want him to be bad? Makes zero sense.

[BillsFan130]

 

I'm really sick of this narrative. We've been through it a million times but Colin Kaepernick, Joe Flacco, the corpse of Peyton Manning, and Russel Wilson have all been to and some even won super bowls in just the last 5 years. Eli Manning has 2 Super Bowls and people don't know if he is a HOFer. How in the world can anyone say he can't take a team to the super bowl definitively. IT IS A TEAM GAME. Getting hot at the right time is often the key to making and or winning a super bowl. The Brady/Manning/Roethlisberger trio have just jaded everyone. If you look at the NFC side going back to 2007 there have been 9 teams represented with only the Giants and Seahawks getting there multiple times.

 

By the definition of not being good enough to take a team to the super bowl being the measuring stick, 23 teams should be looking into moving on from their QB. Here is the list of Super Bowl starting qbs in the league right now: Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Ben Roethlisberger, Aaron Rodgers, Matt Ryan - that's a good list but it is only 5 of the names. Eli Manning, Russel Wilson, Joe Flacco, and Cam Newton have all taken teams to the super bowl recently. None of them are playing as good as Tyrod is this year although Wilson has heated up lately. In their Super Bowl years they played well but have also proven that they can play at a level lower than Tyrod. Why can't he elevate like these guys did?

 

So please can we stop with the "can't take us to the Super Bowl" nonsense? The Bills as a franchise haven't even made the playoffs in 17 years. 15 years before TT got here. He shouldn't be responsible for solely pulling this team out of the doldrums, it needs to be on all sides of the ball. QB isn't end all be all even the mighty Brady needs a team around him. Drew Brees has won 7 games a year the last 3 years if even he, as great of a qb as he is, can't do it without a team around him why in the world would that be an expectation of Tyrod.

 

I don't mean this post directed to you other than the Super Bowl narrative but it was as good a place as any to put this rant

Its just my personal opinion man, I'm not right or wrong yet...

 

I 100 percent agree that football is a team game.

 

I know you don't know my poster but I always preach that and have defended Tyrod plenty of times using that argument.

 

But in my personal opinion I don't think he is good enough to help his team to a Superbowl.

 

If you're going to win, that means you're going to have to go at New England in January and score probably 28 plus points and make big time throws.

 

The only QBs that have gone to the Superbowl in the AFC the last 16 years or so besides Brady, are big Ben, Flacco once (when he decided to be Joe Montana that playoffs), and Peyton.

 

So back to my original point, I think he can get you into the playoffs but not the Superbowl.

 

And yes you're right it is a team game. But the QB is also the most important player on the field and as of right now I don't see him making enough plays to help his team get there.

 

Its just my personal opinion buddy. You of course are free to disagree which you obviously do. All good

Edited October 27, 2017 by billsfan11

[Scott7975]

 

By the same token, we may also see how bad Taylor really is when there aren't 9 defenders stacked in the box on nearly every snap.

McCoy has seen 8+ in the box 29.09% of the time. That's 20th in the league. There isn't 9 defenders stacked in the box on nearly every snap.

[GunnerBill]

Its just my personal opinion man, I'm not right or wrong yet...

 

I 100 percent agree that football is a team game.

 

I know you don't know my poster but I always preach that and have defended Tyrod plenty of times using that argument.

 

But in my personal opinion I don't think he is good enough to help his team to a Superbowl.

 

If you're going to win, that means you're going to have to go at New England in January and score probably 28 plus points and make big time throws.

 

The only QBs that have gone to the Superbowl in the AFC the last 16 years or so besides Brady, are big Ben, Flacco once (when he decided to be Joe Montana that playoffs), and Peyton.

 

So back to my original point, I think he can get you into the playoffs but not the Superbowl.

 

And yes you're right it is a team game. But the QB is also the most important player on the field and as of right now I don't see him making enough plays to help his team get there.

 

Its just my personal opinion buddy. You of course are free to disagree which you obviously do. All good

I think Flacco has done it twice actually and one of those Ray Rice went for like 200 yards.

McCoy has seen 8+ in the box 29.09% of the time. That's 20th in the league. There isn't 9 defenders stacked in the box on nearly every snap.

