jeffismagic Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 I agree with you. Lesson to be learned: Dithering is not a good strategy for job retention. Well, the new guys need to make it happen soon. If it doesn't happen after the 2017 and 2018 draft it won't happen with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike in Horseheads Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 Well, I wish Whaley had been given one more draft. I think he would have gotten it done. Well, I wish Whaley had been given one more draft. I think he would have gotten it done. Well, I wish Whaley had been given one more draft. I think he would have gotten it done. You wanted Whaleys head on a platter and NOW you wish he had one more draft. Amazing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffismagic Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 You wanted Whaleys head on a platter and NOW you wish he had one more draft. Amazing I did state that although I wanted Whaley replaced I would prefer him picking the players over the new defensive coach. It's not that amazing, it's a nuanced position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 (edited) Avoiding thread proliferation Just saw two articles on our BB explaining why Watkins is not a bust. http://auburnpub.com/blogs/in_the_pros/why-buffalo-bills-wide-receiver-sammy-watkins-isn-t-a/article_2da20488-472d-11e7-83ae-e7969474cf57.html http://buffalonews.com/2017/06/01/vic-caruccis-bills-analysis-early-say-watkins-headed-toward-bust/ I think it's fair to say, when you're a 4th year player and sportswriters feel the need to defend you from being a bust, there's significant danger of deserving this status. Edited June 2, 2017 by Hapless Bills Fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 Avoiding thread proliferation Just saw two articles on our BB explaining why Watkins is not a bust. http://auburnpub.com/blogs/in_the_pros/why-buffalo-bills-wide-receiver-sammy-watkins-isn-t-a/article_2da20488-472d-11e7-83ae-e7969474cf57.html http://buffalonews.com/2017/06/01/vic-caruccis-bills-analysis-early-say-watkins-headed-toward-bust/ I think it's fair to say, when you're a 4th year player and sportswriters feel the need to defend you from being a bust, there's significant danger of deserving this status. I love all this bust talk to be honest. Any idiot who can count to 3 can see that when healthy he is an ELITE talent at WR. So I hope people keep talking about him "maybe" or actually "being" a "bust" because if Watkins can stay healthy all this talk is just going to further add to his fire along with the contract year and put him in line for a monster season. No joke, If he can put the injury bug behind him finally, this kid can easily hit 1400+ yards, 90+ catches, and double digit TD's even in a run oriented offense here this year. Sammy isnt remotely close to a bust if you weigh him on talent, he's just had some bad luck on the injury front. Given he had no prior injury issues, its not unrealistic that he could put it behind him this year. And with his fracture, historically the injury has responded quite well after the 2nd surgery, so there is reason to be optimistic about this foot issue being in the past. So I hope this thread hits 100 pages of "bust" nonsense and keeps adding more gasoline to the fire as I think he's going to put on a show this year and I can't wait to watch it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What a Tuel Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 (edited) Watkins and especially Clay because he was a free agency acquisition are two talented players who haven't come close to realizing their talents with the Bills because the qb position was not at a level it needed to be. You can accumulate all the offensive pieces you want and still not get a good return if the trigger man is inadequate. It is approaching a quarter century since the Bills have not had a legitimate long term qb. Addressing that position should be the priority! Whaley had more than enough time to address that issue. He dithered. He ended up losing his job. One of his first responses after being fired was that he should have made finding a franchise more of a priority. No shiiit Sherlock! No more excuses! While I agree he failed on the QB front, I think he'd still be GM if he didn't fail on that aspect. That may be obvious to some, but I think it is a testament of the talent he brought to the roster outside of QB. Edited June 2, 2017 by What a Tuel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 I love all this bust talk to be honest. Any idiot who can count to 3 can see that when healthy he is an ELITE talent at WR. So I hope people keep talking about him "maybe" or actually "being" a "bust" because if Watkins can stay healthy all this talk is just going to further add to his fire along with the contract year and put him in line for a monster season. No joke, If he can put the injury bug behind him finally, this kid can easily hit 1400+ yards, 90+ catches, and double digit TD's even in a run oriented offense here this year. Sammy isnt remotely close to a bust if you weigh him on talent, he's just had some bad luck on the injury front. Given he had no prior injury issues, its not unrealistic that he could put it behind him this year. And with his fracture, historically the injury has responded quite well after the 2nd surgery, so there is reason to be optimistic about this foot issue being in the past. So I hope this thread hits 100 pages of "bust" nonsense and keeps adding more gasoline to the fire as I think he's going to put on a show this year and I can't wait to watch it. Some folks really think this. Insane. I think I'd bet $100k on Sammy not hitting those numbers if he played 15+ games this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 Some folks really think this. Insane. I think I'd bet $100k on Sammy not hitting those numbers if he played 15+ games this year. Then you aren't paying attention. His per target production portends numbers quite close to those that you call insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 Then you aren't paying attention. His per target production portends numbers quite close to those that you call insane. Based on his career to this point we'd be looking at 157 targets to reach 1400 yards. It's basically 10 targets a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 (edited) Then