Correct. The problems in the run game before last week were mainly execution by the offensive line not 9 men in the box every time.

[BuffaloHokie13]

I think Flacco has done it twice actually and one of those Ray Rice went for like 200 yards.

 

In the Super Bowl run the Ravens beat the Pats* 28-13. Flacco was 21/36 for 240 yards and 3 TDs, no INTs. Box Score

In 2009, the Ravens beat the Pats 33-14. Flacco was 4/10 for 34 yards, 0 TDs and 1 INT. Box Score

 

Neither of those look like stat lines that are outside of Tyrod's capabilities, especially the latter

[GunnerBill]

In the Super Bowl run the Ravens beat the Pats* 28-13. Flacco was 21/36 for 240 yards and 3 TDs, no INTs. Box Score

In 2009, the Ravens beat the Pats 33-14. Flacco was 4/10 for 34 yards, 0 TDs and 1 INT. Box Score

 

Neither of those look like stat lines that are outside of Tyrod's capabilities, especially the latter

I think the top one is pretty close to a career game for Tyrod. I wasn't making the point that Flacco was better by the way... I knew Ray Rice went OFF that first time. I was just correcting the stat.

[BuffaloHokie13]

I think the top one is pretty close to a career game for Tyrod. I wasn't making the point that Flacco was better by the way... I knew Ray Rice went OFF that first time. I was just correcting the stat.

Agreed, just adding substance to your suspicion.

 

I don't know offhand, but 240+ and 3 feels like something Tyrod's done probably a half dozen times in his 36 games, though typically on fewer attempts than 36.

[Scott7975]

 

In the Super Bowl run the Ravens beat the Pats* 28-13. Flacco was 21/36 for 240 yards and 3 TDs, no INTs. Box Score

In 2009, the Ravens beat the Pats 33-14. Flacco was 4/10 for 34 yards, 0 TDs and 1 INT. Box Score

 

Neither of those look like stat lines that are outside of Tyrod's capabilities, especially the latter

​Other notable games the Pats got knocked out...

 

2015 Broncos: Manning 17/32 176 yards 2 TDs

2010 Jets: Sanchez 16/25 194 yards 3 TDs

Edited October 27, 2017 by Scott7975

[GunnerBill]

Agreed, just adding substance to your suspicion.

 

I don't know offhand, but 240+ and 3 feels like something Tyrod's done probably a half dozen times in his 36 games, though typically on fewer attempts than 36.

3 passing TDs?? Or we including rushing?

 

He has thrown 3 TDs 6 times. Twice the yardage was lower tho.

Edited October 27, 2017 by GunnerBill

[BuffaloHokie13]

3 passing TDs?? Or we including rushing?

3 passing. I went ahead and looked. He's met the yard & pass TD & no INT mark 3 times, yard and pass TD mark 5 times, and thrown for 3 TDs 6 times.

 

2016:

Miami - 329 yards, 3 TDs, 0 INTs

NYJ - 297 yards, 3 TDs, 1 INT

 

2015:

Houston - 211 yards, 3 TDs, 0 INT, 1 rush TD

KC - 291 yards, 3 TDs, 0 INT

Miami - 277 yards, 3 TDs, 0 INT

NE - 242 yards, 3 TDs, 3 INTs, 1 rush TD

[Scott7975]

3 passing TDs?? Or we including rushing?

Taylor has 6 games with 3 passing TDs. The poster is correct. NE, MIA, KC, HOU 2015. Jets, MIA 2016.

[KDIGGZ]

Just scrap the offense and let Tyrod do whatever he wants to do. It worked somewhat with Tebow in Denver. If he wants to play backyard ball and run around and throw it down field as far as he can then let him do it. What's the worst that can happen? They let the reigns off a little bit last game and he did his thing. Just scrap the offense and say Tyrod just do what you do

[GunnerBill]

Taylor has 6 games with 3 passing TDs. The poster is correct. NE, MIA, KC, HOU 2015. Jets, MIA 2016.

Yea I confess that is a couple more than I'd have guessed. But still... that stat line is pretty close to his career days which was my point.

[section122]

Its just my personal opinion man, I'm not right or wrong yet...

 

I 100 percent agree that football is a team game.

 

I know you don't know my poster but I always preach that and have defended Tyrod plenty of times using that argument.

 

But in my personal opinion I don't think he is good enough to help his team to a Superbowl.

 

If you're going to win, that means you're going to have to go at New England in January and score probably 28 plus points and make big time throws.

 

The only QBs that have gone to the Superbowl in the AFC the last 16 years or so besides Brady, are big Ben, Flacco once (when he decided to be Joe Montana that playoffs), and Peyton.

 

So back to my original point, I think he can get you into the playoffs but not the Superbowl.

 

And yes you're right it is a team game. But the QB is also the most important player on the field and as of right now I don't see him making enough plays to help his team get there.

 

Its just my personal opinion buddy. You of course are free to disagree which you obviously do. All good

 

I know and it is why I wanted to put that caveat in at the end. After reading I thought man this guy is gonna think I hate his take when that isn't the case

 

That post wasn't directed at you I just wanted to get that info out. The AFC qbs are what I was talking about in my post though. On the NFC side there have been a ton of teams and a ton of qbs. I see Tyrod perform at the same level as a host of qbs who have either taken their teams to the super bowl or deep in the playoffs.

[BuffaloHokie13]

Yea I confess that is a couple more than I'd have guessed. But still... that stat line is pretty close to his career days which was my point.

Yep, like I said the stat lines are within the limits we've seen from him. And I'd agree that given the context of a playoff game in Foxborough, matching those numbers would be a career day.

 

I'd also argue that, of the 6, a 4 TD day against that 2015 Houston Defense is probably his best performance despite the yards.

Edited October 27, 2017 by BuffaloHokie13

[GunnerBill]

Let's forget for a second whether he can take us to a Superbowl and start with him proving he can take us into the playoffs by doing it this year. That is the most important thing at this point. Beyond this year what will be will be.

[BuffaloHokie13]

Let's forget for a second whether he can take us to a Superbowl and start with him proving he can take us into the playoffs by doing it this year. That is the most important thing at this point. Beyond this year what will be will be.

[GunnerBill]

Haha. I cringed when he said that. Cringed when we hired him. Roared like a lion in the middle of a quiet coach on an intercity train when we fired him. In the top 10 sporting moments of my life that was. God I can't stand that man.

Edited October 27, 2017 by GunnerBill

[section122]

Yea I confess that is a couple more than I'd have guessed. But still... that stat line is pretty close to his career days which was my point.

 

6 starts out of 35 means he does it 17% of the time. Almost 1 in every 5 times he is the starting qb he goes for 3 tds. I wouldn't say it is a career day when it happens instead I think it shows that Tyrod CAN achieve those numbers and if they are good enough for other guys to lead teams to the Super Bowl why wouldn't they be good enough for TT to do so? Which was my original point of wanting people to stop with this you can't win with him.

 

This year is starting to show they can win because of him which is a nice development. I think this past Sunday Tyrod carried this team with a lot of clutch 3rd down conversions, a late td drive, and a couple of huge runs. I won't say this will be an every week thing but if he can continue down this path I see great things. Think of the knocks on him coming into this year: Can't throw to the middle - started doing it, can't win late - done, doesn't use the te - done, can't win when throwing more than 30 times - done, can't go through progressions - improvement, he has reached his ceiling - all of the above prove that as false imo. So now we are left with can be inaccurate at times and can also hold the ball too long/be indecisive. The other knocks are projections of team success that to me shouldn't be put on his shoulders.

 

I know many disagree but I feel like we are watching a young qb grow and continue to grow. 3rd year as a starter and I see growth from last year. Interested to see the rest of the year and his continued development! I wish the Bills had given him the Wentz/Goff treatment and gotten him weapons to be successful with but hopefully the future brings that.

Haha. I cringed when he said that. Cringed when we hired him. Roared like a lion in the middle of a quiet coach on an intercity train when we fired him. In the top 10 sporting moments of my life that was. God I can't stand that man.

 

Man I wanted to believe that bravado. I even gave him the benefit of the doubt going into year 2. He wasn't invested in the job at all and it was unbelievable the way he treated his job.