you aren't paying attention. His per target production portends numbers quite close to those that you call insane. That's fantastic. The sneaky thing about the "per target production" stat is that you need X number of targets to hit those numbers. It's not gonna happen. Sammy Watkins is not going to be the tenth highest targeted WR in Dennison's offense with TT at the helm. I think you're the one "not paying attention." Now if we trade for Phillip Rivers or something, then I could see it. Based on his career to this point we'd be looking at 157 targets to reach 1400 yards. It's basically 10 targets a game. 5 WR's in the NFL recieved 10 targets per game in 2016. And Sammy Watkins paired with the 20th or so best QB in the NFL will be one of them next year? Check or cash? Edited June 3, 2017 by jmc12290 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 Avoiding thread proliferation Just saw two articles on our BB explaining why Watkins is not a bust. http://auburnpub.com/blogs/in_the_pros/why-buffalo-bills-wide-receiver-sammy-watkins-isn-t-a/article_2da20488-472d-11e7-83ae-e7969474cf57.html http://buffalonews.com/2017/06/01/vic-caruccis-bills-analysis-early-say-watkins-headed-toward-bust/ I think it's fair to say, when you're a 4th year player and sportswriters feel the need to defend you from being a bust, there's significant danger of deserving this status. Anybody but sportswriters and I'd at least consider the possibility of entertaining the thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 That's fantastic. The sneaky thing about the "per target production" stat is that you need X number of targets to hit those numbers. It's not gonna happen. Sammy Watkins is not going to be the tenth highest targeted WR in Dennison's offense with TT at the helm. I think you're the one "not paying attention." Now if we trade for Phillip Rivers or something, then I could see it. 5 WR's in the NFL recieved 10 targets per game in 2016. And Sammy Watkins paired with the 20th or so best QB in the NFL will be one of them next year? Check or cash? I didn't say that he would receive that many. 145 is the number in my head which would tie him with Crabtree and Demaryius Thomas. The Bills will throw the ball more and Watkins will get the majority of the looks. I'm thinking more like 9 targets a game and 1,250 or so yards (if healthy). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanC883 Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 I believe Watkins had better numbers than AB when healthy. And that's with TT not Big Ben as QB. The guy is a stud if he stays healthy. I think he does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 He's never going to put up big numbers over the course of a season in this offense, simply by virtue of how little we pass the ball. He's arguably one of the most underutilized wideouts in the game. I'd hate to see him go, but our offense doesn't rely on his production (or any production out of the passing game, really). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 He's never going to put up big numbers over the course of a season in this offense, simply by virtue of how little we pass the ball. He's arguably one of the most underutilized wideouts in the game. I'd hate to see him go, but our offense doesn't rely on his production (or any production out of the passing game, really).We've never seen this offense? It sure sounds like they are going to throw the ball more. They aren't going to be like the Saints or anything but 34 or 35 attempts a game seems reasonable. If that's the case you are probably looking at another 2 targets a game for Sammy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 We've never seen this offense? It sure sounds like they are going to throw the ball more. They aren't going to be like the Saints or anything but 34 or 35 attempts a game seems reasonable. If that's the case you are probably looking at another 2 targets a game for Sammy. I hope not. We have a QB whose main benefit is his ability to be efficient. That sweet spot of 27 APG in 2015 was where he needs to be at...move him up 2 more throws per game and he dips a full 10 points in QB rating as evidenced by last season. Those are touches that could and should be more productively given to McCoy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 I didn't say that he would receive that many. 145 is the number in my head which would tie him with Crabtree and Demaryius Thomas. The Bills will throw the ball more and Watkins will get the majority of the looks. I'm thinking more like 9 targets a game and 1,250 or so yards (if healthy). Ah, you responded to bandit and it looked like you agreed with him. My mistake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 (edited) The crystal ball can be misleading. Edited June 3, 2017 by Augie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 We've never seen this offense? It sure sounds like they are going to throw the ball more. They aren't going to be like the Saints or anything but 34 or 35 attempts a game seems reasonable. If that's the case you are probably looking at another 2 targets a game for Sammy. I just don't know about that. Sammy playing with the Bills QB that threw the most in recent memory hit 8 targets a game. That was good for 29th. The top 10 WR's in targets per game in 2016 had QB's like: Jameis Big Ben Brady Eli Dalton Luck Bortles Brocketship Palmer Rodgers Now the only 2 QB's TT compares to on that list is Bortles and Brocketship. Maybe he can be one of those 2/10 next year, but I just don't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 3, 2017 Share Posted June 3, 2017 (edited) I just don't know about that. Sammy playing with the Bills QB that threw the most in recent memory hit 8 targets a game. That was good for 29th. The top 10 WR's in targets per game in 2016 had QB's like: Jameis Big Ben Brady Eli Dalton Luck Bortles Brocketship Palmer Rodgers Now the only 2 QB's TT compares to on that list is Bortles and Brocketship. Maybe he can be one of those 2/10 next year, but I just don't think so. Siemian was in Denver and Thomas was tied for 10th at 145 (in Dennison's offense). That's what I have been using as the guide. http://www.espn.com/nfl/statistics/player/_/stat/receiving/sort/receivingTargets Edited June 3, 2017 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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